Why do some men minimise or deny the reality of domestic violence?

com7fy8

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I could go and find countless examples of God being angry or God's servants being rightly angry.

And I submit that abuse is one situation at which it is reasonable both for Christians to be angry and to extrapolate God's anger from God's known attitudes.
I think of Ephesians 4:31-32 >

"Let all bitterness, wrath, anger, clamor, and evil speaking be put away from you, with all malice. And be kind to one another, tenderhearted, forgiving one another, even as God in Christ forgave you." (Ephesians 4:31-32)

This comes right after our Apostle Paul says, "do not grieve the Holy Spirit of God". So, I see how the Holy Spirit does feel and react about how we relate. The Holy Spirit is grieved by our "bitterness", among other anti-love things. And abuse can be at least partly because of bitterness in the personality of the abuser.

But, Paidiske . . . even if an abuser is not stopped from abusing, the woman who is abused can do well not to allow herself to be overcome by "bitterness".

Yes, there is a culture of enabling men to abuse women, but also there is a culture of grooming women to stay like victims and to accept becoming bitter; so I think the abused person, also, can be grieving to the Holy Spirit; what do you think?

And even though there might not be an effective cultural way to stop the abuse, victims can become strong in Jesus so they can not be under the spiritual and emotional power of abusers >

"Do not be overcome by evil, but overcome evil with good." (Romans 12:21)

Jesus says we all in Jesus will be attacked and hated and killed by evil people; and Jesus feeds us how to deal with this, so evil can not have power over us . . . in us, I think this means, mainly :)

So, yes, Jesus Christ's gospel says,

To release the captives, to free the oppressed, to bring the Lord's favour... that looks to me like a raising up of those who have been made less than equal; an affording them the dignity of being also in the image of God and having a place in the kingdom of God.
But this comes, first, with how in us we have the almighty power of Jesus to make us deeply free, even with "rest for your souls" (Matthew 11:28-30) while cultural surroundings may still be against us.

We need to not depend on getting this evil world to change for us, but depend on how our Heavenly Father is able to change us . . . to correct us > Hebrews 12:4-11. Then we are above this world's victim and predator kingdom . . . not being either personality :)

Did Jesus let the those (truly) oppressed by Rome physically free from Roman rule?
Mainly, Jesus makes us free from "the power of Satan" > Acts 26:18 > and Satan's evil spirit > Ephesians 2:2 < which can make abusers but also victims bitter; but then with God we can be creative so we get free from how this evil world would try to use us. You might consider how God with Joseph used his horrible situation, not only in order to help himself, but to save many lives > Genesis 37-50 < when God somehow in some practical way delivers us, He has His all-loving result, because He is all-loving.

But this worked first and mainly because of Joseph being faithful to God, not first and mainly because of social and cultural things being in his favor.

Did Jesus release everyone who was imprisioned (captives)? Or, was He referring to we who are captives to sin and satan?
It has been both. Paul and Peter were both delivered from prison . . . but how God did it . . . not in some one-size-fits-all social program way which might be at the mercy of secular people who are worldly. I consider we need how God uses each of us Christians to help people - - - so they have our love example >

"nor as being lords over those entrusted to you, but being examples to the flock." (1 Peter 5:3)

Did Jesus bring good news to the financially poor, e.g., there is a pot of gold under that tree. Or, is He referring to the riches of knowing Him and His redemptive work to the spiritually bankrupt?
very good point, of course > we have "the unsearchable riches" of Jesus > Ephesians 3:8; and Paul says we have "every spiritual blessing in the heavenly places in Christ" (in Ephesians 1:3).

And this includes how God's perfect love "casts out fear; because fear involves torment" (in 1 John 4:18). So, this is good . . . so much more good than only cultural equality can bring > if we help people's circumstances but they still are in ego with their ability and weakness to fear and have personality "torment" of fear, we have not truly helped them. Plus, Jesus does say that if we seek God's kingdom and His righteousness "first", He will take care of us > Matthew 6:33. And I understand that this means our Father will do with us all we need culturally and materially . . . however He pleases.

So - - -

Christians who live and work to make the kingdom of God a reality will seek to reform oppressive rule, to reduce poverty and alleviate ill health, and so on and so forth. The gospel is social as well as spiritual.
But there is what is needed by each individual "first" > Matthew 6:33. Or else, if one is continuing in one's ego >

"God resists the proud" (in James 4:6, and in 1 Peter 5:5).

