what is the spiritual body?

[JohnRabbit]

speaking of man, paul says this:

1 Corinthians 15:44(NKJV)
44It is sown a natural body, it is raised a spiritual body. There is a natural body, and there is a spiritual body.


like to know your thoughts on the "spiritual body".

 

[williamgramsmith]

It is a Resurrected perfected body being spiritually raised in Godliness but still made of matter.

It also shows that the usage of the word "spirit" doesn't necessarily mean ONLY SPIRIT, as most Christians (but not LDS) interpret the "God is Spirit" verse.

Further food for thought, is that in LDS Theology, the Spirit itself is also matter, but more refined. After all, anything that has "form" has to have "element" in it.

 

[n2thelight]

speaking of man, paul says this:

1 Corinthians 15:44(NKJV)
44It is sown a natural body, it is raised a spiritual body. There is a natural body, and there is a spiritual body.


like to know your thoughts on the "spiritual body".

I Corinthians 15:44 "It is sown a natural body; it is raised a spiritual body. There is a natural body, and there is a spiritual body."

There is a natural body, which is your flesh body, and there is also a spiritual or soul body. The two are different and when the natural body, or flesh body dies the spiritual body is "raised", or in the Greek text "egiro, awakened, become active from its death". You have two bodies, one natural body contains your spiritual body, and that spiritual body is awakened to a new life, when the flesh or natural body dies and releases your soul. Your spirit and your soul are together, for the spirit is your "self", "the intellect of your soul" which houses your spirit within you.

You don't have a soul,you are a soul,you have a body.......

 

[zeke37]

what the angels exist in...and what we shall be changed to....

 

[zeke37]

I Corinthians 15:44 "It is sown a natural body; it is raised a spiritual body. There is a natural body, and there is a spiritual body."

There is a natural body, which is your flesh body, and there is also a spiritual or soul body. The two are different and when the natural body, or flesh body dies the spiritual body is "raised", or in the Greek text "egiro, awakened, become active from its death". You have two bodies, one natural body contains your spiritual body, and that spiritual body is awakened to a new life, when the flesh or natural body dies and releases your soul. Your spirit and your soul are together, for the spirit is your "self", "the intellect of your soul" which houses your spirit within you.

You don't have a soul,you are a soul,you have a body.......

it's curious that u have Bullinger in your footer...
I doubt he'd agree with your assessment...just sayin'...
ps, he's one of my favorites

 

[Hillsage]

it's curious that u have Bullinger in your footer...
I doubt he'd agree with your assessment...just sayin'...
ps, he's one of my favorites

Hello Zeke,

Love ole E.W. myself. Got the Companion bible, Number in Scripture but my favorite work is Word Studies on the Holy Spirit. And I agree with you that I don't think he would agree with n2...sorry bro.

I think he was triparte and would say we are not souls. He'd say we are spirit that have a soul/mind and live in a body of flesh.

1 Corinthians 15:44 It is sown a natural/Psuchikos/soulish body; it is raised a spiritual body. There is a natural/soulish body, and there is a spiritual body.

If I am led by my spirit I am spiritually minded my spirit and soul are in union and we lead our body about as a slave, and do not sin. But if our soul/mind is aligned with our flesh/body then we quench our spirit and sin.

1 Corinthians 3:1 And I, brethren, could not speak unto you as unto spiritual, but as unto carnal, even as unto babes in Christ.

Babes in Christ are those Christians still walking in the desires of the flesh more than they are walking by the holy 'born again' spirit. And the word carnal above means 'pertaining to the flesh' and also 'unregenerate'...or as someone who isn't born again.

So what do you think Zeke, would Bullinger agree?

 

[tezboski99]

The point Paul was making is that Adam came from the "dust of the earth" and Jesus came from heaven. Each man, Adam and Jesus, had a body of a different source. A person from heaven Jesus, angels, etc. are all spirits in a "spirit body" and persons from the "dust" are all flesh.

