Who Did Cain Fear, And Who Did He Marry?

[COG2013]

Nope, sorry. This is one of those far fetched, spin jobs to try and make it work.

The Bible talks about Adam and Eve having another son, Seth, to replace Abel. It then talks about the descendants of Adam, and goes on to say that Adam and Eve had other children. All of this comes AFTER Cain has been banished. You can find it in Genesis chapter 5.

The Bible does NOT tell us how many total children that Adam and Eve had, nor does it tell us their gender. If you believe otherwise, cite your sources.

My source is their Father, and if you have a problem with that, take it up with Him!

 

[Phantasman]

My source is their Father, and if you have a problem with that, take it up with Him!

Another one that thinks that out of 7 Billion people on the planet, God gives him the only truth.

 

[eachallberg]

Genesis chapter 4 is the brief story of Cain and Abel, the offpsring of Adam and Eve. In the story, Cain kills Abel, and fears being banished by God because he is afraid that someone will kill him. Here's the conundrum...

Who was he afraid of, since the only people alive at the time, according to creation, were Adam, Eve, Cain and the now deceased Abel? If he was banished and sent out away from his parents, who was around to kill him? The Bible doesn't say.

The second conundrum is the fact that Cain moves to the land of Nod, and it is there that he marrries a woman (not Eve) and has a son named Enoch. Where did she come from, if Eve was the only female on earth at that time? Again, the Bible doesn't say.

This is why I, and so many others, do not take Genesis (or a lot of the rest of the Bible) literally. There are too many unanswered questions, contradictons, discrepanices and things that just don't add up.

However, let's take a quick step back for a moment and look at Genesis chapter 1, verses 26-31. God creates man and woman, not as singular individuals, but as multitudes, and instructs them to procreate. Thus ended "day 6."

God rests on "day 7."

The Garden of Eden, Adam and Eve aren't created until chapter 2, AFTER "day 7." It would seem that Adam and Eve were created specifically for the Garden of Eden, but were not the first humans. Some argue that chapter 2 is a recount of chapter 1, but that is subject to personal opinion.

If my theory is correct, then the multitudes were created first, and populated the world, and THEN Adam and Eve were created for the Garden, and their offspring of Cain and Abel were born. That would explain who Cain feared if he was banished, and it would explain why he was able to marry a woman and have Enoch. This scenario seems far more logical (and you don't have to have a lot of far stretched theories and spin jobs, to make it work).

Straight out of the Bible, Genesis chapters 1, 2 and 4.

The bible doesn't explain where the other people came from. Scripture does imply other beings of all kinds around. Cherubim, Seraphims, Watchers, Nephilim, angel of..., ect.

The bible is a horrible history book, and its far from being non fiction.

Some things in the bible maybe historical, and history is like a condiment. It's not the meat.

The best part is what is contained in the symbols.

There are Gnostics here that I talk with as well as Christians friends.

Same here.

 

[Vanguard PCD]

My source is their Father, and if you have a problem with that, take it up with Him!

I did.

He told me to tell you to stop spreading lies and false propaganda.

Of course, the rest of us just know that you say what you say as a means to get atttention, and nothing more. No one takes you seriously.

 

[Soulgazer]

You can't just toss out the OT.

I think we can. It's part of the foundation of catholicism, true. However catholicism is not the only school of Christianity. It was very unfair of you to question why we spend time on a Christian instead of a Gnostic forum. We could ask you why you spend time on a Christian instead of a catholic forum. That is rhetorical; You are as welcome here as anyone and I enjoy your posts.

 

[Vanguard PCD]

I think we can. It's part of the foundation of catholicism, true. However catholicism is not the only school of Christianity. It was very unfair of you to question why we spend time on a Christian instead of a Gnostic forum. We could ask you why you spend time on a Christian instead of a catholic forum. That is rhetorical; You are as welcome here as anyone and I enjoy your posts.

Thanks but...since when am I Catholic? Far from it.

 

[Soulgazer]

Thanks but...since when am I Catholic? Far from it.

If you use the western bible, it was comnpiled by catholics for the promotion of catholicism. That's catholic with a small "c", as opposed to other schools of early Christianity.

 

[Vanguard PCD]

If you use the western bible, it was comnpiled by catholics for the promotion of catholicism. That's catholic with a small "c", as opposed to other schools of early Christianity.

I'd have to say that is a stretch, but I guess you could say that "catholicism" is the root of Christianity, and other denominations sprang from it (Protestants, Eastern Orhtodox, Roman Catholicism, etc.). However, most people in this day and age know that Catholic simply refers to the Roman Catholic Church/faith. I can see a distinction in the way you present it, but many, including myself, would be offended to be called "catholic."

As far as the Bible goes, I use a variety of English translations to include the NASB, ESV, NIV, HCSB, YLT, KJV, OJB, CJB, as well as studying the Hebrew Torah/Tanakh, and an Interlinear Greek-English Bible. Seminary requires it.

