Who else is a Bible-believing Democratic voter?

[camille70]

The Bible says nothing about abortion...except one or two brief passages where it endorses it...

What passages? I've never seen anything that seemed to endorse it.

 

[Allandavid]

What passages? I've never seen anything that seemed to endorse it.

Oh, it's been quite a while, but something about the punishment for an unfaithful wife. Giving her a potion which causes an abortion.

 

[GUANO]

I couldn't do it for Trump. He's beyond the pale. But Hillary was worse, if such is possible.

On the one hand, we have a nationalist business shark, on the other, a communist, globalist, atheist who illegally overthrows nations and is directly responsible for the deaths of hundreds of thousands of people. I'm not a fan of Trump, but to even compare them as being 'close' is interesting to me. I'm interested to understand how you came to this judgement. Trump is only just now being initiated into the whole illegal wars thing.

 

[GUANO]

What passages? I've never seen anything that seemed to endorse it.

They did not used to perform abortions. They would have the children and then offer them to Moloch as a burnt offering. And this was strictly condemned.

 

[camille70]

Oh, it's been quite a while, but something about the punishment for an unfaithful wife. Giving her a potion which causes an abortion.

I found it. Numbers 5:11-31. This is reading like even if she didn't cheat and he only thinks she did he can bring her before the priest and accuse her. The passage I was thinking of is Exodus 21:22-25. The wife's life would have been an eye for an eye, the child was a fine, treated as a loss of property.


Edit: Ok that is so cute how the forum links to the passage...I didn't know the site did that.

 

[ByTheSpirit]

The Bible says nothing about abortion...except one or two brief passages where it endorses it...

Jeremiah 1:5
Psalms 139:13
Psalms 139:16

Clearly point that the Lord is intimately involved with the unborn.

 

[Allandavid]

Jeremiah 1:5
Psalms 139:13
Psalms 139:16

Clearly point that the Lord is intimately involved with the unborn.

Yes, involved with. But nothing about abortion being wrong.

 

[Strathos]

On the one hand, we have a nationalist business shark, on the other, a communist, globalist, atheist who illegally overthrows nations and is directly responsible for the deaths of hundreds of thousands of people. I'm not a fan of Trump, but to even compare them as being 'close' is interesting to me. I'm interested to understand how you came to this judgement. Trump is only just now being initiated into the whole illegal wars thing.

Do you have any idea what communism actually is?

It involves the government owning all means of production. US democrats are so far from that it's laughable to even make the comparison. In most European countries, Obama would have been considered a right-wing politician, and yet those countries are still far to the left of actual communists. But the right wingers like to label anyone to the left of Mussolini as a communist. It's a meaningless accusation. If you want to know what actual communism is like, go to China, because I guarantee you it's nothing like the US.

 

[ByTheSpirit]

Yes, involved with. But nothing about abortion being wrong.

Does scripture have to spell it out for you?

Someone here mentioned Exodus 21:22-25 I believe. That passage says if anyone causes the death of an infant before the mother gives birth they are to be put to death. Eye for an eye, tooth for a tooth. The same protection is afforded to the unborn as to an adult. So how exactly can we say the Lord is not against abortion?

 

[camille70]

nevermind

 

[ByTheSpirit]

nevermind

“"When men strive together and hit a pregnant woman, so that her children come out, but there is no harm, the one who hit her shall surely be fined, as the woman's husband shall impose on him, and he shall pay as the judges determine.”
‭‭Exodus‬ ‭21:22‬ ‭ESV‬‬

I don't know it seems to be talking about the children. Doesn't say specifically, but you can't possibly tell me if the child dies then God would say "Eh oh well"

 

[LoAmmi]

“"When men strive together and hit a pregnant woman, so that her children come out, but there is no harm, the one who hit her shall surely be fined, as the woman's husband shall impose on him, and he shall pay as the judges determine.”
‭‭Exodus‬ ‭21:22‬ ‭ESV‬‬

I don't know it seems to be talking about the children. Doesn't say specifically, but you can't possibly tell me if the child dies then God would say "Eh oh well"

That's not a great translation from what I know of the passage. It's pretty clear in the text the harm is talking about harm to the woman, not the child. This passage is why Judaism doesn't consider abortion to be murder, even if it doesn't allow for abortion except in the case of the mother's life being in jeopardy.

