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WHO DO YOU SAY HE IS? Part One

Discussion in 'Paterology, Christology & Pneumatology' started by CHRISTgospel, Jul 18, 2002.

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  1. CHRISTgospel

    CHRISTgospel Member

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    As recorded in the synoptic gospels, Jesus asked his disciples, "whom do men say that I the Son of man am?" Their reply varied and in turn Jesus asked them directly, "But whom say ye that I am?" Simon Peter answered and said, Thou art the Christ, the Son of the living God. And Jesus answered and said unto him, "Blessed are thou, Simon Bar-Jona: for flesh and blood hath not revealed it unto thee, but my Father which is in heaven. (Matthew 16:13-17)

    Please note carefully who Peter said Jesus was. First Peter said Jesus is the Christ. What does "Christ" mean? Strong's Exhaustive Concordance of the Bible #5547 shows that Christ means "anointed, i.e. the Messiah." Let us look at what Luke tells us in the book of Acts, chapter 10, verse 38. (Acts 10:38)

    How God anointed Jesus of Nazareth with the Holy Spirit and power, and how he went around doing good and healing all who were under the power of the devil, because God was with him.


    When reading this verse do you clearly see that Jesus is a separate being from God? This writer certainly sees the separation. Please note that God, the one and only true God, Jesus' Father and our Father if we are called to be His children, was with Jesus. Jesus is NOT God. God did not come AS Jesus. God dwells IN Jesus, Jesus was in the form of God.
     
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  2. CHRISTgospel

    CHRISTgospel Member

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    The Prophet Isaiah foretold a virgin would conceive and bear a son, and would call his name Immanuel, which means "God with us." Again, how did God come to be with us? He came to be with us through His only begotten son Jesus the Christ, a man anointed by God the Father as we just read. Please take notice of those key words "in the form of". The words form and image are interchangeable.


    Phil 2:6 who, although He existed in the form of God, did not regard equality with God a thing to be grasped,


    Col 1:15 He is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn over all creation.


    Pay close attention to what Peter tells the multitude on the day of Pentecost. "Men of Israel, listen to this: Jesus of Nazareth was a man accredited by God to you by miracles, wonders and signs, which God did among you through him, as you yourselves know. (Acts 2:22)

    Again, we are talking about two different beings here. Jesus is one person. And God is another being. They are one only in spirit (mind and purpose). If you were taught as a child, as this writer was taught, that Jesus was God in the flesh, that God came down in human form, you have been taught to believe another Jesus. For the Bible clearly tells us that Jesus was a man anointed by God. And that God is NOT A MAN.

    Num 23:19 God is not a man, that he should lie, nor a son of man, that he should change his mind. Does he speak and then not act? Does he promise and not fulfill?
     
  3. CHRISTgospel

    CHRISTgospel Member

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    What does this verse say to you?

    2 John 1:7 Many deceivers, who do not acknowledge Jesus Christ as coming in the flesh, have gone out into the world. Any such person is the deceiver and the antichrist.

    To this writer it states that Jesus, is Jesus in the flesh. It does not say "God as coming in the flesh" nor does it say "The Most High God as coming in the flesh" or "The Father coming in the flesh." It says many deceivers, who do not acknowledge JESUS CHRIST AS COMING IN THE FLESH, have gone out into the world. Any such person [that does NOT acknowledge and accept this fact] is the deceiver and the antichrist. Pretty strong words, yes?

    So who is this Jesus that God anointed? Did the prophets speak about this man that God would use as His agent to speak to His people?
     
  4. CHRISTgospel

    CHRISTgospel Member

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    Deuteronomy 18:18-19 I will raise them up a Prophet from among their brethren, like unto thee, and will put my words in his [Jesus] mouth; and he shall speak unto them all that I shall command him. [19]And it shall come to pass, that whosoever will not hearken unto my words which he shall speak in my name, I will require it of him.

    Jeremiah 23:5 Behold, the days come, saith the LORD, that I will raise unto David a righteous Branch, and a King shall reign and prosper, and shall execute judgment and justice in the earth.

