Who is the true Israel of God?
- Thread starter keras
- Start date
-
- Tags
- holy land israel of god jews
- Status
- Feb 7, 2013
- 13,716
- 2,493
- 82
- Country
- New Zealand
- Faith
- Pentecostal
- Marital Status
- Married
This is wrong, those who remain alive will be normal humans, no mention of immortality yet, except for the resurrected martyrs. Only at the GWT judgement does that happen.
However, Isaiah 65:19-25 describing the Millennium, says no child will die in infancy and those who die at 100 are considered to be youths. The world will be back as it was in Adams time.
Your other comments may or may not be correct, time will reveal.
Upvote
0
Keras Keras keras!!! The one who continues to pull verses out of context. The one who thinks he's the only one who understands old testament....and new testament prophecies. The one who uses them to pull a wool over other people's eyes.
1) The throne of God and God Himself.
2) Jesus.
3) All the angels.
4) The elders.
5) The four living creatures.
And you're arguing this is on earth and not in heaven?
Keras,
How are you gonna fit a great multitude of countless people of every language and race into a throne room in the city of Jerusalem?
They can't even fit 8 million people in Israel and is constantly expanding settlements into the west bank.
Keras, there is no such room on earth that can fit this many people.
Are you not the writer of bible prophecy study guides and not know these things? John 3:10
.
Revelation 7:9-11 New King James Version (NKJV)
9 After these things I looked, and behold, a great multitude which no one could number, of all nations, tribes, peoples, and tongues, standing before the throne and before the Lamb, clothed with white robes, with palm branches in their hands, 10 and crying out with a loud voice, saying, “Salvation belongs to our God who sits on the throne, and to the Lamb!” 11 All the angels stood around the throne and the elders and the four living creatures, and fell on their faces before the throne and worshiped God,
Well this is what's written in Revelation 7. This place consists of:9 After these things I looked, and behold, a great multitude which no one could number, of all nations, tribes, peoples, and tongues, standing before the throne and before the Lamb, clothed with white robes, with palm branches in their hands, 10 and crying out with a loud voice, saying, “Salvation belongs to our God who sits on the throne, and to the Lamb!” 11 All the angels stood around the throne and the elders and the four living creatures, and fell on their faces before the throne and worshiped God,
1) The throne of God and God Himself.
2) Jesus.
3) All the angels.
4) The elders.
5) The four living creatures.
And you're arguing this is on earth and not in heaven?
Keras,
How are you gonna fit a great multitude of countless people of every language and race into a throne room in the city of Jerusalem?
They can't even fit 8 million people in Israel and is constantly expanding settlements into the west bank.
Keras, there is no such room on earth that can fit this many people.
Are you not the writer of bible prophecy study guides and not know these things? John 3:10
.
Last edited:
Upvote
0
Let suppose the First Resurrection is only for the Christians martyrs ,there will be mortal people in flesh and blood and immortal people during the Millennium.
Isaiah 65:19-25 is not describing the millennium see verse 17
Isaiah 65:17-25 describe life as it will be on THE NEW EARTH after the millennium ....
Isaiah 65
17 For, behold, I create new heavens and a new earth: and the former shall not be remembered, nor come into mind.
18 But be ye glad and rejoice for ever in that which I create: for, behold, I create Jerusalem a rejoicing, and her people a joy.
19 And I will rejoice in Jerusalem, and joy in my people: and the voice of weeping shall be no more heard in her, nor the voice of crying.
20 There shall be no more thence an infant of days, nor an old man that hath not filled his days: for the child shall die an hundred years old; but the sinner being an hundred years old shall be accursed.
Upvote
0
- Feb 7, 2013
- 13,716
- 2,493
- 82
- Country
- New Zealand
- Faith
- Pentecostal
- Marital Status
- Married
We have a serious anomaly here, because Rev 20:14 says there will be no more death in Eternity.
We HAVE to believe that Isaiah 65:17-25 is talking about the Millennium period and it isn't wrong to say the heavens and the earth will be renewed then, as what happens from the Sixth Seal thru the Great Trib, is cosmic and earthly devastation.
Upvote
0
- Feb 7, 2013
- 13,716
- 2,493
- 82
- Country
- New Zealand
- Faith
- Pentecostal
- Marital Status
- Married
(staff edit)
We are plainly told that Jesus will be standing on Mt Zion, Revelation 14:1, when He selects the 144k from out of His righteous Christian people, gathered in the Holy Land.