1 Corinthians 15 (edited)

“How are the dead raised? With what kind of body will they come?” Not all flesh is the same: People have one kind of flesh, animals have another, birds another and fish another. 40 There are also heavenly bodies and there are earthly bodies; but the splendor of the heavenly bodies is one kind, and the splendor of the earthly bodies is another.
If there is a natural body, there is also a spiritual body. 45 So it is written: “The first man Adam became a living being”; the last Adam, a life-giving spirit. 46 The spiritual did not come first, but the natural, and after that the spiritual. 47 The first man was of the dust of the earth; the second man is of heaven. 48 As was the earthly man, so are those who are of the earth; and as is the heavenly man, so also are those who are of heaven. 49 And just as we have borne the image of the earthly man, so shall we bear the image of the heavenly man.

When Jesus went back to heaven he was a spirit. (1 Corinthians 15:45, 1 Peter 3:18-19)

 

[Hillsage]

The point Paul was making is that Adam came from the "dust of the earth" and Jesus came from heaven. Each man, Adam and Jesus, had a body of a different source. A person from heaven Jesus, angels, etc. are all spirits in a "spirit body" and persons from the "dust" are all flesh.

My POV is Jesus didn't come from heaven he came from Mary and that's what made him the 'son of man'. The spirit of Jesus was born of God/heaven and that's what made Him...the 'son of God'.

Jesus had the same natural 'sinful flesh' body as all men had. He just never yielded to it.

ROM 8:3 For God has done what the law, weakened by the flesh, could not do: sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh...

1 Corinthians 15 (edited)

“How are the dead raised? With what kind of body will they come?” Not all flesh is the same: People have one kind of flesh, animals have another, birds another and fish another.

All this says is that Jesus had a PEOPLE flesh just like us...and not that of an animal/bird/fish.

40 There are also heavenly bodies and there are earthly bodies; but the splendor of the heavenly bodies is one kind, and the splendor of the earthly bodies is another.
If there is a natural body, there is also a spiritual body. 45 So it is written: “The first man Adam became a living being”; the last Adam, a life-giving spirit. 46 The spiritual did not come first, but the natural, and after that the spiritual. 47 The first man was of the dust of the earth; the second man is of heaven.

When Jesus went back to heaven he was a spirit. (1 Corinthians 15:45, 1 Peter 3:18-19)

Jesus came with the 'Christ spirit' in Him, and a natural 'sinful flesh' body. He then worked out the salvation/'sanctification' of his soul "wholly" thereby winning the war for his soul because of the 'lusts of his sinful flesh'. Lusts which tempted him in every way just like we are.

1PE 2:11 Beloved, I urge you as aliens and strangers to abstain from fleshly lusts which wage war against the soul.

IOW Jesus the Christ came as a natural man "made like unto his brethren in every respect". But he then overcame in every respect thereby receiving his spiritual body AFTER dying on the cross...but before going to preach in the prison of 1Peter.

HEB 2:17 Therefore he had to be made like his brethren in every respect, so that he might become a merciful and faithful high priest in the service of God, to make expiation for the sins of the people.

48 As was the earthly man, so are those who are of the earth; and as is the heavenly man, so also are those who are of heaven. 49 And just as we have borne the image of the earthly man, so shall we bear the image of the heavenly man.

This verse simply promises us that we too can follow Jesus from having an "earthly body' to a 'glorified/heavenly body' which will be made alive by the spirit even as Jesus body was. After the resurrection his heavenly body was "flesh and bone" no longer needing the "life that's in the blood." Jesus didn't have a 'flesh and bone' body until after he bled out on the cross and was resurrected.

That's my 2 cents anyway.

 

[Raimi Stranger]

speaking of man, paul says this:

1 Corinthians 15:44(NKJV)
44It is sown a natural body, it is raised a spiritual body. There is a natural body, and there is a spiritual body.


like to know your thoughts on the "spiritual body".

the array of misunderstandings here is a good illustration of the problems caused by not listening to Jesus ... if anyone REALLY wants to understand the Truth then they will do what Jesus said is the only way, to learn from God directly all Truth in spirit baptism [once one has stopped sinning to enable God to baptise one without killing one in facing Him] not seek answers by looking at verses of scripture in isolation ...

