Where Did Lazarus Go When He Died? Did He Go to Heaven and Back?

Sammy-San

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a speaker at my church (dean braxton actually) once said that people die when the soul leaves the body, not the other way around. was lazarus's soul in his body when he died? was he taken back from heaven and hell when he was ressurected, or did it only appear that he died?
 

Pedrito

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[[Edit added below.]]

The answer may be quite simple.

Let's say friends of yours to whom you are quite close, lose a brother. Just like Martha and Mary lost Lazarus.

You go to comfort them.

What would you say to them? Something about his being happy and in a better place? Would you tell them that they will see him and be with him again in Heaven when they also die? Something of that nature?

What did Jesus say? (John 11:23)
23 Jesus said to her, Your brother shall rise again.
How did Martha respond (as she had been taught by Jesus)? (John 11:24)
Martha said to Him, I know that he shall rise again in the resurrection at the last day.
What did Paul say to Christians who were worried about other Christians who had died? (1 Thessalonians 4:13-17, 18)
13 But I would not have you ignorant, brothers, concerning those who are asleep, that you be not grieved, even as others who have no hope.
14 For if we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so God will also bring with Him all those who have fallen asleep through Jesus.
15 For we say this to you by the Word of [the] Lord, that we who are alive [and] remain until the coming of the Lord shall not go before those who are asleep.
16 For the Lord Himself shall descend from Heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel and with the trumpet of God. And the dead in Christ shall rise first.
17 Then we who are alive [and] remain shall be caught up together with them in [the] clouds, to meet the Lord in the air. And so we shall ever be with the Lord.
18 Therefore comfort one another with these words.
Is the subject matter similar?

We know that Lazarus was dead. Jesus said so. (John 11:11-14)
11 He said these things; and after that He said to them, Our friend Lazarus sleeps. But I go so that I may awaken him out of sleep.
12 Then His disciples said, Lord, if he sleeps, he will get well.
13 But Jesus spoke of his death, but they thought that He had spoken of taking rest in sleep.
14 Then Jesus said to them plainly, Lazarus is dead.
Now, compare what Paul and Jesus said with what the speaker said. And maybe also compare Jesus' and Paul's words with Post #10 in the thread “God's Judgement On Sodom and Gommorah” in the Baptist forum [[**** No! Sorry! It was this forum. ****]]. (You could also read Posts #11 & 12 in that thread.)

So, as was asked:
was lazarus's soul in his body when he died? was he taken back from heaven and hell when he was ressurected, or did it only appear that he died?
 
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Sammy-San

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The answer may be quite simple.

Let's say friends of yours to whom you are quite close, lose a brother. Just like Martha and Mary lost Lazarus.

You go to comfort them.

What would you say to them? Something about his being happy and in a better place? Would you tell them that they will see him and be with him again in Heaven when they also die? Something of that nature?

What did Jesus say? (John 11:23)

How did Martha respond (as she had been taught by Jesus)? (John 11:24)

What did Paul say to Christians who were worried about other Christians who had died? (1 Thessalonians 4:13-17, 18)



Is the subject matter similar?

We know that Lazarus was dead. Jesus said so. (John 11:11-14)


Now, compare what Paul and Jesus said with what the speaker said. And maybe also compare Jesus' and Paul's words with Post #10 in the thread “God's Judgement On Sodom and Gommorah” in the Baptist forum. (You could also read Posts #11 & 12 in that thread.)

So, as was asked:

Was Lazarus in heaven, and then brought back?
 
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Job8

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a speaker at my church (dean braxton actually) once said that people die when the soul leaves the body, not the other way around. was lazarus's soul in his body when he died? was he taken back from heaven and hell when he was ressurected, or did it only appear that he died?
Lazarus went to Abraham's Bosom in Hades, while his body remained in the tomb. The OT saints could not enter Heaven until the resurrection of Christ, and he would have been among the OT saints.
 
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Job8

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what about the other person who was ressurected?
The same. As we know from the words of Christ Himself, the righteous (justified ones) all went to Abraham's Bosom (the place of the righteous dead in Hades) and Christ Himself went there before He was resurrected. Upon His resurrection, He took all these souls and spirits to Heaven, and since then, the saints go directly to Heaven. See Acts 7.
 
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brinny

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where did lazarus go before he came back to life?
a speaker at my church (dean braxton actually) once said that people die when the soul leaves the body, not the other way around. was lazarus's soul in his body when he died? was he taken back from heaven and hell when he was ressurected, or did it only appear that he died?

