• Welcome to Christian Forums
  1. Welcome to Christian Forums, a forum to discuss Christianity in a friendly surrounding.

    Your voice is missing! You will need to register to be able to join in fellowship with Christians all over the world.

    We hope to see you as a part of our community soon and God Bless!

  2. The forums in the Christian Congregations category are now open only to Christian members. Please review our current Faith Groups list for information on which faith groups are considered to be Christian faiths. Christian members please remember to read the Statement of Purpose threads for each forum within Christian Congregations before posting in the forum.
  3. Please note there is a new rule regarding the posting of videos. It reads, "Post a summary of the videos you post . An exception can be made for music videos.". Unless you are simply sharing music, please post a summary, or the gist, of the video you wish to share.
  4. There have been some changes in the Life Stages section involving the following forums: Roaring 20s, Terrific Thirties, Fabulous Forties, and Golden Eagles. They are changed to Gen Z, Millennials, Gen X, and Golden Eagles will have a slight change.
  5. CF Staff, Angels and Ambassadors; ask that you join us in praying for the world in this difficult time, asking our Holy Father to stop the spread of the virus, and for healing of all affected.

Featured What is the Mark of the Beast?

Discussion in 'General Theology' started by UnprofitableServant, Feb 20, 2019.

  1. UnprofitableServant

    UnprofitableServant ThyWillBeDone

    155
    +99
    United States
    Christian
    Single
    I've recently been interested in the prophecy on the 'mark of the beast' because of an article I watched a video based on about the Kenyan government wanting to give the Kenyan people a RFID card that will be used as the 'single source of truth'. This card will contain everything from how many people live with them, where there land is located, financial, medical records. It seems very similar to the RFID chip that people in Sweden are using to 'buy and sell'.

    What do people think? Is what's happening in Kenya proof that the RFID microchip implant is the mark of the beast? Or is it something else?

    Here is a link to the video if people are interested in watching it:
    bit.ly/MOTB666
     
    We teamed up with Faith Counseling. Can they help you today?
  2. Jonaitis

    Jonaitis Pilgrim

    +3,164
    United States
    Reformed
    Single
    US-Republican
    I don't read Revelation through a modern lens, isolating passages and applying it to certain events today. I look at Revelation as an inspired book, as any other book of Scripture, to convey truths that apply to every generation since the time it was written. I find it absurd to think that Revelation speaks about modern day countries, or about modern technology, when this would have not made sense to the seven churches that it was originally written to, nor to all the succeeding generations after them. Whatever Revelation is teaching us is applicable to everyone, and it teaches us all the same truths.

    I have personally seen some things written there that was specifically applicable to the original readers and the things that they were to suffer and experience, but also pertains things to teach all of us as well.

    I have never seen the mark of the beast as something actually physically or visible in any form, but rather some sort of spiritual distinction made between God's people and the world.

    Interestingly, it has been known and noted that the name 'Nero Caesar' transliterated in Hebrew from Greek comes to the number 666 if one uses the method of gematria (assigning a numerical value to a Hebrew name, word or phrase based on its letters). But, I am not so sure if this is a true fact.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
    • Winner Winner x 1
    • List
  3. mark kennedy

    mark kennedy Natura non facit saltum Supporter

    +7,256
    Calvinist
    Single
    US-Democrat
    The video looks like a typical conspiracy theory. The mark of the beast is basically, letter characters would double as numbers. So the idea is add up the letters and it will come to 666. I'm sure that's true but you have to understand, no one recieves this mark accidentally or against their will. Whats more you won't need this identifier to know who he is. In the wake of his rise he slaughters all who will not submit to him on a global scale. He is also said to blaspheme anything called god, unheard of blasphemy.
     
  4. ewq1938

    ewq1938 Well-Known Member Staff Member Purple Team - Moderator Supporter

    +4,891
    United States
    Christian
    Single
    US-Republican

    Rev 13:17 And that no man might buy or sell, save he that had the mark, or the name of the beast, or the number of his name.

    The mark is different than "the name of the beast, or the number of his name" The number of his name is 666, but his name and the mark are not 666.
     
  5. Pethesedzao

    Pethesedzao Well-Known Member

    772
    +309
    United Kingdom
    Charismatic
    Single
    It will be computer generated for sure. AI will be commonplace and technology will be greatly advanced.
     
  6. timewerx

    timewerx the village i--o--t--

    +5,027
    Christian Seeker
    Single
    It's just an electronic ID.

    I think the Mark of the Best has more to do with good 'ol "simple" money. You cannot buy nor sell without it too. You need to receive it on your arm (have money) or on the forehead (skills to make money / profit).

    Money has a number as well. And there's also a more obscure numeric symbol on it like the Hexagram with the US Dollar for example which represents the number 666. Other designs of money in many countries has the country's coat of arms and other designs which is occult / satanic in origin and originated with the Roman Empire.