 

[hiscosmicgoldfish]

i think there is an urge to chuck out the OT, but it's got some predictions about jesus in it, hasn't it? and there seems to be some inspiration there, and some real stuff, mixed in with all the rubbish, failed prophesy, lies, plagiariam, lack of compassion, genocide etc.
and some of that sort of garbage made it into the NT as well.. 'revelation'.

 

[Vanguard PCD]

i think there is an urge to chuck out the OT, but it's got some predictions about jesus in it, hasn't it?

Yes. As a matter of fact, the very essence of Jesus as the Messiah is whether or not He fulfilled OT prophecies.

Christians say that Jesus was the Messiah.
Jews say that is impossible because Jesus did not fulfill 23 OT prophecies.
Christians respond with they will be fulfilled in the 2nd coming.
Jews counter with the Bible does not mention a 2nd coming.

So why are Jews so against Jesus as the Messiah? In the OT, the Jews were God's chosen people (an issue of pride). In the NT, Jesus tells them that everyone will be saved as equals, Jews and Gentiles alike. That was a slap in their face (it hurt their pride).

Anyway, we are far off topic at this point.

 

[Soulgazer]

I'd have to say that is a stretch, but I guess you could say that "catholicism" is the root of Christianity, and other denominations sprang from it (Protestants, Eastern Orhtodox, Roman Catholicism, etc.). However, most people in this day and age know that Catholic simply refers to the Roman Catholic Church/faith. I can see a distinction in the way you present it, but many, including myself, would be offended to be called "catholic."

As far as the Bible goes, I use a variety of English translations to include the NASB, ESV, NIV, HCSB, YLT, KJV, OJB, CJB, as well as studying the Hebrew Torah/Tanakh, and an Interlinear Greek-English Bible. Seminary requires it.

It's all still of the catholic schools, which distguishes it from the Naasene, Valentinian and Marcionite schools, all of which are Christian and none of which placed much value on the Old testament. If you are offended to being referred to as "catholic" or of the "catholic school", I'm sorry. It's historically valid though, and distinguishes modern Christianity from aboriginal Christianities such as Messianic Judaism and Paulinism.

"catholic school" is the term used at University level historical studies. "catholic school" thinking began developing in the 2nd century. The root of Christianity after Christ is a pretty wide field of study. If Christianity were a tree, it would resemple in some way a cyprus, with multiple roots merging into catholicism, and again seperating into branches.

 

[Frenchfrye]

Genesis chapter 4 is the brief story of Cain and Abel, the offpsring of Adam and Eve. In the story, Cain kills Abel, and fears being banished by God because he is afraid that someone will kill him. Here's the conundrum...

Who was he afraid of, since the only people alive at the time, according to creation, were Adam, Eve, Cain and the now deceased Abel? If he was banished and sent out away from his parents, who was around to kill him? The Bible doesn't say.

The second conundrum is the fact that Cain moves to the land of Nod, and it is there that he marrries a woman (not Eve) and has a son named Enoch. Where did she come from, if Eve was the only female on earth at that time? Again, the Bible doesn't say.

This is why I, and so many others, do not take Genesis (or a lot of the rest of the Bible) literally. There are too many unanswered questions, contradictons, discrepanices and things that just don't add up.

However, let's take a quick step back for a moment and look at Genesis chapter 1, verses 26-31. God creates man and woman, not as singular individuals, but as multitudes, and instructs them to procreate. Thus ended "day 6."

God rests on "day 7."

The Garden of Eden, Adam and Eve aren't created until chapter 2, AFTER "day 7." It would seem that Adam and Eve were created specifically for the Garden of Eden, but were not the first humans. Some argue that chapter 2 is a recount of chapter 1, but that is subject to personal opinion.

If my theory is correct, then the multitudes were created first, and populated the world, and THEN Adam and Eve were created for the Garden, and their offspring of Cain and Abel were born. That would explain who Cain feared if he was banished, and it would explain why he was able to marry a woman and have Enoch. This scenario seems far more logical (and you don't have to have a lot of far stretched theories and spin jobs, to make it work).

Straight out of the Bible, Genesis chapters 1, 2 and 4.

its possible that Adam and eve had many kids before they sinned. God said be fruitful and multiply. But since they figured they would never die and the whole world was green and produced fruits, they had lots of kids and they left the garden and did their own thing.

 

[Vanguard PCD]

its possible that Adam and eve had many kids before they sinned. God said be fruitful and multiply. But since they figured they would never die and the whole world was green and produced fruits, they had lots of kids and they left the garden and did their own thing.

While I guess anything is possible, your scenario is not what is dictated in the Bible.

The "be fruitful and multiply" was not directed at Adam and Eve, but rather the multitudes found in Genesis 1, on day 6. Remember, Adam and Eve did not come about until Genesis 2, on day 7.

If you say that Adam and Eve were the humans God created in Genesis 1, and the story is merely expanded in Genesis 2, you've already run into a contradiction: which day were they created on...6th or 7th?

Hence my theory.

 

[Frenchfrye]

While I guess anything is possible, your scenario is not what is dictated in the Bible.

The "be fruitful and multiply" was not directed at Adam and Eve, but rather the multitudes found in Genesis 1, on day 6. Remember, Adam and Eve did not come about until Genesis 2, on day 7.

