When the heat comes

[keras]

Jer 30 is already true in Christ.

The day of worldwide judgement is not to be broken down into parts by experts. The correct view is the swiftest in elapsed time. That's why the NT spends much more time on the offer of justification from our debt of sins regarding that day, than scientific or chronological detail ad nauseum

The Bible itself describes the Lord's judgement in several stages; first a worldwide reset of civilization, a similar event to Noah's flood, but this time with fire.
Next the wipe out of Satan's army at Armageddon and chaining him up.
Then after the Millennium comes the GWT judgement of all humans.

I suggest you read Jeremiah 30 again. It starts with the Lord's Day of wrath, then says how He we should not be afraid on that Day. The Lord will bring us back from afar, He will heal us, forgive our sins, restore our fortunes, bless us and settle us in the Holy Land. We will choose our own leader, a person that will approach God in a similar way as did Moses and David.
In Jer 30:23-24 the Day of wrath is reiterated, it will accomplish it's purpose, that is to depopulate all the Holy Land. But only in the last days will you understand.

 

[BABerean2]

There are other prophesies that confirm Jesus will be seen by His own, before the Return in glory.
The leaders of Beulah will be able to approach Him, in a similar way that Moses and David did. Jer. 30:21 The Shekinah Glory will go into the new Temple, Ezekiel 43:2. He stands on the Temple mount to select the 144,000, Rev. 14:1

Re the judgement/punishment by fire; all the over 70 prophesies that tell of the Lord's terrible fiery wrath, that we know will be a CME sunstrike, will happen at the Psalm 83/ Sixth Seal event.

A friend of mine told me the Glory of the Lord had not entered back into the temple and thus this was a prophecy never fulfilled.

When he said this, I reminded him that God had walked back into the temple on His own two feet in the person of Christ Jesus.

They forcibly removed Him from the temple and crucified Him.


Act 2:22 Ye men of Israel, hear these words; Jesus of Nazareth, a man approved of God among you by miracles and wonders and signs, which God did by him in the midst of you, as ye yourselves also know:


Act 2:23 Him, being delivered by the determinate counsel and foreknowledge of God, ye have taken, and by wicked hands have crucified and slain:



Those who do not know God, will be destroyed by a Son strike.


Psa 2:7 I will declare the decree: the LORD hath said unto me, Thou art my Son; this day have I begotten thee.


Psa 2:8 Ask of me, and I shall give thee the heathen for thine inheritance, and the uttermost parts of the earth for thy possession.


Psa 2:9 Thou shalt break them with a rod of iron; thou shalt dash them in pieces like a potter's vessel.

.

 

[keras]

A friend of mine told me the Glory of the Lord had not entered back into the temple and thus this was a prophecy never fulfilled.
When he said this, I reminded him that God had walked back into the temple on His own two feet in the person of Christ Jesus.
They forcibly removed Him from the temple and crucified Him.


Act 2:22 Ye men of Israel, hear these words; Jesus of Nazareth, a man approved of God among you by miracles and wonders and signs, which God did by him in the midst of you, as ye yourselves also know:
Act 2:23 Him, being delivered by the determinate counsel and foreknowledge of God, ye have taken, and by wicked hands have crucified and slain:

Those who do not know God, will be destroyed by a Son strike.
Psa 2:7 I will declare the decree: the LORD hath said unto me, Thou art my Son; this day have I begotten thee.
Psa 2:8 Ask of me, and I shall give thee the heathen for thine inheritance, and the uttermost parts of the earth for thy possession.
Psa 2:9 Thou shalt break them with a rod of iron; thou shalt dash them in pieces like a potter's vessel .

You state facts we are already very well aware of. The Lord will judge the nations, Hab 3:12, in His fury He will traverse the earth. How this will be carried out, you seem unable to understand.

RE the glory of God; other than the time when He was 12, the only time Jesus actually entered Herod's Temple, was to throw out the moneychangers, etc. So the prophesies I point out remain to be fulfilled.

 

[BABerean2]

How this will be carried out, you seem unable to understand.

If you mean your insistence that it will be carried out through a naturally occurring event known as a coronal mass ejection, you are correct.

I cannot get your naturalistic scenario to match up with God's Word.
You see a natural event produced by the sun, with some people surviving the event by being protected in underground bunkers.

I see an earth shattering, earth melting supernatural event produced by the One who made the sun and the Laws of Physics.