    Jesus also made strong connection of money as a false god - Mammon. And many people worship money over our Sovereign Lord without them realizing it.

    The RFID implant chip is just another form of money. Just as evil as money but we've been using money since the beginning.

    It's how and where you spend money / resources is what only matters and what makes the difference and what sets you apart from unbelievers. Unbelievers would usually spend most of their money to themselves to establish good lives in this world instead of using their resources to help our brothers and sisters in desperate need of help.

    Why loving money is evil is for the most part, (the majority of money in the world) is being used for evil / malevolent / unlawful / unGodly purposes. Loving money is hatred / opposition / anti - God / anti-Christ - Luke 16:13.
     
    Last edited: Feb 20, 2019
  7. Lost4words

    Lost4words Jesus I Trust In You Supporter

    +6,248
    United Kingdom
    Catholic
    Single
    There is a big ugly dog that lives around the corner from me. When he goes out for his daily walk he definitely leaves his 'mark'...ewwwwww
     
  8. UnprofitableServant

    UnprofitableServant ThyWillBeDone

    155
    +99
    United States
    Christian
    Single
    I find it difficult to understand how the book of Revelation can't be applied to modern day technology or countries, when this whole revelation is depicting the return of Jesus that happens in the future.

    At least that is how I always understood it. To say that the prophecy had to be fulfilled back in the time of John doesn't seem consistent with other prophecies. For example, Daniel 9 depicting the Messiah being cut off. This happened almost 400 years after Daniel wrote this. So it seems that prophecies are made for the future not necessarily for the present.
     
  9. Jonaitis

    Jonaitis Pilgrim

    +3,164
    United States
    Reformed
    Single
    US-Republican
    I disagree, only parts of Revelation refers to the future, but much of it has already happened and is happening until the arrival of Christ's return. The passages that refer to the future are mainly the second coming, the resurrection, the judgment seat, and the new heaven and new earth. The rest, I have learned from more studied teachers on the subject, that much of the illustrations and depictions are spoken in symbols and types to convey what is happening between the Church and the World until the arrival of Christ (among other things). The message of Revelation is to encourage, not only the Seven Churches of Asia who were the original audience, but to all of us who struggle with the powers of darkness in this fallen world until the restoring of all things at the second coming of our Savior when he will be victorious over the enemy and bring his kingdom to consummation.

    Explain how the seven churches would have possibly grasped your interpretation when they read this in their churches? It makes no sense.
     
  10. Rubiks

    Rubiks proud libtard

    +2,181
    United States
    Christian
    Single
    The Greek word here is kharagma; a more accurate translation would be stamp or imprint.

    Most Bible scholars understand this to be referring to Roman coinage with Nero's face. Nero in gematria adds up to exactly 666 or 616 depending if you read his name in Greek or in Hebrew.

    [​IMG]
    Many ancients Jews were against using Roman coinage because it was perceived as going against God's command against idols/graven images.
     
  11. eleos1954

    eleos1954 God is Love Supporter

    +2,942
    United States
    Christian
    Single
    US-Others
    Rev 13:17 And that no man might buy or sell, save he that had the mark, or the name of the beast, or the number of his name.

    We know there is a battle going on between satan and god ... and that battle is over the truth of God and the lies of satan.

    no man might buy or sell - money (currencies) are controlled by governments.

    There will be a union or coalition of the two.

    There will be a prominent "religious system" come to power and it will be a false one ... but ... many people will be deceived. This power will be in unity with the government power.

    There is not a physical "mark" ... the mark are those who worship according to the false religious system.
     
  12. HTacianas

    HTacianas Well-Known Member

    +5,600
    United States
    Eastern Orthodox
    Single
    The "mark of the beast" was a letter certifying that a person had proven their loyalty to Rome by sacrificing and burning incense to the gods of Rome and to the emperor. You can see one here:

    Libellus - Wikipedia
     
    • Like Like x 1
    • Winner Winner x 1
    • List
  13. parousia70

    parousia70 I'm livin' in yesterday's tomorrow Supporter

    +3,238
    United States
    Catholic
    Married
    US-Others
    There are two identifiable "marks" in Revelation.

    The sealing of the 144,000 jews is accomplished by a mark in the forehead in parallel fashion to the MARK of the beast in the forehead. (see Rev. 9:4 and Rev. 7:2-8 and Rev 14:1). (NOTE: futurists are never consistent on this: if one is physical-literal then shouldn't both MARKS should be seen as physical-literal? Yet just ask a futurist who is the "computer chip manufacturer" today who is producing the "Mark of God," and they have no answer. However, they could speculate all day and night on which technology company is in cahoots with satan to produce his computer implant. I propose that Bill Gates is working on the "Mark-of-God chip implant" for the 144,000. )

    John for certain didn't have computer chips in mind at all when he wrote the passage. Rather, as in so many other parts of Revelation, he was quoting the Old Testament. The following passages should be carefully examined when discussing "the mark on the forehead or hand" that marks people for doom or salvation:

    Ez. Chapter 9 -- angels mark people for God's destruction of Jerusalem in 6th Century B.C.