but to explain for confirmed sinners, Jesus died and rose in the FLESH [Luke 24:39] ,so UNDERSTAND that Paul is talking about one's resurrected PHYSICAL body being spiritual here, not suggesting that the spirit can have a body [the spirit is ONE, and indivisible, not divided into bodies of any kind, not divisible even]

thus as you see most folks don't bother using the scripture to understand the scripture, let alone waiting for God to explain because they actually follow what Jesus said is the ONLY way to know all things, FROM God Himself, not in words, not from men

the resurrected body is flesh, PHYSICAL, and is spiritual simply because one is freed from sin by death [Romans 6:7]... that is all Paul is pointing out here, but it is not popular in religion to realise that death frees men from sin for the later salvation of billions by works [Rev 20:13] after ALL are freed from hel as Jesus states... [read it] ... how very sad then that almsot all folks are taught by men who are sinners and cannot know God or Jesus, cannot be baptised by God , so cannot enter the kingdom until after death they become spiritual [spiritual righteousness to Love ruined again if they sin again-Ezek 18:24]

there is the Truth expressed in scripture for any to read, but few do , so few find the way to Jesus and God in this life -Matt 7:13-14, and the masses of mass religion are destroyed [Matt 7:13] for their unrepented sin [one has not repented at all if one still sins, so now you know the BIG lie of religion and why this thread is so nonsensical until one simply reads what Jesus explained about resurrection and SHOWED us ... so why not read what he and the sints say instead of listening to sinners, who cannot know]

1 John 3:6 Whosoever abideth in him sinneth not: whosoever sinneth hath not seen him, neither known him.

read and weap for sinners in frocks taught by sinners in frocks and the billions they deceive after themselves... as the saint confirms, they cannot know God or Jesus at all... as Jesus says they will choose Satan as lord of the whole earth -Rev 13:3-4... so much for mass religion and men's faith in men... but neither Jesus nor God asked anyone to have faith in men at all, Jesus died so men who are willing to obey him and Love, not sin, would ALL be taught by God , not by words in the bible, not by men, but by God :-

John 14:26 But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you.

John 16:7 Nevertheless I tell you the truth; It is expedient for you that I go away: for if I go not away, the Comforter will not come unto you; but if I depart, I will send him unto you.

 

[tezboski99]

My POV is Jesus didn't come from heaven he came from Mary and that's what made him the 'son of man'. The spirit of Jesus was born of God/heaven and that's what made Him...the 'son of God'.

Jesus had the same natural 'sinful flesh' body as all men had. He just never yielded to it.

ROM 8:3 For God has done what the law, weakened by the flesh, could not do: sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh...

All this says is that Jesus had a PEOPLE flesh just like us...and not that of an animal/bird/fish.

Jesus came with the 'Christ spirit' in Him, and a natural 'sinful flesh' body. He then worked out the salvation/'sanctification' of his soul "wholly" thereby winning the war for his soul because of the 'lusts of his sinful flesh'. Lusts which tempted him in every way just like we are.

1PE 2:11 Beloved, I urge you as aliens and strangers to abstain from fleshly lusts which wage war against the soul.

IOW Jesus the Christ came as a natural man "made like unto his brethren in every respect". But he then overcame in every respect thereby receiving his spiritual body AFTER dying on the cross...but before going to preach in the prison of 1Peter.

HEB 2:17 Therefore he had to be made like his brethren in every respect, so that he might become a merciful and faithful high priest in the service of God, to make expiation for the sins of the people.

This verse simply promises us that we too can follow Jesus from having an "earthly body' to a 'glorified/heavenly body' which will be made alive by the spirit even as Jesus body was. After the resurrection his heavenly body was "flesh and bone" no longer needing the "life that's in the blood." Jesus didn't have a 'flesh and bone' body until after he bled out on the cross and was resurrected.

That's my 2 cents anyway.

Jesus already existed in heaven of course. (Hebrews 1:1-3) He left heaven and became a man. (Phillipians 2:6-7; Hebrews 10:5-6) The body Jesus had as a man was offered up in it's entirety. (Hebrews 10:10; Ephesians 5:2)

Scriptures as a whole don't indicate that Jesus when resurrected kept his fleshly body as some say. Flesh and blood cannot inherit GOD's Kingdom. (1 Corinthians 15:50) Jesus' body was also the "Passover Lamb" that was to be completely destroyed. (Exodus 12:10, 1 Corinthians 5:7, Hebrews 10:5) In any of the sacrifices that were made there is no example of anyone taking sacrifices back in any form. (There was the one example of Eli's sons Phineas and Hophni who took other's sacrificed meat for themselves and were put to death but, no examples of a person making an offering and having it returned to them in an approved manner.)