I also was not able to get your lunar thermite reaction to work, since the necessary reactants of Iron oxide and pure Aluminum are not found on the moon. Fe2O3 + Al --------> Fe + Al2O3 + Heat Energy

At one time the thermite reaction was used for welding together the steel rails of a railroad track.
The reaction is well understood, as a typical exothermic reaction.

The general physics of a coronal mass ejection is also understood.

The destruction of this rotten, sin-cursed world and it's replacement with a New Heavens and a New Earth is something that only God can understand.

 

[Interplanner]

Keras wrote:
From all the prophesies about this gathering and settling, we know it will happen before Jesus Returns for His Millennium reign.

No we don't. He said the kingdom was here (and there aren't too many kingdoms made without human hands, Dan 2). The NT is instead full of using such OT passages as they are true in Christ. There is also no theological need to set up anything in any land, if we read Jn 4 and Hebrews rightly. We have Christ!

 

[Interplanner]

Keras,
re the glory in the temple...
Jn 12. "I have glorified it and I will glorify it again". Not to mention that the fact of Christ out among all the nations is alluding to this, Col 1:27 (to the day when the 'temple' of God would be filled, not to the Jn 12 moment in itself). It's why Paul referred to the entire church as a living temple; living did not just mean it was people, but the glory was alive in it.

 

[keras]

BaB, If you can't see this forthcoming fire judgement, when it is prophesied over 70 times in the Bible, as the Lord's punishment of the nations in a similar way as He did in Noah's day, then the only conclusion I can say is you are blinded.
Isaiah 42:19 Who is so blind as My servants.... We don't have to be that way, but we must clear our minds of any false teachings and concentrate on what the prophets actually said.
Our main divergence is that you combine the Sixth Seal with the NHNE. Don't know anyone else who does that, not what the Bible says at all.

IP, your spiritualization of what the OT prophets described is wrong. Paul said that what happened to the ancient Israelites was symbolic of future things to happen in the last days. 1 Cor. 10:11
God's plans WILL be fulfilled, His people WILL become 'a light to the nations', it is them who will say: Blessed is He who comes in the Name of the Lord!

 

[Interplanner]

THey were in the last days, as defined there.
Funny you should pick 'light of the world' because that is the one verse used to follow up the sermon of Acts 13 (13:47) to say that that mission of being the light was underway.
'Until you say, 'Blessed is he...' is not a prediction. It is a reprimand for the leaders not doing what the followers did. In other words, he is saying they won't (understand him). Jesus does not pop into "prophecy mode" (especially distant prophecy) just any old time you feel like it.

 

[Interplanner]

Beyond all the details Keras, there is no need. Read Eph 1-3 and see if anything seems to be missing from "In Christ." Or Col 1, the champion of all Christological passages.

 

[keras]

Beyond all the details Keras, there is no need. Read Eph 1-3 and see if anything seems to be missing from "In Christ." Or Col 1, the champion of all Christological passages.

All the details, IP?
No, you ignore the vividly prophesied details NT and OT. This world is right now 'as in the days of Noah', the great 'shaking' is about to happen. Hebrews 12:26, Haggai 2:6
The prophecy in Haggai goes on to say the new Temple will exceed the splendour of the former ones and the Holy Land will have prosperity and peace.
Look forward to it!

 

[Interplanner]

Look foward to it? If anything, it is the deception of a resurgence of Judaism. What's to look forward to?

The vivid details of some prophecies are not there for us to chase down and pin on a chart. There is no evidence of that in the NT. But they do confirm the final day of worldwide judgement, yes. But I had no doubts of that to begin with.

The 'days of Noah' expression was about the 1st century ignorance about what would happen to them as the zealots triggered the destruction of the Israel. In pagan or secular settings, you could say its been like that expression since the watermelon.

Back to the grandeur of what has been brought about in Christ; do you get that? Do you understand that the need for a restored Judaism or anything in Israel does not exist? Have you read Hebrews lately?

 

[keras]

IP, I certainly do look forward to the blessings of God toward His people.
This is prophesied to happen soon after the Sixth Seal worldwide disaster. People from every tribe, nation and language will gather and live in all of the Holy Land. They will have righteous teachers and will live in peace and prosperity.
Because of denial of the prophesies and a preterist beliefs, many fail to see this Biblical truth of what God has planned for His people. They miss out on the anticipation of receiving those promises.