There are people who are in trouble because God is resisting them in their ego. So, trying to help them while they are not being humble can be "hard" >

"Good understanding gains favor,
.But the way of the unfaithful is hard."
. . . . . . . . . .. . (Proverbs 13:15)

So . . . I now think of this question, @Paidiske, if you please >

The Bible appears to be saying that people in trouble could be there because God is resisting them. Do you believe this can be the case for certain people, if not all? And if you do, does your training include that you need to evaluate each case of abuse, in order to find out if the woman has helped to bring it on by living only or mainly for her own self? Are there cases of abuse, in which the abused woman has been helping it to happen because of her disobeying God and because God is resisting her?

Do we not need, also, then, to obey how our Father guides and cares for us?

Also, I have noticed how a number of people do not make sure with God about whom they belong with, in marriage. And then they get so upset when they find out who they have married.

So, do you think prevention is better, if possible . . . by having women learn how to make sure with our Heavenly Father, about whom we marry?

And, of course, men need to be brought up to know how to love. This would need the input of their mothers. Why have women not been bringing up their boys to know how to love . . . in the first place? Prevention would help. How much to you find that mothers need to learn how to bring up boys so they don't abuse? In some number of cases, the mother has the main contact and involvement with children.

I am not sure that social programs with legal controls is the real solution, then, but first is so needed the spiritual upbringing. Or else, programs can be only trying to control people while their nature keeps on being able to abuse or to go along with it. Ones controlled might only find other ways to hurt themselves and others, at least by simply not really loving other people.
 
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Paidiske

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Yes, there is a culture of enabling men to abuse women, but also there is a culture of grooming women to stay like victims and to accept becoming bitter; so I think the abused person, also, can be grieving to the Holy Spirit; what do you think?

I have not seen this. I think there is a culture of supporting women to heal and flourish after experiences of abuse. But for that to even be possible, the abuse must stop first.

Of course an abused person can sin (we all sin). But I'm trying to say that resisting abuse is not a sin.

So . . . I now think of this question, @Paidiske, if you please >

The Bible appears to be saying that people in trouble could be there because God is resisting them. Do you believe this can be the case for certain people, if not all? And if you do, does your training include that you need to evaluate each case of abuse, in order to find out if the woman has helped to bring it on by living only or mainly for her own self? Are there cases of abuse, in which the abused woman has been helping it to happen because of her disobeying God and because God is resisting her?

Do we not need, also, then, to obey how our Father guides and cares for us?

Just so I'm clear... you're claiming that in some instances, a woman is being abused because God wills it, and she should obey God and stay in that abusive situation?

No. I reject this claim. God does not will such treatment for anyone. (My training is that I need to refer abused women on to specialists in this area (I am not one) for psychological support. I can do a limited amount of practical support but beyond that I need to refer to welfare agencies anyway). But in the immediate instance of disclosure of abuse, before I have referred someone, my training is to believe, encourage and support the abused person. Because failure to do so can compound the damage they've experienced in very harmful ways.

Also, I have noticed how a number of people do not make sure with God about whom they belong with, in marriage. And then they get so upset when they find out who they have married.

So, do you think prevention is better, if possible . . . by having women learn how to make sure with our Heavenly Father, about whom we marry?

Well, this is a good thing for all sorts of reasons and not just for abuse prevention. But given that many abusers do not reveal their true character until after they have the woman well under their control, I refuse to blame the woman for having been in an abusive marriage.

And, of course, men need to be brought up to know how to love. This would need the input of their mothers. Why have women not been bringing up their boys to know how to love . . . in the first place? Prevention would help. How much to you find that mothers need to learn how to bring up boys so they don't abuse? In some number of cases, the mother has the main contact and involvement with children.

So even when a man chooses to abuse, somehow it's a woman's fault! What evidence do you have that abuse by men is in any way caused by the faults of their mothers?

I mean, yes, in general I think parenting should be taken seriously and done well. But really, it's a very cruel thing to do to blame a mother for the evil choices of her adult children!

And of course, part of the reason we need social controls rather than just spiritual perfection, is that we are not in a Christian society but a secular one, and many of the people concerned are not Christians.
 
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JacksBratt

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Yes, there is a culture of enabling men to abuse women, but also there is a culture of grooming women to stay like victims and to accept becoming bitter; so I think the abused person, also, can be grieving to the Holy Spirit; what do you think?

