Why do Christians

[ilovejcsog]

I think A LOT of people go outside the Word of God because they're not actually filled with the Holy Spirit. The Holy Spirit is the one who leads and guides us into all Truth. He's also the one who unlocks the Word and gives us "witness" to the Word. So many people are full of religion and traditions of men, so they can't receive the Word as God intended...

Or they don't like what is said in the word and want to find an answer that agrees with the way they believe. I know people like that. Try to find something to disprove the word. IMO, if they strive to prove the bible wrong they put themselves above God.

 

[ilovejcsog]

""People who use a whole page to respond lose their audience, especially me!"
Oh boy in most cases I agree!! It drives me crazy and I usually don't read them. I have been trying to find the words for this and you said it perfectly, thanks. Do you think it will do any good? I don't. Some people are just long winded.:O)

 

[ilovejcsog]

The simple answer is this: People who go outside the Bible for answers do not believe the Bible is good enough to address all matters pertaining to life and our relationship with our Creator.

When people begin to deny the sufficiency of the scriptures, they then begin to doubt its authority, and when they no longer trust in its authority, they lose faith in its inerrancy and when they lose faith in its inerrancy, their faith in the Gospel is lost.

What strengthens our faith in Christ? Our confidence in the scriptures that point to Him in the first place.


"People who use a whole page to respond lose their audience, especially me!"


Only those with short attention spans.

Sorry, I think I just posted pretty much what you said, lol.

 

[Loversofjesus_2018]

Loverofjesus_2018, after reading through the entire thread, I appreciate your many questions. I've lived with those questions. Here's a humble offering. The conclusion I draw at this point is that...not to be harsh or uncaring ....but, it's all up to you. This is about you, not about any other "them" whether the church or other brethren or the world. You have the wonderful God-assigned task of this one life to live and all that is needed is already available to you to meet the assignment. Find it - it's there. Study the scriptures as if your life depended on it. Take the good you find from people, churches, the daily news, wherever, and see how it fits into the picture. If your goal is Christ and the full measure of Him in your life, don't be afraid to make adjustments along the way, but be wary of compromises. You'll learn more how to spot the difference as you go along. The goal won't change, but depending on the many small choices you have along the way, you'll be constantly correcting your course so YOU might appear to change. Stay small in your own eyes, but stay strong and take your place in God's plan, because you have a voice you must add so that the brethren are encouraged (and sometimes corrected), and so that the nations hear the good news. Your voice will influence others regardless whether you intend to or not, so intend good and just set your mind and do this godly life every day. Keep in mind that the same person who today says something encouraging to you is also on a course of continual correction, so don't stumble when you find they are missing the mark in some way. It's the nature of humanity. We are called to help one another, not crush one another. We all miss the mark and come short, but we are called to something much more wonderful. Step by step keep going. You can do this. You are called by God most High to overcome and inherit something more precious than life. You have blessed my heart with your questions! Be strong!

Thanks! What you just wrote I absolutely understand! Much appreciated. I will keep on trying to seek out the truth!

 

[dms1972]

Those are partial explanations; let's not assume that Paul lays out for us anything near a complete, comprehensive and systematic view of how to understand God and the World He has made and set us within.

Thanks for that, I think we are somewhat in agreeance if not entirely.

Everything outside the Bible is of secondary import - that is to say commentary, theology, christian philosophy etc. I am not saying those things may not be helpful to an individual - but none of us can force our favorite philosopher or biblical commentator unto the church - we can only offer their cogitations as perhaps being helpful to some people. I have books outside the Bible that I personally find helpful at times. Sometimes I quote from those in the forums, but I cannot demand others accept those quotes as finally authoritative.

The Gospel writers, and the Apostles were uniquely guided in their recollections and selections and sequencing of what they recorded, and what they explain - because the Holy Spirit has in sovereignty supervised the composition of the Bible. Modern scholarship notwithstanding (upon which rests the burden of proof if 20 centuries later it wants to suggest otherwise) this has been the historic position of the main churches that the Holy Spirit supervised the writing of the Bible.

Most times people posting in the forums are debating a teaching of a particular theologian and arguing about that rather than about the Bible. They frequently endeavour to use the Bible to settle the matter. I think that is methodologically wrong if they decide the matter in advance and don't allow for the possibility themselves to be corrected by the Word and Spirit.

The only thing I believe I can do personally is allow for other christians to have their interpretation provided they are not forcing it on me. I don't go looking for arguments, or debates on contentious issues.

Yes there are systematic theologies out there - several of them. Worldview books - again several. There really is not too much disagreement on what the main worldviews today are.

But as far as Christian Theologies (rather than natural philosophies) and Evangelical Protestantism are concerned they proceed on a certain set of axioms, they proceed as I understand it from an assumption of Revelation given. They proceed on the assumption that this can be systematised properly and they argue that it is something revealed in the Old or New Testaments that is decisive in matters of dispute, and that a theologian beyond his interpretations is to give final authority to the Word and the Spirit.

A Minister or teacher of God's Word, can be approached for help because they have a wider knowledge of God's Word written, so they would be able to point someone with a question to further scriptures that give light on the matter.

 

[dms1972]

Well, I agree with the most basic sentiment expressed by those versus, BUT we do have to recognize that the Scriptures the writer is referring to are those we call the Old Testament not the New, and 2) scholars are divided over whether 2 Timothy is actually even an authenticate letter of Paul. So, this is where, as I've said elsewhere, hermeneutics, along with Philosophy of History and several other fields and a good dose of existential leaping, come into play.

Look, you may require Philosophy of History and existential leaps for some reason, but I have found there are others equally intelligent and critically minded who do not!!

Isn't it enough that the Holy Spirit confirmed through ecumenical church councils that second Timothy was to be included in the Canon of Scripture?

Is it not enough that it was included in the early Latin and Syriac versions of the New Testament?

Whether it was written by Paul or another Apostolic writer can be discussed - but the burden of proof again is on those who cast doubt on its authorship, because its generally been accepted to have been St. Paul who wrote it (Eusebius).

Some argue it doesn't contain the same teaching as Paul's earlier letters. But then one must ask why would Paul having systematically dealt in detail with core christian doctrines in several other letters, need to keep writing on that? He knew his life was nearing an end, he wanted to encourage Timothy his fellow missionary and much younger brethren to keep going and carry on the work of Gospel preaching and strengthning the churches. All he needs to say on his early teaching and letters (which has not changed) is what he says in 2 Timothy 1:13

"What you have heard from me, keep as the pattern of sound teaching, with faith and love in Christ Jesus."

Some people you might have noticed read scripture for the salvation and sancification of their souls, not merely for academic reasons.

Selah