WHO IS GOD'S TRUE CHURCH ACCORDING TO GOD'S WORD?

[Norbert L]

Yes, love is the answer. Does the 10 C tell us to believe in the name of Jesus Christ and to love one another? No. They were for people while they were yet sinners. But Jesus took away our sin, and in Him there is no sin.

I in order to establish that, to find out if those commandments require believing in the name of Jesus Christ, we'd need to know Who gave Moses those 10 commandments. In which person of the Trinity were they handed over.

The ESV and numerous other translations point out in Jude 1:5, "Now I want to remind you, although you once fully knew it, that Jesus, who saved a people out of the land of Egypt, afterward destroyed those who did not believe."

Implicitly it is possible to come to the conclusion that it was Jesus in His preincarnate form giving Moses those commandments. In other words Moses would understand that worshiping God also meant worshiping in the name of Jesus Christ.

 

[Dave L]

WHO IS GOD'S TRUE CHURCH ACCORDING TO GOD'S WORD?

Firstly I believe God has his people in EVERY CHURCH as long as they are living up to all the KNOWLEDGE God has revealed to them through his WORD.

JOHN 10:16 And other sheep I have, which are not of this fold: them also I must bring, and they shall hear my voice; and there shall be one fold, and one shepherd.

However God is calling his people out from following man made traditions to worship God in Spirit and in truth.

JOHN 4:24 God is a Spirit: and they that worship him must worship him in spirit and in truth.

WHO IS GOD'S CHURCH?

IS GOD'S CHURCH A BUILDING or a CHURCH ORGANISATION?

Before we look at who God's WORD says is God's true Church let's start off by looking at the GREEK meaning of the word Church which is ἐκκλησία which means a calling out or meeting.

This links in very nicely with

MATTHEW 18:20 For where two or three are gathered together in my name, there am I in the midst of them.

A Church therefore is the people the BELIEVE and FOLLOW God's WORD. They are the called out and Jesus is in the midst of them.

WHO IS GOD'S TRUE CHURCH ACCORDING TO GOD'S WORD?

1 JOHN 2:3-4
3, And hereby we do know that we know him, if we keep <ALL> his commandments. 4, He that saith, I know him, and keeps not his commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him.

REVELATION 12:17
And the dragon was wroth with the woman, and went to make war with the remnant of her seed, which keep the commandments of God, and have the testimony of Jesus Christ.

REVELATION 14:12
Here is the patience of the saints: here are they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus.

REVELATION 22:14
Blessed are they that do his commandments, that they may have right to the tree of life, and may enter in through the gates into the city.

Notice God's people keep ALL of God's Commandments through FAITH in Christ?

NOTE: God's saints keep ALL THE COMMANDMENTS of God. It is these people that are a remnant that the devil is making war with. They are called God's saints and these are the ones that have right to the tree of life.

How many Church's do you see keeping all of God's Commandments?

What are your thoughts?

“And hath put all things under his feet, and gave him to be the head over all things to the church, Which is his body, the fulness of him that filleth all in all.” (Ephesians 1:22–23)

But his body is found throughout Christendom and beyond. No single group is his body, but contains his body as far as believers remain therein.

 

[SteveIndy]

WHO IS GOD'S TRUE CHURCH ACCORDING TO GOD'S WORD?

Firstly I believe God has his people in EVERY CHURCH as long as they are living up to all the KNOWLEDGE God has revealed to them through his WORD.

JOHN 10:16 And other sheep I have, which are not of this fold: them also I must bring, and they shall hear my voice; and there shall be one fold, and one shepherd.

However God is calling his people out from following man made traditions to worship God in Spirit and in truth.

JOHN 4:24 God is a Spirit: and they that worship him must worship him in spirit and in truth.

WHO IS GOD'S CHURCH?

IS GOD'S CHURCH A BUILDING or a CHURCH ORGANISATION?

Before we look at who God's WORD says is God's true Church let's start off by looking at the GREEK meaning of the word Church which is ἐκκλησία which means a calling out or meeting.

This links in very nicely with

MATTHEW 18:20 For where two or three are gathered together in my name, there am I in the midst of them.

