Why does God allow so much suffering?

[JIMINZ]

Not true. There is quite a bit in the Bible I don't like, including eternal damnation, but it says what it says, and attempts to explain it away are less than convincing.

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You don't believe in Creation as described in the Bible do you?
Don't you believe in The Theory of Evolution more?

 

[lesliedellow]

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You don't believe in Creation as described in the Bible do you?
Don't you believe in The Theory of Evolution more?

I believe that God is the creator of all things, evolution not excluded. I would have no problem with a six day creation if there was not a mountain of evidence that it didn't happen that way.

Genesis can be read as something intended to teach some very important theological truths - which are not to be disputed, but it cannot be read as a science text book.

 

[JIMINZ]

I believe that God is the creator of all things, evolution not excluded. I would have no problem with a six day creation if there was not a mountain of evidence that it didn't happen that way.

Genesis can be read as something intended to teach very important theological truths, but it cannot be read as a science text book.

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So what you saying is that God Created everything except for the things which He didn't Create, like Man, he Evolved like all of the birds animals, trees and others things........Right?

If not, what part does Evolution play in the CREATION of everything as God said He did?

 

[lesliedellow]

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So what you saying is that God Created everything except for the things which He didn't Create, like Man, he Evolved like all of the birds animals, trees and others things........Right?

You may have noticed that I am a Calvinist, which means I believe that everything which comes to pass is foreordained by God. That everything includes the emergence of human beings through the process of evolution.

Or, in case that isn't explicit enough, God is their Creator.

 

[Mafeking]

I am really struggling to answer this question. It can't be just be about free will. Natural disasters, accidents and diseases are the cause of many deaths each day. Dying without having a choice sounds like the opposite of free will to me.

No one has had a satisfactory answer for this ageless question. But our general attitude to the issue will determine our conclusions on it. I once had a friend whose wife was a nurse. She was this tiny little woman who one day had to lift up a 250 pound patient she was working with. The result was that she unhinged her back in the process, and for a while she had to drive her kids to school using a piece of stick to both gas and stop her car.

I asked him if he was upset that GOD had not healed his wife. His answer very much surprised me because though he called himself a Christian, he was usually quite critical of GOD. His answer was that we live in a sinful and imperfect dispensation, and that in this dispensation we should expect all these things. He concluded his answer by saying that when the world is again made perfect we do not have to face these unpleasant things.

 

[JIMINZ]

You may have noticed that I am a Calvinist, which means I believe that everything which comes to pass is foreordained by God. That everything includes the emergence of human beings through the process of evolution.

Or, in case that isn't explicit enough, God is their Creator.

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WOW!
Now your saying God Created Man through the process of Evolution?

I wonder what Calvin would think about that,.

I don't think he ever postulated that belief.

 

[lesliedellow]

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WOW!
Now your saying God Created Man through the process of Evolution?

I wonder what Calvin would think about that.

I haven't a clue what Calvin would make of evolution, if he was around in 2017, but like most Christians outside of America, I suspect he would have accepted it.

 

[CrystalDragon]

The "problem of suffering" is only a problem if you presuppose that God's number one, and top, priority, is to make our lives as pain free as possible. What if he has got other priorities, such as the pursuit of his own glory, and to that end he was prepared to inflict suffering even upon his incarnate self?

"Pursuit of his own glory" seems very egotistical.

 

[CrystalDragon]

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You know full well what I meant.

Do you believe God sends Hurricanes, and Tornadoes, Earthquakes?
If so why don't they happen in the Godless Countries like the UK,

They happen everywhere.

 

[lesliedellow]

"Pursuit of his own glory" seems very egotistical.

God is God. He has a right to view himself highly given that he is ultimately the author of all things. Indeed, if he had a lower view of himself, he would be holding to a belief which wasn't true - the truth is that he IS the ultimate reality, and nothing is higher than him.

 

[toLiJC]

Jeremiah 32:27 “I am the Lord, the God of all mankind. Is anything too hard for me?"

Even if not in those exact words, God poses that rhetorical question more than once in the course of scripture, and he is clearly expecting the answer "no".

yes, in principle the One Who is really the true God can do any good thing without exceptions, but, also, there is an inevitable transition marking the end of the eternity as well as its next beginning, though He determines exactly when...

Revelation 22:13 "I am the Alpha and the Omega, the first and the last, the beginning and the end."

Blessings

 

[JIMINZ]

They happen everywhere.

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Could you provide the dates of the last Hurricane, Tornado, Earthquake to hit the UK?

 

[JIMINZ]

I haven't a clue what Calvin would make of evolution, if he was around in 2017, but like most Christians outside of America, I suspect he would have accepted it.

