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Who are the wicked?

Discussion in 'Baptists' started by Avid, Jun 14, 2015.

  1. Avid

    Avid A Pilgrim and a Sojourner...

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    There is confusion in our language as pertains to the meaning of certain words in the Bible. This word has, ALSO, been used to say something is extremely desirable, likeable or something approximating that. How long before that becomes the accepted use of the word, and the scriptures are diminished in the English language because of it?

    British Dictionary

    wicked
    adjective

    1. morally bad in principle or practice
    2. mischievous or roguish, esp in a playful way: a wicked grin
    3. causing injury or harm
    4. troublesome, unpleasant, or offensive

    What does scripture tell us? How is the word used in scripture?

    G e n e s i s 13
    13 But the men of Sodom were wicked and sinners before the LORD exceedingly.

    E x o d u s 23
    7 Keep thee far from a false matter; and the innocent and righteous slay thou not: for I will not justify the wicked.

    D e u t e r o n o m y 23
    9 ¶ When the host goeth forth against thine enemies, then keep thee from every wicked thing.

    II K i n g s 17
    11 And there they burnt incense in all the high places, as did the heathen whom the LORD carried away before them; and wrought wicked things to provoke the LORD to anger:

    J o b 20
    5 That the triumphing of the wicked is short, and the joy of the hypocrite but for a moment?

    P s a l m s 7
    11 God judgeth the righteous, and God is angry with the wicked every day.

    P s a l m s 11
    2 For, lo, the wicked bend their bow, they make ready their arrow upon the string, that they may privily shoot at the upright in heart.

    P r o v e r b s 12
    26 ¶ The righteous is more excellent than his neighbour: but the way of the wicked seduceth them.

    P r o v e r b s 15
    8 ¶ The sacrifice of the wicked is an abomination to the LORD: but the prayer of the upright is his delight.

    P r o v e r b s 29
    16 ¶ When the wicked are multiplied, transgression increaseth: but the righteous shall see their fall.

    I s a i a h 57
    21 There is no peace, saith my God, to the wicked.

    II T h e s s a l o n i a n s 3
    2 And that we may be delivered from unreasonable and wicked men: for all men have not faith.

    II P e t e r 2
    7 ¶ And delivered just Lot, vexed with the filthy conversation of the wicked:

    There are many more verses, but these seem to exemplify what God has said about the wicked.
     
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  2. miamited

    miamited Ted Supporter

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    Hi avid,

    God knows the end from the beginning. His word tells us to be mindful of those who call evil good and good evil. None of this catches Him by surprise. My daugher-in-law, who lives in Boston where the term seems to be used a lot, was caught up with this phraseology of calling 'good' things 'wicked'. I asked her if she realized that she was doing exactly what God's word warns us against. The last time we visited I don't recall hearing her use the phrase.

    But the world? It's a big place and the Scriptures seem to describe the general population of the world as falling further and further into wickedness. On such a large scale, it is just another reminder that God is right. It confirms once again, to me, that He does know the end from the beginning.

    God bless you.
    In Christ, Ted
     
  3. Goodbook

    Goodbook Reading the Bible

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    Yes ive heard people use wicked to describe something bad in a positive way.

    Ive also heard it used to describe really hot spicy food, like kfc chicken wings.

    But I know what God says about what wicked really means. I think people just want to play around with language. Like calling good evil and evil good, which scripture tells us not to do.
     
  4. Goodbook

    Goodbook Reading the Bible

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    Scriptures will never be diminished. Its people who just love sin thats all and revel in it.
     
  5. Avid

    Avid A Pilgrim and a Sojourner...

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    About 30 years ago, I designed a house, had it built, and we moved in. I had a neighbor who went to Church with us. He was a little older than me, but when he saw my kitchen, he said only, "Wicked kitchen!" My wife reacted to me telling her that, and asked what he could have possibly meant by that!
     
  6. twin1954

    twin1954 Baptist by the Bible

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    It is a symptom of a depraved and wicked world. Most people have no clue as to what sin is. I have heard folks say , speaking as though it were something to be enjoyed and longed for, that something is positively sinful. How often do the unbelieving rebels easily tell others to go to Hell not knowing the torments awaiting them there?