A Church therefore is the people the BELIEVE and FOLLOW God's WORD. They are the called out and Jesus is in the midst of them.

WHO IS GOD'S TRUE CHURCH ACCORDING TO GOD'S WORD?

1 JOHN 2:3-4
3, And hereby we do know that we know him, if we keep <ALL> his commandments. 4, He that saith, I know him, and keeps not his commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him.

REVELATION 12:17
And the dragon was wroth with the woman, and went to make war with the remnant of her seed, which keep the commandments of God, and have the testimony of Jesus Christ.

REVELATION 14:12
Here is the patience of the saints: here are they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus.

REVELATION 22:14
Blessed are they that do his commandments, that they may have right to the tree of life, and may enter in through the gates into the city.

Notice God's people keep ALL of God's Commandments through FAITH in Christ?

NOTE: God's saints keep ALL THE COMMANDMENTS of God. It is these people that are a remnant that the devil is making war with. They are called God's saints and these are the ones that have right to the tree of life.

How many Church's do you see keeping all of God's Commandments?

What are your thoughts?

The wheat and the tares grow together until the coming of the Lord to do the separating. We are plainly told that the end times will be a time of great deception and smallness and not largeness of the Body of Christ. "The gate is narrow and the way strait (as in difficult) and few there be that enter, but wide is the gate and broad is the way that leads to hell and many travel in it." The Bible does well to command us to exaime ourselves to see if we are in the correct way. So, we can conclude that what is popular and what is displayed as the church up and down main street is not the church. Christ called His followers "A little flock." If your Christianity looks like popular christianity then you may want to take a closer look at the words of Jesus starting with the Matthew 5,6, and 7.

 

[dqhall]

True if you do not understand the OLD COVENANT how can we understand what the NEW is?

You wrote the law is the Ten Commandments. In reality the first century Jewish law written about in the New Testament was hundreds of commandments. Not all the law was righteous as they had a law requiring the death penalty for those who worked on the seventh day. The law required murdering someone working as a physician during the Sabbath. In this respect one who obeyed the law sinned.

Jesus worked seven days as did his father. From John 5:17 WEB:
But Jesus answered them, "My Father is still working, so I am working, too."

They wanted to kill Jesus for breaking the law in Jerusalem. He healed a paralytic at Bethesda on the seventh day. Jesus was executed within a year.

One should not boast about resting one day and not any other day.

 

[Danthemailman]

The True Church is the body of Christ (Ephesians 5:23; Colossians 1:18,24) which is made up of all born again believers (Acts 11:17; Ephesians 1:13; 1 Corinthians 12:13) and is not merely an institution with a name stamped on the front of the building.

 

[JLB777]

You believe John knew the answer. So do I. When John used the word "commandments" don't you think it would be advisable to know what HE means?

1 John 2:
3 Now by this we know that we know Him, if we keep His commandments. 4 He who says, “I know Him,” and does not keep His commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him. 5 But whoever keeps His word, truly the love of God is perfected in him. By this we know that we are in Him. 6 He who says he abides in Him ought himself also to walk just as He walked.

1 John 3
16 By this we know love, because He laid down His life for us. And we also ought to lay down our lives for the brethren. 17 But whoever has this world’s goods, and sees his brother in need, and shuts up his heart from him, how does the love of God abide in him?

18 My little children, let us not love in word or in tongue, but in deed and in truth. 19 And by this we know that we are of the truth, and shall assure our hearts before Him. 20 For if our heart condemns us, God is greater than our heart, and knows all things. 21 Beloved, if our heart does not condemn us, we have confidence toward God. 22 And whatever we ask we receive from Him, because we keep His commandments and do those things that are pleasing in His sight. 23 And this is His commandment: that we should believe on the name of His Son Jesus Christ and love one another, as He gave us commandment.

Note what "His commandments" are in 1 John 2:3 and 1 John 3:22! Those are His Church!

The commandments of God are about love.


