Where in the Bible does it say these are sins?? Confused...

[com7fy8]

when we enjoy ourselves God enjoys the things we enjoy with us

God "gives us richly all things to enjoy." (in 1 Timothy 6:17)

What this means can grow. At first, I might enjoy photography. Then I get with a church and discover how enjoyable it can be with God to find out how to love the good example people plus the horrible people in the church > learning with God how to love is very enjoyable in its result. Then I get much more personal with certain people, and this requires more maturity with the deep enjoyment of becoming creative in how we handle problems, instead of avoiding them or giving in to them and spouting and pouting about them. The picture of enjoyment changes. Loving and forgiving is more deeply benefitting and enjoyable.

 

[Junia]

We 're meant to love our neighbours the same as ourselves. Not more than ourselves or less thaN ourselves. Therefore cutting M abusive parent out your life like I did with my dad is fine. My dad is saved he has a church! He doesn't need me in his life. Making sure our own needs are met before we are able to give to others is also Biblical

Am not being harsh but really believe that this physically compromising your own health for another person who isn't even born yet seems like codeendency or valuing yourself is less than other people

Jesus have his life for us.. We are called to lay down our lives to preach the gospel or still worship Jesus in a hostile land even face martydom. We are also called as best we can to love and give our plans up for our children IF we already have chosen to have them....

Motherhood is a vocation. I was a child when I realised I didn't have this calling. Most women are fine to be mothers most have maternal desires. A few of us were born and created by God not having this calling or desire. It is innate and like having red hair or blue eyes or something

No more a sin than being left handed. The issue isn't childlessness being a sin because new testament endorses celibacy for some..I also have no sexual desires and romantic interests. But I was prophesied over that one day when I was ready emotuonally, late in life, in would marry. This prophecy resonates in my spirit deeply. I also am prophetic and this confirmed.earlier revelation I had.

So this isn't the issue.

The issue would be sterilisation being wrong or what about people who want to a adopt??

I am happy to meet
God on judgement day with my barren womb and look Him in the eyes, head held high, no shame and give account to Him for why I chose childlessness...

But I would want to be clear about sterilisation because although childlessness is not a sin I did not know about srerilisation. I should perhaps have made it clear in my posts

 

[HappyHope]

I

As someone with severe level PCOS with all the added complications with it, I understand but the birth control pills stoped me bleeding to point of haemorrhage for months in end and the migraines and PMS that went with it.

I guess PCOS may be a poor example.because PCOS is usually genetic.

if my being o n the pill causes abortions when or if I marry it would be an uni intentional sin. I deliberately haven't researched if the BC pill am on causes abortions or not becAuse it I found out it did i would know aNd then I may be found guilty of sinning against my conscience if I don't stop taking it....we are told in Bible we can eat any foods and not ask whether they were offered to idols for this same reason. I have a very hypersensitive conscience, as in OCD issues, serious ones, so for me I stay away from asking where my things came from or if they are bad and just rely on God to tell me if He wants me to know that


l

It sounds like you are very aware of your physical and spiritual inclinations. So, any decision you make in this realm are informed decisions. This is good.

 

[Junia]

God "gives us richly all things to enjoy." (in 1 Timothy 6:17)

What this means can grow. At first, I might enjoy photography. Then I get with a church and discover how enjoyable it can be with God to find out how to love the good example people plus the horrible people in the church > learning with God how to love is very enjoyable in its result. Then I get much more personal with certain people, and this requires more maturity with the deep enjoyment of becoming creative in how we handle problems, instead of avoiding them or giving in to them and spouting and pouting about them. The picture of enjoyment changes. Loving and forgiving is more deeply benefitting and enjoyable.

can't you do both though? enjoy people and church and photography?? Why is it either or??

I use art and I use it to glorify God. Same with my pets they are a minsitry.tool as well..

we all need "me time" and time to just relax.

I haven't poured or spouted.

as I said from a child myself I never wanted kids...this proves it is an innate thing, and that am not called to it

 

[Junia]

Helping others who already have children can be very good . . . bearing one another's burdens > Galatians 6:2.

