Who are the sheep in John 10?

zoidar

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It just struck me! I can't believe I missed it! The sheep in John 10 are all those that know Jesus. He is saying it straight out in:

V. 14
I am the good shepherd, and I know My own and My own know Me,


"I know my sheep and my sheep know me."

V. 27
My sheep hear My voice, and I know them, and they follow Me


"My sheep hear my voice since they know me"

What then about v. 26
But you do not believe because you are not of My sheep.

"But you do not believe because you don't know me."

V. 37-38
If I do not do the works of My Father, do not believe Me; but if I do them, though you do not believe Me, believe the works, so that you may know and understand that the Father is in Me, and I in the Father.


"believe my works so that you may know Me and be my sheep."
 

eleos1954

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It just struck me! I can't believe I missed it! The sheep in John 10 are all those that know Jesus. He is saying it straight out in:

V. 14
I am the good shepherd, and I know My own and My own know Me,


"I know my sheep and my sheep know me."

V. 27
My sheep hear My voice, and I know them, and they follow Me


"My sheep hear my voice since they know me"

What then about v. 26
But you do not believe because you are not of My sheep.

"But you do not believe because you don't know me."

V. 37-38
If I do not do the works of My Father, do not believe Me; but if I do them, though you do not believe Me, believe the works, so that you may know and understand that the Father is in Me, and I in the Father.


"believe my works so that you may know Me and be my sheep."

who did you think the sheep were before?
 
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klutedavid

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It just struck me! I can't believe I missed it! The sheep in John 10 are all those that know Jesus. He is saying it straight out in:

V. 14
I am the good shepherd, and I know My own and My own know Me,


"I know my sheep and my sheep know me."

V. 27
My sheep hear My voice, and I know them, and they follow Me


"My sheep hear my voice since they know me"

What then about v. 26
But you do not believe because you are not of My sheep.

"But you do not believe because you don't know me."

V. 37-38
If I do not do the works of My Father, do not believe Me; but if I do them, though you do not believe Me, believe the works, so that you may know and understand that the Father is in Me, and I in the Father.


"believe my works so that you may know Me and be my sheep."
Who did you think the sheep were before?
 
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klutedavid

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no .... look at your post .... look at mine .... You capitalized the W in who .... I did not. Was just a flukey thing LOL
That is a one in ten million event. The exact same words at the exact same time, incredible.
 
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redleghunter

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V. 37-38
If I do not do the works of My Father, do not believe Me; but if I do them, though you do not believe Me, believe the works, so that you may know and understand that the Father is in Me, and I in the Father.


"believe my works so that you may know Me and be my sheep."
Unfortunately what you quoted does not say what you conclude.
 
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zoidar

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who did you think the sheep were before?

Who did you think the sheep were before?

What is new to me is that Jesus is talking in present tense. We are not sheep in this context until we know Jesus. Cetrainly we didn't know him until we were saved and certainly we didn't follow him before we became his sheep.
 
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redleghunter

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What do you think it says?
That verse says nothing about sheep. Jesus concluded His Good Shepherd discourse before the quoted verse. You skipped quite a few verses of context before drawing your conclusion. As in The Father gives the sheep to Jesus.
 
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zoidar

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That verse says nothing about sheep. Jesus concluded His Good Shepherd discourse before the quoted verse. You skipped quite a few verses of context before drawing your conclusion. As in The Father gives the sheep to Jesus.

Good Day, Peter

There is a whole half of the chapter that has to be considered, before we get to your verses.

DA Carson covers it here:

Part 6: Jesus the Shepherd of God (John 10:1-21)

In Him,

Bill

Still no Calvinist have had a good answer to why Jesus says what he says in v. 37-38, not yet at least...

Bill, DA Carson, for almost an hour, too long for me to go through.
 
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redleghunter

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Still no Calvinist have had a good answer to why Jesus says what he says in v. 37-38, not yet at least...
I gave you one. Verses 37-38 have nothing to do with the Good Shepherd discourse. That’s why you won’t get a “good Calvinist” answer. You selectively took a few verses from Chapter 10 and tried to fit it into your theory.
 
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zoidar

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I gave you one. Verses 37-38 have nothing to do with the Good Shepherd discourse. That’s why you won’t get a “good Calvinist” answer. You selectively took a few verses from Chapter 10 and tried to fit it into your theory.

Saying what it is not, doesn't explain what it is.
 
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redleghunter

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Saying what it is not, doesn't explain what it is.
I explained verses 37-38 are not relevant to the Good Shepherd discourse. The subject changed to the Jews picking up rocks wanting to stone Jesus for claiming to be equal to God.
 
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zoidar

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I explained verses 37-38 are not relevant to the Good Shepherd discourse. The subject changed to the Jews picking up rocks wanting to stone Jesus for claiming to be equal to God.

Thank you! But still not explaining why Jesus says what he says to the Jews, why Jesus wants them to believe he is God.
 
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redleghunter

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Thank you! But still not explaining why Jesus says what he says to the Jews, why Jesus wants them to believe he is God.
So they can be judged. Notice Jesus said you don’t believe me.


He said: (1) 37“If I do not do the works of My Father, do not believe Me;“

Then (2) 38but if I do them, though you do not believe Me, believe the works, so that you may know and understand that the Father is in Me, and I in the Father.”

They could not deny the works Jesus did was from Heaven from God yet they still did not believe Who He was, the Messiah and Son of God.

Knowing they did not believe Him but could believe the works because they witnessed the works with their own eyes and ears, they are set in disbelief and judged already. These are the same people in the Good Shepherd discourse Jesus said the following:

25Jesus answered them, “I told you, and you do not believe; the works that I do in My Father’s name, these testify of Me. 26“But you do not believe because you are not of My sheep.
 
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