The other thing you can't comprehend, is God and His Throne, etc, are spiritual. We are unable to see spiritual things, only if He allows it, as He did for Ezekiel 1:1, Stephen- Acts 7:56
Revelation 7:1-17 describes entirely earthly scenes and it is only those who believe the false rapture theory, that think any of it is in heaven. With the extremely pretentious notion of themselves in heaven, dressed in white robes and waving palm branches.
BTW, I have been all around Israel and there is plenty of open space. I walked the Jesus Trail from Nazareth to Tiberius and hardly saw anybody. There were coneys in the rocks at Hattim! Their West Bank settelments are for political reasons.
What you fail to understand, is the complete change to Jerusalem and the whole earth after the devastations of the Sixth Seal and later the Great Trib events.
We are plainly told that Jesus will be standing on Mt Zion, Revelation 14:1, when He selects the 144k from out of His righteous Christian people, gathered in the Holy Land.
The other thing you can't comprehend, is God and His Throne, etc, are spiritual. We are unable to see spiritual things, only if He allows it, as He did for Ezekiel 1:1, Stephen- Acts 7:56
Revelation 7:1-17 describes entirely earthly scenes and it is only those who believe the false rapture theory, that think any of it is in heaven. With the extremely pretentious notion of themselves in heaven, dressed in white robes and waving palm branches.
BTW, I have been all around Israel and there is plenty of open space. I walked the Jesus Trail from Nazareth to Tiberius and hardly saw anybody. There were coneys in the rocks at Hattim! Their West Bank settelments are for political reasons.
Last edited by a moderator:
Upvote
0
No anomaly at all...
Death was thrown into the lake of fire Revelation 20:14...
This apply to those of us redeemed of the present Earth Age who started with Adam and Eve ...and who will End after the Great White Throne Judgment Revelation 20:7-15.
Isaiah 65:17-25 is about the New Earth described in Revelation 21 and Revelation 22 who will exist after the millennium after the Great White Throne Judgement Revelation 20:7-15.
Isaiah 65
17 For, behold, I create new heavens and a new earth: and the former shall not be remembered, nor come into mind.
Last edited:
Upvote
0
"We are plainly told that Jesus will be standing on Mt Zion, Revelation 14:1, when He selects the 144k from out of His righteous Christian people, gathered in the Holy Land."
The 144000 are the sealed mortals of the 12 tribes of Israel .... these are not of the Gentiles of the nations
These will spread the gospel of the Lord's soon coming millennial kingdom, first to Israel, and then to the Gentile nations during the tribulation [Matthew 24:14]
Their witness will start at the beginning of the tribulation period and they will be protected by the Lord's sealing from the wiles of the period [Revelation 7:1-8; 14:1-7]
These are not of today's "church" who will have already been made immortal just before the tribulation begins .... and these are seen in Heaven during the tribulation [Revelation 7:9-17; 11:1; 12:12; 13:6; 17:14; 19:1-9; 19:14; 20:4 [those already on thrones]]
The "true Israel of God" are those of the ethnic nation of Israel that have and will turn to their Messiah and King .... this counting does not include the believing Gentiles of the nations
The 144000 are the sealed mortals of the 12 tribes of Israel .... these are not of the Gentiles of the nations
These will spread the gospel of the Lord's soon coming millennial kingdom, first to Israel, and then to the Gentile nations during the tribulation [Matthew 24:14]
Their witness will start at the beginning of the tribulation period and they will be protected by the Lord's sealing from the wiles of the period [Revelation 7:1-8; 14:1-7]
These are not of today's "church" who will have already been made immortal just before the tribulation begins .... and these are seen in Heaven during the tribulation [Revelation 7:9-17; 11:1; 12:12; 13:6; 17:14; 19:1-9; 19:14; 20:4 [those already on thrones]]
The "true Israel of God" are those of the ethnic nation of Israel that have and will turn to their Messiah and King .... this counting does not include the believing Gentiles of the nations
Last edited:
Upvote
0
Those sitting on thrones in Heaven are 24 elders celestial beings.The twelve apostles will be given twelve thrones on the earth to judge the twelve tribes of Israel when Jesus will Come on the Earth .
We know that you imagine yourself sitting on a throne with the power to Judge those who disagree with you...
Last edited:
Upvote
0
Kings sit on thrones RB [Revelation 1:6]
Here they are again dwelling in heaven during the tribulation [Revelation 7:9; 11:7; 12:12; 13:6; 17:4; 19:1-9; 19:14]
And the same will rule with the Lord upon the earth during His coming millennial kingdom [Revelation 20:4]
(staff edit)
Who is the true "Israel of God" RB?
