What will Pope Francis Change Next?

[redleghunter]

This is open to everyone. Recently Pope Francis changed church teaching on Capital punishment. This thread is for discussion on what you think is the next church teaching Francis will change by fiat.

Poll is up.

 

[zippy2006]

I think he will change his cap.

 

[dzheremi]

This is sad. (Not going to vote; I just wanted to say that, because it is.)

 

[redleghunter]

I believe he will amend CCC 2308 based on his logic for tightening up on capital punishment.

2308 All citizens and all governments are obliged to work for the avoidance of war.

However, "as long as the danger of war persists and there is no international authority with the necessary competence and power, governments cannot be denied the right of lawful self-defense, once all peace efforts have failed."​

 

[PeaceByJesus]

This is open to everyone. Recently Pope Francis changed church teaching on Capital punishment. This thread is for discussion on what you think is the next church teaching Francis will change by fiat.

Poll is up.

Perhaps canon law on the celibate clergy. If he is a V2 RC, he has a precedent for change. Even an infallible teaching as "The sacrosanct Roman Church...firmly believes, professes, and proclaims that..not only pagans, but also Jews and heretics and schismatics cannot become participants in eternal life but will depart into everlasting fire...unless before the end of life the same have been added to the flock," (Pope Eugene IV and the Council of Florence) can be changed to, "though they do not profess the faith in its entirety or do not preserve unity of communion with the successor of Peter... many who honor Sacred Scripture, taking it as a norm of belief and a pattern of life, and who show a sincere zeal..are united with Christ.. are joined with us in the Holy Spirit," (Lumen Gentium 16) "the spirit of Christ has not refrained from using them as means of salvation...” (Dominus Iesus) can be passed off/spinned as a "clarification."

 

[redleghunter]

Perhaps canon law on the celibate clergy. If he is a V2 RC, he has a precedent for change. Even an infallible teaching as "The sacrosanct Roman Church...firmly believes, professes, and proclaims that..not only pagans, but also Jews and heretics and schismatics cannot become participants in eternal life but will depart into everlasting fire...unless before the end of life the same have been added to the flock," (Pope Eugene IV and the Council of Florence) can be changed to, "though they do not profess the faith in its entirety or do not preserve unity of communion with the successor of Peter... many who honor Sacred Scripture, taking it as a norm of belief and a pattern of life, and who show a sincere zeal..are united with Christ.. are joined with us in the Holy Spirit," (Lumen Gentium 16) "the spirit of Christ has not refrained from using them as means of salvation...” (Dominus Iesus) can be passed off/spinned as a "clarification."

Will have to add a few options to the poll.

 

[redleghunter]

This is sad. (Not going to vote; I just wanted to say that, because it is.)

I added more to the poll choices.

 

[Philip_B]

I have just voted other. The grounds for voting other have to do with I think that one of the things he is working on is the attitude of the Western Patriarchy to other parts of the Church, be they Eastern, Oriental, Anglican or Reformed, and is working on establishing better relationships between other Churches. It is now more than fifty years since the mutual excommunications (the vehicle which pronounced the Great Schism) were lifted, he seems ready to continue to work on this area. I think that the East is justifiably reserved on this matter, and in the West, beyond those who are determined that Rome is wrong in all things there is a growing warming to his approach, for a kinder, gentler, and more loving Church. Yet like Paul, there are those at home who are working against him.

That he is well received outside the Church is often painted as his being too worldly, yet I see in his ministry a clarion call of authenticity.

 

[redleghunter]

I have just voted other. The grounds for voting other have to do with I think that one of the things he is working on is the attitude of the Western Patriarchy to other parts of the Church, be they Eastern, Oriental, Anglican or Reformed, and is working on establishing better relationships between other Churches. It is now more than fifty years since the mutual excommunications (the vehicle which pronounced the Great Schism) were lifted, he seems ready to continue to work on this area. I think that the East is justifiably reserved on this matter, and in the West, beyond those who are determined that Rome is wrong in all things there is a growing warming to his approach, for a kinder, gentler, and more loving Church. Yet like Paul, there are those at home who are working against him.

That he is well received outside the Church is often painted as his being too worldly, yet I see in his ministry a clarion call of authenticity.

Do you think, in outreach to the East, Francis would denounce Papal supremacy?

 

[Philip_B]

Do you think, in outreach to the East, Francis would denounce Papal supremacy?

I think the word is renounce - and I think he nearly has save for the Curia backlash that he would not survive. His model is servant of the servants of God.

 

[juvenissun]

This is open to everyone. Recently Pope Francis changed church teaching on Capital punishment. This thread is for discussion on what you think is the next church teaching Francis will change by fiat.

Poll is up.

I don't care much on what he will do. He is a man. This is a question less significant than: What would Donald Trump do next?

 

[JIMINZ]

I don't care much on what he will do. He is a man. This is a question less significant than: What would Donald Trump do next?

.
We already know that,.....He's going to Micky D"S

 

[FireDragon76]

I wonder why he felt this was necessary now, at this time.

