What Prevents Orthodox Jews From Recognizing Jesus As Messiah?

[friend of]

This is sort of confusing to me now. I'm going to bullet-point my questions and get to the point. If this is in the incorrect forum, please move it!

1) Did Jesus not fulfill the prophecies of the Torah?

2) What is the concept of what the Jewish messiah is supposed to be like? (ex., exclusive for the Jewish people, specific prophetic fulfillments, etc..)

3) What is their theological basis for rejecting Jesus and the Bible? Is it a contrast between the character of OT and NT?

Any other questions please add.

 

[Dirk1540]

IMO you'll never get better answers to these questions then Dr Michael Brown's DVD course 'Countering The Counter Missionaries.' Brilliant teacher, grew up as an orthodox Jew...converted to Christianity. Considered by many to be the foremost expert at debating orthodox Jews about Jesus being the Messiah. Arguments you wouldn't even think of, Dr Brown points out that if you could defend Jesus being the Messiah to experienced Jews than you can defend it to anyone! They have the toughest objections out of anyone (and he mows them down IMO). Very enlightening course. My personal story...I considered all of the 'Prophecy' arguments to be very ambiguous and rather weak, until I bought that course! And I thought the prophecy arguments were weak for YEARS. I LOVE that course, that course was a key step for me!!

 

[Sabertooth]

Doesn't it just boil down to having a receptive heart like it does for the Gentiles? Jesus' eleven disciples and Paul didn't trade in their Jewishness when they got saved. They just got turned on to the bigger picture. It wasn't clear until Cornelius that the Gospel was meant for anybody but the Jews...!

 

[Faith Alone 1 Cor 15:1-4]

This is sort of confusing to me now. I'm going to bullet-point my questions and get to the point. If this is in the incorrect forum, please move it!

1) Did Jesus not fulfill the prophecies of the Torah?

2) What is the concept of what the Jewish messiah is supposed to be like? (ex., exclusive for the Jewish people, specific prophetic fulfillments, etc..)

3) What is their theological basis for rejecting Jesus and the Bible? Is it a contrast between the character of OT and NT?

Any other questions please add.

Jews nowday are not what they were before , after temple was destroyed 70 AD , they needed to do something to save judaism because they knew that Hebrews 9:22 , they had no temple for sacrifice .

So they made judaism as religion of works and don't read Torah anymore .

On top of that they are blind Romans 11:25 , is it punishment from God for rejecting them or is it due to thier rock solid hearths i don't know .

Jesus fullfille prophecy from Scriptures , Jews just don't want to believe it . Not all Jews tho , but majority .

 

[victorinus]

why do jews support the democratic party?

 

[JIMINZ]

This is sort of confusing to me now. I'm going to bullet-point my questions and get to the point. If this is in the incorrect forum, please move it!

1) Did Jesus not fulfill the prophecies of the Torah?

2) What is the concept of what the Jewish messiah is supposed to be like? (ex., exclusive for the Jewish people, specific prophetic fulfillments, etc..)

3) What is their theological basis for rejecting Jesus and the Bible? Is it a contrast between the character of OT and NT?

Any other questions please add.

.

It's not just the Orthodox Jews, it's the Jews as a People, Nation
These verses should give you some understanding of the Issue.

Mat. 13:11
He answered and said unto them, Because it is given unto you to know the mysteries of the kingdom of heaven, but to them it is not given.

John 12:40
He hath blinded their eyes, and hardened their heart; that they should not see with their eyes, nor understand with their heart, and be converted, and I should heal them.

Rom. 11:7
What then? Israel hath not obtained that which he seeketh for; but the election hath obtained it, and the rest were blinded

2 Cor. 3:14
But their minds were blinded: for until this day remaineth the same vail untaken away in the reading of the old testament; which vail is done away in Christ.

Rom. 11:25
For I would not, brethren, that ye should be ignorant of this mystery, lest ye should be wise in your own conceits; that blindness in part is happened to Israel, until the fulness of the Gentiles be come in.

 

[bbbbbbb]

why do jews support the democratic party?

Mostly for the same reason that Irish Catholics are Democrats. When they were a (relatively) persecuted minority in this country the Democratic party fostered their allegiance. Now this allegiance is deeply engrained in their personal identity despite the fact that times have dramatically changed and the Democratic party is now solidly anti-Israel.

It is the same with religious beliefs. The Jews, having been persecuted by "Christians" for millenia know that they would never identify themselves as a member of those who hate them. Their identity is very much that they are not Christians, not necessarily that they believe in God or are Jewish.

 

[Major1]

This is sort of confusing to me now. I'm going to bullet-point my questions and get to the point. If this is in the incorrect forum, please move it!

1) Did Jesus not fulfill the prophecies of the Torah?

2) What is the concept of what the Jewish messiah is supposed to be like? (ex., exclusive for the Jewish people, specific prophetic fulfillments, etc..)

3) What is their theological basis for rejecting Jesus and the Bible? Is it a contrast between the character of OT and NT?

Any other questions please add.

FAITH! We become saved when we realize that we are sinners and that all sin must be paid for. That payment can only come by the shed blood of Jesus Christ as He was God's perfect Son and the sacrifice for all of humanities sin.