Here they are again dwelling in heaven during the tribulation [Revelation 7:9; 11:7; 12:12; 13:6; 17:4; 19:1-9; 19:14]
And the same will rule with the Lord upon the earth during His coming millennial kingdom [Revelation 20:4]
(staff edit)
Who is the true "Israel of God" RB?
Last edited by a moderator:
Upvote
0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums
Revelation 7:9
The great multitude to large to number wearing white robes are seen before the throne of the Lamb (Jesus) in Heaven, they are not sitting on thrones....They are the souls of millions of Christians who died martyrs since Jesus have ascended to Heaven ...
Revelation 20:4 that you refers mention that these will be those beheaded by the Beast who will reign with Jesus....
Last edited:
Upvote
0
You don't have to worry about this RB
You will not be there on a throne during the tribulation .... or maybe even after [Revelation 5:1-19; 7:9-17; 11:1; 13:6; 17:14; 19:1-9]
Neither will you be one of these [Revelation 19:14]
Did you know that being on a "throne" is symbolic for participating in the Lord's government?
Your destiny according to your posts will be on the earth during the tribulation as a mortal
Here is what the Lord says about this fate [Revelation 3:15-19; 6:12-17]
You will not be there on a throne during the tribulation .... or maybe even after [Revelation 5:1-19; 7:9-17; 11:1; 13:6; 17:14; 19:1-9]
Neither will you be one of these [Revelation 19:14]
Did you know that being on a "throne" is symbolic for participating in the Lord's government?
Your destiny according to your posts will be on the earth during the tribulation as a mortal
Here is what the Lord says about this fate [Revelation 3:15-19; 6:12-17]
Upvote
0
You have lot of imagination believing that it is you or any other human(s) that John saw sitting on a throne in Heaven ---
The ONE that John saw mentioned in Revelation 5:1-19 in the midst of the throne and of the four beasts, and in the midst of the elders,is Jesus [the Lamb]...
The four beasts (verse 6)and the twenty four elders (verse 8) are celestial beings who were created by God with the angels eon of time before that God created the material universe ,they are part of the administrative Heavenly realm.
The one sitting on the Throne in Heaven is God the father (verse 7)
Do you believe that one day you will sit on God's Throne in Heaven ?
If so,you have been deceived.
Take notice that you will be Judged by God the same way that you stubbornly Judge others.
Revelation 5:1-19
6 And I beheld, and, lo, in the midst of the throne and of the four beasts, and in the midst of the elders, stood a Lamb as it had been slain, having seven horns and seven eyes, which are the seven Spirits of God sent forth into all the earth.
7 And he came and took the book out of the right hand of him that sat upon the throne.
8 And when he had taken the book, the four beasts and four and twenty elders fell down before the Lamb, having every one of them harps, and golden vials full of odours, which are the prayers of saints.
Last edited:
Upvote
0
- Feb 7, 2013
- 13,716
- 2,493
- 82
- Country
- New Zealand
- Faith
- Pentecostal
- Marital Status
- Married
This statement totally conflicts with New Testament teaching of how the Israel of God is people from every tribe, race, nation and language. Revelation 5:9, Revelation 7:9 The Jews are NOT true Israel.
Please cease making false statements and your assertion of the 'church' being made immortal before the Lord's wrath, for which there is no scriptural support.
(staff edit)
Last edited by a moderator:
Upvote
0
(staff edit)
"This statement totally conflicts with New Testament teaching of how the Israel of God is people from every tribe, race, nation and language. Revelation 5:9, Revelation 7:9 TheJews are NOT true Israel."
[Revelation 5:5; 7:1-8]
Romans
11:25 For I would not, brethren, that ye should be ignorant of this mystery, lest ye should be wise in your own conceits; that blindness in part is happened to Israel, until the fulness of the Gentiles be come in.
11:26 And so all Israel shall be saved: as it is written, There shall come out of Sion the Deliverer, and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob:
11:27 For this is my covenant unto them, when I shall take away their sins.
11:28 As concerning the gospel, they are enemies for your sakes: but as touching the election, they are beloved for the father's sakes.
11:29 For the gifts and calling of God are without repentance.
11:30 For as ye in times past have not believed God, yet have now obtained mercy through their unbelief:
11:31 Even so have these also now not believed, that through your mercy they also may obtain mercy.
11:32 For God hath concluded them all in unbelief, that he might have mercy upon all.
