SummerMadness

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Why Are Republican Presidents So Bad for the Economy?
A president has only limited control over the economy. And yet there has been a stark pattern in the United States for nearly a century. The economy has grown significantly faster under Democratic presidents than Republican ones.

It’s true about almost any major indicator: gross domestic product, employment, incomes, productivity, even stock prices. It’s true if you examine only the precise period when a president is in office, or instead assume that a president’s policies affect the economy only after a lag and don’t start his economic clock until months after he takes office. The gap “holds almost regardless of how you define success,” two economics professors at Princeton, Alan Blinder and Mark Watson, write. They describe it as “startlingly large.”
Since 1933, the economy has grown at an annual average rate of 4.6 percent under Democratic presidents and 2.4 percent under Republicans, according to a Times analysis. In more concrete terms: The average income of Americans would be more than double its current level if the economy had somehow grown at the Democratic rate for all of the past nine decades. If anything, that period (which is based on data availability) is too kind to Republicans, because it excludes the portion of the Great Depression that happened on Herbert Hoover’s watch.
What, then, are the most plausible theories?

First, it’s worth rejecting a few unlikely possibilities. Congressional control is not the answer. The pattern holds regardless of which party is running Congress. Deficit spending also doesn’t explain the gap: It is not the case that Democrats juice the economy by spending money and then leave Republicans to clean up the mess. Over the last four decades, in fact, Republican presidents have run up larger deficits than Democrats.

That leaves one broad possibility with a good amount of supporting evidence: Democrats have been more willing to heed economic and historical lessons about what policies actually strengthen the economy, while Republicans have often clung to theories that they want to believe — like the supposedly magical power of tax cuts and deregulation. Democrats, in short, have been more pragmatic.
 

Albion

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We just had a Republican president and the economy soared. That followed a Democratic president and the economy languished for eight long years. In other words, I wouldn't put too much stock in the idea that the political party of the President is alone what makes the difference.
 
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Pavel Mosko

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We just had a Republican president and the economy soared. That followed a Democratic president and the economy languished for eight long years. In other words, I wouldn't put too much stock in the idea that the political party of the President is alone what makes the difference.

.
 
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pitabread

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We just had a Republican president and the economy soared. That followed a Democratic president and the economy languished for eight long years.

What metrics are you basing those claims on?

Btw, it's a rhetorical question. I know you don't have a citation for this, but I'm just bringing this up to make that point.


Meanwhile:

Obama’s Last Three Years Of Job Growth All Beat Trump’s Best Year

Trump continually says that, “the U.S. is experiencing the best economy ever.” This is obvious gaslighting since the new results show that President Trump’s best year of job growth was 2.314 million in 2018 (the first year of the tax cut) but it falls short of any of Obama’s last three years. His boasts also don’t stand up when you peel the onion on GDP growth and realize that the Federal deficits during his Presidency will exceed any that were not impacted by a recession.

And:

How GDP Growth Under Trump Compares To Clinton, Obama And Other Presidents

Trump’s GDP Numbers: Trump has campaigned as the best choice for the U.S. economy. Trump often uses the stock market as a scorecard for his policies, but the best representation of the real U.S. economy is gross domestic product.

Here’s a look at annual U.S. GDP growth during Trump’s presidency. The 2020 estimate comes from the Federal Reserve:

  • 2017: +2.3%
  • 2018: +3%
  • 2019: +2.2%
  • 2020: -3.7%
How Trump Compares: Overall, U.S. GDP growth has averaged about 0.95% during Trump’s first term in office. Here’s a look at how that GDP growth stacks up to his predecessor, President Barack Obama:
  • 2009: -2.5%
  • 2010: +2.6%
  • 2011: +1.6%
  • 2012: +2.2%
  • 2013: +1.8%
  • 2014: +2.5%
  • 2015: +3.1%
  • 2016: +1.7%
In his eight years in office, U.S. GDP growth averaged 1.62% under Obama, about 70% higher than Trump’s growth rate.
 
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rambot

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We just had a Republican president and the economy soared. That followed a Democratic president and the economy languished for eight long years.
Let us know when you'd like to revisit reality because NONE of that is factually accurate. Frankly, it's distressingly inaccurate.
 
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SummerMadness

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We just had a Republican president and the economy soared. That followed a Democratic president and the economy languished for eight long years. In other words, I wouldn't put too much stock in the idea that the political party of the President is alone what makes the difference.
The linked article has figures and tables that show the actual data, your claim is simply untrue.
 
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rambot

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Out of curiousity, I'm wondering what would be the benefit of a robust discussion of reality by starting with completely nonfactual information?

I was hoping to have a meaningful(ish) conversation on, you know, presidential performance. Why should nonsense and nonfactual information be both shared AND THEN promoted as "winner" when it isn't even true?
 
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Pavel Mosko

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Alternative facts.

It's not the Obama claim he made can be easily documented.


Final Tally: Obama's Subpar Economy Cost Americans $2.4 Trillion

Obama Wins The Gold For Worst Economic Recovery Ever

Opinion | Why the ‘Obama Recovery’ Took So Long


That not hard to understand when you look at what Obamacare did to the job market in the first few years it was implemented. Lots of small companies closed because of it. Lots of other businesses pared down their staff to not get hit with the fines.
 
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We just had a Republican president and the economy soared. That followed a Democratic president and the economy languished for eight long years. In other words, I wouldn't put too much stock in the idea that the political party of the President is alone what makes the difference.
Oh, give it up. The economy didn't suddenly jump back to life at the beginning of the Trump administration. Trump deserves the credit for continuing favorable economic trends begun during Obama's first term. Good for him.
 
