What is the purpose of going to church?

[prodromos]

a physical home is never called a church, all we read in the holy scripture ( which we are to try all doctrines by) is the "church which meets in their home" the church is the called out assembly of believers gathered n Christ. Jesus Christ is the head of that body. This is a spiritual house made up of living stones.

To miss this is to see only natural things and miss the spiritual.

The buildings Christians gathered in to worship God were known as the "ναος" or temple. Referring to the building as a church is relatively modern, whereby the building is identified by the Church gathered there.

I notice you have no response to the archaeological finds of the early centuries.

 

[Arsenios]

Acts 7:49
"47 But Solomon built him an house. 48 Howbeit the most High dwelleth not in temples made with hands; as saith the prophet, 49 Heaven is my throne, and earth is my footstool: what house will ye build me? saith the Lord: or what is the place of my rest? 50 Hath not my hand made all these things? 51 Ye stiffnecked and uncircumcised in heart and ears, ye do always resist the Holy Ghost: as your fathers did, so do ye."

and Jesus said,

John 2:19
"Jesus answered and said unto them, Destroy this temple, and in three days I will raise it up."

and we read

Mark 14:58
"We heard him say, I will destroy this temple that is made with hands, and within three days I will build another made without hands."

and "
2 Corinthians 5:1
For we know that if our earthly house of this tabernacle were dissolved, we have a building of God, an house not made with hands, eternal in the heavens."

2 Corinthians 5:2
For in this we groan, earnestly desiring to be clothed upon with our house which is from heaven:"

and

Hebrews 3:6
But Christ as a son over his own house; whose house are we, if we hold fast the confidence and the rejoicing of the hope firm unto the end."

and

1 Peter 2:5
"Ye also, as lively stones, are built up a spiritual house, an holy priesthood, to offer up spiritual sacrifices, acceptable to God by Jesus Christ."

1 Timothy 3:15
But if I tarry long, that thou mayest know how thou oughtest to behave thyself in the house of God, which is the church of the living God, the pillar and ground of the truth."

The House of God is Heavenly and Spiritual, no question, and is our abidence therein, even as we walk upon the earth... But the Ekklesia is the fleshly Body of Christ on earth, and we gather in earthly and Holy places of worship right here upon the earth... And these consecrated places we construct in imitation of the heavenly according to God's will...

Arsenios

 

[Arsenios]

The buildings Christians gathered in to worship God were known as the "ναuς" or temple.

Indeed they still are - The part of the Church building where the faithful gather to worship during the services of the Church is called the Nave [Naus in the Greek]... And that very term is a NAVAL term, meaning a ship, even a long-ship, a trireme, and in some words means admiral... It is where Baptism into Christ takes place...

For the Salvation of man was first effected through the waters of the Great Flood of Noah, which was effected by a Naus, a great ship, Noah's Ark... And even today, when we enter into the Church, we are entering the Ark of Salvation, the Naus, of the Ekklesia...

The Church building IS the Ark of Salvation OF the Ekklesia, the Body of Christ in the flesh...

Arsenios

 

[LoveofTruth]

They originally worshiped in the synagogues, until the Jews drove them out, then homes were re-purposed as houses of worship such as the example discovered in Dura Europos in Syria. Even before persecution of the Church ended with the Edict of Milan, there is evidence that Christians were building purpose built temples of worship as found in the recent discovery at Megiddo. After persecution ended there was an explosion of temple construction by Christians

No they early Christians are the temple of God they also met from house to house from the very start before any persecution as we read in Acts “having favour with all the people” this idea that they only went to homes because of persecution is easily corrected.

Also, just because the Jewish believers were still bound up under the law and the temple system for a while during the times of reformation doesn’t mean that that is where the church should meet nor to try and take an idea of that for today

The “ Dura Europos“ was simply a house for meeting where they may have knocked out a wall etc. This was much later in history and it is the earliest record as I know of a home for the church to gather historically.

Jesus told them even before the day of Pentecost to go to the house and wait .

Christians would not be allowed to worship Jesus in the temple and many Jews who believed in Jesus still were going into the temple all through Acts. Read Acts 21 they even went into the temple and sacrificed animals

 

[LoveofTruth]

Indeed they still are - The part of the Church building where the faithful gather to worship during the services of the Church is called the Nave [Naus in the Greek]... And that very term is a NAVAL term, meaning a ship, even a long-ship, a trireme, and in some words means admiral... It is where Baptism into Christ takes place...

For the Salvation of man was first effected through the waters of the Great Flood of Noah, which was effected by a Naus, a great ship, Noah's Ark... And even today, when we enter into the Church, we are entering the Ark of Salvation, the Naus, of the Ekklesia...

The Church building IS the Ark of Salvation OF the Ekklesia, the Body of Christ in the flesh...

Arsenios

No such thing as a “church building” in scripture the modern man made Babel buildings actually fight against the order and function of the true church which is the body of Christ.

