Who brought about The State of Israel?

[Shamash Of Yeshua]

I would like to ask Everyone who is behind the State of Israel we see today?
Is it the Fake Jews or were the Real Jews involved?

 

[Digout]

I would like to ask Everyone who is behind the State of Israel we see today?
Is it the Fake Jews or were the Real Jews involved?

Lots of politics more than spiritual aspects are involved in the formation of Zionist Israel!

 

[Thomas L Cossette]

More Jewish people Believe in Karl Marx than Moses but does that unjew them? Ashkenazi Jews have little or no Hebrew blood in them, does that make them nonjews? Jew means "of Judah". Judah means "praise of Yahweh". Hebrew is a blood line Jew is a state of mind. That is why Yeshua said I know the blaspheme of them that say they are Jews but are not......If your not praising Yahweh you are not a Jew. Something tells me real Jews were involved and in most cases if they do not accept Yeshua it is because of misinformation, from both Christians and non believing Judaism clerics.

 

[visionary]

God will separate the wheat from the tares, but we are not to root them out, but let them grow together til the harvest.

 

[ContraMundum]

I would like to ask Everyone who is behind the State of Israel we see today?

God. He's the one in Charge. Doesn't matter how He does it or who He uses to bring His will into creation.

 

[ContraMundum]

More Jewish people Believe in Karl Marx than Moses but does that unjew them? Ashkenazi Jews have little or no Hebrew blood in them, does that make them nonjews? Jew means "of Judah". Judah means "praise of Yahweh". Hebrew is a blood line Jew is a state of mind. That is why Yeshua said I know the blaspheme of them that say they are Jews but are not......If your not praising Yahweh you are not a Jew. Something tells me real Jews were involved and in most cases if they do not accept Yeshua it is because of misinformation, from both Christians and non believing Judaism clerics.

A number of sweeping generalizations in there. Be pretty hard to prove those generalizations I would say.

"Hebrew is a blood line Jew is a state of mind" - RT?

 

[Thomas L Cossette]

Visionary

we are in the last days.......right? the rest of that parable is he will send messengers that will separate the wheat from the tares; the tares will be bound in bundles (denominations) to be burned, the wheat into his barn, (see also the dead wife carved into 12 pieces in Judges 19)

 

[Armoured]

"Fake Jews"?

 

[Digout]

God. He's the one in Charge. Doesn't matter how He does it or who He uses to bring His will into creation.

That is true. However, we should make sure whether we are with Him under all circumstances or against Him.

 

[Optimus Fortis]

"Fake Jews"?

Behold, I will make those of the synagogue of Satan who say that they are Jews and are not, but lie—behold, I will make them come and bow down before your feet and they will learn that I have loved you.

Revelation 3:9 I will make those who are of the synagogue of Satan, who claim to be Jews though they are not, but are liars--I will make them come and fall down at your feet and acknowledge that I have loved you.

By posting this, I am not saying that I understand this because I don't but according to this, there will be people whose claim of being Jews will be false.

 

[Armoured]

Behold, I will make those of the synagogue of Satan who say that they are Jews and are not, but lie—behold, I will make them come and bow down before your feet and they will learn that I have loved you.

Revelation 3:9 I will make those who are of the synagogue of Satan, who claim to be Jews though they are not, but are liars--I will make them come and fall down at your feet and acknowledge that I have loved you.

By posting this, I am not saying that I understand this because I don't but according to this, there will be people whose claim of being Jews will be false.

Fair enough

 

[ContraMundum]

Behold, I will make those of the synagogue of Satan who say that they are Jews and are not, but lie—behold, I will make them come and bow down before your feet and they will learn that I have loved you.

Revelation 3:9 I will make those who are of the synagogue of Satan, who claim to be Jews though they are not, but are liars--I will make them come and fall down at your feet and acknowledge that I have loved you.

By posting this, I am not saying that I understand this because I don't but according to this, there will be people whose claim of being Jews will be false.

Please understand that that citation may well be about those who claim to have replaced Israel and are the "true Jews" by their faith. eg- replacement theology.

I also posited in another thread that this could mean all kinds of things (and I got a warning for such speculation) but I do find it interesting that this would be posted on a thread that insinuates "false" Jews behind the forming of the State of Israel.

A person doesn't have to say much for the rest of us to know where it is going. We've heard this song and dance before. Bring on the conspiracy theories, blame the Jews.

 

[ContraMundum]

Visionary

we are in the last days.......right? the rest of that parable is he will send messengers that will separate the wheat from the tares; the tares will be bound in bundles (denominations) to be burned, the wheat into his barn, (see also the dead wife carved into 12 pieces in Judges 19)

Who teaches you this stuff? God made/will make denominations to burn their members up?

No Messianic mommy

I will not answer you. Why you say I need to read the rules again is simple beyond me. All I said was Jewishness is a state of mind...... and quoted the one who you said is Messsiah

You should answer her. Jewishness is not just a state of mind. That is extremely crass and a massive insult to people that actually have to pay the price for being Jewish.

 

[Optimus Fortis]

Please understand that that citation may well be about those who claim to have replaced Israel and are the "true Jews" by their faith. eg- replacement theology.

Do you mean those who teach that because Abraham was justified by faith and not by circumcision as mentioned in Romans 4?

 

[ContraMundum]

Do you mean those who teach that because Abraham was justified by faith and not by circumcision as mentioned in Romans 4?