I have not seen any indication of such a culture. Not in Ontario Canada, anyway. As for grooming women to stay like victims, I have seen none of this either. Quite the opposite.

I think the whole OP of:

Why do some men minimise or deny the reality of domestic violence?

would only include a very small portion of men.


The reality of domestic violence is right out in the open in Ontario Canada. It is a problem widely recognized and is not being ignored.

I think that, today, one problem that is slipping through the system is that of men who are abused by their female companions.

Men are too proud or embarrassed to go to the police about being mentally or physically abused by their spouse.

 
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com7fy8

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resisting abuse is not a sin.
I don't mean to say what you should do or not do; thank you for doing what you can, and may God bless you to discover whatever more and better you can do.

I have been told that something like one in five women have been abused; so I understand, then, that may be one in five women I know and see are victims. So, I be good to them all, and care for them and pray for them and show them all love, in case this helps any who are or have been abused.

Since a number of women we all meet, each day, are victims . . . how would you say we need to relate with women . . . in case one is a victim and we don't know it, plus the odds are maybe one in five that we are relating with a victim?? This might be in the United States. A pastor gave me these figures, I think. What are the figures where you are? Aren't you in Great Britain? I remember being told one in five, where I am.

I resist abuse by starting with however God knows I myself need correction, then do what He has me do to help the abusive person, mainly by being an example of staying kind and caring and encouraging in my attitude for the person to become kind and caring . . . trusting however God is able to change the person > including through my ministry > 1 Corinthians 15:58. But I am not a woman in a marriage with an abuser; so I understand my times of being abused are not the same thing; what helps me a lot is in me to pray and for God to make me strong so evil people can't have power to decide how I am >

"Do not be overcome by evil, but overcome evil with good." (Romans 12:21)

Just so I'm clear... you're claiming that in some instances, a woman is being abused because God wills it, and she should obey God and stay in that abusive situation?
First . . . I have seen how people can do what is wrong, and this can help them to be in and stay in bad situations. This, in my opinion as one who does not personally know all women, may not always be the case. But I have seen how women can go after worldly men, then be aghast at how they turn out to be . . . worldly < we do reap what we are sowing > a woman's motives for seeking a man can have a lot to do with whom she gets.

The bait you use can be what chooses the fish you catch.

So, I think it can help for a victim to evaluate what ways she trusted and depended on, in order to get the man she is with, so those same ways don't get her a same result, later, and so she can live her life better.

Now, Paidiske, you have already made yourself clear how evil people can put on quite a charm act and fool people. I understand your point, though I question it, based on scripture I am aware of. But I will offer > our motives can have a lot to do with who we get in relationships with. Our character and ways can have us in God's personal guiding in His peace (Colossians 3:15) so He is guiding us to whom He knows we belong with. Or, our ways can have us elsewhere so we are easy to fool.

"There submit to God. Resist the devil and he will flee from you." (James 4:7)

If we submit to our Heavenly Father and His correction > Hebrews 12:4-11 > we have and enjoy His personal and trustworthy guiding, so we don't trust the wrong people in ways He is not guiding us to. He makes us able to tell the difference > Philippians 1:9 < in His love with His light.

Well, this is a good thing for all sorts of reasons and not just for abuse prevention. But given that many abusers do not reveal their true character until after they have the woman well under their control, I refuse to blame the woman for having been in an abusive marriage.
So, do you not feel that God is able to lead and guide us according to all He knows about a man's character?? The Bible says not to lean to our own understanding, but trust the LORD and He will guide our paths > but I realize that there is Bible translation work which seems to not indicate this meaning, of Proverbs 3:5-6 >

"Trust in the LORD with all your heart,
.And lean not on your own understanding;
.In all your ways acknowledge Him,
.And He will direct your paths."
. . . . . . . . . . . (Proverbs 3:5-6)

And I find there are other scriptures which indicate how our Heavenly Father does personally guides those who submit to how He leads and guides us. So, whenever I get in trouble because of what I chose to do, I take personal responsibility for the fact that I did not do what God was guiding me to do. And I confess my need for God to correct me so I am obeying how He personally guides me. So, when I know of women who have gotten with wrong men, I wonder if they know about submitting to God's personal leading and guiding.

