When did the church which is Christ’s body begin? Study series. Lesson#1 Israel’s position of preeminence in Gods Kingdom.

Soyeong

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The church, the body of Christ, began in Luke 24:44-48, after the resurrection. Before Jesus's resurrection, the gospel of Salvation was kept secret from man's understanding.

Here are verses before the crucifixion and resurrection. Jesus told the disciples what was going to happen to him before he was crucified, but the understanding was kept hidden from them and everyone else, until after the resurrection.

Here it is in Luke 18, about it being kept hidden from the disciples' understanding....

31 Then he took unto him the twelve, and said unto them, Behold, we go up to Jerusalem, and all things that are written by the prophets concerning the Son of man shall be accomplished.

32 For he shall be delivered unto the Gentiles, and shall be mocked, and spitefully entreated, and spitted on:

33 And they shall scourge him, and put him to death: and the third day he shall rise again.

34 And they understood none of these things: and this saying was hid from them, neither knew they the things which were spoken.

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Next go to Luke 24:44-48, to where the church began....

After the resurrection, Jesus appeared to the disciples in their midst. In verse 44, Jesus reminded the disciples of what he said was going to happen in Luke 18 above, but the understanding was hid from the them before the crucifixion took place.

In verse 45, Jesus opened their understanding of the gospel of Salvation. And sends them to preach to the nations, as witnesses.


44 And he said unto them, These are the words which I spake unto you, while I was yet with you, that all things must be fulfilled, which were written in the law of Moses, and in the prophets, and in the psalms, concerning me.

45 Then opened he their understanding, that they might understand the scriptures,

46 And said unto them, Thus it is written, and thus it behoved Christ to suffer, and to rise from the dead the third day:

47 And that repentance and remission of sins should be preached in his name among all nations, beginning at Jerusalem.

48 And ye are witnesses of these things.
The Greek word "ecclesia" is translated as "church" and is used many times in the Septuagint to refer to Israel in the wilderness, so again the body of Christ had its roots with Abraham in accordance with the promise, and the disciples not understanding those things does not change this.


It is also important to know that the gospel of Savlation, the understanding of it, was hidden before the resurrection.

Because otherwise, Satan and his angels (the princes of this world) would not have sought to have Jesus's crucified - because in doing so, they unwittingly made it possible for God to justly judge them for their sins - while allowing God to justly forgive man for his sins.

Here are the verses...

1Corinthians2:7-8.

7 But we speak the wisdom of God in a mystery, even the hidden wisdom, which God ordained before the world unto our glory:

8 Which none of the princes of this world knew: for had they known it, they would not have crucified the Lord of glory.
They were saved through faith in a promised Redeemer even if they did not know the means of how he would accomplish their redemption. In Hebrews 11, it lists examples of people who had saving faith who all lived before the time of Christ.
 
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Marilyn C

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The church, the body of Christ, began in Luke 24:44-48, after the resurrection. Before Jesus's resurrection, the gospel of Salvation was kept secret from man's understanding.

Here are verses before the crucifixion and resurrection. Jesus told the disciples what was going to happen to him before he was crucified, but the understanding was kept hidden from them and everyone else, until after the resurrection.

Here it is in Luke 18, about it being kept hidden from the disciples' understanding....

31 Then he took unto him the twelve, and said unto them, Behold, we go up to Jerusalem, and all things that are written by the prophets concerning the Son of man shall be accomplished.

32 For he shall be delivered unto the Gentiles, and shall be mocked, and spitefully entreated, and spitted on:

33 And they shall scourge him, and put him to death: and the third day he shall rise again.

34 And they understood none of these things: and this saying was hid from them, neither knew they the things which were spoken.

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Next go to Luke 24:44-48, to where the church began....

After the resurrection, Jesus appeared to the disciples in their midst. In verse 44, Jesus reminded the disciples of what he said was going to happen in Luke 18 above, but the understanding was hid from the them before the crucifixion took place.

In verse 45, Jesus opened their understanding of the gospel of Salvation. And sends them to preach to the nations, as witnesses.


44 And he said unto them, These are the words which I spake unto you, while I was yet with you, that all things must be fulfilled, which were written in the law of Moses, and in the prophets, and in the psalms, concerning me.

45 Then opened he their understanding, that they might understand the scriptures,

46 And said unto them, Thus it is written, and thus it behoved Christ to suffer, and to rise from the dead the third day:

47 And that repentance and remission of sins should be preached in his name among all nations, beginning at Jerusalem.

48 And ye are witnesses of these things.
Hi Douggg,

The Lord opened the disciples eyes as to Him having to die. He did not reveal the Body of Christ then. Remember it was to the apostle Paul that that revelation was revealed. (Eph. 3: 3)
 
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Douggg

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The Greek word "ecclesia" is translated as "church" and is used many times in the Septuagint to refer to Israel in the wilderness, so again the body of Christ had its roots with Abraham in accordance with the promise, and the disciples not understanding those things does not change this.
The church did not exist before the resurrection of Jesus. In Matthew 16:18, Jesus said (paraphrased) I will (future tense) build my church on this rock (referring to Peter's statement of Jesus being the messiah).
They were saved through faith in a promised Redeemer even if they did not know the means of how he would accomplish their redemption. In Hebrews 11, it lists examples of people who had saving faith who all lived before the time of Christ.
They had the hope of redemption based on faith - not works. No one was "saved" until after Jesus was resurrected. Hebrews 11 is about the principle that no-one can be saved according to works, but by faith. The example of Abraham was - to point out righteousness (not salvation) being accounted to him because of his faith, not his works.