Nope.

It's a reference to those who teach that the Church replaces the Jews/Israel, and therefore that Christians are the only "true" Jews. This is generally called replacement theology.

 

[Zeek]

I would like to ask Everyone who is behind the State of Israel we see today?
Is it the Fake Jews or were the Real Jews involved?

Hi Shamash,

This is the sort of question that can be answered on a variety of levels.

I believe that obviously YHWH is behind it, and just as He used the pagan nations to bring judgment to His people at various times in their history, so he has used the aspirations, hopes and determination of many unbelieving Jews in the 20th Century to help establish the present State of Israel.

This is not to endorse their unbelief, but to use aspects of their passion to accomplish the fulfillment of His word in Ezekiel 36, and because He cares for His Name...which is upon the Jewish people. Therefore even when they have not repented per se, He is still bringing His purposes to pass and will deal with them in the Land.

Satma Haredim have this the wrong way around, and cannot understand the evidence before their eyes (e.g. Israel now exists) because they believe G-d will not bring back the Jews to the Land until they have repented...this just isn't the case.

On another level, you could claim that Israel owes its legal existence to the Balfour declaration of 1917, leading to the San Remo Resolution of 1920 which led to the 1922 Mandate for Palestine via the League of Nations and has 51 signatories. Not only did these support the setting up of the Jewish State, but they were bound to aid them in any way possible...this has never been rescinded and is the binding force behind the Jewish claim to all of Israel, including the heart-land of Judea and Samaria...against which all the UN resolutions and International Law Court rulings are impotent.

A Jew is a Jew...whatever the state of his heart or his system of belief, but it is G-ds desire that they should know Messiah and fulfill the Law.
There is a profound truth in this, because just as Jesus did not come to abolish the Law but to fulfill it, so a Jew is not flouting the Law or disregarding it when they believe Jesus is Messiah...they too are fulfilling it.

Regards. Zeek

 

[Gxg (G²)]

And as far as genetics go:

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/06/10/science/10jews.html?_r=0
AJHG - Abraham's Children in the Genome Era: Major Jewish Diaspora Populations Comprise Distinct Genetic Clusters with Shared Middle Eastern Ancestry


How Do Sephardic Jews Figure Into The Genetic Equation? Forward.com
(there are others, but these two are a good jumping off point.)

Good info

 

[Mazock]

Do you mean those who teach that because Abraham was justified by faith and not by circumcision as mentioned in Romans 4?

You might want to start a different thread for this.

Also, please keep in mind the SOP about teaching against Torah Observance in this particular forum.

Feel free to ask if you're seriously interested in learning about Messianic Jewish beliefs.

 

[Shamash Of Yeshua]

That is true. However, we should make sure whether we are with Him under all circumstances or against Him.

God. He's the one in Charge. Doesn't matter how He does it or who He uses to bring His will into creation.

Deu 13:1-4 “When there arises among you a prophet or a dreamer of dreams, and he shall give you a sign or a wonder, (2) and the sign or the wonder shall come true, of which he has spoken to you, saying, ‘Let us go after other mighty ones – which you have not known – and serve them,’ (3) do not listen to the words of that prophet or that dreamer of dreams, for יהוה your Elohim is trying you to know whether you love יהוה your Elohim with all your heart and with all your being. (4) “Walk after יהוה your Elohim and fear Him, and guard His commands and obey His voice, and serve Him and cling to Him.

I forgot to say Greetings and Long time to all those who have known me years ago when I was very active here.

So onto more insight into this land in which is claimed biblically to be Israel.

 

[Thomas L Cossette]

Really Lulav

I thought he OP asked everyone what they thought of the formation of the modern day nation of Israel. Was it created by true Jews or fake Jews. I objectively pointed out both were involved. So why is a crowd gathering to stone me again. What Lashaun harah have I committed this time.

Fact: Karl Marx and Moses Hess wrote the communist manifesto they both lived good parts of their lives on kibbutz's in Palestine in the 1800s Fact; Nicolai Lenin the leader of the Communist revolution in Russia came from a Kibbutz in Palestine at the turn of the 1900s; these are simple easy to look up facts. their model for government was inspired by the Kibbutz with theology removed.

The question asked was were they fake or real Jews that started the modern nation of Israel. these people of these kibbutz's are the most long standing in the land people who called themselves Jews.

The fact that the secular Jews control Israel rather than the religious Jews and they the state, sanction secular kibbutz's before religious Kibbutz's is at the heart of what the OP was asking. If the religious controlled Israel there would be a temple on the mount rather than a mosques.

I simple said both were involved in the making of the nation. And that according to Yeshua whom you all say is your savior Jewishness is a state of heart and mind. If it is not so then Moses must have got it wrong according to the crowd forming around me to stone me a second time. Exodus 12:43-49

Will any of you practice Torah and diligently check out the facts as Torah commands before you stone someone. As far as I can see is lashron harah is practiced daily on this site, what is not tolerated is the truth. When I am thrown off this site it is not Thomas L Cossette that was scourged and thrown out of your cyber synagogue. It is truth you all brutalized, for unless you love the truth with the small "t" how can you love the SPIRIT of Truth with the large "T" you all gnash your teeth at me with stones in your hands, because what I say is truth and it picks you all to your hearts. Very few of you love truth enough to even follow Torah and check out the history before you kill truth spoken to you.It is the people who hate truth that makes the war zone.