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Which would apply to the USA?

Discussion in 'Bibliology & Hermeneutics' started by A.ModerateOne, Sep 18, 2021.

  1. A.ModerateOne

    A.ModerateOne Member Supporter

    United States
    "If my people, which are called by my name, shall humble themselves, and pray, and seek my face, and turn from their wicked ways; then will I hear from heaven, and will forgive their sin, and will heal their land." (2Chr 7:14, KJV)

    That is directed to God's people, not a secular nation.

    What about this one?

    "The word of the LORD came again to me, saying, Son of man, when the land sinneth against me by trespassing grievously, then will I stretch out mine hand upon it, and will break the staff of the bread thereof, and will send famine upon it, and will cut off man and beast from it: Though these three men, Noah, Daniel, and Job, were in it, they should deliver but their own souls by their righteousness, saith the Lord GOD." (Ezek 14:12-14, KJV)

    Yet, the LORD agreed to not destroy Sodom if only 10 righteous could be found there, but there was not even 10.

    It looks like we are in the same place as ancient Israel under God's judgment:

    "The shew of their countenance doth witness against them; and they declare their sin as Sodom, they hide it not. Woe unto their soul! for they have rewarded evil unto themselves. Say ye to the righteous, that it shall be well with him: for they shall eat the fruit of their doings. Woe unto the wicked! it shall be ill with him: for the reward of his hands shall be given him. As for my people, children are their oppressors, and women rule over them. O my people, they which lead thee cause thee to err, and destroy the way of thy paths." (Isa 3:9-12, KJV)

    The 19th Presbyterian theologian A. A. Hodge warned the Christians about turning education over to the government with no establishment of religion, but apparently no one listened.

    "I am as sure as I am of the fact of Christ’s reign that a comprehensive and centralized system of national education, separated from religion, as is now commonly proposed, will prove the most appalling enginery for the propagation of anti-Christian and atheistic unbelief, and of anti-social nihilistic ethics, individual, social, and political, which this sin-rent world has ever seen."
    A.A. Hodge – Public Schools are the "Engine" of Atheism — TEACH DILIGENTLY
    We teamed up with Faith Counseling. Can they help you today?
  2. Der Alte

    Der Alte This is me about 1 yr. old. Supporter

    United States
    If the government gets in the religion business it would have to include every religion; Christianity, Judaism, Hinduism, Islam, Shintoism[Japan] etc. etc. etc. Is that what we want? We have already had children being forced to memorize the five pillars of Islam and the Shahada which one recites to become a Muslim
    Ashadu an la ilaha illa illa-ilah, wa ashadu anna muhammadan rasul ullah.” Translation: “There is no God but God (Allah – i.e. there is none worthy of worship but Allah), and Muhammad is the Messenger of Allah.”
    I don't think that is what we want.
  3. A_Thinker

    A_Thinker Well-Known Member Supporter

    All of the scriptures you cite apply to Old Testament Israel ...
  4. d taylor

    d taylor Well-Known Member

    United States
    Any nation can be judged by God.

    Concerning the education of christians/believers and their children, the church should have taken up that role for themselves.

    And not try and take a secular government education system and expect them educated christians from a Biblical christian perspective.

    Even now the christian education system is so infected by false teaching that, that is really not a true Biblical education (especially in areas of creation)
  5. Michael Collum

    Michael Collum Everything began with a voice, use yours Supporter

    Christian Seeker
    I am reminded of Nineveh in a sense.

    They accepted the message of Jonah and repented.

    However, this message did not take root in the next generation so it was up for judgment later on.

    Nowadays, God does not destroy nations like He did back in the days prior to Jesus being resurrected.

    However, God does allow people and nations alike to be destroyed by their sins. O saints, do you notice the hardening of your heart, due to the increase of injustice? This is when to pray all the more.
  6. RDKirk

    RDKirk Alien, Pilgrim, and Sojourner Supporter

    One pastor has said, "If you send your children to Roman schools, do not be surprised if they turn out Roman"
  7. RDKirk

    RDKirk Alien, Pilgrim, and Sojourner Supporter

    This question is discussed at length and answered by the first two chapters of 1 Peter.

    1 Peter starts out with a firm revelation of who Christians are with respect to the world. Most people did not move around much. People were commonly born, lived, and died within a 20-mile radius. It was common that a family lived even in the same house for generation upon generation. Yet, to those people, who physically hadn't moved more than 20 miles from the place of their births--but because of their new birth in Christ--1 Peter says this:

    To the elect who are exiles of the Dispersion throughout Pontus, Galatia, Cappadocia, Asia, and Bithynia, chosen according to the foreknowledge of God the Father and sanctified by the Spirit for obedience to Jesus Christ and sprinkling by His blood.

    The conclusion of that discussion is this:

    But you are a chosen people, a royal priesthood, a holy nation, a people for God’s own possession, to proclaim the virtues of Him who called you out of darkness into His marvelous light. Once you were not a people, but now you are the people of God; once you had not received mercy, but now you have received mercy.

    This is the "team speech," by which we should realize that we who call ourselves Christian are a nation unto ourselves by privilege of a new birth, and now distinct from the natives of whatever territory we were first born into.
  8. d taylor

    d taylor Well-Known Member

    United States
    Good point, i have never seen the reason why having prayer or even some devotional in school, read at the start of a class. Has been so important to christian groups, it just seem to only have a political reason.

    Kind like the atheist have evolution in school, so the political christian cries we want our voices in there too.

    But yet how many of them are walking the streets (door to door, etc..), telling people how to receive God's free gift of Eternal Life.