    This is speaking of the coming kingdom of God/heaven - the millennium reign - when Christ returns [The message of the Kingdom has to do with the land promised to Abraham - promises not yet fulfilled. It concerns the reestablishment of the throne of David and the permanent restoration and expansion of the fortunes of the nation of Israel.] 3 [In order for restoration to take place, in order for something to be restored it must have been in existence. For example, if God decided to take his people to heaven that would not be restitution. Since man never had a home in heaven, he could not have lost it, and Jesus could not restore it. Yet Scripture clearly teaches restitution.] (Acts 3:19-21)

    [6] In his days (when Christ rules on earth) Judah shall be saved, and Israel shall dwell safely(this certainly is not the case at this present time in history - Christians are losing their lives for their testimony so we can not be living in the millennium as some believe we are): and this is his name whereby he shall be called, THE LORD OUR RIGHTEOUSNESS.

    Hebrews 1:1-3 In the past God spoke to our forefathers through the prophets at many times and in various ways, but in these last days he has spoken to us by his Son, whom he appointed heir of all things, and through whom he made the universe. The Son is the radiance of God's glory and the exact representation of his being [form, image], sustaining all things by his powerful word. After he had provided purification for sins, he sat down at the right hand of the Majesty in heaven.
     
  5. CHRISTgospel

    CHRISTgospel Member

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    In reply to the question Jesus directly asked his disciples, Peter, as we have read, stated that Jesus is the Christ. Peter also said that Jesus is the Son of the living God. Notice that Peter did not say Jesus was God as so many church goers believe to be the truth. No where in the Bible does it state "God the Son" nor do you find anyone claiming Jesus is God.

    This paper ends, as it began, with the question, Who Do You Say He is? Do away with man's doctrine that has you believing in another gospel - another Jesus, and believe the words of the Christ: Now this is eternal life: that they may know you, the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom you have sent.
     
  6. Father's Image

    Father's Image New Member

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    Does not all of creation teach us that whatever the father is, so also is the son? Do bears beget chickens? No! Life from life, like from like, spirit from spirit, light from light, God from God. Have you even read the first chapter of John? "In the beginning was the Word,..."

    Ken
     
  7. CHRISTgospel

    CHRISTgospel Member

    105
    +0
    Hello, Ken.

    Yes, I have read John. The translator chose to "CAP" the letter "W".... word as you know in Greek is "logos" (thought, plan) and logos is not CAPPED in manuscripts.

    for example: I have plans to build a house. I think of how I want my floorplan. I bring forth my thoughts - my plans and speak them to the person that will put my plans on blueprint. We see the manifestation of my plans when the house is completed.

    this is how many believe John 1:1 reads. In the beginning was the Jesus, and the Jesus was with God, and the Jesus was God.

    that is not what John is teaching - Johns message has always been that Jesus in the Son of God. One would have to replace all the words "logos" in the Bible with the name Jesus if what you believe is true. This would not make sense - go try it.

    Jesus, is the Messiah - the annointed one that God had plans to manifest in the flesh just as John 1:14 states.... "And the word (God's plan/thoughts) was made flesh, and dwelt among us........."

    please read 2 John 1:7 once again: Many deceivers, who do not acknowledge Jesus Christ as coming in the flesh, have gone out into the world. Any such person is the deceiver and the antichrist.

    To this writer it states that Jesus, is Jesus in the flesh. It does not say "God as coming in the flesh" nor does it say "The Most High God as coming in the flesh" or "The Father coming in the flesh." It says many deceivers, who do not acknowledge JESUS CHRIST AS COMING IN THE FLESH, have gone out into the world. Any such person [that does NOT acknowledge and accept this fact] is the deceiver and the antichrist. Pretty strong words, yes?

    but we have been taught to believe and to call others heretics if they do not claim that God came in the flesh.....hmmm
     
  8. LouisBooth

    LouisBooth Well-Known Member

    +62
    Christian
    Married
    US-Libertarian
    Hey, I have an idea Gospel, lets take more scripture out of context and twist it just a little to get it wrong? ;)

    Christ is God. He proved that in word and in deed.


    *mod hat on*
    There are many thread already discussing this topic, please pick one of them to discuss this topic. Thanks :)
    *mod hat off*
     
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