If you say that Adam and Eve were the humans God created in Genesis 1, and the story is merely expanded in Genesis 2, you've already run into a contradiction: which day were they created on...6th or 7th?

Hence my theory.

God rested on day 7 all creation was finished by then
So God created mankind in his own image,
in the image of God he created them;
male and female he created them.
28 God blessed them and said to them, “Be fruitful and increase in number; fill the earth and subdue it. Rule over the fish in the sea and the birds in the sky and over every living creature that moves on the ground.”

29 Then God said, “I give you every seed-bearing plant on the face of the whole earth and every tree that has fruit with seed in it. They will be yours for food. 30 And to all the beasts of the earth and all the birds in the sky and all the creatures that move along the ground—everything that has the breath of life in it—I give every green plant for food.” And it was so.

31 God saw all that he had made, and it was very good. And there was evening, and there was morning—the sixth day

 

[Vanguard PCD]

God rested on day 7 all creation was finished by then...

Not quite.

What you quoted was from Genesis 1, and has no mention of Adam or Eve.

Genesis 2 concludes the creation:

1 Thus the heavens and the earth were completed, and all their hosts. 2 By the seventh day God completed His work which He had done, and He rested on the seventh day from all His work which He had done. 3 Then God blessed the seventh day and sanctified it, because in it He rested from all His work which God had created and made.

He rested, from everything He had done thus far. The heavens and earth (planets and stars) were completed. It does not say He was done with humanity (this example is the study of hermeneutics).

Genesis 2:7 is when Adam was created and placed in the Garden of Eden.
Genesis 2:21-25 is the creation of Eve, and husband/wife.

Last time I checked, Genesis 1 comes BEFORE Genesis 2.

My theory stands.

 

[Ishraqiyun]

Then why spend time on a Christian forum? You should be frequenting a Gnostic forum.

What forum should Gnostic Christians frequent? Marcion and Theudas were both Christians. Theudas was a direct disciple of St Paul who imparted the inner teachings of Christianity to Valentinus. Many of these people didn't even call themselves "Gnostic" that's more a term given to them by heresy hunters. They simply called themselves Christians. It's only when viewed through the skewed lens of the triumphant literalists that these people loose the title of Christian. Paul himself was a knower whose authority was later subverted to the literalist side through the use of the forged pastoral epistles that portray him spouting anti-Gnostic rhetoric.

 

[Frenchfrye]

Not quite.

What you quoted was from Genesis 1, and has no mention of Adam or Eve.

Genesis 2 concludes the creation:

1 Thus the heavens and the earth were completed, and all their hosts. 2 By the seventh day God completed His work which He had done, and He rested on the seventh day from all His work which He had done. 3 Then God blessed the seventh day and sanctified it, because in it He rested from all His work which God had created and made.

He rested, from everything He had done thus far. The heavens and earth (planets and stars) were completed. It does not say He was done with humanity (this example is the study of hermeneutics).

Genesis 2:7 is when Adam was created and placed in the Garden of Eden.
Genesis 2:21-25 is the creation of Eve, and husband/wife.

Last time I checked, Genesis 1 comes BEFORE Genesis 2.

My theory stands.

he talks about the whole creation its a recount of what he did and you put thus far in it doesnt say that in the bible

 

[Frenchfrye]

Not quite.

What you quoted was from Genesis 1, and has no mention of Adam or Eve.

Genesis 2 concludes the creation:

1 Thus the heavens and the earth were completed, and all their hosts. 2 By the seventh day God completed His work which He had done, and He rested on the seventh day from all His work which He had done. 3 Then God blessed the seventh day and sanctified it, because in it He rested from all His work which God had created and made.

He rested, from everything He had done thus far. The heavens and earth (planets and stars) were completed. It does not say He was done with humanity (this example is the study of hermeneutics).

Genesis 2:7 is when Adam was created and placed in the Garden of Eden.
Genesis 2:21-25 is the creation of Eve, and husband/wife.

Last time I checked, Genesis 1 comes BEFORE Genesis 2.

My theory stands.

45 And so it is written, The first man Adam was made a living soul; the last Adam was made a quickening spirit.

 

[Vanguard PCD]

45 And so it is written, The first named man [found in the bible] Adam was made a living soul; the last Adam was made a quickening spirit.

I corrected it for you...in a literal English translation.

However, the Classical Hebrew word אָדָם‎ (adam) is used extensively to denote not an individual, but mankind, and is the masculine form of adamah.

Maybe, just maybe, the 47 scholars/scribes working for the Church of England, on the 1611 KJV, got it wrong here and there, and later translations followed tradition?

Yeah, I think so.

I suppose you also buy the story of the one rib? It's interesting that both males and females have 24 ribs, in even pairs. If the rib story is true, we'd have 25 ribs, being uneven on one side. We don't, so...

It's also interesting that in Messianic Jewish Bibles, like the OJB, 'adam' is not capitalized as a proper noun. It is merely talking about a human made specifically for the Garden.

 

[Vanguard PCD]

Anyway, let's get back to the OP topic: who did Cain fear if he was banished, and who did he marry?