Now the reason why Jews are hard to get saved is simply that Judaism does teach sin. In fact, there are twenty different words for sin in Hebrew, ranging from "missing the mark," to "failing at a duty," to "personal offense," to "breaching a covenant."

Regarding personal sin, Judaism teaches that the offender must take steps before God can forgive. If he harms another person, he must regret his action, ask forgiveness, and make amends. If this is done sincerely, God will pardon his offense and give him a long and prosperous life—the same promise given to Israel as a nation. But Judaism does not universally teach original sin or that mankind is born with a sin nature.

Until a man realizes that he is a lost sinner he can not become a saved sinner.

 

[Methesinner]

Like Pharaoh, the hardness of their hearts

 

[Constantine the Sinner]

Orthodox Judaism is the continuation of Pharisaic Judaism. So...it's pretty clear.

 

[Constantine the Sinner]

*

 

[bbbbbbb]

Orthodox Judaism is the continuation of Pharisaic Judaism. So...it's pretty clear.

Most Orthodox Jews are not Pharisees, in that they have no Temple and they do not believe in spirits and in the resurrection of the dead. However, that is a very simplistic overview. You may wish to read this for a more complete understanding - Orthodox Judaism - Wikipedia

 

[bbbbbbb]

Orthodox Judaism is the continuation of Pharisaic Judaism. So...it's pretty clear.

Most Orthodox Jews are not Pharisees, in that they have no Temple and they do not believe in spirits and in the resurrection of the dead. However, that is a very simplistic overview. You may wish to read this for a more complete understanding - Orthodox Judaism - Wikipedia

 

[Constantine the Sinner]

Most Orthodox Jews are not Pharisees, in that they have no Temple and they do not believe in spirits and in the resurrection of the dead. However, that is a very simplistic overview. You may wish to read this for a more complete understanding - Orthodox Judaism - Wikipedia

Hm.

The Pharisees /ˈfærəˌsiːz/ were at various times a political party, a social movement, and a school of thought in the Holy Land during the time of Second Temple Judaism. After the destruction of the Second Temple in 70 CE, Pharisaic beliefs became the foundational, liturgical and ritualistic basis for Rabbinic Judaism.

Pharisees - Wikipedia

Orthodox Jews do generally believe in the Resurrection of the Dead.

Orthodox Jews don't have a temple because the Romans destroyed it. After the Romans destroyed the temple, the Sadducees floundered, in fact basically every sect of Judaism did except the Pharisees and the Christians. Orthodox Judaism is basically a continuation of Pharisaic Judaism, any Orthodox Jew will tell you this. Pharisaic Judaism is not as contingent upon a temple, because the Pharisees did not argue much about temple law, they argued about every day law, that is what they specialized in. The Oral Law of the Pharisees was codified and expressed in the Talmud.

As for Conservative and Reform Judaism, those are new religions and were made in the last century or so.

 

[bbbbbbb]

Hm.


Pharisees - Wikipedia

Orthodox Jews do generally believe in the Resurrection of the Dead.

Orthodox Jews don't have a temple because the Romans destroyed it. After the Romans destroyed the temple, the Sadducees floundered, in fact basically every sect of Judaism did except the Pharisees and the Christians. Orthodox Judaism is basically a continuation of Pharisaic Judaism, any Orthodox Jew will tell you this. Pharisaic Judaism is not as contingent upon a temple, because the Pharisees did not argue much about temple law, they argued about every day law, that is what they specialized in. The Oral Law of the Pharisees was codified and expressed in the Talmud.

As for Conservative and Reform Judaism, those are new religions and were made in the last century or so.

Did I mention a thing about Conservative or Reform Judaism?

 

[Constantine the Sinner]

Did I mention a thing about Conservative or Reform Judaism?

No, but I did to prevent them from being introduced here.

 

[bbbbbbb]

No, but I did to prevent them from being introduced here.

Thanks.

 

[Dale]

This is sort of confusing to me now. I'm going to bullet-point my questions and get to the point. If this is in the incorrect forum, please move it!

1) Did Jesus not fulfill the prophecies of the Torah?

2) What is the concept of what the Jewish messiah is supposed to be like? (ex., exclusive for the Jewish people, specific prophetic fulfillments, etc..)

3) What is their theological basis for rejecting Jesus and the Bible? Is it a contrast between the character of OT and NT?

Any other questions please add.

I'm afraid there is some truth to the answer BBBB gave in post #7, Jews have been persecuted for centuries. They believe they have been persecuted by Christians, although it may not be that simple.

I do look at the press from Israel from time to time, and one columnist I am familiar with is Jonathan Rosenblum. He is a Haredi, an ultra-orthodox Jew. In one of his columns he responds to the question of whether dialogue with Christians is needed. Rosenblum's answer: There is nothing to discuss because Christians are ignorant of the teachings of the great rabbis.

I wish I didn't have to deliver that answer but there it is.

 

[friend of]

Rosenblum's answer: There is nothing to discuss because Christians are ignorant of the teachings of the great rabbis.

Thanks for the response. Would you happen to have any examples of these teachings handy?

 

[bbbbbbb]

Thanks for the response. Would you happen to have any examples of these teachings handy?

This might be a good place to start - Orthodox Judaism - Wikipedia