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pitabread

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It's not the Obama claim he made can be easily documented.


Final Tally: Obama's Subpar Economy Cost Americans $2.4 Trillion

Obama Wins The Gold For Worst Economic Recovery Ever

Opinion | Why the ‘Obama Recovery’ Took So Long


That not hard to understand when you look at what Obamacare did to the job market in the first few years it was implemented. Lots of small companies closed because of it. Lots of other businesses pared down their staff to not get hit with the fines.

Meanwhile, there is the U.S.'s botched handling of the pandemic on Trump's watch and the economic devastation that hath wrought. Do we want to talk about that?
 
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pitabread

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Out of curiousity, I'm wondering what would be the benefit of a robust discussion of reality by starting with completely nonfactual information?

I was hoping to have a meaningful(ish) conversation on, you know, presidential performance. Why should nonsense and nonfactual information be both shared AND THEN promoted as "winner" when it isn't even true?

Given the legacy of Trump's Presidency was marked by gaslighting everyone over the election, this should come as no surprise.
 
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Pavel Mosko

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Meanwhile, there is the U.S.'s botched handling of the pandemic on Trump's watch and the economic devastation that hath wrought. Do we want to talk about that?

When we say this stuff I think they call it "What Aboutism".


I've been watching Biden for decades, I don't think he can do any better. He is already moving away from his campaign promises, and never was a strong leader in the first place. He just is given more sympathy. And watching congress, it's the same thing. Trump did a lot of stuff right. Some things I would have liked better or differently. I have no faith in the Democratic Congressional leadership, they cannot even get timely Covid relief bills passed when they have complete lockdowns and people are going bankrupt and fighting evictions. They just got to lobby to give that patronage to their donors and special interests.
 
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pitabread

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When we say this stuff I think they call it "What Aboutism".

The point of comparison is Republican vs Democratic presidencies. IMHO, it's quite relevant here (especially since the first response was engaging in exactly that comparison, albeit from an alternative universe).

Trump did a lot of stuff right. Some things I would have liked better or differently. I have no faith in the Democratic Congressional leadership, they cannot even get timely Covid relief bills passed when they have complete lockdowns and people are going bankrupt and fighting evictions.

IMHO, the general social safety net is broken in the U.S. But that's a deeper issue than either Republicans or Democrats. There is a fundamental culture in the U.S. that seems to fight against improvements in that respect.
 
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Der Alte

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What metrics are you basing those claims on?
Btw, it's a rhetorical question. I know you don't have a citation for this, but I'm just bringing this up to make that point.
Meanwhile:
Obama’s Last Three Years Of Job Growth All Beat Trump’s Best Year

Trump continually says that, “the U.S. is experiencing the best economy ever.” This is obvious gaslighting since the new results show that President Trump’s best year of job growth was 2.314 million in 2018 (the first year of the tax cut) but it falls short of any of Obama’s last three years. His boasts also don’t stand up when you peel the onion on GDP growth and realize that the Federal deficits during his Presidency will exceed any that were not impacted by a recession.
And:
How GDP Growth Under Trump Compares To Clinton, Obama And Other Presidents
Trump’s GDP Numbers: Trump has campaigned as the best choice for the U.S. economy. Trump often uses the stock market as a scorecard for his policies, but the best representation of the real U.S. economy is gross domestic product.
Here’s a look at annual U.S. GDP growth during Trump’s presidency. The 2020 estimate comes from the Federal Reserve:
2017: +2.3%

  • 2018: +3%
  • 2019: +2.2%
  • 2020: -3.7%
How Trump Compares: Overall, U.S. GDP growth has averaged about 0.95% during Trump’s first term in office. Here’s a look at how that GDP growth stacks up to his predecessor, President Barack Obama:
  • 2009: -2.5%
  • 2010: +2.6%
  • 2011: +1.6%
  • 2012: +2.2%
  • 2013: +1.8%
  • 2014: +2.5%
  • 2015: +3.1%
  • 2016: +1.7%
In his eight years in office, U.S. GDP growth averaged 1.62% under Obama, about 70% higher than Trump’s growth rate.
Are you serious? I just ran those numbers through Excel. Trump's average growth rate was 2.8% Obama's was 1.63% Maybe someone ran that -2.5% as a positive. Tsk tsk.
 
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Der Alte

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Meanwhile, there is the U.S.'s botched handling of the pandemic on Trump's watch and the economic devastation that hath wrought. Do we want to talk about that?
Oh you mean the DP calling Trump Xenophobic when he restricted imports from China?
 
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pitabread

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Are you serious? I just ran those numbers through Excel. Trump's average growth rate was 2.8% Obama's was 1.63% Maybe someone ran that -2.5% as a positive. Tsk tsk.

It seems you ran the negative 3.7% in 2020 as a positive. That's how you got that 2.8%.

If you input it as the correct -3.7%, you'll get the 0.95% average they claim in the article.

(Tsk tsk. ;) )
 
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It seems you ran the negative 3.7% in 2020 as a positive. That's how you got that 2.8%.
If you input it as the correct -3.7%, you'll get the 0.95% average they claim in the article.
(Tsk tsk. ;) )
My bad I missed that. Didn't that -3.7% happen during a pandemic year vwhen businesses were closing down at a rate unseen in my lifetime 8 decades plus? I wonder if there was anything any president would have done to prevent that? Where is that miraculous recovery the DP claims they would make happen?
 
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