I

Sure. We are to care for others AND self and only give what energy and time we have. If it only twice a week for an hour that is ok. God is pleased with even a cup of water given to the needy

boundaries are important...hobbies we enjoy, rest, friends we can relax with

 

[com7fy8]

I have brain ddamage

I was abused by my dad a christian minister and other men all my childhood and most of adulthood or until social services took me somewhere safe

Well, of course I am sad and horrified that you have gone through that. And I am glad you are safe.

And now I think of this > you are the only one like you.

And what has happened in your past is not really the same as what has happened to others > how it effects you can be different, then, than how things like that are going to effect others.

And what really matters is how God knows what He wants to do with you.
He is very creative

I am now considering . . . it is possible that your past things are being used to limit you to what you think you can and can not do. But also > they can be typical things which culture uses to keep us busy with typical questions and issues, like if you can have children. May be you don't even need to be thinking about this!? Where does God want our attention, then?

I can keep having things come back to nag me and my attention . . . my failures, my past, and how I imagine I can have problems with people. But I can be quiet and trust God to guide me and my attention >

"casting all your care upon Him, for He cares for you." (1 Peter 5:7)

 

[lsume]

I was reading another thread on CF just now from a woman who is pondering the question of children with her husband but she says she has alwAys had stronger desire to adopt .she says her church told her that adopting children or having tubal ligation/sterilisation is sinning against God

I have heard these opinions before from Christians but am a bit confused because I cAnnot find any scripture referring to either of these matters?

Are there any scriptures on these topics at all, have I just missed them. Am curious because I never felt led by the Lord to be a mother and if I marry when am recovered enough from my issues I was pondering sterilisation. I am not keen on idea of taking a birth control pills that may be abortificent, stopping embryos from implanting.

I cAnnot understAnd why adoption would be considered wrong biblicLy? Wasn't Esther technicAlly brought up by her uncle? Moses was adopted.

The most important question is do you know that you are a born again Christian? As to your aforementioned questionable understanding of Biblical edicts pertaining to childbearing, adoption should be fine. It is inferred in The Word to adopt when led. The God Of Christ and our Holy God is not a terror to good works involving orphans.
Jas.1

1. [26] If any man among you seem to be religious, and bridleth not his tongue, but deceiveth his own heart, this man's religion is vain.
2. [27] Pure religion and undefiled before God and the Father is this, To visit the fatherless and widows in their affliction, and to keep himself unspotted from the world.

 

[com7fy8]

Motherhood is a vocation. I was a child when I realised I didn't have this calling. Most women are fine to be mothers most have maternal desires. A few of us were born and created by God not having this calling or desire. It is innate and like having red hair or blue eyes or something

You say you were prophesied to get married later in your life. And it seems you are curious what such marriage would be. I now understand that love is better than physical intimacy. And ones in marriage can make discoveries in how love can become in a close relationship, outdating however they were in love, at first. There is deeper and better, for us who keep growing in Jesus.

But many worldly marriages break down, even while ones may stay faithful to the end. They can be wishing for how they were at the first. But God gives increase No matter what happens to our bodies as we get older, still we can have more and more deep intimacy with God and others in this love.

So . . . likewise . . . how you see motherhood now could be a foil for how you can discover mothering to be. Here is how Paul and Silvanus and Timothy say they related with the Thessalonians >

"just as a nursing mother cherishes her own children" (in 1 Thessalonians 2:7).

I understand that Paul and Silvanus and Timothy were men and celibate; yet, in God's love they had God's way of mothering instinct, I see from this scripture!!!

 

[DamianWarS]

Am giving glory to God by not hAving children becAuse I M making my heAlth a priority. When we look.after.ourselves and not be harsh on ourselves we 're being kind and self compassionate which is Christian

Not having children is a product of sterilization and of course the act of "not having children" can give glory to God but not having children is not the issue. The issue is the act of sterilization.