11:33 O the depth of the riches both of the wisdom and knowledge of God! how unsearchable are his judgments, and his ways past finding out!
11:34 For who hath known the mind of the Lord? or who hath been his counsellor?
11:35 Or who hath first given to him, and it shall be recompensed unto him again?
11:36 For of him, and through him, and to him, are all things: to whom be glory for ever. Amen.
Ezekiel
36:1 Also, thou son of man, prophesy unto the mountains of Israel, and say, Ye mountains of Israel, hear the word of the LORD:
36:2 Thus saith the Lord GOD; Because the enemy hath said against you, Aha, even the ancient high places are ours in possession:
36:3 Therefore prophesy and say, Thus saith the Lord GOD; Because they have made you desolate, and swallowed you up on every side, that ye might be a possession unto the residue of the heathen, and ye are taken up in the lips of talkers, and are an infamy of the people:
36:4 Therefore, ye mountains of Israel, hear the word of the Lord GOD; Thus saith the Lord GOD to the mountains, and to the hills, to the rivers, and to the valleys, to the desolate wastes, and to the cities that are forsaken, which became a prey and derision to the residue of the heathen that are round about;
36:5 Therefore thus saith the Lord GOD; Surely in the fire of my jealousy have I spoken against the residue of the heathen, and against all Idumea, which have appointed my land into their possession with the joy of all their heart, with despiteful minds, to cast it out for a prey.
36:6 Prophesy therefore concerning the land of Israel, and say unto the mountains, and to the hills, to the rivers, and to the valleys, Thus saith the Lord GOD; Behold, I have spoken in my jealousy and in my fury, because ye have borne the shame of the heathen:
36:7 Therefore thus saith the Lord GOD; I have lifted up mine hand, Surely the heathen that are about you, they shall bear their shame.
36:8 But ye, O mountains of Israel, ye shall shoot forth your branches, and yield your fruit to my people of Israel; for they are at hand to come.
36:9 For, behold, I am for you, and I will turn unto you, and ye shall be tilled and sown:
36:10 And I will multiply men upon you, all the house of Israel, even all of it: and the cities shall be inhabited, and the wastes shall be builded:
36:11 And I will multiply upon you man and beast; and they shall increase and bring fruit: and I will settle you after your old estates, and will do better unto you than at your beginnings: and ye shall know that I am the LORD.
36:12 Yea, I will cause men to walk upon you, even my people Israel; and they shall possess thee, and thou shalt be their inheritance, and thou shalt no more henceforth bereave them of men.
36:13 Thus saith the Lord GOD; Because they say unto you, Thou land devourest up men, and hast bereaved thy nations:
36:14 Therefore thou shalt devour men no more, neither bereave thy nations any more, saith the Lord GOD.
36:15 Neither will I cause men to hear in thee the shame of the heathen any more, neither shalt thou bear the reproach of the people any more, neither shalt thou cause thy nations to fall any more, saith the Lord GOD.
36:16 Moreover the word of the LORD came unto me, saying,
36:17 Son of man, when the house of Israel dwelt in their own land, they defiled it by their own way and by their doings: their way was before me as the uncleanness of a removed woman.
36:18 Wherefore I poured my fury upon them for the blood that they had shed upon the land, and for their idols wherewith they had polluted it:
36:19 And I scattered them among the heathen, and they were dispersed through the countries: according to their way and according to their doings I judged them.
36:20 And when they entered unto the heathen, whither they went, they profaned my holy name, when they said to them, These are the people of the LORD, and are gone forth out of his land.
36:21 But I had pity for mine holy name, which the house of Israel had profaned among the heathen, whither they went.
36:22 Therefore say unto the house of Israel, thus saith the Lord GOD; I do not this for your sakes, O house of Israel, but for mine holy name's sake, which ye have profaned among the heathen, whither ye went.
36:23 And I will sanctify my great name, which was profaned among the heathen, which ye have profaned in the midst of them; and the heathen shall know that I am the LORD, saith the Lord GOD, when I shall be sanctified in you before their eyes.
36:24 For I will take you from among the heathen, and gather you out of all countries, and will bring you into your own land.
36:25 Then will I sprinkle clean water upon you, and ye shall be clean: from all your filthiness, and from all your idols, will I cleanse you.
36:26 A new heart also will I give you, and a new spirit will I put within you: and I will take away the stony heart out of your flesh, and I will give you an heart of flesh.
36:27 And I will put my spirit within you, and cause you to walk in my statutes, and ye shall keep my judgments, and do them.