    But worse are those who are church goers who claim to believe on Christ who, without thinking, are conformed to this world. They easily and without remorse take the name of the Lord in vain by using His name as an exclamation. How many times have you heard someone say "Jesus" when they were surprised or frightened or just as a byword? How often do people, church goers, who cry "Oh God" when something happens that they didn't expect? I cringe every time I hear it.

    I personally find those far more alarming than how they use the word wicked. But you are right that language does take on different meanings in their historical context. It is up to us, who are responsible for this generation in which we live, to speak in love to those who oppose themselves explaining the Scriptural meaning and importance of understanding how words are used in the Scriptures.

    I will give you an example:

    The word "know" as it is used in the Scriptures means much more than just a familiarity or knowledge of something or someone. In connection with God it most often denotes an intimate union with someone. When Christ tells the folks who thought that they did many mighty works in His name that He never knew them it didn't mean that He had no knowledge or wasn't familiar with them but that He had never had an intimate union with them. The same is true about the word foreknow or foreknowledge. It doesn't mean that God looks down through time and sees what will happen it means that He has been intimately united to them from before the foundation of the world.
     
  7. Bluelion

    Bluelion Peace and Love

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    . So your responsible for this generation? I know I am not. No where in scripture does it ever suggest we are responsible for the actions of others who reject God unless the person did something in God's name that was evil causing the person to curse God. Are you saying this is what you have done?

    Jesus said He did not know them as they were a strange and not His child. There is another time the word Knew was used in sodom they said they wanted to know the Angels , have sexual relations with them. Jesus was simple saying they were not from Him. Seem very basic people would understand He was not talking about knowledge.
     
  8. twin1954

    twin1954 Baptist by the Bible

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    We are responsible to preach the truth of the Gospel to the generation in which we live. Slaps head.

    (Eze 33:1) Again the word of the LORD came unto me, saying,


    (Eze 33:2) Son of man, speak to the children of thy people, and say unto them, When I bring the sword upon a land, if the people of the land take a man of their coasts, and set him for their watchman:


    (Eze 33:3) If when he seeth the sword come upon the land, he blow the trumpet, and warn the people;


    (Eze 33:4) Then whosoever heareth the sound of the trumpet, and taketh not warning; if the sword come, and take him away, his blood shall be upon his own head.


    (Eze 33:5) He heard the sound of the trumpet, and took not warning; his blood shall be upon him. But he that taketh warning shall deliver his soul.


    (Eze 33:6) But if the watchman see the sword come, and blow not the trumpet, and the people be not warned; if the sword come, and take any person from among them, he is taken away in his iniquity; but his blood will I require at the watchman's hand.


    (Eze 33:7) So thou, O son of man, I have set thee a watchman unto the house of Israel; therefore thou shalt hear the word at my mouth, and warn them from me.


    (Eze 33:8) When I say unto the wicked, O wicked man, thou shalt surely die; if thou dost not speak to warn the wicked from his way, that wicked man shall die in his iniquity; but his blood will I require at thine hand.


    (Eze 33:9) Nevertheless, if thou warn the wicked of his way to turn from it; if he do not turn from his way, he shall die in his iniquity; but thou hast delivered thy soul.

    Try doing a study in how the word "know" is used in the Scriptures in connection with God then come back and talk.
     
  9. Avid

    Avid A Pilgrim and a Sojourner...

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    It is important that the LOST of the world HEAR the truth. The more pure truth, the better for them. Less confusion when there are not objections because of erroneous info. They are COMMANDED to repent, but may never be told so plainly.

    A c t s 17
    30 And the times of this ignorance God winked at; but now commandeth all men every where to repent:

    R o m a n s 10
    13 For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved.
    14 How then shall they call on him in whom they have not believed? and how shall they believe in him of whom they have not heard? and how shall they hear without a preacher?
    15 And how shall they preach, except they be sent? as it is written, How beautiful are the feet of them that preach the gospel of peace, and bring glad tidings of good things!
    16 But they have not all obeyed the gospel. For Esaias saith, Lord, who hath believed our report?
    17 So then faith cometh by hearing, and hearing by the word of God.

    The tactic of the enemy is to diminish the significance of the truth of God by various means, including the diminishing of the meaning of words in the language used to show the truth.

    My main purpose here is to ask, "Who are the Wicked?" A question like this was asked of me many years ago when I had no clear answer. The diminished proclamation of the truth had me "Dumbed-Down," and I was not ready to answer any better than the other worldly people who dabbled in things of the LORD. It was time to be serious, and the description of who the wicked actually are surprised me.