And I have talked with women about this, and ones agree that they need to submit to God and His leading and use "discernment"; but other women talk around this or can't even stay in a conversation with me long enough for me to finish offering my point.

Jesus says, "'Do not judge according to appearance, but judge with righteous judgment.'" (John 7:24)

So, if a woman or a man evaluates a person by one's outward appearing behavior, then it can be easy for an evil person to conceal his or her true character. This, I understand, is part of why Jesus says not to judge by appearance, but with "righteous judgment" which I understand would be in God's leading in His love with His light for seeing people right. But, Paidiske, I know I am not perfect; so I keep checking in prayer with God, seeking for howsoever He pleases to guide me reliably about all people I know :) And when I am proven wrong, I'm the first who needs correction > Hebrews 12:4-11 :)

So even when a man chooses to abuse, somehow it's a woman's fault! What evidence do you have that abuse by men is in any way caused by the faults of their mothers?
It's the abuser's fault.

My opinion of my experience and scripture meditation, Paidiske, is that how a woman brings up her children can have a lot to do with how they come out, later. However, yes, each man will answer to God for his behavior. But a woman can have a lot of influence on how her children come out. I, anyway, have heard a lot of men say they so appreciate how their mommies disciplined and brought them up. And, ones say the hand that rocks the cradle rules the world, right? So, possibly, not only I think a mother can have a lot to do with how a child grows up. And 1 Corinthians 15:58, I offer, is very clear that if you do things God's way, your labor will not be in vain . . . "in the Lord". And so yes you can help victims plus abusers.

Going by the Bible > Peter says,

"nor as being lords over these entrusted to you, but being examples to the flock." (1 Peter 5:3)

So, yes example does work. And, of course, if a woman has her man with her, they together can feed their example to their children, so children grow up seeing how to relate in love which is unselfish. And if you know the real deal, it is harder for a predatory faker to fool you. My opinion, Paidiske, is that there are church culture people who are not really into the Bible and how God has us discovering how to love; and these can evaluate by someone's acting so the actor can put on the act they are looking for. So, if you are wise to this, you can stay quiet and observe the acting which people are putting on in order to fool people who judge by looks :) And then just stay clear of the person. In my church setting, we have a number of women who charm and can talk Bible and self-evaluation, even; but they are not the same as the ones who obey 1 Peter 3:4 >

"rather let it be the hidden person of the heart, with the incorruptible beauty of a gentle and quiet spirit, which is very precious in the sight of God." (1 Peter 3:4)

And they can flatter me, instead of humbling me. There is a big difference between flattering and encouraging. I need to pray for how Jesus has me seeing things and responding in love and good example. I can be an actor, too; so with seeing others I need to see myself and have compassion >

"He can have compassion on those who are ignorant and going astray, since he himself is also subject to weakness." (Hebrews 5:2)

I mean, yes, in general I think parenting should be taken seriously and done well. But really, it's a very cruel thing to do to blame a mother for the evil choices of her adult children!
I do not mean to be cruel, but to encourage us to evaluate how we are doing things. There is a big difference between taking responsibility for how our example is, versus taking responsibility for the choices our children make, later. I am not saying a mother is responsible for her children's future choices, but for the example she has given them.

And of course, part of the reason we need social controls rather than just spiritual perfection, is that we are not in a Christian society but a secular one, and many of the people concerned are not Christians.
Yes, God uses secular people to help.

Men are too proud or embarrassed to go to the police about being mentally or physically abused by their spouse.
I pray. I go to God. But yes I get help from other people.

I have more that helps me see people reliably, if you want. And I can offer scripture which helps with this.
 
