What was Paul's Theology?

[All Souls]

If you're a self-designated non-Pauline follower of Messiah, I would appreciate it if you could explain briefly what Paul's theology was, particularly with reference to creation, covenant, and eschatology.

 

[Anto9us]

I am NON-non-Pauline, AllSouls -- so I guess I should sit this one out

 

[All Souls]

Worth reading is Tom Wright's What Saint Paul Really Said, the quest here is not to determine whether Paul was right or wrong in what he believed, but simply to ask: what did Paul teach?

 

[timewerx]

If you're a self-designated non-Pauline follower of Messiah, I would appreciate it if you could explain briefly what Paul's theology was, particularly with reference to creation, covenant, and eschatology.

I thought you said in another thread you won't waste a time of the day with Pauline-related writings not coming from a Pauline Scholar??

If the information is written someone who has not been trained in Pauline scholarship why would I give it the time of day?

from:

http://www.christianforums.com/t7814878-5/#post65380194



And you said it's not worth the dialogue with anyone on the subject of Paul who doesn't have a "significant corpus" in the field:

I did skim through it; but unless it is peer-reviewed or written by someone with a significant corpus in the field then it is not really worth having a dialogue with.

Are you acquainted with the works of contemporary Pauline scholars?

From:

http://www.christianforums.com/t7814878-6/#post65380232



I think you're not being completely honest with us, especially by creating this thread with a contrary purpose than what you really believe



...

 

[All Souls]

I think you're not being completely honest with us, especially by creating this thread with a contrary purpose than what you really believe

I am more than happy to discuss with you what you believe and why. What I am uninterested in doing is being asked to respond to why such and such a book that is poorly written is wrong.

So feel free to explain what Paul's theology was, let's discuss that.

 

[timewerx]

I am more than happy to discuss with you what you believe and why. What I am uninterested in doing is being asked to respond to why such and such a book that is poorly written is wrong.

So feel free to explain what Paul's theology was, let's discuss that.

If Paul's epistles are so well-written, why does it take to be a Pauline Scholar to fully understand his epistles?



“If you can't explain it to a six year old, you don't understand it yourself.”

― Albert Einstein


At that time Jesus said, "I praise you, Father, Lord of heaven and earth, because you have hidden these things from the wise and learned, and revealed them to little children.

― Jesus (Matthew 11:25)



So why does it take a Pauline Scholar to fully understand Paul's Epistles??

But why does the teachings of Jesus (Words of God - John 1:1) revealed clearly to little children??


Are they not the same?



..

 

[All Souls]

If Paul's epistles are so well-written, why does it take to be a Pauline Scholar to fully understand his epistles?

It doesn't, but one ought be conversant with the scholarship to speak authoritatively on what Paul taught. Douglas J. Del Tondo is a California litigation attorney with no advanced degrees in New Testament studies, thus I do not feel the need to take his work seriously.

 

[All Souls]

What do you think Paul's theology was concerning the covenant?

 

[Der Alte]

If Paul's epistles are so well-written, why does it take to be a Pauline Scholar to fully understand his epistles?

It doesn't.

“If you can't explain it to a six year old, you don't understand it yourself.”

― Albert Einstein

A reasonable sounding homily. But there are many things which cannot be explained to a six year old; birth, disease, death, etc.

At that time Jesus said, "I praise you, Father, Lord of heaven and earth, because you have hidden these things from the wise and learned, and revealed them to little children.

― Jesus (Matthew 11:25)

So why does it take a Pauline Scholar to fully understand Paul's Epistles??

It doesn't.

But why does the teachings of Jesus (Words of God - John 1:1) revealed clearly to little children??

Are they not the same? ..

Do you think if you read the words of Jesus and the writings of Paul to a 6 year old, the child would have a better understanding of Jesus' words? Or would you have to simplify both for the child to better undertand them?