In the true church all believers are connected as a part of the spiritual body of Christ where Jesus Christ is the head and where he works effectually in every part.

Yes believers are to bring their bodies into subjection and and as they crucufybthe flesh Christ can minister through them. And yes we are to physically gather. But this physical gathering and assembling is only the outward necessity to come and wait on the Lord who works in all believers by His Spirit.

To make the church a religious building of man or an organization etc is error

Noah’s Ark was simply a type of being in Christ where we are in rest. Noah’s mane means rest . They were crucified to the old workd and raised up into the heavenlies and brought to a new world. Peter talks of this spiritual salvation in 2 Peter 3:21 and he is not talking about water baptism for savation. But rather the immersion into Christ by the Spirit.

Here is a few good verses showing the spiritual inward aspect of the true church

“ Ephesians 4 - 15. But speaking the truth in love, may grow up into him in all things, which is the head, even Christ: 16. From whom the whole body fitly joined together and compacted by that which every joint supplieth, according to the effectual working in the measure of every part, maketh increase of the body unto the edifying of itself in love.”

 

[LoveofTruth]

The House of God is Heavenly and Spiritual, no question, and is our abidence therein, even as we walk upon the earth... But the Ekklesia is the fleshly Body of Christ on earth, and we gather in earthly and Holy places of worship right here upon the earth... And these consecrated places we construct in imitation of the heavenly according to God's will...

Arsenios

Sorry to say my friend, but you are fighting against the scriptures I gave and making up your own stuff there

The most high dwelleth NOT in temple made with hands

All believers are the temple

God works in every believer to will and to do and to make them perfect unto every good work

 

[LoveofTruth]

The People of God before Christ had God in Spirit...
And now we have God in the Flesh...
Why then do you seek to return to the pre-incarnate God?
And call the Body of Christ a Spiritual Body?

Ephesians 4 - 15. But speaking the truth in love, may grow up into him in all things, which is the head, even Christ: 16. From whom the whole body fitly joined together and compacted by that which every joint supplieth, according to the effectual working in the measure of every part, maketh increase of the body unto the edifying of itself in love. “

We don’t know Christ after the flesh now as Paul said and Jesyscsaid those who worship God must worship him in Spirit and in truth

Consider

“2 Corinthians 5 - 16. Wherefore henceforth know we no man after the flesh: yea, though we have known Christ after the flesh, yet now henceforth know we him no more.”

This would also include saying that literal bread becomes his flesh.

Yes we are of his flesh and bones in a sense Paul uses and hevthatvis joined to the Lird is one spirit but Paul still say we don’t know him after the flesh.

To be the body of Christ is to have Jesus Christcas the head of that body (not s man)!wecate a spiritual house as scripture teaches and yes we live in the spirit and walk after the spirit we have no confidence in the flesh. Though we are in these corruptible bodies for now we wait for the redemption of them one day. In the flesh dwelleth no good thing as scripture teaches.

“ Romans 8 - 5. For they that are after the flesh do mind the things of the flesh; but they that are after the Spirit the things of the Spirit. 6. For to be carnally minded is death; but to be spiritually minded is life and peace. 8. So then they that are in the flesh cannot please God. 9. But ye are not in the flesh, but in the Spirit, if so be that the Spirit of God dwell in you. Now if any man have not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of his. 10. And if Christ be in you, the body is dead because of sin; but the Spirit is life because of righteousness. 12. Therefore, brethren, we are debtors, not to the flesh, to live after the flesh. 13. For if ye live after the flesh, ye shall die: but if ye through the Spirit do mortify the deeds of the body, ye shall live. 14. For as many as are led by the Spirit of God, they are the sons of God.”

 

[LoveofTruth]

These are the Churches the Ekklesia has erected

This one statement shows the confusion of your entire argument. The Ekklesia is the church when you use the word “churches” here you are referring to man made buildings that are “erected” tradition that makes the word of God of no effect. The church is the body of Christ the word “church” in scripture is the word “ekklesia”. To make the word “churches “ refer to something the church erects is confusion and error . Can’t you see this?

To me, when anyone calls a man made building the church, they lie and confound scripture and are seeking to build another church that Christ is not building. Jesus said he would build his church and the gates of hell would not prevail against it but a man made Bebel building taken from pagan designs with altars and steeples is not the church he is building. Those buildings can break down catch fire be destroyed but this does not happen to his body in that way.

If I was to examine the order and function of your church we would see many things that fight against the commands of God clearly shown from scripture.

And I believe in the faith handed down by the apostles and the biblical record given of this and the order of the church as well in holy scripture. I put holy scripture against all and any who walk after man made forms and traditions and that contradict the scripture.

I also do not call the so called “church fathers” equal to the apostolic faith once delivered to the saints and I do not put men above that which is written.

 

[Arsenios]

The most high dwelleth NOT in a temple made with hands

Matt 21:13 And (Jesus) said unto them, "It is written:
'My house shall be called the house of prayer...'
but ye have made it a den of thieves."

