What is Your View on Soteriology? (Calvinist/Arminian/etc.)

[ChristIsSovereign]

Really curious, that's all.

 

[anna ~ grace]

The Catholic view is a lot more nuanced than that.

 

[ChristIsSovereign]

The Catholic view is a lot more nuanced than that.

Didn't want to make it a 30 word statement, but I see it as good works accompanied by merited grace.

 

[thecolorsblend]

I see it as good works accompanied by merited grace.

That's also not correct.

 

[ChristIsSovereign]

That's also not correct.

Explain your position.

 

[thecolorsblend]

Explain your position.

Try though I might, I can't really think of a bumper sticker slogan to use in the poll.

If you need some kind of explanation for it, one might be...

The Catholic Church does not now, nor has it ever, taught a doctrine of salvation by works…that we can “work” our way into Heaven. Additionally, nowhere in the Bible does it teach that we are saved by “faith alone.” The only place in all of Scripture where the phrase “faith alone” appears is in James 2:24, where it says that we are not justified (or saved) by faith alone. The Bible says very clearly that we are not saved by faith alone.Works do have something to do with our salvation. Numerous passages in the New Testament that I know of about judgment says we will be judged by our works, not by whether or not we have faith alone. We see this in Romans 2, Matthew 15 and 16, 1 Peter 1, Revelation 20 and 22, 2 Corinthians 5, and many, many more verses. If we are saved by faith alone, why does 1 Corinthians 13:13 say that love is greater than faith? Shouldn’t it be the other way around? As Catholics we believe that we are saved by God’s grace alone. We can do nothing, apart from God’s grace, to receive the free gift of salvation. We also believe, however, that we have to respond to God’s grace. Protestants believe that, too. However, many Protestants believe that the only response necessary is an act of faith; whereas, Catholics believe a response of faith and works is necessary…or, as the Bible puts it in Galatians 5:6, “For in Christ Jesus neither circumcision nor uncircumsion is of any avail, but faith working through love…” Faith working through love…just as the Church teaches.

https://www.catholicscomehome.org/your-questions/church-teachings/salvation

 

[dreadnought]

Really curious, that's all.

Soteriology is one of those words I have to google to know what it means. Okay, now that I've done that, I believe salvation is the act of the Lord getting us out of the messes we get ourselves into. That is different than going to heaven. After we've been saved, we still have work to do.

 

[Doug Melven]

I voted freewill.
The key to figuring out salvation is found in the Parable of the sower.
Jesus sows the Word in all kinds of soil.
The soil determines if the seed grows or not.
The Holy Spirit starts His work of convicting of unbelief, and once we accept Him, The Holy Spirit does what only He can do in making us a child of God.

 

[ChristIsSovereign]

Try though I might, I can't really think of a bumper sticker slogan to use in the poll.

If you need some kind of explanation for it, one might be...

Appreciated. Here's an article I referred to... to explain the apparent contradiction between Paul and James in this regard: Does James Contradict Paul?

 

[Apologetic_Warrior]

I am a Calvinist, what is called "hyper-Calvinism" has to do with more than a view on the logical order of God's decrees. More often that not it is also used as a pejorative term and as a means of division. The issue of Infralapsarianism and Supralapsarianism is what you might call an in-house debate. This also includes a number of other related issues, and there is the temptation to say "well so and so held to this, and so and so held to that" but I think, and this is my opinion, what is most important to the issue of hyper-Calvinism are the implications. Regardless of where one stands, it should be understood on this issue that historically Calvinists have a great track record concerning evangelism. For example, Jonathan Edwards and George Whitefield, both Calvinists, were leaders in a revival known in American history as the "Great Awakening". Another less known man, a Presbyterian, a Calvinist by the name of Arthur T. Pierson was a pioneer of evangelistic missions, who lived to see the world evangelized. Personally, I am probably more in line with "moderate Calvinism", but probably have some "higher Calvinism" tendencies.

If you click on the Infralapsarian and Supralapsarianism link, you'll read from the article: "Many Calvinists reject both lapsarian views for various reasons." And it would be interesting if one could make a real case for either from any major historical Reformed Confession.

 

[ChristIsSovereign]

I am a Calvinist, what is called "hyper-Calvinism" has to do with more than a view on the logical order of God's decrees. More often that not it is also used as a pejorative term and as a means of division. The issue of Infralapsarianism and Supralapsarianism is what you might call an in-house debate. This also includes a number of other related issues, and there is the temptation to say "well so and so held to this, and so and so held to that" but I think, and this is my opinion, what is most important to the issue of hyper-Calvinism are the implications. Regardless of where one stands, it should be understood on this issue that historically Calvinists have a great track record concerning evangelism. For example, Jonathan Edwards and George Whitefield, both Calvinists, were leaders in a revival known in American history as the "Great Awakening". Another less known man, a Presbyterian, a Calvinist by the name of Arthur T. Pierson was a pioneer of evangelistic missions, who lived to see the world evangelized. Personally, I am probably more in line with "moderate Calvinism", but probably have some "higher Calvinism" tendencies.