    Not only are the terrible, the vicious, the mass murderers and rapists, wicked, but many people, even churchgoers, think, say, and do wickedness from a heart void of God's Holy Spirit.

    The wicked:
    ----------------
    • Have no faith
    • Have no fear of God
    • Have contempt for God
    • Have filthy conversation
    • Have triumph and joy that is short lived
    • Provoke God to anger
    • Are hated by God
    • Are made by the LORD for the day of evil
    • Blesses the covetous
    • Speak loftily
    • Desires evil
    • Gives heed to false lips
    • Are unreasonable
    • Are corrupt
    • Are like the troubled sea, when it cannot rest, casting up mire and dirt
    • Works wicked things
    • Works a deceitful work
    • Borrows, and pays not again
    • Is snared in the work of his own hands
    • Shall see his desire perish
    • Labors in vain
    • Hardens his face
    • Devours iniquity with his mouth
    • Have their expectation perish
    • Increase transgression
    • Refuses to do judgment.
    • Perverts Judgment with bribes
    • Vex the righteous
    • Plot against the Just, and bite him
    • Seeks to slay the righteous
    • Regards not the cause of the poor
    • Speak peace while mischief is in their hearts
    • Shall be filled with mischief
    • Gives deceitful council
    • Secretly shoot arrows at the righteous and upright in heart
    • Take away the righteousness of the righteous from him
    • Lay wait and set a trap to catch men
    • Is seduced by his own ways
    • Are set in slippery places
    • Know not at what they stumble
    • Have his fears come upon him
    • Flee when no man pursues
    • Is adversary and enemy to the righteous
    • Is reserved to the day of destruction
    • Are overthrown by their own wickedness
    • Shall be destroyed forever
    • Are brought to desolation in a moment
    • Have no bands in their death
    • Are NOT are not in trouble or plagued as other men
    • Are NOT learners of righteousness
    • Are NOT Seekers after God
    • Are NOT Seekers of God's statutes
    • Are NOT Justified
    • Are NOT At peace
    • Will NOT learn righteousness
    • Shall NOT inhabit the earth
    • Shall NOT be unpunished
    Let us search our own hearts continually. Let none of us be unaware of who or what we really are.
     
    Last edited: Jun 15, 2015
  10. twin1954

    twin1954 Baptist by the Bible

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    I would add one thing to that list: they think that they are good.
     
  11. Bluelion

    Bluelion Peace and Love

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    sorry but your the one making claims the burden of prove is on you. I like how you quote scripture out of context. The fact is not everyone is meant to preach the Word of God, so by logic not everyone can be responsible for it.

    1cor 12

    12 The human body has many parts, but the many parts make up one whole body. So it is with the body of Christ. 13 Some of us are Jews, some are Gentiles, some are slaves, and some are free. But we have all been baptized into one body by one Spirit, and we all share the same Spirit.

    14 Yes, the body has many different parts, not just one part. 15 If the foot says, “I am not a part of the body because I am not a hand,” that does not make it any less a part of the body. 16 And if the ear says, “I am not part of the body because I am not an eye,” would that make it any less a part of the body? 17 If the whole body were an eye, how would you hear? Or if your whole body were an ear, how would you smell anything?

    18 But our bodies have many parts, and God has put each part just where he wants it. 19 How strange a body would be if it had only one part! 20 Yes, there are many parts, but only one body. 21 The eye can never say to the hand, “I don’t need you.” The head can’t say to the feet, “I don’t need you.”

    22 In fact, some parts of the body that seem weakest and least important are actually the most necessary. 23 And the parts we regard as less honorable are those we clothe with the greatest care. So we carefully protect those parts that should not be seen, 24 while the more honorable parts do not require this special care. So God has put the body together such that extra honor and care are given to those parts that have less dignity. 25 This makes for harmony among the members, so that all the members care for each other. 26 If one part suffers, all the parts suffer with it, and if one part is honored, all the parts are glad.

    27 All of you together are Christ’s body, and each of you is a part of it. 28 Here are some of the parts God has appointed for the church:


    what you are saying is everyone is a hand or foot, that is not what God says, maybe you are the one in need of study?
     
  12. Bluelion

    Bluelion Peace and Love

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    You asked who is wicked, we are. All of us, we have all sinned against God. We are the wicked, but by God's Grace we are made righteous. This also helps us to have mercy on others to know we to are sinners.
     