 

[ByTheSpirit]

That's not a great translation from what I know of the passage. It's pretty clear in the text the harm is talking about harm to the woman, not the child. This passage is why Judaism doesn't consider abortion to be murder, even if it doesn't allow for abortion except in the case of the mother's life being in jeopardy.

I don't know... I looked at it in the NIV and the KJV and the subject of the verse to me is about the child being born prematurely which in those days would almost certainly result in death.

 

[camille70]

That's not a great translation from what I know of the passage. It's pretty clear in the text the harm is talking about harm to the woman, not the child. This passage is why Judaism doesn't consider abortion to be murder, even if it doesn't allow for abortion except in the case of the mother's life being in jeopardy.

This was always my understanding, and that biblically life didn't start until the child had taken it's first breath. When rereading it though, it does read as though it could be harm to the mother or the child, and when I check other translations that seems to be the case as well. I'm going to look into it some more. My brother has studied from the original text/language so I'll ask him, but it may be months before I see or talk to him.

 

[ByTheSpirit]

I will grant this, the Bible doesn't say specifically if a person ends the life of a child in the womb then it is sin. But murder is sin, and God is involved with a fetus from the moment it is conceived, forming it part by part for life.

I just do not understand how anyone can say it is ok to destroy something God has put together.

 

[JackRT]

The one thing Republicans have is they do not advocate for abortion.

I have never met anyone of any party who "advocates for abortion". I believe that abortion should be legal and safe and available and the woman's informed choice. But most of all it should be rare.

 

[JLB777]

I’d like to find more connections to people and organizations that stand on the essentials (or, fundamentals) of the Christian faith (the Bible is true; Jesus is the divine Son of God; He really did die on the cross and literally rise again; salvation is by faith in Christ alone. . .and so on), while supporting the Democratic party platform. I voted Republican every year since 1972, until 2016 arrived and I changed my mind about which party is closer to (or perhaps just not as far away from) a Biblical position. I have a lot to say, but first I just want to ask. . .Who is with me on this forum?



Evan Jellicoe

Your joking right?

You think Hillary Clinton stands for biblical truth?

 

[LoAmmi]

I don't know... I looked at it in the NIV and the KJV and the subject of the verse to me is about the child being born prematurely which in those days would almost certainly result in death.

View attachment 200567

Well, I'm relying on something like 1500 years+ of Jewish traditional understanding of this verse from the Hebrew. Keep in mind that Judaism only allows abortion in the event the mother's life is in danger, so there's no real reason to suspect it was some kind of reason to accept abortion or anything like that. People who were experts in Hebrew, who studied the Torah every day, came to that conclusion.

 

[GUANO]

Do you have any idea what communism actually is?

It involves the government owning all means of production. US democrats are so far from that it's laughable to even make the comparison. In most European countries, Obama would have been considered a right-wing politician, and yet those countries are still far to the left of actual communists. But the right wingers like to label anyone to the left of Mussolini as a communist. It's a meaningless accusation. If you want to know what actual communism is like, go to China, because I guarantee you it's nothing like the US.

Yes, I know what communism is. I'm wearing my Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn shirt right now so that must be proof. What you say above is correct, the U.S. is not a communist country and does not resemble one yet. But the ideology is here, it's strong, and it dominates Universities. There are many communists in government, mostly on the Dem side, and they certainly won't be openly admitting it, but many were members of and/or sympathetic to the Weather Underground and if you view their political imagry (especially that of both Clinton and Obama) it's directly copied from Stalin and Mao... I'll go ahead and call people commies. I live in Southern California where the govt is trying to take over the telecom companies next...

 

[ByTheSpirit]

Well, I'm relying on something like 1500 years+ of Jewish traditional understanding of this verse from the Hebrew. Keep in mind that Judaism only allows abortion in the event the mother's life is in danger, so there's no real reason to suspect it was some kind of reason to accept abortion or anything like that. People who were experts in Hebrew, who studied the Torah every day, came to that conclusion.

They were also the ones that failed to see Jesus in scriptures and still fail to see him in scriptures.