Excellent question.

This would be a great Bible study.
 
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Pedrito

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Superhero Sam asked in Post #3:
Was Lazarus in heaven, and then brought back?
Suppose a friend of yours was pronounced dead and then came back to life in the funeral parlour a few days later?

What would you ask them?

Would the most natural and pressing of questions not be, “What was it like?”

Had an important question like that been asked of Lazarus, it would have been recorded, along with the answer.

The question was not asked by those people because they were familiar with what God had revealed in the inspired Scriptures He had given them (what we call the “Old Testament”), and because they had been personally taught by their knowledgeable friend Jesus.

They knew that such a question (had anybody thought to suggest it) would have been meaningless.

-------------------------------------------------------------------

The “Apostles Creed” says Jesus descended into Hell.

The original Nicene Creed of 325AD which added Jesus to God, and the later Constantinople creed of 381AD which added the Holy Spirit as a third element (it is presented to us as the “Nicene Creed”), say he was buried, and ascended into Heaven after his resurrection.

A number of churches teach that prior to Jesus' death, dead people were conscious in Hades, either in the part reserved for righteous people or in the part reserved for unrighteous people (without necessarily defining what “righteous” means).

A belief such as that would also have sparked the question to Lazarus, “What was it like?”.

-------------------------------------------------------------------

So what did God reveal about the death state in the Jewish Scriptures? Whatever it was, Jesus taught the same thing.

The answer to that question might just be the direct and accurate and fulfilling response that Superhero Sam is looking for.

-------------------------------------------------------------------

Brinny in Post#7 suggested regarding Superhero Sam's initial post:
Excellent question.

This would be a great Bible study.
I agree. I have suggested a good place to start.

(By the way, I suggest we employ a degree of precision when dealing with God's Holy Written Revelation to us. Would the reader agree that Acts Chapter 7 in no way indicates that:
Upon His resurrection, He took all these souls and spirits to Heaven, and since then, the saints go directly to Heaven. See Acts 7.

Only with precision comes true understanding.
 
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FreeinChrist

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The same. As we know from the words of Christ Himself, the righteous (justified ones) all went to Abraham's Bosom (the place of the righteous dead in Hades) and Christ Himself went there before He was resurrected. Upon His resurrection, He took all these souls and spirits to Heaven, and since then, the saints go directly to Heaven. See Acts 7.

Yep. The OT saints were saved by faith - but that salvation was not realized until Christ died for their sins. He took them to heaven.
 
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ewq1938

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a speaker at my church (dean braxton actually) once said that people die when the soul leaves the body, not the other way around.

The body can not leave the soul. That much is true.


was lazarus's soul in his body when he died?

Yes, and when he died the soul and spirit left.

was he taken back from heaven and hell when he was ressurected, or did it only appear that he died?

Heaven and hell/hades are two different places. Based on Christ resurrecting him, I believe Lazarus was in heaven not Hades and he might have been the same Lazarus that is in the story about the rich man who went to Hades.
 
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ewq1938

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Lazarus went to Abraham's Bosom in Hades, while his body remained in the tomb.

Abraham's bosom is not in Hades, nor Hades in it for that matter. They are different places separated by a great gulf. A.B. is a Jewish term for heaven, The heaven where God is.


The OT saints could not enter Heaven until the resurrection of Christ, and he would have been among the OT saints.

Please prove that.
 
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Job8

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Abraham's bosom is not in Hades, nor Hades in it for that matter.
"Abraham's bosom" is now obsolete (has been since the resurrection of Christ), although it was in Hades before. Those spirits are now in the New Jerusalem (Heb 12:22-24 KJV). Notice the term "the spirits of just men made perfect" alongside "the general Assembly and Church" of the first born: But ye are come unto mount Sion, and unto the city of the living God, the heavenly Jerusalem, and to an innumerable company of angels, To the general assembly and church of the firstborn, which are written in heaven, and to God the Judge of all, and to the spirits of just men made perfect, And to Jesus the mediator of the new covenant, and to the blood of sprinkling, that speaketh better things than that of Abel.
Please prove that.
Easy enough. When Christ died, His body was placed in the tomb, and His soul and Spirit went to Hades, and after three days and three nights He was resurrected. Hence it is written (Acts 2:24-27): Whom God hath raised up, having loosed the pains of death: because it was not possible that he should be holden of it. For David speaketh concerning him, I foresaw the Lord always before my face, for he is on my right hand, that I should not be moved: Therefore did my heart rejoice, and my tongue was glad; moreover also my flesh shall rest in hope: Because thou wilt not leave my soul in hell [Greek hades = Hades], neither wilt thou suffer thine Holy One to see corruption [in the tomb].