  13. Avid

    Avid A Pilgrim and a Sojourner...

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    This is what I discovered when I looked candidly at it over 30 years ago. The answer was, I was the wicked.
     
  14. Bluelion

    Bluelion Peace and Love

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    Awesome Avid. You saw the truth. You are blessed, because the truth is a blessing not everyone can see it.
     
  15. Goodbook

    Goodbook Reading the Bible

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    I found using some discernment, that what people laugh at is a good indicator at where their heart is at.

    An example off the top of my head is when someone being sarcastic, or makes a cruel joke...at someone elses expense. I dont mind gentle ribbing but i have seen some people be especially cruel and nasty to someone who is innocent. And then laughing about it. They mocking God while doing it, it grieves the holy spirit ultimately...blaspheming God.
     
  16. brinny

    brinny everlovin' shiner of light in dark places Supporter

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    *subscribing*
     
  17. Catherineanne

    Catherineanne Well-Known Member

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    Chance would be a fine thing. : )
     
  18. Bluelion

    Bluelion Peace and Love

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    some people laugh because the group is even though they think it mean, they are afraid they will be laughed at if they stand up for the person. So no it does not always show where the heart is at.
     
  19. nonaeroterraqueous

    nonaeroterraqueous Nonexistent Member

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    Semantics is a very important subject, and I always appreciate when the matter is brought up. We always lose a little bit of understanding whenever the meanings of words get blurred. For instance, I think we're all familiar with how the ancient Greeks had the words phileo, agape, eros and storge. These days, all of them are summed by the word, "love," which made it utterly impossible to tell my best friend that I loved him, back in second grade. I didn't want him to assume that I meant eros.

    Ancient Greeks also had two words for time, kairos, and chronos, which, if they had an equivalent in today's language could revolutionize the way we think about time.

    The more that words lose their meaning, the harder it becomes to communicate, and the more those words are core to the nature of religious debate, the harder it becomes to share religious ideas. Hence, Avid is exactly right. Misuse of the word, "wicked," will make it harder to convey Biblical ideas about wickedness. Misuse of the word, "God," takes away the sense of God's awesomeness, and makes it harder for us to convey the idea of God. Unfortunately, we can't stop the world from abusing words, but we can abstain from participating in that abuse.

    How important is it that we abstain? Remember that communication is a two-part process. One is the preaching of the gospel, and the second part is in the hearing and understanding. If we sabotage the second part, while doing the first, then we are like the man who tries to lose weight through vigorous exercise, while eating like a glutton, or the wife who tries to earn a little money on the side through odd jobs, while spending her family into oblivion. If we ruin our own words, then we blunt the tools of our own debate.

    On a lighter note, just to demonstrate how words change over time, I sometimes like to tell people that I'm a follower of Josh. I think Josh is the only person I've ever known who never did anything wrong. I pray to Josh, and I think Josh has the power to atone for my sins. It sounds heretical, but Josh, which is short for Joshua, is a transliteration of Yeshua, just as the name Jesus is a transliteration of Yeshua. That is to say that the name Josh is the same as the name Jesus. At least, it was the same. If we preach about Josh, then we tend to evoke a different response than if we preach about Jesus. One word, just one, had its connotative meaning drift from the original in two different directions, or, as I should probably say, one form drifted and the other anchored. In a situation where the word does not split, but only drifts, then we are left with only the weaker of the two options. It would be the same as having to preach about the miraculous life of Josh, until the name regains the same strength as the name of Jesus. In other words, the only way to save a word is to use it correctly and frequently.
     
  20. Avid

    Avid A Pilgrim and a Sojourner...

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    I have seen this breakdown of words and phrases hurt a person who sought remedy in the law. The State took her case to trial as she was complaining of being attacked by another, older woman. Around midnight, she was standing in a convenience store, and this woman (who thought she was having a relationship with her husband) came in with a group, and bumped into her. The issue escalated to a fight. The yonger woman said that, when the other person came bumping into her, she exclaimed, "I was, like 'Okay!!!' "

    The defense lawyer for the accused stated that without the inflection intended by the fouled-up language, and said, "She was not all that upset by being bumped, because she testified, "I was like Okay." That statement in his summation defied the way it was said, but worked against her to the point of the accused being acquitted.
     
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