 

[PeaceByJesus]

Will have to add a few options to the poll.

Well, some go further, but while changing a teaching that is far more established is not tenable, such a change of a moral teaching to exclude what Catholicism once allowed (which is nothing new, see V2) weakens the moral authority of all moral teachings.
[Cath Cauc]LGBT‘Catholic’ groups:If Pope can reverse ...teaching on death penalty, why not homosex?

8/3/2018, 10:05:52 PM · by ebb tide · 12 replies
LifeSite News ^ | August 3, 2018 | Dorothy Cummings McLean
LGBT ‘Catholic’ groups: If Pope can reverse Church teaching on death penalty, why not homosexuality? Dorothy Cummings McLean Follow Dorothy catechism of the catholic church, catholic, death penalty, fortunate families, homosexuality, new ways ministry, pope francis LEXINGTON, Kentucky, August 3, 2018 (LifeSiteNews) – Pro-homosexual dissident 'Catholic' groups see in Pope Francis’ ‘changing’ of the Church’s teaching on the death penalty the hope that the Church will one day also change its teaching against homosexuality. New Ways Ministry called the change in the Catechism proof that "Church teaching can change."

 

[dreadnought]

This is open to everyone. Recently Pope Francis changed church teaching on Capital punishment. This thread is for discussion on what you think is the next church teaching Francis will change by fiat.

Poll is up.

I think Catholics would be well off to allow women priests.

 

[Landon Caeli]

This is open to everyone. Recently Pope Francis changed church teaching on Capital punishment. This thread is for discussion on what you think is the next church teaching Francis will change by fiat.

Poll is up.

Do you know what the Church teaching was (and still is) regarding capitol punishment?

 

[Landon Caeli]

I do...

Capitol punishment has always been denounced -that is unless there is no way of ensuring that a killer will not kill other inmates.

...In this day and age, the threat is not as real as it was a thousand or two years ago.

 

[redleghunter]

I wonder why he felt this was necessary now, at this time.

Some Catholic news sites like Life Site believes he announced this change due to the news cycle covering the sex abuse scandal cases. One Cardinal (retired) defrocked and two more pending release of information which could lead to charges.

 

[Anto9us]

Pope Francis has made a secret deal with Colonel Sanders to change The Lord's Prayer to say "give us this day our daily chicken" rather than "give us this day our daily bread".

At first, Colonel Sanders called on the Pope and offered a million dollars if the Pope would change the wording of the Lord's Prayer -- but the Pope said "Colonel, the Lord's Prayer is unalterable, I'm sorry -- I can't do that."

Then Colonel Sanders upped it to ten million dollars, saying, "Your Holiness, you simply MUST change daily bread to daily chicken!!"

But the Pope held firm.

Then Colonel Sanders said "Oh, alright, I will donate A HUNDRED MILLION DOLLARS to the Roman Catholic Church if you change the wording to say 'daily chicken'!!"


The next day, The Pope calls in his cardinals -- "Guys, I have some good new and some bad news.

The good news is that the church has just received a payment of a HUNDRED MILLION DOLLARS --

the bad news is that we are LOSING the Wonder Bread account."

 

[redleghunter]

Do you know what the Church teaching was (and still is) regarding capitol punishment?

You mean outside the CCC?

2267 Assuming that the guilty party's identity and responsibility have been fully determined, the traditional teaching of the Church does not exclude recourse to the death penalty, if this is the only possible way of effectively defending human lives against the unjust aggressor.

If, however, non-lethal means are sufficient to defend and protect people's safety from the aggressor, authority will limit itself to such means, as these are more in keeping with the concrete conditions of the common good and more in conformity to the dignity of the human person.

Today, in fact, as a consequence of the possibilities which the state has for effectively preventing crime, by rendering one who has committed an offense incapable of doing harm - without definitely taking away from him the possibility of redeeming himself - the cases in which the execution of the offender is an absolute necessity "are very rare, if not practically nonexistent."68

Source: http://www.scborromeo.org/ccc/p3s2c2a5.htm

Change to:

The catechism now will read: "Recourse to the death penalty on the part of legitimate authority, following a fair trial, was long considered an appropriate response to the gravity of certain crimes and an acceptable, albeit extreme, means of safeguarding the common good.

"Today, however, there is an increasing awareness that the dignity of the person is not lost even after the commission of very serious crimes. In addition, a new understanding has emerged of the significance of penal sanctions imposed by the state. Lastly, more effective systems of detention have been developed, which ensure the due protection of citizens but, at the same time, do not definitively deprive the guilty of the possibility of redemption," the new section continues.

Pope Francis' change to the text concludes: "Consequently, the church teaches, in the light of the Gospel, that 'the death penalty is inadmissible because it is an attack on the inviolability and dignity of the person,' and she works with determination for its abolition worldwide."

Source:

http://www.catholicnews.com/service...hism-to-say-death-penalty-is-inadmissible.cfm

Opposed to life in prison:

http://www.catholicnews.com/service...penalty-and-life-imprisonment-cns-1404377.cfm