Our Salvation entails (1) redemption of the soul, and (2) redemption of the body (which completes our salvation).
 
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Soyeong

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The church did not exist before the resurrection of Jesus. In Matthew 16:18, Jesus said (paraphrased) I will (future tense) build my church on this rock (referring to Peter's statement of Jesus being the messiah).
In Matthew 16:18, "oikodomeó" can and should be be translated as I will rebuild my church on this rock. In Acts 15:16-18, they saw themselves and the inclusion of Gentiles as being part of the restoration of Israel in fulfillment of prophecy, not as a brand new entity that was distinct from Israel.

They had the hope of redemption based on faith - not works. No one was "saved" until after Jesus was resurrected. Hebrews 11 is about the principle that no-one can be saved according to works, but by faith. The example of Abraham was - to point out righteousness (not salvation) being accounted to him because of his faith, not his works.

Our Salvation entails (1) redemption of the soul, and (2) redemption of the body (which completes our salvation).
No one has ever been saved as the result of works because works were never commanded as a way of earning our salvation as a wage, even through perfect obedience (Romans 4:1-5). In Psalms 119:29-30, David wanted to put false ways far from him, for God to be gracious to him by teaching him by teaching him to obey His law, and he chose the way of faithfulness, so this has always been the one and only way of salvation by grace through faith. In Exodus 33:13, Moses wanted God to be gracious to him by teaching him His way that he might know Him and Israel too, and in Matthew 7:23, Jesus said that he would tell those who are workers of lawlessness to depart from him because he never knew them, so knowing God and Jesus is the goal of the law, which is eternal life, and which again is salvation by grace through faith. The people in the OT knew about salvation, grace, faith, and the coming Messiah, so they were saved by the same means that we are.
 
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Douggg

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The people in the OT knew about salvation, grace, faith, and the coming Messiah, so they were saved by the same means that we are.
Them in the OT did not know that the Messiah would die for their sins. And them in the New Testament before the resurrection did not think that the Messsiah would die at all.

John 12:34 The people answered him, We have heard out of the law that Christ abideth for ever: and how sayest thou, The Son of man must be lifted up? who is this Son of man?

In Matthew 16:18, "oikodomeó" can and should be be translated as I will rebuild my church on this rock.
All of the bible translators got it wrong ? I don't think so.

One place to go and read through all of the various translations is at Bible Hub.

You, being a messianic (a Jew by birth I assume), are you aware that, similarly, Jews (Judaism) interpret the "new" covenant promised in Jeremiah 31:31 as being a "renewal" of their existing Mt. Sinai covenant ? They choose that interpretation to deny the new covenant in Christ.

Jesus is not rebuilding his church in Matthew 16:18.

If you want to know when the church began, it is in Luke 24:44-48, when the disciples first understood the gospel of Salvation, and were told to go out and spread it to the nations.
 
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Guojing

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The church, the body of Christ, began in Luke 24:44-48, after the resurrection. Before Jesus's resurrection, the gospel of Salvation was kept secret from man's understanding.

Here are verses before the crucifixion and resurrection. Jesus told the disciples what was going to happen to him before he was crucified, but the understanding was kept hidden from them and everyone else, until after the resurrection.

Here it is in Luke 18, about it being kept hidden from the disciples' understanding....

31 Then he took unto him the twelve, and said unto them, Behold, we go up to Jerusalem, and all things that are written by the prophets concerning the Son of man shall be accomplished.

32 For he shall be delivered unto the Gentiles, and shall be mocked, and spitefully entreated, and spitted on:

33 And they shall scourge him, and put him to death: and the third day he shall rise again.

34 And they understood none of these things: and this saying was hid from them, neither knew they the things which were spoken.

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Next go to Luke 24:44-48, to where the church began....

After the resurrection, Jesus appeared to the disciples in their midst. In verse 44, Jesus reminded the disciples of what he said was going to happen in Luke 18 above, but the understanding was hid from the them before the crucifixion took place.

In verse 45, Jesus opened their understanding of the gospel of Salvation. And sends them to preach to the nations, as witnesses.


44 And he said unto them, These are the words which I spake unto you, while I was yet with you, that all things must be fulfilled, which were written in the law of Moses, and in the prophets, and in the psalms, concerning me.