Just as when we pay a bill we don't keep our money, when Jesus paid for our sins with his perfect body he didn't get to keep the body. GOD resurrected Jesus in a heavenly form or spirit. That's the point that Paul was making, that when they are resurrected they will be in the form of the heavenly or divine "man".

 

[Imagican]

Agreed. The moment that we are 'born again' we are born again in SPIRIT. We are 'born' into the Body of Christ.

So there is the vessel, the physical 'body' that each of us possess. And then there is the Spiritual 'body of Christ' which those that ARE born again are born into.

Blessings,

MEC

 

[zeke37]

My POV is Jesus didn't come from heaven he came from Mary and that's what made him the 'son of man'. The spirit of Jesus was born of God/heaven and that's what made Him...the 'son of God'.

Jesus had the same natural 'sinful flesh' body as all men had. He just never yielded to it.

ROM 8:3 For God has done what the law, weakened by the flesh, could not do: sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh...

All this says is that Jesus had a PEOPLE flesh just like us...and not that of an animal/bird/fish.

Jesus came with the 'Christ spirit' in Him, and a natural 'sinful flesh' body. He then worked out the salvation/'sanctification' of his soul "wholly" thereby winning the war for his soul because of the 'lusts of his sinful flesh'. Lusts which tempted him in every way just like we are.

1PE 2:11 Beloved, I urge you as aliens and strangers to abstain from fleshly lusts which wage war against the soul.

IOW Jesus the Christ came as a natural man "made like unto his brethren in every respect". But he then overcame in every respect thereby receiving his spiritual body AFTER dying on the cross...but before going to preach in the prison of 1Peter.

HEB 2:17 Therefore he had to be made like his brethren in every respect, so that he might become a merciful and faithful high priest in the service of God, to make expiation for the sins of the people.

This verse simply promises us that we too can follow Jesus from having an "earthly body' to a 'glorified/heavenly body' which will be made alive by the spirit even as Jesus body was. After the resurrection his heavenly body was "flesh and bone" no longer needing the "life that's in the blood." Jesus didn't have a 'flesh and bone' body until after he bled out on the cross and was resurrected.

That's my 2 cents anyway.

the lamb had to be spotless for the Passover
it could not have spots and then be washed off
it could not be born and be less perfect, than it was at the Sacrifice
so the analogy doesn't work for me.

Jesus was spotless

 

[Phantasman]

The body is the components that make up something. If eyes cannot see spirit, do we need them to live in spirit? The new body will have what it requires. Those who think we need ears, eyes and a digestive system, etc. are thinking physically.

1 Corinthian 15:
42 So also is the resurrection of the dead. It is sown in corruption; it is raised in incorruption:
43 It is sown in dishonour; it is raised in glory: it is sown in weakness; it is raised in power:
44It is sown a natural body; it is raised a spiritual body. There is a natural body, and there is a spiritual body.
45 And so it is written, The first man Adam was made a living soul; the last Adam was made a quickening spirit.
46 Howbeit that was not first which is spiritual, but that which is natural; and afterward that which is spiritual.
47 The first man is of the earth, earthy; the second man is the Lord from heaven.
48 As is the earthy, such are they also that are earthy: and as is the heavenly, such are they also that are heavenly.
49 And as we have borne the image of the earthy, we shall also bear the image of the heavenly.
50 Now this I say, brethren, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God; neither doth corruption inherit incorruption.
51 Behold, I shew you a mystery; We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed,
52 In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed.

 

[Raimi Stranger]

Rather choose to understand scripture FROM SCRIPTURE, not by imposing your own ideas on it... when the bible says 'raised' it means RESURRECTED - see the two current parallel threads, resurrection is to THE FLESH, and resurrection is NOT salvation [translation to the spirit]

thus the 'spiritual bidy' is the resurrected PHYSICAL body made free of sin , spiritual BY DEATH and resurrection -Romans 6:7...

note that Jesus PROVED to us that resurrection is to the flesh NOT to the spirit, and is not translation [salvation] :-

Luke 24:39 Behold my [Jesus afte resurrection] hands and my feet, that it is I myself: handle me, and see; for a spirit hath not flesh and bones, as ye see me have.