36:28 And ye shall dwell in the land that I gave to your fathers; and ye shall be my people, and I will be your God.
36:29 I will also save you from all your uncleannesses: and I will call for the corn, and will increase it, and lay no famine upon you.
36:30 And I will multiply the fruit of the tree, and the increase of the field, that ye shall receive no more reproach of famine among the heathen.
36:31 Then shall ye remember your own evil ways, and your doings that were not good, and shall lothe yourselves in your own sight for your iniquities and for your abominations.
36:32 Not for your sakes do I this, saith the Lord GOD, be it known unto you: be ashamed and confounded for your own ways, O house of Israel.
36:33 Thus saith the Lord GOD; In the day that I shall have cleansed you from all your iniquities I will also cause you to dwell in the cities, and the wastes shall be builded.
36:34 And the desolate land shall be tilled, whereas it lay desolate in the sight of all that passed by.
36:35 And they shall say, This land that was desolate is become like the garden of Eden; and the waste and desolate and ruined cities are become fenced, and are inhabited.
36:36 Then the heathen that are left round about you shall know that I the LORD build the ruined places, and plant that that was desolate: I the LORD have spoken it, and I will do it.
36:37 Thus saith the Lord GOD; I will yet for this be enquired of by the house of Israel, to do it for them; I will increase them with men like a flock.
36:38 As the holy flock, as the flock of Jerusalem in her solemn feasts; so shall the waste cities be filled with flocks of men: and they shall know that I am the LORD.
Let's do some testing on your dogma about Israel not retaining separate national standing today and into the future
Interpret the following scriptures for the forum [Ezekiel 38; 39]
Then we will select other pertinent and related scriptures for you to interpret
I want to see how you substantiate your idea that you being a Gentile are one of the "true Israel of God"
"This statement totally conflicts with New Testament teaching of how the Israel of God is people from every tribe, race, nation and language. Revelation 5:9, Revelation 7:9 TheJews are NOT true Israel."
[Revelation 5:5; 7:1-8]
Romans
11:25 For I would not, brethren, that ye should be ignorant of this mystery, lest ye should be wise in your own conceits; that blindness in part is happened to Israel, until the fulness of the Gentiles be come in.
11:26 And so all Israel shall be saved: as it is written, There shall come out of Sion the Deliverer, and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob:
11:27 For this is my covenant unto them, when I shall take away their sins.
11:28 As concerning the gospel, they are enemies for your sakes: but as touching the election, they are beloved for the father's sakes.
11:29 For the gifts and calling of God are without repentance.
11:30 For as ye in times past have not believed God, yet have now obtained mercy through their unbelief:
11:31 Even so have these also now not believed, that through your mercy they also may obtain mercy.
11:32 For God hath concluded them all in unbelief, that he might have mercy upon all.
11:33 O the depth of the riches both of the wisdom and knowledge of God! how unsearchable are his judgments, and his ways past finding out!
11:34 For who hath known the mind of the Lord? or who hath been his counsellor?
11:35 Or who hath first given to him, and it shall be recompensed unto him again?
11:36 For of him, and through him, and to him, are all things: to whom be glory for ever. Amen.
Ezekiel
36:1 Also, thou son of man, prophesy unto the mountains of Israel, and say, Ye mountains of Israel, hear the word of the LORD:
36:2 Thus saith the Lord GOD; Because the enemy hath said against you, Aha, even the ancient high places are ours in possession:
36:3 Therefore prophesy and say, Thus saith the Lord GOD; Because they have made you desolate, and swallowed you up on every side, that ye might be a possession unto the residue of the heathen, and ye are taken up in the lips of talkers, and are an infamy of the people:
36:4 Therefore, ye mountains of Israel, hear the word of the Lord GOD; Thus saith the Lord GOD to the mountains, and to the hills, to the rivers, and to the valleys, to the desolate wastes, and to the cities that are forsaken, which became a prey and derision to the residue of the heathen that are round about;
36:5 Therefore thus saith the Lord GOD; Surely in the fire of my jealousy have I spoken against the residue of the heathen, and against all Idumea, which have appointed my land into their possession with the joy of all their heart, with despiteful minds, to cast it out for a prey.
36:6 Prophesy therefore concerning the land of Israel, and say unto the mountains, and to the hills, to the rivers, and to the valleys, Thus saith the Lord GOD; Behold, I have spoken in my jealousy and in my fury, because ye have borne the shame of the heathen:
36:7 Therefore thus saith the Lord GOD; I have lifted up mine hand, Surely the heathen that are about you, they shall bear their shame.