If you click on the Infralapsarian and Supralapsarianism link, you'll read from the article: "Many Calvinists reject both lapsarian views for various reasons." And it would be interesting if one could make a real case for either from any major historical Reformed Confession.

If I was a Calvinist, I'd be an infralapsarian, since God is not the author of evil.

 

[anna ~ grace]

Didn't want to make it a 30 word statement, but I see it as good works accompanied by merited grace.

Hey, CIS. These may give some more answers.

What is the Catholic understanding of the biblical plan of salvation? | Catholic Answers

EWTN.com - soteriology

Why does the Church teach that works can obtain salvation? | Catholic Answers

 

[ChristIsSovereign]

Hey, CIS. These may give some more answers.

What is the Catholic understanding of the biblical plan of salvation? | Catholic Answers

EWTN.com - soteriology

Why does the Church teach that works can obtain salvation? | Catholic Answers

Another guy explained it in a much shorter way, by the way, which was satisfying as it was.

 

[ChristIsSovereign]

Hey, CIS. These may give some more answers.

What is the Catholic understanding of the biblical plan of salvation? | Catholic Answers

EWTN.com - soteriology

Why does the Church teach that works can obtain salvation? | Catholic Answers

In response to the Catholic Answers website, that is essentially what I believe but that works are a result of our regeneration in Jesus Christ our Savior. We are inclined... even persuaded by the Holy Spirit to do good works.

Yet if God transforms me on my deathbed, that also means I'm going to Heaven, does it not?

Without regeneration (being born again), our works amount to nothing.

 

[anna ~ grace]

In response to the Catholic Answers website, that is essentially what I believe but that works are a result of our regeneration in Jesus Christ our Savior. We are inclined... even persuaded by the Holy Spirit to do good works.

Yet if God transforms me on my deathbed, that also means I'm going to Heaven, does it not?

Without regeneration (being born again), our works amount to nothing.

That sounds closer to what many Protestants believe; that saving faith automatically produces good works, which are fruits of, but not an aspect of, salvation (which is understood by them to be through faith alone, that faith being made possible by grace).

 

[ChristIsSovereign]

That sounds closer to what many Protestants believe; that saving faith automatically produces good works, which are fruits of, but not an aspect of, salvation (which is understood by them to be through faith alone, that faith being made possible by grace).

Quite a good understanding of that doctrine, may I say.

Yes, without a change of heart divinely imbued by Jesus Christ Himself, our works are just self-serving and vain at the heart of it all.

We don't strive to look pious but to be righteous. Righteousness isn't the clothes you wear, the words you say, but the inner state granted through regeneration.

 

[Apologetic_Warrior]

Hey, CIS. These may give some more answers.

Seeing your post and reading the post about your husband being a Baptist just reminded me of one of the greatest evangelistic preachers of all-time the Calvinistic Baptist Charles Hadden Spurgeon. How I allowed him to slip my mind I do not know, getting old I suppose.

 

[Hank77]

For example, Jonathan Edwards and George Whitefield, both Calvinists, were leaders in a revival known in American history as the "Great Awakening".

Did you know that John Wesley and Whitefield were great friends even though they debated over their differences in theology. John Wesley gave the sermon at George Whitefield funeral.

 

[anna ~ grace]

Quite a good understanding of that doctrine, may I say.

Yes, without a change of heart divinely imbued by Jesus Christ Himself, our works are just self-serving and vain at the heart of it all.

We don't strive to look pious but to be righteous. Righteousness isn't the clothes you wear, the words you say, but the inner state granted through regeneration.

Yeah, that's pretty close to how many Protestants might summarize a theology of salvation. One Protestant preacher on the radio expressed it as "we do good works because we are saved, not to be saved".

But a Catholic response to that would see salvation as a journey of grace acting through faith and also through our free will in action, as we love God, and keep His commandments. Both because of grace, but in a manner in which our will co-operates with God's will towards our salvation. Many Catholic sources today seem to cite "faith working through love", which is also meant to include obedience, good works, compassion for the poor, humility, sacrifices, and fidelity in general. Not as opposing things, but as equally necessary yet different components.

 

[anna ~ grace]

Seeing your post and reading the post about your husband being a Baptist just reminded me of one of the greatest evangelistic preachers of all-time the Calvinistic Baptist Charles Hadden Spurgeon. How I allowed him to slip my mind I do not know, getting old I suppose.

I haven't been able to read much of Spurgeon, but would like to. I think they called him "the Prince of Preachers". Do you have any other favorite thinkers?