A person with no legs can give glory to God without question but does an operation to remove someone's legs on a healthy person give glory to God?

Can you give glory to God without the sterilization? Do you give more glory to God after the sterilization? What role of the sterilization contributes to the glory of God?

You have a lot of self-care reasons. Personal health including emotional is important. I don't know the answers, you need to figure that one out yourself, I'm just showing different angles but is sterilization a reasonable physical/emotional health need? Is your physical/emotional well being under negative stress from not having the sterilization? Are there are ways to deal with this stress that perhaps may be more healthy or have you already sought out this care?

This subject is important and quick solutions for physical/emotional health are typically not the best. If your personal well being is problematic without sterilization I would suggest sterilization may not take the pain away and perhaps christian therapy or a counselor may serve you better while you're trying to figure this out.

 

[Online.Gamer.79]

I was reading another thread on CF just now from a woman who is pondering the question of children with her husband but she says she has alwAys had stronger desire to adopt .she says her church told her that adopting children or having tubal ligation/sterilisation is sinning against God

I have heard these opinions before from Christians but am a bit confused because I cAnnot find any scripture referring to either of these matters?

Are there any scriptures on these topics at all, have I just missed them. Am curious because I never felt led by the Lord to be a mother and if I marry when am recovered enough from my issues I was pondering sterilisation. I am not keen on idea of taking a birth control pills that may be abortificent, stopping embryos from implanting.

I cAnnot understAnd why adoption would be considered wrong biblicLy? Wasn't Esther technicAlly brought up by her uncle? Moses was adopted.

You know there is not a line in the bible about not adopting or sterilization. Males with mental retardation as rule are sterile, females are not, often enough parents have there female daughters with mental retardation sterilized...because one anyone with mind of child can not consent, two they as rule can not take care of there child. There is a difference between gods laws...and mans, alot of church's make up rules and laws that are gods laws but mans. And we don't follow all the literal bible laws anymore, if you were a prostitute or committed adulatory or a child who is rebellious gods law says they are to be executing. This makes it real easy...the two most important of gods laws are...love the lord and love your neighbor...if you want to know who your neighbor is go to the parable of the good Samaritan. If you follow those two laws you can not break any of the others.

 

[NerdGirl]

The scriptures that I have heard used to explain that birth control is a sin is Genesis 38:8-10. It's not a literal thou shalt not commit birth control, but the implication is there. Basically Onan was preventing the conception of a child while still having sex, he was put to death.

Considering the millions (if not billions) of men who have used the pull-out method since the world began, and I'm pretty darn sure they haven't dropped dead from divine wrath or being put to death...definitely not an example to impose upon all of mankind. "Take the lesson for what it is and nothing more" is a good rule to live by.

 

[Junia]

Well, of course I am sad and horrified that you have gone through that. And I am glad you are safe.

And now I think of this > you are the only one like you.

And what has happened in your past is not really the same as what has happened to others > how it effects you can be different, then, than how things like that are going to effect others.

And what really matters is how God knows what He wants to do with you.
He is very creative

I am now considering . . . it is possible that your past things are being used to limit you to what you think you can and can not do. But also > they can be typical things which culture uses to keep us busy with typical questions and issues, like if you can have children. May be you don't even need to be thinking about this!? Where does God want our attention, then?

I can keep having things come back to nag me and my attention . . . my failures, my past, and how I imagine I can have problems with people. But I can be quiet and trust God to guide me and my attention >

"casting all your care upon Him, for He cares for you." (1 Peter 5:7)

No am not dwelling on my past I am having medical treatment to help me walk again and other issues. God have me this treatment he was the one who secured my place with this doctor. so for next couple years my focus is on getting whole.

There is plenty of time for me to serve God when am recovered. am 38 and likely will live well into my 70s or 80s if my family tree is anything to go by as long as am careful at managing my diabetes, weight and other issues.