36:8 But ye, O mountains of Israel, ye shall shoot forth your branches, and yield your fruit to my people of Israel; for they are at hand to come.
36:9 For, behold, I am for you, and I will turn unto you, and ye shall be tilled and sown:
36:10 And I will multiply men upon you, all the house of Israel, even all of it: and the cities shall be inhabited, and the wastes shall be builded:
36:11 And I will multiply upon you man and beast; and they shall increase and bring fruit: and I will settle you after your old estates, and will do better unto you than at your beginnings: and ye shall know that I am the LORD.
36:12 Yea, I will cause men to walk upon you, even my people Israel; and they shall possess thee, and thou shalt be their inheritance, and thou shalt no more henceforth bereave them of men.
36:13 Thus saith the Lord GOD; Because they say unto you, Thou land devourest up men, and hast bereaved thy nations:
36:14 Therefore thou shalt devour men no more, neither bereave thy nations any more, saith the Lord GOD.
36:15 Neither will I cause men to hear in thee the shame of the heathen any more, neither shalt thou bear the reproach of the people any more, neither shalt thou cause thy nations to fall any more, saith the Lord GOD.
36:16 Moreover the word of the LORD came unto me, saying,
36:17 Son of man, when the house of Israel dwelt in their own land, they defiled it by their own way and by their doings: their way was before me as the uncleanness of a removed woman.
36:18 Wherefore I poured my fury upon them for the blood that they had shed upon the land, and for their idols wherewith they had polluted it:
36:19 And I scattered them among the heathen, and they were dispersed through the countries: according to their way and according to their doings I judged them.
36:20 And when they entered unto the heathen, whither they went, they profaned my holy name, when they said to them, These are the people of the LORD, and are gone forth out of his land.
36:21 But I had pity for mine holy name, which the house of Israel had profaned among the heathen, whither they went.
36:22 Therefore say unto the house of Israel, thus saith the Lord GOD; I do not this for your sakes, O house of Israel, but for mine holy name's sake, which ye have profaned among the heathen, whither ye went.
36:23 And I will sanctify my great name, which was profaned among the heathen, which ye have profaned in the midst of them; and the heathen shall know that I am the LORD, saith the Lord GOD, when I shall be sanctified in you before their eyes.
36:24 For I will take you from among the heathen, and gather you out of all countries, and will bring you into your own land.
36:25 Then will I sprinkle clean water upon you, and ye shall be clean: from all your filthiness, and from all your idols, will I cleanse you.
36:26 A new heart also will I give you, and a new spirit will I put within you: and I will take away the stony heart out of your flesh, and I will give you an heart of flesh.
36:27 And I will put my spirit within you, and cause you to walk in my statutes, and ye shall keep my judgments, and do them.
36:28 And ye shall dwell in the land that I gave to your fathers; and ye shall be my people, and I will be your God.
36:29 I will also save you from all your uncleannesses: and I will call for the corn, and will increase it, and lay no famine upon you.
36:30 And I will multiply the fruit of the tree, and the increase of the field, that ye shall receive no more reproach of famine among the heathen.
36:31 Then shall ye remember your own evil ways, and your doings that were not good, and shall lothe yourselves in your own sight for your iniquities and for your abominations.
36:32 Not for your sakes do I this, saith the Lord GOD, be it known unto you: be ashamed and confounded for your own ways, O house of Israel.
36:33 Thus saith the Lord GOD; In the day that I shall have cleansed you from all your iniquities I will also cause you to dwell in the cities, and the wastes shall be builded.
36:34 And the desolate land shall be tilled, whereas it lay desolate in the sight of all that passed by.
36:35 And they shall say, This land that was desolate is become like the garden of Eden; and the waste and desolate and ruined cities are become fenced, and are inhabited.
36:36 Then the heathen that are left round about you shall know that I the LORD build the ruined places, and plant that that was desolate: I the LORD have spoken it, and I will do it.
36:37 Thus saith the Lord GOD; I will yet for this be enquired of by the house of Israel, to do it for them; I will increase them with men like a flock.
36:38 As the holy flock, as the flock of Jerusalem in her solemn feasts; so shall the waste cities be filled with flocks of men: and they shall know that I am the LORD.