Isaiah 51:4-8 Listen to Me, My people, My instruction will shine forth from Me and My judgement will dawn upon you. In an instant the sky will be dispersed like smoke, the earth will become tattered and torn and many people will die, but you who keep My Laws – do not fear your enemies, do not let their reviling dismay you. For My saving power is unbroken and My Deliverance will be everlasting.
This describes a sunstrike CME, that will kill many people. The terrible Day of the Lord's wrath. Rev 6:12-17 But those who keep His Laws will be protected and will go to live in Beulah. Isaiah 62:1-5

 

[BABerean2]

BaB, If you can't see this forthcoming fire judgement, when it is prophesied over 70 times in the Bible, as the Lord's punishment of the nations in a similar way as He did in Noah's day, then the only conclusion I can say is you are blinded.

Oh, I see the fire judgment coming just fine.
It could be compared to the punishment that happened in Noah's day.
So far we are in perfect agreement.

The only people that survived in Noah's day were on that ship. After the event, all the others were dead.
That ship today is Jesus Christ.

My eyes are wide open and I see just fine, except when it comes to your version of it, as a CME.

For some reason, if I do not agree with your interpretation I must be blinded, even though I have never heard your version from anyone else on the forum. You may want to do a reality check.

There are several here who agree that Revelation chapter 6 is a reference to Armageddon.
As a matter of fact I was introduced to the idea by another member of this forum over a year ago, before you started posting.

How many here agree with your Coronal Mass Ejection/Lunar Thermite/Satellite Crash scenario???
.

 

[Interplanner]

The whole universe as we know it may be redone. There is no proof that the NHNE is the type of place as we know of right now.

 

[Dave Watchman]

Isaiah 51:4-8 Listen to Me, My people, My instruction will shine forth from Me and My judgement will dawn upon you. In an instant the sky will be dispersed like smoke, the earth will become tattered and torn and many people will die, but you who keep My Laws – do not fear your enemies, do not let their reviling dismay you. For My saving power is unbroken and My Deliverance will be everlasting.
This describes a sunstrike CME, that will kill many people. The terrible Day of the Lord's wrath. Rev 6:12-17 But those who keep His Laws will be protected and will go to live in Beulah. Isaiah 62:1-5

Keras, there's a reason why the Old Testament end time prophecies don't mix that well with Daniel and Revelation. There's parallels and similarities but the two speak about different methods to arrive at the same outcome. Daniel 9 was the fork in the road. Not just for the old time Jewish Nation and the two prophetic outcomes but for our understanding of them. Did you ever wonder where in Revelation's story is there an infant that will play near the cobra's den or a young child that will put its hand into the viper's nest?

God had 3 prophets in operation at the very same time: Ezekiel, Jeremiah and Daniel. These 3 prophets were being given somewhat different end time plans, these two scenarios do not mix well. The end time plan in Ezekiel and Jeremiah was set to begin and continue to completion with the arrival of Messiah. This is why John the Immerser was saying "repent for the Kingdom of God is at hand." At that point in time it was set to begin immediately. Jesus would have resurrected David to rule Israel and then build the Ezekiel Temple. The Old Testament prophecies that you quote would have taken place already (Gog Magog) during the years we call the middle ages and Revelation would have never been written.

Daniel was being given the alternative plan that would have a slightly prolonged outcome after 1844 and stretching out into our time.
70 weeks were cut off (chathak) from the times of the Gentiles to give Old Israel one last chance:

• To finish the transgression,

• To put an end to sin,

• To atone for iniquity,

• To bring in everlasting righteousness,

• To seal both vision and prophet,

• To anoint a most holy place.

I'll let you figure out which vision and prophet got sealed up, but I wouldn't be holding my breath for Ezekiel's Temple.


Strong's #2852: chathak (pronounced khaw-thak')
a primitive root; properly,
to cut off, i.e. (figuratively) to decree:--determine.



Brown-Driver-Briggs Hebrew Lexicon:

châthak
1) to divide, determine
1a) (Niphal) to be determined, be decreed, be settled, be marked out
Part of Speech: verb
Relation: a primitive root

Usage:

This word is used 1 times:
Daniel 9:24: "Seventy weeks are determined upon thy people and upon thy holy city,"

 

[Interplanner]

God does not do 2P2P.

 

[keras]

Keras, there's a reason why the Old Testament end time prophecies don't mix that well with Daniel and Revelation. There's parallels and similarities but the two speak about different methods to arrive at the same outcome. Daniel 9 was the fork in the road. Not just for the old time Jewish Nation and the two prophetic outcomes but for our understanding of them. Did you ever wonder where in Revelation's story is there an infant that will play near the cobra's den or a young child that will put its hand into the viper's nest?

