Who speaks in Church?

[Heavenhome]

Hello, I don't know if this is where to post or not but my question is for churches who do not have women in authority.
I'm not posting for arguments on that subject, just an answer to the two questions.

What churches would also not have women reading the scripture?
Also when did the practice of having laypeople read scripture instead of the pastor alone?

 

[Rescued One]

In many Mennonite churches, a woman might sing a duet with her husband, but they never preach. Reading scripture is only done as part of the sermon. I'm not familiar with every denomination, but most seem to be allowing female preachers.

 

[Radagast]

I'm not familiar with every denomination, but most seem to be allowing female preachers.

Actually, no. Female preachers only exist in mainline (liberal) Protestant denominations and in some Pentecostal groups.

 

[yeshuaslavejeff]

What churches would also not have women reading the scripture?

Obedient, peaceful, joyful, holy assemblies.

Also when did the practice of having laypeople read scripture instead of the pastor alone?

1st century.
"pastor" wasn't even a title or position yet, and might not be in some 'churches' today.

 

[Heavenhome]

I may not have been very clear. Some churches have laypeople read a portion of Scripture not preaching, when did this start?
Was it to make people feel included in the service, and why is it even necessary?

 

[yeshuaslavejeff]

I may not have been very clear. Some churches have laypeople read a portion of Scripture not preaching, when did this start?

In the meetings/assemblies of Ekklesia, Jesus and the Apostles and disciples saw and were "lay people" reading Scripture in the 1st century.

Was it to make people feel included in the service, and why is it even necessary?

"Feelings" were crucified/ excluded, so it was not for feeling included.

Reading TORAH , Reading SCRIPTURE, is foundational.

 

[Heavenhome]

Obedient, peaceful, joyful, holy assemblies.
I AGREE with that.

1st century.
"pastor" wasn't even a title or position yet, and might not be in some 'churches' today.

I am confused as to why we have to have (well some churches) people standing up and reading the Scripture apart from the minister. I do think we should all be reading (if we can read) from our Bibles as it is read.

 

[yeshuaslavejeff]

I am confused as to why we have to have (well some churches) people standing up and reading the Scripture apart from the minister. I do think we should all be reading (if we can read) from our Bibles as it is read.

Yes, the confusion is understandable and will continue possibly for quite some time.

The New Testament examples and instructions are not for "the minister" at all as if there is only one. This type of "one" minister is not in line with the 1st century practice of the Ekklesia, and may often thus be confusing (as well as mis-leading?).
It takes quite some time of prayer and reading Scripture personally to start to find out how the Ekklesia in the New Testament lived in obedience to Jesus.

 

[Heavenhome]

So would you say a home church is more in line with the New Testament churches?

What about in 1Timothy 3 with instructions for those in a church setting?

 

[yeshuaslavejeff]

So would you say a home church is more in line with the New Testament churches?

In the New Testament, Ekklesia are the people called out and set apart (holy) by Yahweh for Himself, regardless of how small a group or how big a group or assembly they have when they meet together to worship Yahweh.

What about in 1Timothy 3 with instructions for those in a church setting?

What about that ?

 

[Radagast]

What churches would also not have women reading the scripture?

Interesting question. I'm not sure how you'd answer it.

Also when did the practice of having laypeople read scripture instead of the pastor alone?

Traditionally (going back at least as far as 200 AD), Scripture reading was done by lectors who were specially appointed but did not need to be presbyteroi.

In a number of Reformed traditions, Scripture could be read by elders, theological students, visiting clergy, and even (in some cases) by laypeople specially appointed to that office, but not by just anybody.

Rules varied: the early Presbyterians in 1581 prohibited non-pastors from reading the Scripture. About the same time, Puritans permitted elders to do so.

During the 20th century rules gradually relaxed, with variations both between denominations and between the personal preferences of pastors.

 

[gordonhooker]

Actually, no. Female preachers only exist in mainline (liberal) Protestant denominations and in some Pentecostal groups.

Thanks be to God.

 

[Heavenhome]

In the New Testament, Ekklesia are the people called out and set apart (holy) by Yahweh for Himself, regardless of how small a group or how big a group or assembly they have when they meet together to worship Yahweh.



What about that ?

Doesn't that set out what we would call qualification's for those who had various authority within the church. So there would have been some sort of hierarchy or am I reading it wrong?

 

[Heavenhome]

In addition
If the church did not have women as preachers why would they have them standing up and reading some of the Bible?
Is this (dare I say it) wrong?

 

[yeshuaslavejeff]

Doesn't that set out what we would call qualification's for those who had various authority within the church....

no.
Every disciple is told by Jesus "You must be holy (set apart)" and every member immersed in Jesus' Name and abiding in Him is called and chosen by Yahweh and set apart by Him for Himself, His Doing.
Ekklesia is everyone who is holy, i.e. set apart by Yahweh,
everyone abiding in Jesus, following Jesus.

 

[yeshuaslavejeff]

In addition
If the church did not have women as preachers why would they have them standing up and reading some of the Bible?
Is this (dare I say it) wrong?

? Who said any in the first century had such ?

 

[bcbsr]

Hello, I don't know if this is where to post or not but my question is for churches who do not have women in authority.
I'm not posting for arguments on that subject, just an answer to the two questions.

What churches would also not have women reading the scripture?
Also when did the practice of having laypeople read scripture instead of the pastor alone?

There are a few places where that comes from. Primarily 1Cor 14:34,35 "women should remain silent in the churches. They are not allowed to speak, but must be in submission, as the Law says. If they want to inquire about something, they should ask their own husbands at home; for it is disgraceful for a woman to speak in the church."

If you read that chapter you'll note that the church was not structured as it is today as a lecture format but as a discussion in which people could stand up and say stuff. My point being originally laypeople were much more involved and the format was more of a discussion than a lecture, and that the modern one person speaks format came is later.
But even in the original format it was saying only men were allowed to speak.

 

[Heavenhome]

? Who said any in the first century had such ?

I was speaking of a church now.

 

[yeshuaslavejeff]

I was speaking of a church now.

Oh. That's a whole different story.

 

[Heavenhome]

There are a few places where that comes from. Primarily 1Cor 14:34,35 "women should remain silent in the churches. They are not allowed to speak, but must be in submission, as the Law says. If they want to inquire about something, they should ask their own husbands at home; for it is disgraceful for a woman to speak in the church."

If you read that chapter you'll note that the church was not structured as it is today as a lecture format but as a discussion in which people could stand up and say stuff. My point being originally laypeople were much more involved and the format was more of a discussion than a lecture, and that the modern one person speaks format came is later.
But even in the original format it was saying only men were allowed to speak.

There are a few places where that comes from. Primarily 1Cor 14:34,35 "women should remain silent in the churches. They are not allowed to speak, but must be in submission, as the Law says. If they want to inquire about something, they should ask their own husbands at home; for it is disgraceful for a woman to speak in the church."

If you read that chapter you'll note that the church was not structured as it is today as a lecture format but as a discussion in which people could stand up and say stuff. My point being originally laypeople were much more involved and the format was more of a discussion than a lecture, and that the modern one person speaks format came is later.
But even in the original format it was saying only men were allowed to speak.

Yes you have probably made clearer what I was trying to say. If the church as in nowadays are following only men to be allowed to speak, why then have them standing up and reading?
It seems like a compromise.