Why is not wrong for me to be doing miniature way am doing it?. I share the gospel by painting pictures for people of illustrated bible verses. I serve the homeless as after my treatment is over I plan to train in maybe psychology or counselling so I can help other abused women? There are Christian organisations especially who do this and even secular ones may allow us to share our faith, depending on whether they are ok with that I don't know

All these things are ministry. All these things are from God.

Why do you think God isn't pleased with my life??

 

[Junia]

Not having children is a product of sterilizatio








n and of course the act of "not having children" can give glory to God but not having children is not the issue. The issue is the act of sterilization.

A person with no legs can give glory to God without question but does an operation to remove someone's legs on a healthy person give glory to God?

Can you give glory to God without the sterilization? Do you give more glory to God after the sterilization? What role of the sterilization contributes to the glory of God?

You have a lot of self-care reasons. Personal health including emotional is important. I don't know the answers, you need to figure that one out yourself, I'm just showing different angles but is sterilization a reasonable physical/emotional health need? Is your physical/emotional well being under negative stress from not having the sterilization? Are there are ways to deal with this stress that perhaps may be more healthy or have you already sought out this care?

This subject is important and quick solutions for physical/emotional health are typically not the best. If your personal well being is problematic without sterilization I would suggest sterilization may not take the pain away and perhaps christian therapy or a counselor may serve you better while you're trying to figure this out.

I can't raise children as am disabled and have serious chronic health. COnditions which mean am in assisted living. I have hospital treatment at help me function, and so things like get dressed washed etc

 

[Junia]

Not having children is a product of sterilization and of course the act of "not having children" can give glory to God but not having children is not the issue. The issue is the act of sterilization.

A person with no legs can give glory to God without question but does an operation to remove someone's legs on a healthy person give glory to God?

Can you give glory to God without the sterilization? Do you give more glory to God after the sterilization? What role of the sterilization contributes to the glory of God?

You have a lot of self-care reasons. Personal health including emotional is important. I don't know the answers, you need to figure that one out yourself, I'm just showing different angles but is sterilization a reasonable physical/emotional health need? Is your physical/emotional well being under negative stress from not having the sterilization? Are there are ways to deal with this stress that perhaps may be more healthy or have you already sought out this care?

This subject is important and quick solutions for physical/emotional health are typically not the best. If your personal well being is problematic without sterilization I would suggest sterilization may not take the pain away and perhaps christian therapy or a counselor may serve you better while you're trying to figure this out.

I

I have decided already to be childless and God has been fine with it. am at peace in my heart about it.and if he wasn't it isn't an issue that can affect my standing with Him

am just not sure yet about sterilisation. Hence the questiom

 

[Junia]

You know there is not a line in the bible about not adopting or sterilization. Males with mental retardation as rule are sterile, females are not, often enough parents have there female daughters with mental retardation sterilized...because one anyone with mind of child can not consent, two they as rule can not take care of there child. There is a difference between gods laws...and mans, alot of church's make up rules and laws that are gods laws but mans. And we don't follow all the literal bible laws anymore, if you were a prostitute or committed adulatory or a child who is rebellious gods law says they are to be executing. This makes it real easy...the two most important of gods laws are...love the lord and love your neighbor...if you want to know who your neighbor is go to the parable of the good Samaritan. If you follow those two laws you can not break any of the others.

I

Thanks. Yes my church very much teaches that we know what is right or wrong and if we saved or not by whether we live others..my church doesn't really keep any additional stuff. E.g. We are encouraged to give money freely IF we have it but tithing is optional . We are not under any law

 

[Junia]

Considering the millions (if not billions) of men who have used the pull-out method since the world began, and I'm pretty darn sure they haven't dropped dead from divine wrath or being put to death...definitely not an example to impose upon all of mankind. "Take the lesson for what it is and nothing more" is a good rule to live by.

Yes! And Christians aren't subject to wrath any longer. Chastisement, yes and that means our sins have consequences on earth.

 

[Junia]

Considering the millions (if not billions) of men who have used the pull-out method since the world began, and I'm pretty darn sure they haven't dropped dead from divine wrath or being put to death...definitely not an example to impose upon all of mankind. "Take the lesson for what it is and nothing more" is a good rule to live by.