For this is the love of God, that we keep His commandments. And His commandments are not burdensome. 1 John 5:3


Paul teaches it this way -


Owe no one anything except to love one another, for he who loves another has fulfilled the law. For the commandments, “You shall not commit adultery,” “You shall not murder,” “You shall not steal,” “You shall not bear false witness,” “You shall not covet,” and if there is any other commandment, are all summed up in this saying, namely, “You shall love your neighbor as yourself.” Love does no harm to a neighbor; therefore love is the fulfillment of the law.
Romans 14:8-10


Key Verse:


if there is any other commandment, are all summed up in this saying, namely, “You shall love your neighbor as yourself.”


Jesus demonstrated how we are to love God, by loving His children, our neighbor.


He did what He saw His Father do, and said what He heard His Father say.

Jesus demonstrated loving obedience, so we who are called by His name could follow His example.

This is the way of God’s kingdom, to love and serve God by loving and serving His people, His children, our brothers and sisters.


His commandments define how we are to go about this lifestyle.


Most of us who have His Spirit, don’t need to have a list of commandments to show us what we are not supposed to do to our neighbor, however some do.


Those of us who have the Spirit, don’t need a list of commandments, to know that stealing from our neighbor is wrong, and is not how to love our neighbor... but some do.


This can be said of murder, or adultrery or lying, of coveting the things our neighbor has.


Most of us who have His Spirit within us, don’t need to have a list of commandments to know that we are to honor and respect our parents, never the less, some still do.


Paul says it this way -


knowing this: that the law is not made for a righteous person, but for the lawless and insubordinate, for the ungodly and for sinners, for the unholy and profane, for murderers of fathers and murderers of mothers, for manslayers, for fornicators, for sodomites, for kidnappers, for liars, for perjurers, and if there is any other thing that is contrary to sound doctrine, according to the glorious gospel of the blessed God which was committed to my trust. 1 Timothy 1:9-11



Whoever hates his brother is a murderer, and you know that no murderer has eternal life abiding in him. 1 John 3:15



However, we all know the motive behind this thread is not about love or obedience to God, but it’s about gathering for a church service on Saturday rather than Sunday, as if going to church on Saturday somehow overrides the commandment to love our neighbor and obeying the Lord.


If we attend church on Saturday but do not love our neighbor what good does it do?


JLB

 

[1stcenturylady]

God's LAW of liberty is LOVE and LOVE is the fulfilling of God's LAW in all those who BELIEVE and FOLLOW God's WORD *JAMES 2:8-11; ROMANS 13:8-10.

Yes, and if you only knew what that meant with regards to the 10C.

 

[JLB777]

Not at all. None are liviing under the NEW COVENANT of GRACE while continuing in KNOWN UNREPENTANT SIN. Grace is not a licence to sin. It is for OBEDIENCE to the faith.

Amen. I couldn’t agree more.


The question is, is going to Church on Sunday or Wednesday or Thursday, a sin?


If it is, please present the scripture from our Lord Jesus, the Mediator of the New Covenant, that teaches it’s a sin to assemble for church on Sunday or Wednesday or Thursday.


Why would the Lord burden people with working on Saturday in the New Covenant.

The Pastors and teachers and musicians and ministry of helps and administrations that all work doing their jobs in a church community must do so on the Sabbath, the day God gave to man to rest?


How do you come to that conclusion?


What scripture do we have from the Lord that teaches we are to work on the Sabbath, doing our ministry?



JLB

 

[1stcenturylady]

For this is the love of God, that we keep His commandments. And His commandments are not burdensome. 1 John 5:3

And can you find where John explains what are "His commandments"? If you are going to quote John, you have to know what he means.

Hint: They are what Jesus preached.

 

[JLB777]

And can you find where John explains what are "His commandments"? If you are going to quote John, you have to know what he means.

Hint: They are what Jesus preached.

I fully agree and know what John and Jesus taught:

Love God and love your neighbor.


That is what the commandments are about loving God and loving His children.


For this is the love of God, that we keep His commandments. And His commandments are not burdensome. 1 John 5:3



JLB

 

[1stcenturylady]

I fully agree and know what John and Jesus taught:

Love God and love your neighbor.