God had 3 prophets in operation at the very same time: Ezekiel, Jeremiah and Daniel. These 3 prophets were being given somewhat different end time plans, these two scenarios do not mix well. The end time plan in Ezekiel and Jeremiah was set to begin and continue to completion with the arrival of Messiah. This is why John the Immerser was saying "repent for the Kingdom of God is at hand." At that point in time it was set to begin immediately. Jesus would have resurrected David to rule Israel and then build the Ezekiel Temple. The Old Testament prophecies that you quote would have taken place already (Gog Magog) during the years we call the middle ages and Revelation would have never been written.

Daniel was being given the alternative plan that would have a slightly prolonged outcome after 1844 and stretching out into our time.
70 weeks were cut off (chathak) from the times of the Gentiles to give Old Israel one last chance:

I do not see any hint of God having different end time plans and just one to be fulfilled, the others are discarded. I've never heard this theory before and I completely refute it.
It would make those prophets that got it wrong, false prophets.
From my intensive studies of all the prophets, I see a coherent and logical sequence of end time events. Each prophet adds something to the picture or reiterates and reinforces what the others say.
That 1844 had or will have anything to do with the last days, is just wrong.
Because the Jews rejected Jesus, they lost the chance to bring about the physical Kingdom at that time. God knew this would happen and He sent the Holy Spirit to sustain true believers during the 2000 years hiatus of the Christian era.
The Temple had great significance and will again, when it is built on the Holy Mountain in the City of Faithfulness. Zech. 8 All to the exact specifications of Ezekiel 40-44.

 

[BABerean2]

I do not see any hint of God having different end time plans and just one to be fulfilled, the others are discarded. I've never heard this theory before and I completely refute it.
It would make those prophets that got it wrong, false prophets.
From my intensive studies of all the prophets, I see a coherent and logical sequence of end time events. Each prophet adds something to the picture or reiterates and reinforces what the others say.
That 1844 had or will have anything to do with the last days, is just wrong.
Because the Jews rejected Jesus, they lost the chance to bring about the physical Kingdom at that time. God knew this would happen and He sent the Holy Spirit to sustain true believers during the 2000 years hiatus of the Christian era.
The Temple had great significance and will again, when it is built on the Holy Mountain in the City of Faithfulness. Zech. 8 All to the exact specifications of Ezekiel 40-44.

The temple you speak of has already been built and now awaits the time for the restoration of all things when He returns at His Second Coming.





Joh_2:19 Jesus answered and said unto them, Destroy this temple, and in three days I will raise it up.

Joh_2:20 Then said the Jews, Forty and six years was this temple in building, and wilt thou rear it up in three days?

Joh_2:21 But he spake of the temple of his body.

 

[keras]

The temple you speak of has already been built and now awaits the time for the restoration of all things when He returns at His Second Coming.
Joh_2:19 Jesus answered and said unto them, Destroy this temple, and in three days I will raise it up.
Joh_2:20 Then said the Jews, Forty and six years was this temple in building, and wilt thou rear it up in three days?
Joh_2:21 But he spake of the temple of his body.

Yes, BaB, we all know how Jesus is at present, our spiritual Temple. That fact does NOT preclude a future physical Temple that we know from 2 Thess 2:4, must be built, in the time of the last days rebellion against God, BEFORE the restoration of all things.
But of course you are another denier of what Bible prophecy tells us will happen, therefore all the details of Ezekiel 40-48 are so much gibberish to you.

 

[BABerean2]

Yes, BaB, we all know how Jesus is at present, our spiritual Temple. That fact does NOT preclude a future physical Temple that we know from 2 Thess 2:4, must be built, in the time of the last days rebellion against God, BEFORE the restoration of all things.
But of course you are another denier of what Bible prophecy tells us will happen, therefore all the details of Ezekiel 40-48 are so much gibberish to you.

2Th 2:3 Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;


2Th 2:4 Who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped; so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God, shewing himself that he is God.

If we truly believe that Jesus is now the Temple of God, then we should know there cannot be two Temples of God.
One would have to be a substitute or an antitemple.

It is more likely that this verse refers to a man in the Church, who claims to be God.

Yes. I am a denier of the Coronal Mass Ejection/Lunar Thermite/Satellite Crash interpretation of prophecy.
I cannot deny it is gibberish to me.
.