    Deut 6:8, Deut 11:18, Exodus 13:9 -- God's marks commanded to be upon the head and hands of his people to show their faithfulness

    John's notions in his vision are related to Old Testament concepts -- not modern day conjectures that the MARK of the beast is to be thought of as some computer product.
     
  14. parousia70

    parousia70 I'm livin' in yesterday's tomorrow Supporter

    +3,238
    United States
    Catholic
    Married
    US-Others
    Revelation 1:1-3
    1 The Revelation of Jesus Christ, which God gave Him to show His servants—things which must shortly take place. And He sent and signified it by His angel to His servant John, 2 who bore witness to the word of God, and to the testimony of Jesus Christ, to all things that he saw. 3 Blessed is he who reads and those who hear the words of this prophecy, and keep those things which are written in it; for the time is near.

    Daniel was told TO seal his vision as it was for a long time and was far off.
    In Contrast, John was told NOT to seal His vision for it was Near and about to take place.

    In what manner of language and understanding is 400 years "a long time and far off" BUT 2000 years is "near and about to take place"?
     
    Last edited: Feb 20, 2019
  15. ewq1938

    ewq1938 Well-Known Member Staff Member Purple Team - Moderator Supporter

    +4,891
    United States
    Christian
    Single
    US-Republican

    The mark doesn't exist yet. The AC has to arise and cause people to make an image of the beast and then he will make it come alive, and only after that does he issue out the mark and it's not said to be on paper but in the right hand or the forehead. A letter of the distant past doesn't match the mark of the beast in any way.
     
  16. HTacianas

    HTacianas Well-Known Member

    +5,600
    United States
    Eastern Orthodox
    Single
    All of those things existed at the time of the early Church. Pliny wrote in a letter to Trajan the procedure he used in trying Christians:

    "I interrogated these as to whether they were Christians; those who confessed I interrogated a second and a third time, threatening them with punishment; those who persisted I ordered executed."

    "Others named by the informer declared that they were Christians, but then denied it, asserting that they had been but had ceased to be, some three years before, others many years, some as much as twenty-five years. They all worshipped your image and the statues of the gods, and cursed Christ."

    All of the events of the Revelation that you have mentioned can be found in Church history.
     
    Last edited: Feb 24, 2019
  17. ewq1938

    ewq1938 Well-Known Member Staff Member Purple Team - Moderator Supporter

    +4,891
    United States
    Christian
    Single
    US-Republican
    No, none of them yet exist as I explained in the last post.
     
  18. UnprofitableServant

    UnprofitableServant ThyWillBeDone

    155
    +99
    United States
    Christian
    Single
    I will like to point you to a very important part of the Revelation that will clear this all up.

    Revelation 1:1, "This is the revelation of Jesus Christ, which God gave Him to show His servants what must soon come to pass." Notice that the revelation is for God's servants. Therefore, it can be understood by only those that follow Jesus.

    In regard to your question, they would have already been aware of the "root of all evil" and were completely free from it. If we read what Jesus taught in Matthew 6:24, "No one can serve two masters: Either he will hate the one and love the other, or he will be devoted to the one and despise the other. You cannot serve both God and money. "

    We see here that Jesus commands his followers not to work for money. Therefore, all the churches that would have received this letter would have been aware of the fact that the love of money is the root of ALL evil. This would have reinforced the thought that staying away from working for money is what we need to do in order to reject the Mark of the Beast.

    Your point that the seven churches couldn't grasp my interpretation is only valid if we assume that the early Christians were meant to grasp it. Many time prophecy are given but are not understood until it is fulfilled, or the warning signs that preclude the fulfillment of the prophecy is happening. To say that our interpretation of what Revelation says has to be done in the context of the first century christians contradicts your point about some of revelation is for the future generation. We can't pick and choose, rather we should interpret as the scriptures reveal; at the same time lining up our interpretation with Jesus and his testimony (which is the spirit of prophecy Revelation 19:10).

    I'll leave it here for now.

    Look forward to your response.

    Peace be to everyone who reads this
     
  19. UnprofitableServant

    UnprofitableServant ThyWillBeDone

    155
    +99
    United States
    Christian
    Single
    Just want to clarify. Are you saying that all of the Revelation happened about 2000 years ago?

    In peace
     
  20. parousia70

    parousia70 I'm livin' in yesterday's tomorrow Supporter

    +3,238
    United States
    Catholic
    Married
    US-Others
    It certainly had PRIMARY prophetic application to the original receivers.
    It, of course, has pastoral application for all peoples of all times.

    To clarify, are you saying the original receivers, the very people to whom the 7 letters were directly addressed and first delivered to, we NOT the people the letters were meant for?
    Are you saying those people are to be REMOVED from ANY application of the book?
     
Loading...