45 Then opened he their understanding, that they might understand the scriptures,

46 And said unto them, Thus it is written, and thus it behoved Christ to suffer, and to rise from the dead the third day:

47 And that repentance and remission of sins should be preached in his name among all nations, beginning at Jerusalem.

48 And ye are witnesses of these things.

Are you saying, after Luke 22, they understood the gospel of Salvation?

But Peter only preached to Israel at Acts 2 and 3 correct?

He also preached to them that Israel murdered Jesus but since God resurrect him, they can still accept he is their promised Messiah by repenting of that national sin and be water baptized. (Acts 2:38)

Is that the gospel of salvation ANYONE of us preach today?
 
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Douggg

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Are you saying, after Luke 22, they understood the gospel of Salvation?
I mean that after Jesus appeared to them after he was resurrected, he opened their minds to understanding the gospel of Salvation, which was previously closed to their understanding.
 
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Guojing

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I mean that after Jesus appeared to them after he was resurrected, he opened their minds to understanding the gospel of Salvation, which was previously closed to their understanding.

Would that "gospel" still be the "gospel of the kingdom" still, not the gospel that Paul preached later?
 
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Douggg

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Would that "gospel" still be the "gospel of the kingdom" still, not the gospel that Paul preached later?
The gospel of the kingdom and the gospel of Salvation are inter-related - as both are tied to Jesus.

The gospel of the kingdom, the disciples went out and preached throughout the nation that it was at hand - ahead of Jesus visiting the various towns and cities in Israel, doing miracles and healing the sick and disabled.

The disciples, after Jesus's death and resurrection, then went out and preached the gospel of Salvation, based upon Jesus's atonement for our sins and belief of His resurrection on the third day.
 
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Guojing

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The disciples, after Jesus's death and resurrection, then went out and preached the gospel of Salvation, based upon Jesus's atonement for our sins and belief of His resurrection on the third day.

Let me try to understand what you are saying with those bolded words.

Do you think there is a difference between preaching:
  • In wickedness, you have killed your Messiah but God raised him from the dead as a sign that he is truly the Son of God, so repent of that wicked deed and be water baptized, and you will be saved from your sins in the future. (Acts 2:36 Acts 3:14-21 Acts 5:30 Acts 7:52 )
versus
  • Christ has died for your sins and rose again on the 3rd day for your justification. (1 Cor 15:1-4)
 
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Douggg

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Let me try to understand what you are saying with those bolded words.

Do you think there is a difference between preaching:
  • In wickedness, you have killed your Messiah but God raised him from the dead as a sign that he is truly the Son of God, so repent of that wicked deed and be water baptized, and you will be saved from your sins in the future. (Acts 2:36 Acts 3:14-21 Acts 5:30 Acts 7:52 )
versus
  • Christ has died for your sins and rose again on the 3rd day for your justification. (1 Cor 15:1-4)
The gospel of Salvation based upon Jesus's atonement for our sins and belief of His resurrection on the third day is constant and does not change.
 
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Guojing

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The gospel of Salvation based upon Jesus's atonement for our sins and belief of His resurrection on the third day is constant and does not change.

But if you read Acts 2 and 3, that was not what Peter was preaching.
 
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Douggg

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But if you read Acts 2 and 3, that was not what Peter was preaching.
Luke 24:45 Then opened he their understanding, that they might understand the scriptures,

46 And said unto them, Thus it is written, and thus it behoved Christ to suffer, and to rise from the dead the third day:

47 And that repentance and remission of sins should be preached in his name among all nations, beginning at Jerusalem.

------------------------------------

From your previous post.... In wickedness, you have killed your Messiah but God raised him from the dead as a sign that he is truly the Son of God, so repent of that wicked deed and be water baptized, and you will be saved from your sins in the future. (Acts 2:36 Acts 3:14-21 Acts 5:30 Acts 7:52 )
 
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Guojing

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Luke 24:45 Then opened he their understanding, that they might understand the scriptures,

46 And said unto them, Thus it is written, and thus it behoved Christ to suffer, and to rise from the dead the third day:

47 And that repentance and remission of sins should be preached in his name among all nations, beginning at Jerusalem.

------------------------------------

From your previous post.... In wickedness, you have killed your Messiah but God raised him from the dead as a sign that he is truly the Son of God, so repent of that wicked deed and be water baptized, and you will be saved from your sins in the future. (Acts 2:36 Acts 3:14-21 Acts 5:30 Acts 7:52 )

So you believe both points are the same, aka no difference.

Alright, thanks for clarifying.
 
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THE FULLMENT OF REVELATION 12:1-3; HAS COME, THE COMMET "CHILD" WILL IN THE SIGH VIGOS STOMACH WHICH WILL COME OUT OF HER WOMB ON ROSH HASHANAH THIS SEP. 2023, ON THE FEAST OF TRUMPETS. I FOUND THIS ON YOUTUBE RAPTUREHOURLYWATCH, "A CHILD IS BORN". THIS IS REAL, THE TIME HAS COME!!! CHECK THIS FOR YOURSELF EVEN ON STELLARUIM
 
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