 

[coraline]

Jesus already existed in heaven of course. (Hebrews 1:1-3) He left heaven and became a man. (Phillipians 2:6-7; Hebrews 10:5-6) The body Jesus had as a man was offered up in it's entirety. (Hebrews 10:10; Ephesians 5:2)

Scriptures as a whole don't indicate that Jesus when resurrected kept his fleshly body as some say. Flesh and blood cannot inherit GOD's Kingdom. (1 Corinthians 15:50) Jesus' body was also the "Passover Lamb" that was to be completely destroyed. (Exodus 12:10, 1 Corinthians 5:7, Hebrews 10:5) In any of the sacrifices that were made there is no example of anyone taking sacrifices back in any form. (There was the one example of Eli's sons Phineas and Hophni who took other's sacrificed meat for themselves and were put to death but, no examples of a person making an offering and having it returned to them in an approved manner.)

Just as when we pay a bill we don't keep our money, when Jesus paid for our sins with his perfect body he didn't get to keep the body. GOD resurrected Jesus in a heavenly form or spirit. That's the point that Paul was making, that when they are resurrected they will be in the form of the heavenly or divine "man".

Good post!

 

[Raimi Stranger]

Originally Posted by tezboski99

Jesus already existed in heaven of course.
[/quote]

of course you are misquoting, it is Logos that is with God and is God as spirit, the spirit is ONE, there are no individuals

Deuteronomy 32:39 See now that I, even I, am he, and there is no god with me:

Logos is God, not a separate god... the spirit is indivisibly ONE God ...

Mark 12:32 And the scribe said unto him, Well, Master, thou hast said the truth: for there is one God; and there is none other but he:

(Hebrews 1:1-3) He left heaven and became a man. (Phillipians 2:6-7; Hebrews 10:5-6)

it is the third heavens that is the spirit, not this heavens... and the name misrepresented as 'Jesus' refers to the man, not to Logos , right-hand coverin cherub at the throne of God...

The body Jesus had as a man was offered up in it's entirety. (Hebrews 10:10; Ephesians 5:2)

there is no such implication, the body was revitalised by the spirit woth its wounds still evident and offered to the disciples as proof that this is no spirit but physical Jesus as flesh and bones

Acts 2:31 He seeing this before spake of the resurrection of Christ, that his soul was not left in hell, neither his flesh did see corruption.

Luke 24:39 Behold my hands and my feet, that it is I myself: handle me, and see; for a spirit hath not flesh and bones, as ye see me have.

John 20:27 Then saith he to Thomas, Reach hither thy finger, and behold my hands; and reach hither thy hand, and thrust it into my side: and be not faithless, but believing.

Scriptures as a whole don't indicate that Jesus when resurrected kept his fleshly body as some say. Flesh and blood cannot inherit GOD's Kingdom. (1 Corinthians 15:50)

atrocious lie and misrepresentation, Jesus states he is flesh and bones, not spirit, after resurrection... those who INHERIT the kingdom are the saints of this earth TRANSLATED to spirit to join the immortal royal priesthood [1Pet 2:9-10] of Melchizedek... but they have to manifest in the new earth to serve the billions resurrected there , all sinners of this earth are freed from death and hell according to Jesus -Rev 20:13- and are flesh and bones just as Jesus showed... so need manifested priest-kings to rule them
under Jesus as king of kings and high priest in the new earth

Jesus' body was also the "Passover Lamb" that was to be completely destroyed. (Exodus 12:10, 1 Corinthians 5:7, Hebrews 10:5)

not destroyed, consumed, eaten... Jesus had to be translated from this earth to bring spirit baptism to the few saints, but his translation to spirit was long after his resurrection... again this a awful misrepresentation and lies ...



​

 

[tezboski99]

Originally Posted by tezboski99

Jesus already existed in heaven of course.
​

of course you are misquoting, it is Logos that is with God and is God as spirit, the spirit is ONE, there are no individuals

Deuteronomy 32:39 See now that I, even I, am he, and there is no god with me:

Logos is God, not a separate god... the spirit is indivisibly ONE God ...