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But you have to know what he would think by his teachings, otherwise you cannot call yourself a Calvinist,.... can you?
If you don't adhere to those teachings, then your something else, like a Pseudo Calvinist.

That's really strange, I call myself a Christian and I know exactly what Christ would say about Evolution.

 

[lesliedellow]

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Could you provide the dates of the last Hurricane, Tornado, Earthquake to hit the UK?

1987. We didn't have the rain, but we certainly had the wind.

 

[lesliedellow]

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But you have to know what he would think by his teachings, otherwise you cannot call yourself a Calvinist,.... can you?
If you don't adhere to those teachings, then your something else, like a Pseudo Calvinist.

As I said to somebody else, Calvinists do not worship Calvin, and they don't believe he was some kind of infallible Protestant pope.

That's really strange, I call myself a Christian and I know exactly what Christ would say about Evolution.

How? Have you been on the phone to him?

 

[mike buckman]

I am really struggling to answer this question. It can't be just be about free will. Natural disasters, accidents and diseases are the cause of many deaths each day. Dying without having a choice sounds like the opposite of free will to me.

In an environment where one has free will, there will inevitably be a certain amount of chaos possible. We wive in a world where we can choose to do evil to others and to hurt or even kill them. That means that Death must be allowed. The chaotic possibilities must exist in order for us to have real freedom of choice, with real consequences. Disease, natural disasters etc... are all part of the choice environment. Its fully rounded.

BUT

God gave us a map and a moral guide.

There is more than enough land to grow enough food on this planet. Why is it that people starve? In Africa for instance. That continent has arguably the most natural resources of any continent on earth, yet more people starve there than any other. This is because men hoard wealth for themselves.

If everyone followed Gods word in their behaviors, there would be no hunger, no poverty, no overpopulation, very little disease... There would still be some chaotic events, but we see in scripture that God does prevent those events from happening to a people whom he is pleased with. Still the fact of the matter is that we all will eventually die. Some will fall off of cliffs, or get sick... get eaten by a bear...

The vast majority of suffering on this planet is caused by men who have been given all of the natural resources they need, as well as the moral guide they need, but they choose to ignore what is moral and choose selfishness and greed.

 

[mike buckman]

What I mean is, no one ever specifies what such worship actually entails. It's all vague whenever I hear it talked about.

In the throng of heaven is Glory. The glory is exceedingly powerful. Everything in the heavenly is perfect, meaning that there is no down side to it. There is no boredom. If there was, it wouldnt be perfect. There is no pain. There is holiness, joy, purity, love and glory. All beings in heaven experience the glory. It is like a sustained hallelujah. like the suns rays soaring through the clouds, only 100,000 times more beautiful. All beings in heaven are doing exactly what they were created to do, and this is the exact thing that brings the most fulfillment and joy to that being. God is all in all there. God is the glory. The beings sing to God and for God, but the song is BY GOD. In this way God is all in all. "He" is the ultimate center of beauty and all power. The center of the universe and what hinges all things together. God is magnificent and to be in "his" presence is to acknowledge the ultimate. This is worship. The very word God automatically draws worship and glory to itself. It is the expression of the ultimate. Does God worship himself? Yes. Truth demands it.

All things are to God, for God, and BY God.

 

[RDKirk]

Jeremiah 32:27 “I am the Lord, the God of all mankind. Is anything too hard for me?"

Even if not in those exact words, God poses that rhetorical question more than once in the course of scripture, and he is clearly expecting the answer "no".

To be historically accurate, "omnipotent" refers specifically to the span of God's authority. The Roman emperor was called the "omnipotense" because all legal authority was vested in the emperor and was delegated to lesser officials. For instance even today an ambassador is called a "plenipotentary," which is the authority of the emperor within the country of posting.

"Omnipotense" means "holding all authority." The Omnipotense had the authority to be the chief priest or the head of the treasury or the commander of all the military or the head dog catcher.

When the Church first began using the term "omnipotense" for God, it was still being used in reference to the emperor and meant the same thing.

"Allmighty" in terms of "physically able to do all things" is a different meaning...although both terms are applicable to God.

 

[jimmyjimmy]

C'mon! You know Arminians don't want God to make all the decisions unless those decisions agree with theirs!

Yes. God is completely sovereign over all things that they allow Him to be sovereign over.

 

[jimmyjimmy]

But you have to know what he would think by his teachings, otherwise you cannot call yourself a Calvinist,.... can you?
If you don't adhere to those teachings, then your something else, like a Pseudo Calvinist.

Yup. Don't wear the badge if it doesn't reflect your views. It's insincere, at best.