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mmksparbud

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I was raised in an abusive home. My father was violent even as a child. He was born in Honduras of an American father and Indian woman. She was wonderful. The father (my grandfather) died long before I was born and never met him. I was told by a cousin that he would beat my father. My father learned to use the whip and machete and killed with them. Being an American meant something back then, and his father had set up the city water in the capital of Honduras--my father literally got away with murder.He fled to Costa Rica with my mother and brothers and he was thrown out of Costa Rica for trying to assassinate the President--(you can't make this stuff up!)My mother divorced him after he drove her to a nervous breakdown.
In the states he married our stepmother. He was brutal with my brothers--and he sexually molested me. He was verbally abusive to my stepmother, a devoutly religious woman, but he never got physical with her nor used profanity. I married a very good man, kind, gentle. But I was angry and I refused to ever let a man rule over me and my anger drove him away. It took a divorce and coming back to God after realizing it was stupid for me to be angry at God for my father had had the free will to choose his behavior. My ex and I forgave each other and remained best buddies till he died at 61.
I married an alcoholic----(stupidity runs in the family). I still had no desire to be a door mat to a man and I lashed out at his abuse. I sent him to jail several times and he had to get anger management classes. It was there he saw some things. Like every single one of the men there always blamed the women for making them beat them! He slowly learned to respect me, (at least my right fist)--I tried to get him to forgive his mother for her bad treatment of him and her low morals--until I met her then it was "Please Lord, just keep me from killing her!!"
It was no longer a mystery why he had no respect for women. It was often galling to have to ask him to forgive me for loosing my temper and lashing out at him, even though he deserved it. I had to learn to control my temper also. We slowly learned to get closer to God and not be ruled by anger. Now, we are both disabled and have had to learn to lean on each other to get by. It's been rough, but we both changed only because we let God change us. Anger and violence is what ruled my family. We've all had to fight the curse of repeating our upbringing. My brothers were never brutal with their children, however, they had trouble being affectionate and were distant from them. They learned as they got older and had grandchildren. No one wanted to act like our father but it was a struggle because of the anger,. I gave mine to God, my brothers have kept theirs. It takes surrender to God, and forgiveness to break the chain of anger and violence.
 
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com7fy8

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Yes, mmksparbud, Jesus went through things of this life, so now He can feel for us and help us with grace which made Him able to do so well through it all >

"For we do not have a High Priest who cannot sympathize with our weaknesses, but was in all points tempted as we are, yet without sin." (Hebrews 4:15)

So, if you are using your hard things to help you feel for and understand and help others, you are doing what our High Priest has done. So . . . welcome to the priesthood of Jesus ! ! ! :clap::groupray::pray::prayer:

And I think this is how an abused person can help oneself . . . by submitting to God, feeding on how God's word says to relate in love making the person more and more strong in Jesus, then help others, being able to feel for them - - not only lecture them like I can >

I need to feel for others; and how you share helps me to appreciate how I need to realize what others can be going through, though they may not show it, and then trust them to God's grace.
 
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Paidiske

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Since a number of women we all meet, each day, are victims . . . how would you say we need to relate with women . . . in case one is a victim and we don't know it, plus the odds are maybe one in five that we are relating with a victim?? This might be in the United States. A pastor gave me these figures, I think. What are the figures where you are? Aren't you in Great Britain? I remember being told one in five, where I am.

I'm in Australia. I can't find figures for all kinds of abuse, but apparently 17% of adult women here are survivors of sexual abuse. So not far off one in five.

I don't know that you need to be very different than "polite." Be respectful. In particular, respect her boundaries, because an abused person will be very sensitive to any boundary-pushing.

If we submit to our Heavenly Father and His correction > Hebrews 12:4-11 > we have and enjoy His personal and trustworthy guiding, so we don't trust the wrong people in ways He is not guiding us to. He makes us able to tell the difference > Philippians 1:9 < in His love with His light.

So, do you not feel that God is able to lead and guide us according to all He knows about a man's character?? The Bible says not to lean to our own understanding, but trust the LORD and He will guide our paths > but I realize that there is Bible translation work which seems to not indicate this meaning, of Proverbs 3:5-6 >

"Trust in the LORD with all your heart,
.And lean not on your own understanding;
.In all your ways acknowledge Him,
.And He will direct your paths."
. . . . . . . . . . . (Proverbs 3:5-6)

And I find there are other scriptures which indicate how our Heavenly Father does personally guides those who submit to how He leads and guides us. So, whenever I get in trouble because of what I chose to do, I take personal responsibility for the fact that I did not do what God was guiding me to do. And I confess my need for God to correct me so I am obeying how He personally guides me. So, when I know of women who have gotten with wrong men, I wonder if they know about submitting to God's personal leading and guiding.

I think this is possible, but, not all women will be able to engage in that kind of discernment. Most women are not practising Christians. Of those that are, not all will be spiritually mature or have that kind of spiritual experience. And even then, it is possible to get it wrong. So I think setting this level of discernment up as a "norm" which we think everyone can achieve is unrealistic.

I really appreciate your openness to this and willingness to explore other people's points of view, though.
 