You say you were prophesied to get married later in your life. And it seems you are curious what such marriage would be. I now understand that love is better than physical intimacy. And ones in marriage can make discoveries in how love can become in a close relationship, outdating however they were in love, at first. There is deeper and better, for us who keep growing in Jesus.

But many worldly marriages break down, even while ones may stay faithful to the end. They can be wishing for how they were at the first. But God gives increase No matter what happens to our bodies as we get older, still we can have more and more deep intimacy with God and others in this love.

So . . . likewise . . . how you see motherhood now could be a foil for how you can discover mothering to be. Here is how Paul and Silvanus and Timothy say they related with the Thessalonians >

"just as a nursing mother cherishes her own children" (in 1 Thessalonians 2:7).

I understand that Paul and Silvanus and Timothy were men and celibate; yet, in God's love they had God's way of mothering instinct, I see from this scripture!!!

True
Jesus doesn't place any burdens on us

There is a prayer:

God grant me the serenity to accept the things I can. The courage to change the things I can. and the wisdom to know the difference

I can't change my situation but ?God can. so while am waiting for that I a working at being more serene about accepting things as they come

Jesus said one day at a time. There is no hurry or rush with Jesus.

 

[Junia]

Jesus came to take burdens from us and let Him carry the load. he calls us to lay out burdens on ?Him and let Him carry us and others.I

I have a background in mental health so I know a bit about this and studies have been done on pastors and other ministers who take on too much and let themselves burn out. The commands of
God are light not burdensome so if we feel unable to cope it is our lack of resting in ?Him that is the issue

so many people who are Christians tell me am lazy because am resting a lot due to the intense pain and muscle spasms of my illness . I tell myself that Jesus isn't judging me because He is pleased with me as I have the righteousness of Jesus . It was given to me at the Cross and I believe it in faith.

 

[Junia]

Feeling guilty about saying no or doing too much is not of God. The protestant work ethic, muscular Christianity are man made philosphoes. am not saying they all bad but they aren't the Gospel. so we are not bound to them

We serve God not man. Which is why important to hear God for ourselves and discern what we hear


If I hear condemnation or before and brimstone then I know that is my flesh not God.I

I just try take one day at a time

some Christians in parts of the world are being tortured for their faith and am thankful to God that I have an easier road to travel.

 

[Junia]

Well, of course I am sad and horrified that you have gone through that. And I am glad you are safe.

And now I think of this > you are the only one like you.

And what has happened in your past is not really the same as what has happened to others > how it effects you can be different, then, than how things like that are going to effect others.

And what really matters is how God knows what He wants to do with you.
He is very creative

I am now considering . . . it is possible that your past things are being used to limit you to what you think you can and can not do. But also > they can be typical things which culture uses to keep us busy with typical questions and issues, like if you can have children. May be you don't even need to be thinking about this!? Where does God want our attention, then?

I can keep having things come back to nag me and my attention . . . my failures, my past, and how I imagine I can have problems with people. But I can be quiet and trust God to guide me and my attention >

"casting all your care upon Him, for He cares for you." (1 Peter 5:7)

I

for me the thi mgs that come back to nag me are serious flashbacks, anxiety attacks, phobias etc so I am working through them in therapy. God has assured me he will bring the right person into my life when am ready but for now to focus on how He loves me and on getting healed

Complex trauma from abuse needs help to heal and that is ok...anyone or anything making me doubt my walk with God or the legitimacy of my disabilities and needs is coming from a spirit not of the Father because the holy spirit is not a spirit causing us self doubt, harshness in ourselves or condemnation.

Holy spirit doesn't want us who are already in the kingdom to arrive or worry.

Self doubt confusion lack of self worth are satanic . Holy spirit is my comforter who validates my needs and worth.
He doesn't make me feel bad about needing time to heal


My future husband can wait..any other thing can wait

For now am working on enjoying God and loving myself and my neighbour