 

[All Souls]

TOM WRIGHT THE SHAPE OF PAUL'S THEOLOGY Paul and the faithfulness of God 2011 - YouTube

 

[ananda]

... scholarship to speak authoritatively .... with no advanced degrees in New Testament studies, thus I do not feel the need to take his work seriously.

What degrees or certifications did Messiah and the 12 apostles hold, or what peer-reviewed works did they publish?

 

[Phantasman]

What degrees or certifications did Messiah and the 12 apostles hold, or what peer-reviewed works did they publish?

If you listen to men, you will wind up probably following men.

The spirit of Truth is spirit. You can get the message in clarity, even through the slightly dirty translations, IMO.

Truth did not come into the world naked, but it came in types and images. The world will not receive truth in any other way. There is a rebirth and an image of rebirth. It is certainly necessary to be born again through the image. Which one? Resurrection. The image must rise again through the image. The bridal chamber and the image must enter through the image into the truth: this is the restoration.-Philip

Truth isn't merely read. It has to be placed spiritually in truth as the image the spirit wants us to see. Even when man tries to do something to disrupt the truth, the Holy Spirit can have it's way:

The saints are served by evil powers, for they are blinded by the Holy Spirit into thinking that they are serving an (ordinary) man whenever they do so for the saints.-Philip

The battle is a spiritual one, not a physical one (of words).

 

[All Souls]

What degrees or certifications did Messiah and the 12 apostles hold, or what peer-reviewed works did they publish?

This is irrelevant; the question we are addressing is what Paul's theology was. Should I give more weight in this debate to a Professor of New Testament or some guy who struggles to write coherent sentences?

 

[Joseph474]

This is irrelevant; the question we are addressing is what Paul's theology was. Should I give more weight in this debate to a Professor of New Testament or some guy who struggles to write coherent sentences?

Almost all experts support Paul. These seminaries train people to like Paul.. There is a Pauline bias.

 

[timewerx]

It doesn't, but one ought be conversant with the scholarship to speak authoritatively on what Paul taught. Douglas J. Del Tondo is a California litigation attorney with no advanced degrees in New Testament studies, thus I do not feel the need to take his work seriously.

Aren't we forgetting something called "The Anointing"?

Does The Anointing come with advanced degree?

Are all preachers without advanced degrees in theology false teachers?



Speaking authoritatively on any subject does not guarantee the lack of errors.

You can in fact speak authoritatively even with false doctrines...



So have you really made a point?


...

 

[Joseph474]

I have invited two non-Pauline writers here..I also posted on TS to invite people.

 

[Der Alte]

Almost all experts support Paul. These seminaries train people to like Paul.. There is a Pauline bias.

Rubbish!

 

[timewerx]

I have invited two non-Pauline writers here..I also posted on TS to invite people.

That's overkill.

Anyone who places higher importance(or any level of importance) on academic leverage against The Anointing has already lost.

1 John 2:16
For everything in the world—the lust of the flesh, the lust of the eyes, and the pride of life—comes not from the Father but from the world.

Luke 16:15
He said to them, “You are the ones who justify yourselves in the eyes of others, but God knows your hearts. What people value highly is detestable in God’s sight.

Jude 1:18-19
They said to you, “In the last times there will be scoffers who will follow their own ungodly desires.” 19 These are the people who divide you, who follow mere natural instincts and do not have the Spirit.



..

 

[Norah63]

Paul preached the resurrection. He was a wittness to our Lord, and eternal life in him.

 

[All Souls]

Almost all experts support Paul. These seminaries train people to like Paul.. There is a Pauline bias.

I am not sure where you're getting your information from: I am referring to those who hold academic positions as prestigious universities such as Tom Wright who is Professor of New Testament and Early Christianity at the University of St. Andrews and Professor Markus Bockmuehl who teaches at Keble College, Oxford. These guys are educated and have done research into what Paul taught, it is essential, therefore, that you are aware of their position.

There are two stages: (1) what did Paul teach? (2) was Paul correct? Unfortunatley you have developed an answer to (2) without really exploring (1).