That is what the commandments are about loving God and loving His children.


For this is the love of God, that we keep His commandments. And His commandments are not burdensome. 1 John 5:3

JLB

Find where John says what loving God is? Where does John say "His commandments," besides 1 John 5?

 

[JLB777]

Find where John says what loving God is? Where does John say "His commandments," besides 1 John 5?

He who says, “I know Him,” and does not keep His commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him. 1 John 2:4


“Know Him” is the biblical definition of eternal life.

Same John -

And this is eternal life, that they may know You, the only true God, and Jesus Christ whom You have sent. John 17:3




People who claim to have eternal life but don’t keep His commandments are liars, and the truth is not in them.



JLB

 

[1stcenturylady]

He who says, “I know Him,” and does not keep His commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him. 1 John 2:4


“Know Him” is the biblical definition of eternal life.

Same John -

And this is eternal life, that they may know You, the only true God, and Jesus Christ whom You have sent. John 17:3




People who claim to have eternal life but don’t keep His commandments are liars, and the truth is not in them.



JLB

Try 1 John 3:23 where John tells what they are. So when you quote John, that is what he is referring to in any work authored by John.

 

[Saint Steven]

Not really it is God's WORD and we should believe and follow it.

But you are inferring that it is speaking of the Ten Commandments when it clearly is not. That's what I mean when I say you are misusing "God's WORD". (which you claim to love) If so, why the abuse?

 

[TuxAme]

Where Peter- the prince of the apostles- and his successors are, there is the Church.

"And I say to thee: That thou art Peter; and upon this rock I will build my church, and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it. And I will give to thee the keys of the kingdom of heaven. And whatsoever thou shalt bind upon earth, it shall be bound also in heaven: and whatsoever thou shalt loose upon earth, it shall be loosed also in heaven." (Matthew 16:18-19)

If I had my laptop, I'd type up what St. John Chrysostom had to say about the Petrine office, and his commentary on Matthew 16.

 

[Saint Steven]

He who says, “I know Him,” and does not keep His commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him. 1 John 2:4


“Know Him” is the biblical definition of eternal life.

Same John -

And this is eternal life, that they may know You, the only true God, and Jesus Christ whom You have sent. John 17:3




People who claim to have eternal life but don’t keep His commandments are liars, and the truth is not in them.



JLB

What "commandments" are those? (the NIV says "commands" -- of Christ)

 

[Eloy Craft]

It is a bit more difficult when you have 40,000 different denominations to choose from. What happens if there is a disagreement between Christians of differing denominations? Who settles the disagreement then?

Good observation. The one that was in the beginning, the one that settled disagreements, is it still on earth or was Jesus mistaken about it's continuation until He returns?

 

[Karola]

Where Peter- the prince of the apostles- and his successors are, there is the Church.

"And I say to thee: That thou art Peter; and upon this rock I will build my church, and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it. And I will give to thee the keys of the kingdom of heaven. And whatsoever thou shalt bind upon earth, it shall be bound also in heaven: and whatsoever thou shalt loose upon earth, it shall be loosed also in heaven." (Matthew 16:18-19)
.

Why was James the head of the church and not Peter?

 

[Saint Steven]

Where Peter- the prince of the apostles- and his successors are, there is the Church.

"And I say to thee: That thou art Peter; and upon this rock I will build my church, and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it. And I will give to thee the keys of the kingdom of heaven. And whatsoever thou shalt bind upon earth, it shall be bound also in heaven: and whatsoever thou shalt loose upon earth, it shall be loosed also in heaven." (Matthew 16:18-19)

If I had my laptop, I'd type up what St. John Chrysostom had to say about the Petrine office, and his commentary on Matthew 16.

What is your claim about Protestantism then? Are you claiming that we are NOT the church?

 

[Karola]

Good observation. The one that was in the beginning, the one that settled disagreements, is it still on earth or was Jesus mistaken about it's continuation until He returns?

Catholics would say they are the true church that was from the beginning, others would dispute that. Others might say the true church is what they follow and believe through their interpretation of scripture. The true church is still here, but it depends what you define that true church to be I would say