Let's do some testing on your dogma about Israel not retaining separate national standing today and into the future
Interpret the following scriptures for the forum [Ezekiel 38; 39]
Then we will select other pertinent and related scriptures for you to interpret
I want to see how you substantiate your idea that you being a Gentile are one of the "true Israel of God"
Last edited by a moderator:
Upvote
0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums
- Jun 13, 2015
- 4,191
- 2,818
- Country
- United States
- Faith
- Christian
- Marital Status
- Married
- Politics
- US-Others
Israel is another name for Jesus. Jesus alone is the legitimate heir of God's promises. And the grace of God is that all who trust in Jesus partake in his heritage. Consider these verses in Isaiah:
Isa 49:1 Listen, O isles, unto me; and hearken, ye people, from far; The LORD hath called me from the womb; from the bowels of my mother hath he made mention of my name.
Isa 49:2 And he hath made my mouth like a sharp sword; in the shadow of his hand hath he hid me, and made me a polished shaft; in his quiver hath he hid me;
Isa 49:3 And said unto me, Thou art my servant, O Israel, in whom I will be glorified.
The whole chapter speaks of the Messiah.
Upvote
0
- Feb 7, 2013
- 13,716
- 2,493
- 82
- Country
- New Zealand
- Faith
- Pentecostal
- Marital Status
- Married
A nation that bears the proper fruit: Matthew 21:43
Who are the "legitimate heirs" of God's promises? They are people, from every tribe, race, nation and language, saved by His power and grace, who will occupy all of the holy Land in the last days. They are the people of God who will be there when the Anti-Christ briefly takes over the new nation of Beulah:
Daniel 7:25 He will defy the Most High and conquer His holy people….. Zechariah 14:1-2
Revelation 13:7 The Beast was allowed to wage war on God’s people and to defeat them………. Revelation 12:13
I'm reluctant to refer to them as "Righteous Christians" or the "Israel of God", because both of these terms "Christians" and "Israel" have become corrupted by too much sin among too many of their respective communities. Christians can be anyone who enters a church and Israel is usurped by the Jewish State.
Paul doesn't cite either term in his comments about this matter in Ephesians 2:11-22. He refers to this new unified "body" of "reconciled" individuals, who are either Jews or Gentiles, as "members of the household of God" (vs 19), or as they are identified in other texts as "the people of God" or as the "sons of the Living God".
Paul makes it clear in several texts that God is bringing together a new group of "righteous" individuals to whom God will give His promised blessings.
Isaiah 51:1-2 Listen to me, all you who keep the Laws of God, all you who seek Him and who follow righteousness. Remember the quarry you were hewn from, your spiritual origin, Abraham is your father and Sarah gave you birth. When God called him, he was but one, God blessed him and now his righteous seed are many.
Romans 2:29 The person who belongs to God is not outwardly a Jew, physically circumcised, but one who is spiritually circumcised of the heart……
One term that could be used to refer to this new body of people, is Nazarenes. That word is used extensively in the Middle east for Christians and it means : the set apart ones or the people dedicated to God.
The very many prophesies God has made about His people living in peace and security in all of that area given so long ago to Abraham and his seed, have never been fulfilled. They will be, God will not forget His Land: Isaiah 49:14-16 it is inscribed onto His hands…. or His righteous people, Isaiah 65:9 I will give heirs to the Patriarchs, My chosen ones will take possession of the Land and those who serve Me will live there.
THIS is the next great promise we look forward to, fulfilling our destiny of being the people of God and is what we Christians have been chosen and prepared for:
Isaiah 49:8, These are the Words of the Lord: In the time of My favor, I will answer your call, Acts 2:21, and protect you. I formed you and destined you to be a light for the nations, restoring the Land and living in its now desolate areas.
Isaiah 43:10 You are My witnesses, you are My servants chosen by Me. To believe in Me and to know that I am God.
Isaiah 43:19-21 Behold, I shall do new things, they will happen. I will make a way through the desert and water for My people to drink. This people I have prepared for Myself and they will proclaim My glory. Isaiah 35:1-10
Jeremiah 33:10-12 See this Land, it lies in ruins without people or animals. [This is how the entire Middle East will be after the devastation of the Lord’s Day of fiery wrath] Yet in this place will once more be heard to sounds of joy and gladness, of bride and bridegroom, of voices shouting: Praise to the Lord God, for His love endures forever…. Joel 2:18-30
Then, all that is prophesied to occur before the glorious Return of Jesus must happen and it will be the survivors of Beulah, the new nation in all of the holy Land, Isaiah 62:1-5, who will greet Jesus as He comes for His Millennial reign.