Whose house was Jesus referring to in this passage?

a - Jesus' House
b - The Ekklesia
c - Someone else's House

People came to that House to see the Power and the Glory of God...

Are you saying that the Most High did NOT dwell in God's House on earth constructed by His Servants?

Arsenios

 

[Arsenios]

These are the Churches the Ekklesia has erected

This one statement shows the confusion of your entire argument.

This sounds serious!

The Ekklesia is the church.

Would it have helped you any if I had said the Church Buildings, instead of Churches?

When you use the word “churches” here you are referring to man made buildings that are “erected”

Yes, they are erected and consecrated to God by the Ekklesia... We have been doing so for 2000 years now, and counting... We build buildings consecrated to God...

(Your) tradition that makes the word of God of no effect.

So we should burn Churches now???

Seems a tad silly to me...

The church is the body of Christ the word “church” in scripture is the word “ekklesia”.

Did you miss the word/term Naus [eg Nave] ??

To make the word “churches “ refer to something the church erects is confusion and error . Can’t you see this?

It seems an obsessive quibble to my little pea brain...

To me, when anyone calls a man made building the church, they lie and confound scripture and are seeking to build another church that Christ is not building.

'Tis a rant, no question!

Have a blessed Easter, my Brother!

Arsenios

 

[LoveofTruth]

Matt 21:13 And (Jesus) said unto them, "It is written:
'My house shall be called the house of prayer...'
but ye have made it a den of thieves."

Whose house was Jesus referring to in this passage?

a - Jesus' House
b - The Ekklesia
c - Someone else's House

People came to that House to see the Power and the Glory of God...

Are you saying that the Most High did NOT dwell in God's House on earth constructed by His Servants?

Arsenios

Hello again,

I can answer much more in-depth later Lord willing at a better time.

But sad to say that you are doing the classical error that all the cults do by trying to put one scripture against other scriptures and thinking you will chose one .

Jesus is not talking about what you are talking about

 

[prodromos]

But sad to say that you are doing the classical error that all the cults do by trying to put one scripture against other scriptures and thinking you will chose one .

Seems to me that this is what you are doing.

 

[Arsenios]

Hello again,

You can sure call me Arsenios - It is my name...

I can answer much more in-depth later Lord willing at a better time.

Take whatever time you like or need...

The simple fact is that we build Churches consecrated to God, and in this we do not shrink back... We have been doing so for 2000 years now and counting... Our Communion is the second largest Christian assembly on earth... And for this you are accusing me of engaging in cultish behavior, as you say next:

You are doing the classical error that all the cults do

And the problem with pointing an accusing finger at the other guy is that there are those other three fingers pointing right back at the finger-pointer...

by trying to put one scripture against other scriptures and thinking you will chose one

.I am a member of the Ekklesia that scripted the NT Scriptures - So I affirm ALL the Scriptures - I never pit one against the other... When two apparently contradict, I affirm both... Seeing fault in my understanding, not in the written...

Jesus is not talking about what you are talking about

He was talking about His House being a House of Prayer, and in this, He affirms the existence of His House - We build such Houses, consecrated to God... For the life of me, I cannot see why you have such a big problem with this...

Maybe this will help:
What confessional Church do you attend?

Arsenios

 

[Arsenios]

Dear @LoveofTruth

1 That which was from the beginning,
which we have heard,
which we have seen with our eyes,
which we have looked upon,
and our hands have handled,
concerning the Word of Life--

2 That Life was manifested,
and we have seen,
and are bearing witness,
and declaring to you
that Eternal Life
Which was with the Father
and was manifested to us--

3 that which we have seen and heard
we are declaring unto you,
that you also may have Communion with us;
and truly our Communion is with the Father
and with His Son Jesus Christ.

And these things we write to you
that your joy may be full.

Paul writes much the same:
"We have the Mind of Christ..."

Communion is koinonia - It means common mind... It is one mind, where mind is nous, and the nous is not intellectual brain activity in concepts and thoughts, but is the faculty of the human soul in the puurified heart that "sees" [know directly] God... Regarding this kind of knowing, Paul writes:
"We are holding the Mystery of the Faith in a purified conscience..."

So that the Way to have Life Eternal is to have Communion with the Apostles who have Communion with the Father and with His Son, Jesus Christ...

You see, that Life is discipled by the Apostolic Ekklesia - even in Church Buildings...

Koino Nia means common mind - a Union-With - Not minds, but the Mind of Christ... The Nous of Christ, Who IS our Salvation... That our Joy may be Full...

It is the Saints that bear witness by experience and disciple us who do not yet have direct experience of this Life of the Word of God, and this first chapter in 1 John clearly tells us that it is this koinonia with those who have touched and held and experienced with their senses the Life that is Eternal that brings us to Salvation...

It is why Christ sent forth His Apostles to Disciple the Nations...

They did so, my Brother...

Christ didd not fail in them...

They did not fail in Christ...

Arsenios