Mark 12:32 And the scribe said unto him, Well, Master, thou hast said the truth: for there is one God; and there is none other but he:

(Hebrews 1:1-3) He left heaven and became a man. (Phillipians 2:6-7; Hebrews 10:5-6)

it is the third heavens that is the spirit, not this heavens... and the name misrepresented as 'Jesus' refers to the man, not to Logos , right-hand coverin cherub at the throne of God...

there is no such implication, the body was revitalised by the spirit woth its wounds still evident and offered to the disciples as proof that this is no spirit but physical Jesus as flesh and bones

Acts 2:31 He seeing this before spake of the resurrection of Christ, that his soul was not left in hell, neither his flesh did see corruption.

Luke 24:39 Behold my hands and my feet, that it is I myself: handle me, and see; for a spirit hath not flesh and bones, as ye see me have.

John 20:27 Then saith he to Thomas, Reach hither thy finger, and behold my hands; and reach hither thy hand, and thrust it into my side: and be not faithless, but believing.

atrocious lie and misrepresentation, Jesus states he is flesh and bones, not spirit, after resurrection... those who INHERIT the kingdom are the saints of this earth TRANSLATED to spirit to join the immortal royal priesthood [1Pet 2:9-10] of Melchizedek... but they have to manifest in the new earth to serve the billions resurrected there , all sinners of this earth are freed from death and hell according to Jesus -Rev 20:13- and are flesh and bones just as Jesus showed... so need manifested priest-kings to rule them
under Jesus as king of kings and high priest in the new earth
not destroyed, consumed, eaten... Jesus had to be translated from this earth to bring spirit baptism to the few saints, but his translation to spirit was long after his resurrection... again this a awful misrepresentation and lies ...[/quote]
​

Let's say that you are absolultely correct. Jesus' human body was raised from the dead. If the perfect body of Jesus paid for our sins and he took it back when he was resurrected then...doesn't that leave us in our sins? If I pay you money for a debt and then take my money back...will you still cancel my debt?

That's what it means if your stance is 100% accurate. If Jesus was resurrected in his own human body, either "glorified" or whatever term you choose to use for it, then the entire sacrificial arrangement is invalid. He took back his sacrifice.

Also the entire sacrifice arrangement is a false inaccurate depiciton and illustration of Jesus sacrifice. How? Because no one ever took back their sacrifice. Anything offered up to GOD became HIS.

In addition it means Peter and Paul had no idea what they were talking about. When writing and referring to Jesus' resurrection they said he was "raised" or "made alive" in the spirit.

1 Peter 3:18-19
"He was put to death in the flesh, but made alive in the spirit, 19 in which also he went and made a proclamation to the spirits in prison,"

1 Corinthians 15:44-49
"It is sown a physical body, it is raised a spiritual body. If there is a physical body, there is also a spiritual body. 45 Thus it is written, “The first man, Adam, became a living being”; the last Adam became a life-giving spirit. 46 But it is not the spiritual that is first, but the physical, and then the spiritual. 47 The first man was from the earth, a man of dust; the second man is from heaven. 48 As was the man of dust, so are those who are of the dust; and as is the man of heaven, so are those who are of heaven. 49 Just as we have borne the image of the man of dust, we will also bear the image of the man of heaven."

Thus, in context, at the point Jesus came alive he was in a spirit body and in this state he later went and preached to other spirits.

Jesus' physical body wasn't allowed to decay naturally but was totally destroyed as illustrated by the sacrifice arrangement, the Highpriest's Atonement Day sacrifice, and that of the passover lamb.

Basically, if you are right then Paul, Peter, and 3 illustrations GOD provided to describe Jesus' sacrifice are all wrong or at the very least inaccurate and misleading.

OR, if you are wrong in your current understanding then Jesus was speaking in a cryptic manner encouraging us to use spiritual insight as he was well known to do many times.

 

[tezboski99]

Originally Posted by tezboski99

Jesus already existed in heaven of course.
​

of course you are misquoting, it is Logos that is with God and is God as spirit, the spirit is ONE, there are no individuals

Deuteronomy 32:39 See now that I, even I, am he, and there is no god with me:

Logos is God, not a separate god... the spirit is indivisibly ONE God ...