Christ did not descend into the Lake of Fire (Hell) and Hades should have simply been transliterated as Hades.
 
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ewq1938

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"Abraham's bosom" is now obsolete (has been since the resurrection of Christ), although it was in Hades before.

That's not correct. Abraham's bosom is heaven.

When Christ died, His body was placed in the tomb, and His soul and Spirit went to Hades, and after three days and three nights He was resurrected.

Christ did not descend into the Lake of Fire (Hell) and Hades should have simply been transliterated as Hades.


I know.
 
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What's not correct? If Abraham's bosom is in Heaven, and the New Jerusalem is in Heaven, what are you complaining about?


I am not complaining, I am correcting some of the errors you have made. Also, Abraham's bosom is not "in heaven" it IS HEAVEN.

Gill:

and was carried by the angels into Abraham's bosom: by Abraham's bosom is meant heaven, a phrase well known to the Jews, by which they commonly expressed the happiness of the future state: of Abraham's happy state they had no doubt; and when they spake of the happiness of another's, they sometimes signified it by going to Abraham.
 
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Job8

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I am not complaining, I am correcting some of the errors you have made. Also, Abraham's bosom is not "in heaven" it IS HEAVEN.
Now you are the one introducing a major error. Abraham's bosom was NEVER in Heaven (neither is Heaven itself) and Gill is mistaken. Please read the account of the Rich Man and Lazarus. They were both in Sheol (which is Hades in Greek) and which is the place of departed spirits. Christ went to Hades while His body was in the tomb and then He took the righteous dead with Him to the New Jerusalem which is in Heaven. Therefore Abraham's bosom does not exist either in Hades or in Heaven at the present, since the spirits of just men have been made perfect.
 
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ewq1938

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Now you are the one introducing a major error. Abraham's bosom was NEVER in Heaven (neither is Heaven itself) and Gill is mistaken.

No, he is not mistaken.


Please read the account of the Rich Man and Lazarus. They were both in Sheol (which is Hades in Greek) and which is the place of departed spirits.

No, they both were not in the same place. The text makes that perfectly clear. Go re-read it. Look for the words "great gulf".
 
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Pedrito

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Post #13:
Those spirits are now in the New Jerusalem (Heb 12:22-24 KJV). Notice the term "the spirits of just men made perfect" alongside "the general Assembly and Church" of the first born: But ye are come unto mount Sion, and unto the city of the living God, the heavenly Jerusalem, and to an innumerable company of angels, To the general assembly and church of the firstborn, which are written in heaven, and to God the Judge of all, and to the spirits of just men made perfect, And to Jesus the mediator of the new covenant, and to the blood of sprinkling, that speaketh better things than that of Abel.
Was Paul writing to dead people? No. He was writing to the living. So they had not yet come to the city, the heavenly Jerusalem. So he must have been writing about their reckoned status as dedicated believers. It was something future for them. And the Scriptures are very specific about when and how they will attain that.

And when applying the verses above to people who died before Jesus' death and resurrection (“and to the spirits of just men made perfect”), should we not take into account what God caused to be recorded in the Old Testament (which specifically deals with that time period), and also Jesus' own words?

And why does the text use the term “spirits” instead of “souls”? Do people's spirits go to Heaven as well as their souls?
 
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Pedrito

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In Post #13 it was stated:
Easy enough. When Christ died, His body was placed in the tomb, and His soul and Spirit went to Hades, and after three days and three nights He was resurrected.
Yet in Luke 23:43, what did Jesus say to the thief on a cross near him:
43 And Jesus said to him, Truly I say to you, Today you shall be with Me in Paradise.
And what did Paul say of himself in the third person in 2 Corinthians 12:4:
that he was caught up into Paradise and heard unspeakable words, which it is not allowed for a man to utter.
So just where were Jesus and Paul?

I tend to want to believe what God inspired Paul to declare in 1 Corinthians 14:33:
For God is not [the author] of confusion, but of peace, as in all churches of the saints.
And while Paul was applying this general principle to a specific situation, that does not invalidate the declared general principle itself. Does it?
 
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