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com7fy8

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I'm in Australia. I can't find figures for all kinds of abuse, but apparently 17% of adult women here are survivors of sexual abuse. So not far off one in five.
Oh, so humans are the same in Australia? I thought Australia was a paradise for nature and niceness and beauty :) lolololololol

I don't know that you need to be very different than "polite." Be respectful. In particular, respect her boundaries, because an abused person will be very sensitive to any boundary-pushing.
Thank you . . . a very simple and practical advice.

In my church relating, I let the women take the initiative to hug and holy kiss.

But I think there are certain, but not all, women who have been abused, and they can be the ones who can cross boundaries. So I, even a guy, need to watch out for that, too. Do you agree?

About if a woman can be expected to make sure with God about who she belongs with >
I think this is possible, but, not all women will be able to engage in that kind of discernment. Most women are not practising Christians. Of those that are, not all will be spiritually mature or have that kind of spiritual experience.
very clear and correct, I would say

I'll offer some more scripture which might feed us to make sure with God about if and how we trust > Joshua chapter nine, about how the Jewish leaders did not seek the LORD's counsel but judged by appearances.

About if someone does become able to make sure with God about who to trust and marry, you say >
And even then, it is possible to get it wrong.
Yes, any of us is still not perfect; so always there can be ways we can fail; so it is good to stay humble if we are successful in this.

Certainly, I can be right in theory but fail in action!

So, we need to keep seeking the LORD for how He is able to develop us with Him and one another.
So I think setting this level of discernment up as a "norm" which we think everyone can achieve is unrealistic.
To expect any and all people would be unrealistic.

And . . . by the way . . . I find there are certain women who can fool themselves about which men are desirable, and then I find they can flatter me and not really know me. So, I encourage them to humble me and be more perceptive so they might learn how to evaluate other men. How do you feel about this approach? And I pray for God to make them more successful in this, since it is possible with God.

But I think it is a basic and worthy thing to seek God for. But this would not be only for trying to use Him to help us get what we want. But seek Him, always, for how He has us loving and trusting each and every person. It does say, "The LORD will guide you continually," in Isaiah 58:11. So, I don't think this is only for certain super-spiritual super-mature people, but yes we do grow in this. And, of course, we need to not be feeling shamed and guilty, as much as we find ourselves not with it, but be encouraged to keep seeking God for Himself and how He has us loving :)

But yes I have been one to find reasons to look down on others; so in case I get more able to discern with people, this does not mean I am superior but I need to have hope for others and care for them and help them.
 
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Paidiske

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Yes, it's true that for some people who have been abused, their sense of boundaries is so shattered that they behave very unhealthily. This is not easy to deal with in any sense, and that's where our own boundaries become so important.

I'm not sure I really understand what you're saying about encouraging women to humble you and be more perceptive, so I don't really know how to respond to that.
 
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mmksparbud

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Those women who have been abused as children, esp those abused for years, brought up that way----do not understand about boundaries. They have been raised, very deliberately taught, to not say no. They sexualize relationships as they have no other point of reference. It seems crazy, but it took me to over 50 years old before I realized the truth of this. On a radio religious program they pointed out that these people simply do not know how to say "No."---it is not a word that is allowed in their upbringing. It explained so much of my choices, and those of others brought up like me.
 
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com7fy8

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I'm not sure I really understand what you're saying about encouraging women to humble you and be more perceptive, so I don't really know how to respond to that.
Hi, Paidiske :)

This comes from certain scriptural development I have developed.

We know the Bible says we need to humble ourselves and to love others as ourselves. And if God wants me to humble myself under His mighty hand (1 Peter 5:5-7), then I am loving myself by humbling myself. But I need to also love others . . . as myself, by humbling them also, I consider :)

So, I expect ladies who get to know me to love my by humbling me the way I need it, and not to only be giving me flattery and a build-up when it is apparent they don't even know me.

I suspect that certain women can evaluate men very superficially, then get themselves in trouble. So, I love them, by encouraging them to learn how I really am and then relate with who I really am and help me by humbling me. And I do this in order to help them learn how to get to know and relate with men so they don't get themselves in their messes.

If they do not humble me, in their perception, they can expect much more of me than I can give them . . . by the way :) And this can hurt things.

But yes . . . maybe I can hear you thinking > this is more than can be realistically expected of a lot of women. So, yes, I need to go easy with this > I offer this and feed bits of this, at a time. I might just say, "I have lived with myself for a while; so I know you need to get to know me better." And, "In comparison with Jesus and how the Bible clearly says we can become with God, I need much more of God's correction."

