When God throws us curve balls

Godlovesmetwo

Fringe Catholic
Mar 16, 2016
10,398
7,257
Antwerp
✟17,860.00
Country
Djibouti
Faith
Christian Seeker
Marital Status
Married
Politics
CA-Others
When theory meets reality.

"Gays and homosexuality are the work of the devil."
Curve Ball. Your son wants to get married to another guy.

"Turn the other cheek".
You turn the other cheek and the bully hits you there too.

"Abortion is evil and should never be allowed in any instance".
Your sister is gang raped and falls pregnant.

"Blessed are the meek."
You witnessed your mother on the receiving end of domestic violence for years. She was meek.

"All Muslims are evil jihadists."
Your car breaks down and a Muslim stops to help you out.
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: archer75

Godlovesmetwo

Fringe Catholic
Mar 16, 2016
10,398
7,257
Antwerp
✟17,860.00
Country
Djibouti
Faith
Christian Seeker
Marital Status
Married
Politics
CA-Others
I think the point I want to make in this thread, is be open to change. Now absolutists will say that secularism and relativism can poison our minds. That the devil will draw us away from the truth and finally "oh anything is OK". Now whilst I do appreciate there is some validity in this viewpoint, I will say that God calls us to act on our hearts, not our minds. Life experience teaches you that what is written in a book aint necessarily so. That may sound heretical to some, my conclusion is, be ready to question your assumptions always and God works in mysterious and surprising ways.
 
  • Like
Reactions: CrystalDragon
Upvote 0

Neogaia777

Old Soul
Supporter
Oct 10, 2011
23,277
5,237
45
Oregon
✟952,487.00
Country
United States
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Celibate
"Their can no justice as long as the law is absolute, the law (and life) is an exercise in exceptions..."

"The courtroom is a crucible, in it we burn away irrelevancies until we are left with a purer product, the truth..."

Some Star Trek wisdom...

God Bless!
 
Upvote 0

Godlovesmetwo

Fringe Catholic
Mar 16, 2016
10,398
7,257
Antwerp
✟17,860.00
Country
Djibouti
Faith
Christian Seeker
Marital Status
Married
Politics
CA-Others
"Their can be no justice as long as the law is absolute, the law (and life) is an exercise in exceptions..."

"The courtroom is a crucible, in it we burn away irrelevancies until we are left with a purer product, the truth..."

Some Star Trek wisdom...

God Bless!
I'll never look down on Star Trek again. :)
 
Upvote 0

Deadworm

Well-Known Member
May 26, 2016
1,061
714
76
Colville, WA 99114
✟68,313.00
Faith
Methodist
Marital Status
Single
Here are 2 examples of Jesus'view that life is too complicated to be entirely governed by moral absolutes.
(1) Jesus approves of Sabbath laws, but then violates them when his disciples are famished. His moral guideline to justify this? "The Sabbath was made for man; man was not made for the Sabbath (Mark 2:23-28)." In other words, the Sabbath was ultimately established as a day of rest and worship to serve our best interests, but when Sabbath rules fail to serve our best interests, they can be set aside!

(2) Jesus approves of Jewish dietary and purity laws, but then insists that they can be violated because of this principle: "It is not what goes into a man that defiles him, but what comes out of man (in terms of quality of ethical conduct--Mark 7:14-15)."

Paul agrees that life is too complicated to be entirely governed by moral absolutes. What best illustrates this? Well, Paul constantly and accurately quotes the OT, but (apart from the institution of the Lord's Supper--! Corinthians 11:23-25) he never quotes Jesus. But he does allude to sayings of Jesus on 2 occasions. Why? To explain why Jesus' rules need not always be followed! (1) Paul alludes to Jesus' prohibition against divorce (7:10; cp. Mark 10:11-12) and agrees with it--as a general rule. But almost immediately he points out an exception--the failed marriage of a believer and an unbeliever (7:15).

(2) Paul alludes to Jesus's saying that a missionary laborer deserves his wages (1 Corinthians 9:14; cp. Matthew 10:9), but then says he'd rather die than keep that rule Why? Because a major aspect of Paul's witness is to offer the Gospel free of charge (9:15-18). So he regularly works on the side as a tentmaker.

He proceeds to explain that the spiritual laws he keeps depend on the views of his missionary audience:
"To the Jews I became as a Jew, in order to win Jews. To those under the Law I became as one under the Law...so that I might win those under the Law. To those outside the Law I became as one outside the Law... so that I might win those outside the Law...I have become all things to all people, so that I might by any means necessary win some (9:20-22)."

P.S. I am mourning the loss of that witty insightful poster "BetterCallPaul." May he rest in peace.
 
Last edited:
  • Informative
Reactions: Godlovesmetwo
Upvote 0

Neogaia777

Old Soul
Supporter
Oct 10, 2011
23,277
5,237
45
Oregon
✟952,487.00
Country
United States
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Celibate
"Your son" has been deceived by an expert, the devil.

Even if he has, what do you "do" about it...?

Turn the other cheek is not to violently respond. The charge laid against you may be accurate, as in a court of law.

People have the right, doesn't mean they necessarily "should", but they have the right to act in self-defense, or in defense and to protect their family, communities, or nation, from those seeking to violently oppress them...

The child is innocent. He or she may grow up to be called by God to be a Christian witness.

Or they could turn out to the next Adolf Hitler, or the person raped might not have any help or even be able to feed the child, let alone supply their other needs... They might still be a child themselves and might be wholly incapable or raising or supporting one...

They are not the meek. They are those who are horribly treated. The meek are those Jews who inherited the Kingdom of God on earth.