Mark 12:32 And the scribe said unto him, Well, Master, thou hast said the truth: for there is one God; and there is none other but he:

(Hebrews 1:1-3) He left heaven and became a man. (Phillipians 2:6-7; Hebrews 10:5-6)

it is the third heavens that is the spirit, not this heavens... and the name misrepresented as 'Jesus' refers to the man, not to Logos , right-hand coverin cherub at the throne of God.[/quote]



Actually, yes Jesus was indeed in heaven as the Logos and was used to by GOD to create the universe.

Hebrews 1:1-2
"In the past God spoke to our ancestors through the prophets at many times and in various ways, 2 but in these last days he has spoken to us by his Son, whom he appointed heir of all things, and through whom also he made the universe."

Jesus stands next to Jehovah/Yahweh who is GOD.

Psalm 110:1-Darby
"Jehovah said unto my Lord, Sit at my right hand, until I put thine enemies [as] footstool of thy feet."

Acts 7:55
"But Stephen, full of the Holy Spirit, looked up to heaven and saw the glory of God, and Jesus standing at the right hand of God."

Hebrews 1:3
"The Son is the radiance of God’s glory and the exact representation of his being, sustaining all things by his powerful word. After he had provided purification for sins, he sat down at the right hand of the Majesty in heaven."

There is GOD Jehovah/Yahweh and it's Jesus/Logos/Word that stands next to GOD as Highpriest.

Hebrews 8:1-2
"Now the main point of what we are saying is this: We do have such a high priest, who sat down at the right hand of the throne of the Majesty in heaven, 2 and who serves in the sanctuary..."

​

 

[coraline]

RaimiS said:

atrocious lie and misrepresentation, Jesus states he is flesh and bones, not spirit, after resurrection... those who INHERIT the kingdom are the saints of this earth TRANSLATED to spirit to join the immortal royal priesthood [1Pet 2:9-10] of Melchizedek... but they have to manifest in the new earth to serve the billions resurrected there , all sinners of this earth are freed from death and hell according to Jesus -Rev 20:13- and are flesh and bones just as Jesus showed... so need manifested priest-kings to rule them
under Jesus as king of kings and high priest in the new earth

First of all, Jesus' body was Divinely Supernatural. The only reason why He said He was in the same flesh was to prove to the disciples that the same Jesus that died on the cross, also arose from the dead.
But we do not get our spiritual bodies the same way Jesus did.

What's more, Jesus took on his spiritual body (supernatural body) for a second time at His ascension. The same supernatural form he had before He came to earth & "was made flesh."

Also, the "saints on earth" were the apostles & disciples in the first century., when Satan was bound so the nations could receive the gospel of salvation. The prayers of the saints were acknowledged in heaven, & the saints did at the end of the "thousand years" - receive the kingdom.

Babylon was destroyed & God gave the kingdom to the Christians.

We shall all put off our tents & receive that heavenly covering for our spirit & souls at the end of our earthly life bc of the Spirit.

God the Father, & the Son & the H.S. came to make their home with believers.
Then when we die, we simply go to heaven bc their is no condemnation (judgment) for those in Christ Jesus. (Rom.8:1)

 

[Raimi Stranger]

of course you are misquoting, it is Logos that is with God and is God as spirit, the spirit is ONE, there are no individuals

Deuteronomy 32:39 See now that I, even I, am he, and there is no god with me:

Logos is God, not a separate god... the spirit is indivisibly ONE God ...

Mark 12:32 And the scribe said unto him, Well, Master, thou hast said the truth: for there is one God; and there is none other but he:

(Hebrews 1:1-3) He left heaven and became a man. (Phillipians 2:6-7; Hebrews 10:5-6)

it is the third heavens that is the spirit, not this heavens... and the name misrepresented as 'Jesus' refers to the man, not to Logos , right-hand coverin cherub at the throne of God...

there is no such implication, the body was revitalised by the spirit woth its wounds still evident and offered to the disciples as proof that this is no spirit but physical Jesus as flesh and bones

Acts 2:31 He seeing this before spake of the resurrection of Christ, that his soul was not left in hell, neither his flesh did see corruption.

Luke 24:39 Behold my hands and my feet, that it is I myself: handle me, and see; for a spirit hath not flesh and bones, as ye see me have.