And the Bible says,

"For I say, through the grace given to me, to everyone who is among you, not to think of himself more highly than he ought to think, but to think soberly, as God has dealt to each one a measure of faith." (Romans 12:3)

If we humble ourselves and one another, we don't make too much of a big deal out of anyone. And this helps us to be sober . . . not drunk with lust disguising itself as love, and not being drunk with our own expectations which we can dictate over others.

So, humbling me includes not trying to put a lot of her own ego's expectations on me . . . while I am likewise not trying to dictate what I want over her.

I have known someone, by the way, who has been abused severely, I would say. And her idea of Christian love and marriage was how I would unconditionally accept her faults and we would spoil each other. But her faults were still actively destroying her health and ability to perceive and react to our personal relating in a healthy way. She did not need me to marry her, I would say, to say the least. But I kept spending time with her, as long as she would stay with me; because I understand that first we Jesus people are family, and so we so dearly care for one another (Ephesians 4:32), whether we are meant for marriage or not.

Because she told me things, I can more appreciate what any woman could be going through, without showing it, so I can be more ready with compassion with any woman, though I don't know all her details. So, she was good for me, to help me learn compassion better.

"But she who lives in pleasure is dead while she lives." (1 Timothy 5:6)

There are people who are trying to use marriage for their own pleasures and desires; and so they do not deeply appreciate any sharing we can have as Jesus brothers and sisters, but they are trying to isolate someone they can use. And their lust can blind them to this.

I myself have often been in selfish love with various women, and I did not know the difference, Paidiske. And by being like this, it was easy to fall for the wrong person, by the way. In my case, I a man could get more and more under the control of a woman, but this was helped by my own blindness of selfish love which had me trying to use a woman for what I wanted.

So, my theory is that a lot of abuse could be averted if a woman learns how to love any and all people the way Jesus has us learning how to love > Matthew 5:46. Then it can be harder to trick her into falling into selfish love with a wrong man.
 
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Goodbook

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It doesnt matter if the parties in question are christian or not, it is NOT ACCEPTABLE for people to be violent in the home or even anywhere.

If people think this is normal, then they need to be shown Gods love and given a dose of reality on how to live and love.
 
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Dave-W

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I'm in Australia. I can't find figures for all kinds of abuse, but apparently 17% of adult women here are survivors of sexual abuse. So not far off one in five.
The numbers are higher in the US as far as I understand it. It is somewhere between 20-25%.
 
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JacksBratt

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Greyy

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Domestic violence has nothing to do with men or women. The notion of a man coming home from work and randomly beating up his crying wife who has done nothing is part of the stereotype that continues the problem, instead of helping. When domestic violence is viewed this way, as it is often done, it is no wonder we find so many families in denial and minimizing it. Real circumstances pale in comparison to the stereotype.

Every family deals with some level of domestic abuse. It is a very gray area. When it is thought of as only physical violence, that's part of the problem.

Domestic violence is a continuation of generational abuse. Children grow up with it, see nothing wrong with it, and accept it. Girls grow up expecting it, and despite what people may think, demand it. Boys find willing partners, or becoming the willing partners of women who wish to be abused. In some cases, the roles are reversed.

There are women who want to be abused, and because some people refuse to accept that, the problem isn't fully addressed. There are women, or victims, we should say, that provoke their partners to the point of providing them with the violence they seek to meet certain psychological needs.

If you say this to the ordinary person, they would think you are trying to be shocking. If you speak with any that has worked professionally in this area, they'll confirm this. There are victims who accept violence because they see no way out, but there are also many who have a deep seated need for violence. Minimizing the situation is done by families.
 
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Paidiske

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Agreed that domestic violence is more than physical; it also has aspects of emotional, financial, social and spiritual abuse.

I have no doubt that there are abused people who fall into that dynamic from a place of woundedness. But to blame them for their place in that seems to me more likely to perpetuate the problem rather than help to break the cycle.
 
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Greyy

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There is one generalization that is generally true - men tend to take out frustration through anger, while women deal with it more internally, through self harm. It's not surprising to find couples who reciprocate these needs. There are women who will provoke and harass their partners to the breaking point. When the issue is approached as man's only issue, it can often end in failure.
 
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