Who are the "legitimate heirs" of God's promises? They are people, from every tribe, race, nation and language, saved by His power and grace, who will occupy all of the holy Land in the last days. They are the people of God who will be there when the Anti-Christ briefly takes over the new nation of Beulah:
Daniel 7:25 He will defy the Most High and conquer His holy people….. Zechariah 14:1-2
Revelation 13:7 The Beast was allowed to wage war on God’s people and to defeat them………. Revelation 12:13
I'm reluctant to refer to them as "Righteous Christians" or the "Israel of God", because both of these terms "Christians" and "Israel" have become corrupted by too much sin among too many of their respective communities. Christians can be anyone who enters a church and Israel is usurped by the Jewish State.
Paul doesn't cite either term in his comments about this matter in Ephesians 2:11-22. He refers to this new unified "body" of "reconciled" individuals, who are either Jews or Gentiles, as "members of the household of God" (vs 19), or as they are identified in other texts as "the people of God" or as the "sons of the Living God".
Paul makes it clear in several texts that God is bringing together a new group of "righteous" individuals to whom God will give His promised blessings.
Isaiah 51:1-2 Listen to me, all you who keep the Laws of God, all you who seek Him and who follow righteousness. Remember the quarry you were hewn from, your spiritual origin, Abraham is your father and Sarah gave you birth. When God called him, he was but one, God blessed him and now his righteous seed are many.
Romans 2:29 The person who belongs to God is not outwardly a Jew, physically circumcised, but one who is spiritually circumcised of the heart……
One term that could be used to refer to this new body of people, is Nazarenes. That word is used extensively in the Middle east for Christians and it means : the set apart ones or the people dedicated to God.
The very many prophesies God has made about His people living in peace and security in all of that area given so long ago to Abraham and his seed, have never been fulfilled. They will be, God will not forget His Land: Isaiah 49:14-16 it is inscribed onto His hands…. or His righteous people, Isaiah 65:9 I will give heirs to the Patriarchs, My chosen ones will take possession of the Land and those who serve Me will live there.
THIS is the next great promise we look forward to, fulfilling our destiny of being the people of God and is what we Christians have been chosen and prepared for:
Isaiah 49:8, These are the Words of the Lord: In the time of My favor, I will answer your call, Acts 2:21, and protect you. I formed you and destined you to be a light for the nations, restoring the Land and living in its now desolate areas.
Isaiah 43:10 You are My witnesses, you are My servants chosen by Me. To believe in Me and to know that I am God.
Isaiah 43:19-21 Behold, I shall do new things, they will happen. I will make a way through the desert and water for My people to drink. This people I have prepared for Myself and they will proclaim My glory. Isaiah 35:1-10
Jeremiah 33:10-12 See this Land, it lies in ruins without people or animals. [This is how the entire Middle East will be after the devastation of the Lord’s Day of fiery wrath] Yet in this place will once more be heard to sounds of joy and gladness, of bride and bridegroom, of voices shouting: Praise to the Lord God, for His love endures forever…. Joel 2:18-30
Then, all that is prophesied to occur before the glorious Return of Jesus must happen and it will be the survivors of Beulah, the new nation in all of the holy Land, Isaiah 62:1-5, who will greet Jesus as He comes for His Millennial reign.
Last edited:
Upvote
0
Yes and you can't seem to comprehend that it's not possible to take a trip to Israel and think you'll find God's throne there on earth.
Israel is only the size of New Jersey. Still not possible to fit a great multitude of people that no one can count.
(staff edit)
.
Last edited by a moderator:
Upvote
0
- Feb 7, 2013
- 13,716
- 2,493
- 82
- Country
- New Zealand
- Faith
- Pentecostal
- Marital Status
- Married
(staff edit)
Of course not. God reveals Himself only at the right times and places.
That His Throne will be seen on Mt Zion when the 144,000 are selected, is plainly stated in Revelation 14:3
(staff edit)
Of course not. God reveals Himself only at the right times and places.
That His Throne will be seen on Mt Zion when the 144,000 are selected, is plainly stated in Revelation 14:3
The new nation of Beulah, Isaiah 62:1-5, will encompass all the area given to Abraham, from the Nile to the Euphrates. Genesis 15:18
(staff edit)
Last edited by a moderator:
Upvote
0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums
- Nov 5, 2011
- 44,419
- 6,800
- Country
- United States
- Faith
- Christian
- Marital Status
- Single
- Politics
- US-Republican
Upvote
0
- Status
Similar threads