John 20:27 Then saith he to Thomas, Reach hither thy finger, and behold my hands; and reach hither thy hand, and thrust it into my side: and be not faithless, but believing.

atrocious lie and misrepresentation, Jesus states he is flesh and bones, not spirit, after resurrection... those who INHERIT the kingdom are the saints of this earth TRANSLATED to spirit to join the immortal royal priesthood [1Pet 2:9-10] of Melchizedek... but they have to manifest in the new earth to serve the billions resurrected there , all sinners of this earth are freed from death and hell according to Jesus -Rev 20:13- and are flesh and bones just as Jesus showed... so need manifested priest-kings to rule them
under Jesus as king of kings and high priest in the new earth
not destroyed, consumed, eaten... Jesus had to be translated from this earth to bring spirit baptism to the few saints, but his translation to spirit was long after his resurrection... again this a awful misrepresentation and lies ...​

Let's say that you are absolultely correct. Jesus' human body was raised from the dead. If the perfect body of Jesus paid for our sins and he took it back when he was resurrected then...doesn't that leave us in our sins? If I pay you money for a debt and then take my money back...will you still cancel my debt?

That's what it means if your stance is 100% accurate. If Jesus was resurrected in his own human body, either "glorified" or whatever term you choose to use for it, then the entire sacrificial arrangement is invalid. He took back his sacrifice.

Also the entire sacrifice arrangement is a false inaccurate depiciton and illustration of Jesus sacrifice. How? Because no one ever took back their sacrifice. Anything offered up to GOD became HIS.

In addition it means Peter and Paul had no idea what they were talking about. When writing and referring to Jesus' resurrection they said he was "raised" or "made alive" in the spirit.

1 Peter 3:18-19
"He was put to death in the flesh, but made alive in the spirit, 19 in which also he went and made a proclamation to the spirits in prison,"

1 Corinthians 15:44-49
"It is sown a physical body, it is raised a spiritual body. If there is a physical body, there is also a spiritual body. 45 Thus it is written, “The first man, Adam, became a living being”; the last Adam became a life-giving spirit. 46 But it is not the spiritual that is first, but the physical, and then the spiritual. 47 The first man was from the earth, a man of dust; the second man is from heaven. 48 As was the man of dust, so are those who are of the dust; and as is the man of heaven, so are those who are of heaven. 49 Just as we have borne the image of the man of dust, we will also bear the image of the man of heaven."

Thus, in context, at the point Jesus came alive he was in a spirit body and in this state he later went and preached to other spirits.

Jesus' physical body wasn't allowed to decay naturally but was totally destroyed as illustrated by the sacrifice arrangement, the Highpriest's Atonement Day sacrifice, and that of the passover lamb.

Basically, if you are right then Paul, Peter, and 3 illustrations GOD provided to describe Jesus' sacrifice are all wrong or at the very least inaccurate and misleading.

OR, if you are wrong in your current understanding then Jesus was speaking in a cryptic manner encouraging us to use spiritual insight as he was well known to do many times.[/quote]

one day you will listen to Jesus teaching and choose his way of knowing the |Truth from God, not from men... then scripture will make sense to you and you will understand the countless misunderstandings and great delusion [2Thess 2] of mankind by diverse religious traditions OF MEN...

Jesus told us to LEARN FROM God , else we cannot be saved :-

John 14:26 But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you.

John 3:5 Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.

so how do you even conceive that you follow Jesus when you ignoe what he says and choose the false way of convincing yourself that you know that destroys the many -Matt 7:13 through sin of the masses led by sinners in politics and religion of men ['kings' and their 'harlots', as scripture puts it]

read scripture enough to learn what Jesus taught if you want to follwo him, then do what he says, Love, no more sin abusing folks, and God will as promised TELL you the Truth so you KNOW , understanding the scripture and beyond what can be said in words of this world...

and understand why Jesus says the many will be deluded in mass religion -Rev 13:3-4 ... so learn from God if you want to be saved earlier , later helping save the many [Rev 7:9-10] in Jesus' kingdom come at last in the new earth, NOT in religion of men here but only to a few scattered saints now [Jesus figure? about two thousand alive at any one time, scattered worldwide doing what Jesus command3ed, seeking out the lost House of Israel - who indeed are not and never were Jews [House of judah], there are two Houses, two separate nations of Israel whom Jesus came to re-unite, but NOT now, not here :-

John 18:36 Jesus answered, My kingdom is not of this world