Don't quite know what you mean by that, but, the meek are usually unjustly stepped on and walked all over on, and very unjustly oppressed in this life, and they have a right to not just sit back and take it, and at some point they are almost forced to stand up for themselves and take a stand against it...

Can I trust him and never doubt? He is, after all, a denier of Christ as long as he remains a Muslim.

If they are nice to you, you should treat them/him the way you want to be treated, regardless of his beliefs, if they seem to trust you, then you should at least take a chance on trusting them as well...

Not written sarcastically or in anger or repudiation .... just offering another POV.

:holy:
I as well...

God Bless!
 
  • Like
Reactions: Godlovesmetwo
Upvote 0

Godlovesmetwo

Fringe Catholic
Mar 16, 2016
10,398
7,257
Antwerp
✟17,860.00
Country
Djibouti
Faith
Christian Seeker
Marital Status
Married
Politics
CA-Others
Here are 2 examples of Jesus'view that life is too complicated to be entirely governed by moral absolutes.
(1) Jesus approves of Sabbath laws, but then violates them when his disciples are famished. His moral guideline to justify this? "The Sabbath was made for man; man was not made for the Sabbath (Mark 2:23-28)." In other words, the Sabbath was ultimately established as a day of rest and worship to serve our best interests, but when Sabbath rules fail to serve our best interests, they can be set aside!

(2) Jesus approves of Jewish dietary and purity laws, but then insists that they can be violated because of this principle: "It is not what goes into a man that defiles him, but what comes out of man (in terms of quality of ethical conduct--Mark 7:14-15)."

Paul agrees that life is too complicated to be entirely governed by moral absolutes. What best illustrates this? Well, Paul constantly and accurately quotes the OT, but (apart from the institution of the Lord's Supper--! Corinthians 11:23-25) he never quotes Jesus. But he does allude to sayings of Jesus on 2 occasions. Why? To explain why Jesus' rules need not always be followed! (1) Paul alludes to Jesus' prohibition against divorce (7:10; cp. Mark 10:11-12) and agrees with it--as a general rule. But almost immediately he points out an exception--the failed marriage of a believer and an unbeliever (7:15).

(2) Paul alludes to Jesus's saying that a missionary laborer deserves his wages (1 Corinthians 9:14; cp. Matthew 10:9), but then says he'd rather die than keep that rule Why? Because a major aspect of Paul's witness is to offer the Gospel free of charge (9:15-18). So he regularly works on the side as a tentmaker.

He proceeds to explain that the spiritual laws he keeps depend on the views of his missionary audience:
"To the Jews I became as a Jew, in order to win Jews. To those under the Law I became as one under the Law...so that I might win those under the Law. To those outside the Law I became as one outside the Law... so that I might win those outside the Law...I have become all things to all people, so that I might by any means necessary win some (9:20-22)."
Thanks for your post deadworm. it has taken me a while to digest it all! :)
 
Upvote 0

Godlovesmetwo

Fringe Catholic
Mar 16, 2016
10,398
7,257
Antwerp
✟17,860.00
Country
Djibouti
Faith
Christian Seeker
Marital Status
Married
Politics
CA-Others
Paul agrees that life is too complicated to be entirely governed by moral absolutes.
I'm glad to hear this. I get the impression from some people that the Bible is full of absolutes that must be strictly obeyed, if we are to consider ourselves good Christians.
 
Upvote 0

archer75

Well-Known Member
Supporter
Nov 16, 2016
5,930
4,649
USA
✟253,749.00
Country
United States
Faith
Eastern Orthodox
Marital Status
Married
841 The Church's relationship with the Muslims. "The plan of salvation also includes those who acknowledge the Creator, in the first place amongst whom are the Muslims; these profess to hold the faith of Abraham, and together with us they adore the one, merciful God, mankind's judge on the last day."
 
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums

archer75

Well-Known Member
Supporter
Nov 16, 2016
5,930
4,649
USA
✟253,749.00
Country
United States
Faith
Eastern Orthodox
Marital Status
Married
Good thread.

Another curveball, if I may add one:

"It is always wrong to take the life of an unborn child."
Curveball: you feel politically unable not to support a bombing campaign that will turn thousands of pregnant women and their babies into corpses.
 
Upvote 0

Anhelyna

Handmaid of God
CF Senior Ambassador
Supporter
Nov 29, 2005
58,173
16,478
Glasgow , Scotland
✟1,288,370.00
Faith
Eastern Orthodox
Marital Status
Private
SistrNChrist

This may be a liberal Catholic Board - but it is still Catholic and abortion is not permitted for Catholics - even under circumstances like rape.

Please be aware of the SoP here
 
  • Informative
Reactions: archer75
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums

SistrNChrist

Newbie
Aug 17, 2006
345
127
41
NYC
✟30,387.00
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Single
Politics
US-Others
SistrNChrist

This may be a liberal Catholic Board - but it is still Catholic and abortion is not permitted for Catholics - even under circumstances like rape.

Please be aware of the SoP here
My apologies. I didn't fully read the Catholic part of this board, so I'll just delete my statement. Didn't mean to step on any toes here.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Anhelyna
Upvote 0

Godlovesmetwo

Fringe Catholic
Mar 16, 2016
10,398
7,257
Antwerp
✟17,860.00
Country
Djibouti
Faith
Christian Seeker
Marital Status
Married
Politics
CA-Others
SistrNChrist

This may be a liberal Catholic Board - but it is still Catholic and abortion is not permitted for Catholics - even under circumstances like rape.

Please be aware of the SoP here
I'm not promoting it either
 
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums