• Welcome to Christian Forums
  1. Welcome to Christian Forums, a forum to discuss Christianity in a friendly surrounding.

    Your voice is missing! You will need to register to be able to join in fellowship with Christians all over the world.

    We hope to see you as a part of our community soon and God Bless!

  2. The forums in the Christian Congregations category are now open only to Christian members. Please review our current Faith Groups list for information on which faith groups are considered to be Christian faiths. Christian members please remember to read the Statement of Purpose threads for each forum within Christian Congregations before posting in the forum.

What is the "abomination of desolation"?

Discussion in 'New Adventist / Bible Study' started by reddogs, Aug 5, 2017.

  1. reddogs

    reddogs Contributor Supporter

    +184
    SDA
    Married
    US-Others
    We see this verse in Daniel 9:27 (KJV)

    "27 And he shall confirm the covenant with many for one week: and in the midst of the week he shall cause the sacrifice and the oblation to cease, and for the overspreading of abominations he shall make it desolate, even until the consummation, and that determined shall be poured upon the desolate."

    Christ refers to it in Matthew 24:15(KJV)

    "15 When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place, (whoso readeth, let him understand:)"

    The Jewish Rabbis have pushed the view that it was when in 167 B.C. a Greek ruler by the name of Antiochus Epiphanies set up an altar to Zeus over the altar of burnt offerings in the Jewish temple in Jerusalem. He also sacrificed a pig on the altar in the Temple in Jerusalem.

    But it doesn't fit, as Jesus declared it looking forward in time, so was it the destruction of Jerusalem in 70 AD. And will it be a event turning the temple in Jerusalem into a place of worship for the Antichrist or the false Christ, which is truly an “abomination.” So what is the abomination of desolation.
     
    We teamed up with Faith Counseling. Can they help you today?
  2. reddogs

    reddogs Contributor Supporter

    +184
    SDA
    Married
    US-Others
    Lets start with Matthew 24:

    "15 When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place, (whoso readeth, let him understand:)16 Then let them which be in Judaea flee into the mountains:17 Let him which is on the housetop not come down to take any thing out of his house:18 Neither let him which is in the field return back to take his clothes.19 And woe unto them that are with child, and to them that give suck in those days!20 But pray ye that your flight be not in the winter, neither on the sabbath day:21 For then shall be great tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be" (Matthew 24: 15-21).

    When Jesus put the words “when you see the ‘abomination of desolation’” with “flee to the mountains,” he speaks of a terrible event, and we see it when Jerusalem is taken by the Romans in AD 70. But Jesus was also speaking of the time of the end. The disciples actually asked a question pertaining to the temple and also to the end times.

    “When will these things be, and what will be the sign of your coming and of the close of the age?” (Matthew 24:3).

    Ellen White speaks of two fulfillments of the abomination of desolation, the first was the literal siege of Jerusalem which began in 68 A.D. and the armies of Rome temporarily abandoned that siege, signaling Christians to flee the city. When the armies of Rome returned in 70 A.D., the temple was burned and Jerusalem destroyed, but the Christians had fled so none of them perished in the second Roman siege. This was the desolation referred to in Luke 21:20-21. It was the "type" or initial fulfillment. The second or "antitype" fulfillment which Christ also speaks to, is the answer to the question asked by the disciples with regard to the second coming: SOP tells us “The Saviour's prophecy concerning the visitation of judgments upon Jerusalem is to have another fulfillment, of which that terrible desolation was but a faint shadow. In the fate of the chosen city we may behold the doom of a world that has rejected God's mercy and trampled upon His law. Dark are the records of human misery that earth has witnessed during its long centuries of crime. The heart sickens, and the mind grows faint in contemplation. Terrible have been the results of rejecting the authority of Heaven. But a scene yet darker is presented in the revelations of the future.” {GC 36}

    Here is from my notes I put into Wikipedia as I am a editor.

    :According to Roman historian Cassio Dio, after the Temple was destroyed in 70 AD the worship overseen by the High Priest ceased. The site was covered over with rubble and a pagan temple dedicated to Jupiter set up on the Temple mount when Hadrian became Caesar (117 - 138 AD). Hadrian installed on the mount, two statues which was seem as idol worship to the Jews, one of Jupiter, another of himself. Hadrian, not only set up a Temple of Jupiter as a center of worship to Jupiter, but expelled the Jews from Jerusalem altogether, only allowing them to come in the city on the fast of Tisha B'av, the ninth day of the lunar month Av, a day of mourning for the destruction of the First and the Second Jewish Temple. This appears to have caused a second Jewish revolt with the intent of recapturing Jerusalem and reconstruction of the Temple, however Rome sent six full legions with auxiliaries and elements from up to six additional legions, which finally managed to crush the revolt. The pagan temple appears to have been rebuilt in the early Umayyad period: as the al-Aqsa Mosque, the Dome of the Rock which sits on the site today.
     
  3. reddogs

    reddogs Contributor Supporter

    +184
    SDA
    Married
    US-Others
    SOP states “When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place, (whoso readeth, let him understand:) then let them which be in Judaea flee into the mountains. Matt. 24:15, 16.

    The time is not far distant, when, like the early disciples, we shall be forced to seek a refuge in desolate and solitary places. As the siege of Jerusalem by the Roman armies was the signal for flight to the Judean Christians, so the assumption of power on the part of our nation [the United States] in the decree enforcing the papal sabbath will be a warning to us. It will then be time to leave the large cities, preparatory to leaving the smaller ones for retired homes in secluded places among the mountains.

    For years I have been given special light that we are not to center our work in the cities. The turmoil and confusion that fill these cities, the conditions brought about by the labor unions and the strikes, would prove a great hindrance to our work. Men are seeking to bring those engaged in the different trades under bondage to certain unions. This is not God's planning, but the planning of a power that we should in no wise acknowledge. God's Word is fulfilling; the wicked are binding themselves up in bundles ready to be burned.

    The trades unions and confederacies of the world are a snare. Keep out of them, and away from them, brethren. Have nothing to do with them. Because of these unions and confederacies, it will soon be very difficult for our institutions to carry on their work in the cities. . . . Educate our people to get out of the cities into the country, where they can obtain a small piece of land, and make a home for themselves and their children. . . .

    Erelong there will be such strife and confusion in the cities, that those who wish to leave them will not be able.

    We are not to locate ourselves where we will be forced into close relations with those who do not honor God. . . . A crisis is soon to come in regard to the observance of Sunday. . . .

    The Sunday party is strengthening itself in its false claims, and this will mean oppression to those who determine to keep the Sabbath of the Lord. . . .

    If in the providence of God we can secure places away from the cities, the Lord would have us do this. There are troublous times before us.”
    From Maranatha - Page 181
     
  4. reddogs

    reddogs Contributor Supporter

    +184
    SDA
    Married
    US-Others
    Now Christ points to what Daniel gives, and we see in Daniel 11:31: “31 And arms shall stand on his part, and they shall pollute the sanctuary of strength, and shall take away the daily sacrifice, and they shall place the abomination that maketh desolate.” Daniel 11:31(KJV)

    This shows its tied to the relationship between God and His people and the accompanying worship services, and then the detestable introduction of idolatry. Solomon built for God what’s probably been the most magnificent sanctuary on earth. Yet Solomon also added worship places for his wives’ false gods in the start of what the Bible refers to as an “abomination.” ( 1 Kings 11 and 2 Kings 23.) Putting another god in place of the true God is abominable, it is a detestable act which leads to desolation when Gods protecting power is withdrawn.

    Thus the “Desolation” is the result of what you get without God. Jesus warned of what was to come in His rebukes to the religious leaders, because they had persistently led the people away from God to the point of rejecting God. He told them of this coming judgment with these words: “38 Behold, your house is left unto you desolate.” (Matthew 23:38 (KJV)). John wrote of their rejection of Jesus: “11 He [Jesus] came unto his own, and his own received him not.” (John 1:11, KJV).
     
  5. reddogs

    reddogs Contributor Supporter

    +184
    SDA
    Married
    US-Others
    Now before the destruction of Solomon's Temple the Jews had been given a warning by Ezekiel:

    "Thus saith the Lord GOD; This is Jerusalem: I have set it in the midst of the nations and countries that are round about her.6 And she hath changed my judgments into wickedness more than the nations, and my statutes more than the countries that are round about her: for they have refused my judgments and my statutes, they have not walked in them.7 Therefore thus saith the Lord GOD; Because ye multiplied more than the nations that are round about you, and have not walked in my statutes, neither have kept my judgments, neither have done according to the judgments of the nations that are round about you;8 Therefore thus saith the Lord GOD; Behold, I, even I, am against thee, and will execute judgments in the midst of thee in the sight of the nations.9 And I will do in thee that which I have not done, and whereunto I will not do any more the like, because of all thine abominations.” Ezekiel 5:5-9 (KJV)

    “11 Wherefore, as I live, saith the Lord God; Surely, because thou hast defiled my sanctuary with all thy detestable things, and with all thine abominations, therefore will I also diminish thee; neither shall mine eye spare, neither will I have any pity.” Ezekiel 5:11 (KJV)

    “1And the word of the LORD came unto me, saying,2 Son of man, set thy face toward the mountains of Israel, and prophesy against them,3 And say, Ye mountains of Israel, hear the word of the Lord GOD; Thus saith the Lord GOD to the mountains, and to the hills, to the rivers, and to the valleys; Behold, I, even I, will bring a sword upon you, and I will destroy your high places.4 And your altars shall be desolate, and your images shall be broken: and I will cast down your slain men before your idols.5 And I will lay the dead carcases of the children of Israel before their idols; and I will scatter your bones round about your altars.6 In all your dwellingplaces the cities shall be laid waste, and the high places shall be desolate; that your altars may be laid waste and made desolate, and your idols may be broken and cease, and your images may be cut down, and your works may be abolished.7 And the slain shall fall in the midst of you, and ye shall know that I am the LORD.8 Yet will I leave a remnant, that ye may have some that shall escape the sword among the nations, when ye shall be scattered through the countries.9 And they that escape of you shall remember me among the nations whither they shall be carried captives, because I am broken with their whorish heart, which hath departed from me, and with their eyes, which go a whoring after their idols: and they shall lothe themselves for the evils which they have committed in all their abominations.10 And they shall know that I am the LORD, and that I have not said in vain that I would do this evil unto them.11 Thus saith the Lord GOD; Smite with thine hand, and stamp with thy foot, and say, Alas for all the evil abominations of the house of Israel! for they shall fall by the sword, by the famine, and by the pestilence.” Ezekiel 6:1-11 (KJV)

    The abomination they were doing was laid out clearly for them:

    "5 Then said he unto me, Son of man, lift up thine eyes now the way toward the north. So I lifted up mine eyes the way toward the north, and behold northward at the gate of the altar this image of jealousy in the entry.
    6 He said furthermore unto me, Son of man, seest thou what they do? even the great abominations that the house of Israel committeth here, that I should go far off from my sanctuary? but turn thee yet again, and thou shalt see greater abominations.
    7 And he brought me to the door of the court; and when I looked, behold a hole in the wall.
    8 Then said he unto me, Son of man, dig now in the wall: and when I had digged in the wall, behold a door.
    9 And he said unto me, Go in, and behold the wicked abominations that they do here.
    10 So I went in and saw; and behold every form of creeping things, and abominable beasts, and all the idols of the house of Israel, pourtrayed upon the wall round about.
    11 And there stood before them seventy men of the ancients of the house of Israel, and in the midst of them stood Jaazaniah the son of Shaphan, with every man his censer in his hand; and a thick cloud of incense went up.
    12 Then said he unto me, Son of man, hast thou seen what the ancients of the house of Israel do in the dark, every man in the chambers of his imagery? for they say, the Lord seeth us not; the Lord hath forsaken the earth.
    13 He said also unto me, Turn thee yet again, and thou shalt see greater abominations that they do.
    14 Then he brought me to the door of the gate of the Lord's house which was toward the north; and, behold, there sat women weeping for Tammuz.
    15 Then said he unto me, Hast thou seen this, O son of man? turn thee yet again, and thou shalt see greater abominations than these.
    16 And he brought me into the inner court of the Lord's house, and, behold, at the door of the temple of the Lord, between the porch and the altar, were about five and twenty men, with their backs toward the temple of the Lord, and their faces toward the east; and they worshipped the sun toward the east.
    17 Then he said unto me, Hast thou seen this, O son of man? Is it a light thing to the house of Judah that they commit the abominations which they commit here? for they have filled the land with violence, and have returned to provoke me to anger: and, lo, they put the branch to their nose.
    18 Therefore will I also deal in fury: mine eye shall not spare, neither will I have pity: and though they cry in mine ears with a loud voice, yet will I not hear them." Ezekiel 8:5-18 (KJV)
     
  6. reddogs

    reddogs Contributor Supporter

    +184
    SDA
    Married
    US-Others
    The desolation came when Nebuchadnezzar laid siege to Jerusalem, in 587 BC. After the fall of Jerusalem, Jerusalem was plundered, and Solomon's Temple was destroyed. Most of the elite including Daniel were taken into captivity in Babylon and the city was razed to the ground and left desolate. On hearing this news, many of the Jews who were in Moab, Ammon, Edom, and in other countries returned to Judah. However the governor installed by Nebuchadnezzar was assassinated and the few Jews that had remained and those who had returned then fled to Egypt for safety. Thus the utter desolation from the abomination, for Jerusalem.

    This prophetic event of the 'First Abomination' is found in the first two verses of Daniel. "In the third year of the reign of Jehoiakim king of Judah came Nebuchadnezzar king of Babylon unto Jerusalem, and beseiged it. And the Lord gave Jehoiakim king of Judah into his hand, with part of the vessels of the house of God: which he carried into the land of Shinar to the house of his god; and he brought the vessels into the treasure house of his god" (Daniel 1:1,2). Here Daniel provides a concise historical background to what he is writing on, and it reveals the abomination of desolation was existent in his time and led to Jerusalem's captivity. Daniel reveals the reason the Jewish kings fell to Babylon. "Jehoiakim was twenty and five years old when he began to reign... and he did that which was evil in the sight of the Lord his God." It was because of Jehoiakim's iniquity that God allowed him to be taken captive.

    The significant feature of this is that Jehoiakim's evil deeds are described this way: "Now the rest of the acts of Jehoiakim, and his abominations which he did, and that which was found in him, behold, they are written in the book of the kings of Israel and Judah: and Jehoiachin his son reigned in his stead" (2 Chronicles 36:5-8). It was specifically the abominations of Jehoiakim that led him and Jerusalem to lose God's protection and fall to Nebuchadnezzar.

    Scripture tells us his sons also followed in his abomination, as Jehoiachin did "that which was evil in the sight of the Lord." Consequently he too was taken captive to Babylon, and "Zedekiah his brother" was placed as king over Judah and Jerusalem and not only did Zedekiah turn out to be just as evil as his two predecessors, but "moreover all the chief of the priests, and the people, transgressed very much after all the abominations of the heathen" (v. 12-14). God's political and religious leaders, as well as the people, adopted heathen ways as their own and away from God and true worship at the expense of God's revealed truth. Notice the people "transgressed very much after all the abominations of the heathen; and polluted the house of the Lord which he had hallowed in Jerusalem" (v. 14). These abominations were standing in God's consecrated holy place, the "house of the Lord." The religious leaders of the day had purposefully led the people to adopt heathen worship practices and incorporated them into their worship of God.
    In substituting for God's commandments the traditions of men, the leaders of God's heritage provoked his wrath. The people rejected God's calls to repentance and reformation and were left to reap the consequences. "Therefore, he brought upon them the king of the Chaldees, who slew their young men with the sword in the house of their sanctuary" (v. 17).

    This judgment was felt not only by the people but in the complete destruction of the city and sanctuary (v. 19). This all was done "To fulfill the word of the Lord by the mouth of Jeremiah, until the land had enjoyed her sabbaths: for as long as she lay desolate she kept sabbath to fulfill threescore and ten years" (v. 21). The result of God's people practicing the religious abominations of the heathen was the desolation of their land, city and sanctuary for 70 years.

    SOP tells us how the ark of the covenant was taken out of the first Temple when Jerusalem was given a respite, “In the ninth year of Zedekiah's reign “Nebuchadnezzar king of Babylon came, he, and all his host, against Jerusalem.” 2 Kings 25:1. The outlook for Judah was hopeless. “Behold, I am against thee,” the Lord Himself declared through Ezekiel. “I will pour out Mine indignation upon thee, I will blow against thee in the fire of My wrath, and deliver thee into the hand of brutish men, and skillful to destroy.” Ezekiel 21:3, 31. SS 236.1
    The Egyptians endeavored to come to the rescue, and the Chaldeans, in order to keep them back, abandoned for a time their siege. Hope sprang up in the heart of Zedekiah, and he sent a messenger to Jeremiah, asking him to pray to God in behalf of the Hebrew nation. SS 236.2
    The prophet's fearful answer was: “Do not deceive yourselves ... . For even if you should defeat the whole army of Chaldeans who are fighting against you, and there remained of them only wounded men, every man in his tent, they would rise up and burn this city with fire.” Jeremiah 37:9, 10, RSV. The remnant of Judah were to go into captivity and learn through adversity the lessons they had refused to learn under more favorable circumstances. SS 236.3
    Among the righteous still in Jerusalem were some who determined to place beyond the reach of ruthless hands the sacred ark containing the tables of stone on which had been traced the Decalogue. With mourning they secreted the ark in a cave. It was hidden from Israel SS 236.4

    SOP continues “Jeremiah 25:1-3. And now, “thus saith the Lord of hosts; Because ye have not heard My words, behold, I will send and take all the families of the north, ... and Nebuchadnezzar the king of Babylon, My servant, and will bring them against this land ... . This whole land shall become a desolation, and an astonishment; and these nations shall serve the king of Babylon seventy years.” Verses 8-11. SS 223
     
  7. reddogs

    reddogs Contributor Supporter

    +184
    SDA
    Married
    US-Others
    So when Daniel wrote about the “abomination of desolation,” the sanctuary in Jerusalem had recently been destroyed with the entire city and even the wall of the city were demolished, the place was left desolate.

    But Daniel also wrote about the sanctuary being restored:

    "25 Know therefore and understand, that from the going forth of the commandment to restore and to build Jerusalem unto the Messiah the Prince shall be seven weeks, and threescore and two weeks: the street shall be built again, and the wall, even in troublous times."Daniel 9:25King James Version (KJV)

    We see this when the Jewish exiles returned to Jerusalem following a decree from Cyrus the Great (Ezra 1:1–4, 2 Chron 36:22–23), construction started at the original site of Solomon's Temple, which had remained a devastated heap during the approximately 70 years of captivity (Dan. 9:1–2).

    After some local opposition the building resumed in 521 BCE under Darius the Great (Ezra 5) and was completed during the sixth year of his reign (516 BCE), with the temple dedication taking place the following year.

    Now by the time Jesus issued His warning about “the ‘abomination of desolation,’ spoken of by Daniel the prophet,” Antiochus IV Epiphanes had reigned (168 BCE), siding with the Hellenized Jews in Jerusalem to consolidate his empire and to strengthen his hold over the region, and tried to Hellenize the Jewish people which led to a revolt. But, when Jesus spoke of an “abomination of desolation,” it was more than a century after the Maccabean Revolt, so that certainly was not the “the ‘abomination of desolation’ He was indicating.
     
  8. reddogs

    reddogs Contributor Supporter

    +184
    SDA
    Married
    US-Others
    After their release from Babylonian captivity and rebuilding the city and temple, the Jewish leaders erected a mountain of rules and regulations designed to protect them from repeating the sins that had led to their bondage. The fourth commandment's seventh-day Sabbath became a special object of amendment. The Jews reasoned that since it was transgression of the Sabbath that led to their captivity, they needed to define in minute detail how the Sabbath should be kept.

    Over 500 rules concerning Sabbath keeping eventually resulted. Some of these Sabbath laws were as ridiculous as this: one could not leave an egg in the sun on the Sabbath because the sun might cook it, and cooking on the Sabbath was a violation of the fourth commandment. Of course, this only resulted in a system of absolute legalism and also the people began to believe that favor with God depended on how well they obeyed the traditions of their elders.

    Ultimately the people were led full circle to disobedience again. Jesus comments that in spite of their apparent religiosity they were still breaking God's law even as their forefathers had during Isaiah's and Daniel's day. "Well hath Isaiah prophesied of you hypocrites, as it is written, This people honoreth me with their lips, but their heart is far from me. Howbeit in vain do they worship me, teaching for doctrines the commandments of men. For laying aside the commandment of God, ye hold the tradition of men... full well ye reject the commandment of God, that ye may keep your own tradition... making the word of God of none effect through your tradition, which ye have delivered" (Mark 7:6-13). Once again the people found themselves immersed in vain and rebellious worship.


    Now look at Haggai 3:3-9:
    “3 Who is left among you that saw this house in her first glory? and how do ye see it now? is it not in your eyes in comparison of it as nothing?
    4 Yet now be strong, O Zerubbabel, saith the LORD; and be strong, O Joshua, son of Josedech, the high priest; and be strong, all ye people of the land, saith the LORD, and work: for I am with you, saith the LORD of hosts:
    5 According to the word that I covenanted with you when ye came out of Egypt, so my spirit remaineth among you: fear ye not.
    6 For thus saith the LORD of hosts; Yet once, it is a little while, and I will shake the heavens, and the earth, and the sea, and the dry land;
    7 And I will shake all nations, and the desire of all nations shall come: and I will fill this house with glory, saith the LORD of hosts.
    8 The silver is mine, and the gold is mine, saith the LORD of hosts.
    9 The glory of this latter house shall be greater than of the former, saith the LORD of hosts: and in this place will I give peace, saith the LORD of hosts.” Haggai 3:3-9.

    SOP continues on this, “But the second temple had not equaled the first in magnificence; nor was it hallowed by those visible tokens of the divine presence which pertained to the first temple. There was no manifestation of supernatural power to mark its dedication. No cloud of glory was seen to fill the newly erected sanctuary. No fire from heaven descended to consume the sacrifice upon its altar. The Shekinah no longer abode between the cherubim in the most holy place; the ark, the mercy seat, and the tables of the testimony were not to be found therein. No voice sounded from heaven to make known to the inquiring priest the will of Jehovah.
    For centuries the Jews had vainly endeavored to show wherein the promise of God given by Haggai had been fulfilled; yet pride and unbelief blinded their minds to the true meaning of the prophet's words. The second temple was not honored with the cloud of Jehovah's glory, but with the living presence of One in whom dwelt the fullness of the Godhead bodily--who was God Himself manifest in the flesh. The "Desire of all nations" had indeed come to His temple when the Man of Nazareth taught and healed in the sacred courts. In the presence of Christ, and in this only, did the second temple exceed the first in glory. But Israel had put from her the proffered Gift of heaven. With the humble Teacher who had that day passed out from its golden gate, the glory had forever departed from the temple. Already were the Saviour's words fulfilled: "Your house is left unto you desolate." Matthew 23:38. (GC CHAPTER 1 pg 18-20)

    Because Israel rejected the Messiah they lost their place as God's favored people. Jesus predicted this would take place by saying, "The kingdom of God shall be taken from you, and given to a nation bringing forth the fruits thereof" (Matthew 21:43).
     
  9. reddogs

    reddogs Contributor Supporter

    +184
    SDA
    Married
    US-Others
    Again as in Ezekiel, the 'abomination' was the rejection of the people of true worship to God. They had brought in their 'traditions' and strict rules on worship on the Sabbath that kept the people from God and wiped out the basis of Gods law, love. It laid a yoke of legalism that would not allow Christ to heal or the disciples to eat as they walked through a wheat field, or a woman's years of suffering be taken away. Even though their apostasy expressed itself in legalism instead of laxness, it was still based on the same principle upon which all pagan religions are based - that man can save himself by his own works. Jesus rebuked this false religious system they had built and called it an abomination. "15 And he said unto them, Ye are they which justify yourselves before men; but God knoweth your hearts: for that which is highly esteemed among men is abomination in the sight of God." (Luke 16:15).

    Jesus condemned them for their abominations on numerous occasions, we see it when He cleansed the temple of the abomination they had created inside it. On these times He expressed His anger at the desecration of His holy place.

    We see a direct connection to the coming desolation in Luke 19:32-46:

    "33 And as they were loosing the colt, the owners thereof said unto them, Why loose ye the colt?
    34 And they said, The Lord hath need of him.
    35 And they brought him to Jesus: and they cast their garments upon the colt, and they set Jesus thereon.
    36 And as he went, they spread their clothes in the way.
    37 And when he was come nigh, even now at the descent of the mount of Olives, the whole multitude of the disciples began to rejoice and praise God with a loud voice for all the mighty works that they had seen;
    38 Saying, Blessed be the King that cometh in the name of the Lord: peace in heaven, and glory in the highest.
    39 And some of the Pharisees from among the multitude said unto him, Master, rebuke thy disciples.
    40 And he answered and said unto them, I tell you that, if these should hold their peace, the stones would immediately cry out.
    41 And when he was come near, he beheld the city, and wept over it,
    42 Saying, If thou hadst known, even thou, at least in this thy day, the things which belong unto thy peace! but now they are hid from thine eyes.
    43 For the days shall come upon thee, that thine enemies shall cast a trench about thee, and compass thee round, and keep thee in on every side,
    44 And shall lay thee even with the ground, and thy children within thee; and they shall not leave in thee one stone upon another; because thou knewest not the time of thy visitation.
    45 And he went into the temple, and began to cast out them that sold therein, and them that bought;
    46 Saying unto them, It is written, My house is the house of prayer: but ye have made it a den of thieves.
    Luke 19:32-46 (KJV)

    The real controversy between Jesus and the Jews was over the abomination they had made of worship, and what they want to do. It tells us in verse 47:

    "And he taught daily in the temple. But the chief priests and the scribes and the chief of the people sought to destroy him," Luke 19:47

    They wanted to kill him because He was a threat to their religious system. He was a threat to their way of life, and the money they had pouring into their coffers. He was threat to their false traditions they had created to set aside Gods Law.

    The religious leaders hated Him because He didn't look like the Messiah they wanted who would throw of the Roman yoke, He didn't respect their traditions and most notably He didn't keep the Sabbath in the manner they had create and thought it should be kept, but actually was a detestable abomination. So it was the Sabbath issue which infuriated the Jewish leaders and led them to seek Jesus' death. We find it many places, but we see it directly in Mark 3:1-6 (KJV)

    "1 And he entered again into the synagogue; and there was a man there which had a withered hand.
    2 And they watched him, whether he would heal him on the sabbath day; that they might accuse him.
    3 And he saith unto the man which had the withered hand, Stand forth.
    4 And he saith unto them, Is it lawful to do good on the sabbath days, or to do evil? to save life, or to kill? But they held their peace.
    5 And when he had looked round about on them with anger, being grieved for the hardness of their hearts, he saith unto the man, Stretch forth thine hand. And he stretched it out: and his hand was restored whole as the other.
    6 And the Pharisees went forth, and straightway took counsel with the Herodians against him, how they might destroy him."Mark 3:1-6 (KJV)

    Jesus sought time and again to bring them to repentance and reformation, just as the prophets had done before at the time of Daniel. He revealed to them their error of their ways and pointed the way to true worship. Yet they hardened their hearts and forsook God's mercy, and brought on His judgement of desolation.
     
  10. reddogs

    reddogs Contributor Supporter

    +184
    SDA
    Married
    US-Others
    After teaching in the temple, Jesus left it for the last time very sad as He saw the ultimate result of their apostasy, which would lead to utter desolation. We read it in Matthew 23:37-38:

    "37 O Jerusalem, Jerusalem, thou that killest the prophets, and stonest them which are sent unto thee, how often would I have gathered thy children together, even as a hen gathereth her chickens under her wings, and ye would not!38 Behold, your house is left unto you desolate." (Matthew 23:37,38).

    Compare it to the previous verses in Luke 19:41-44: "For the days shall come upon thee, that thine enemies shall cast a trench about thee, and compass thee round, and keep thee in on every side and shall lay thee even with the ground, and thy children within thee; and they shall not leave in thee one stone upon another; because thou knewest not the time of thy visitation" (Luke 19:41-44).

    Jesus placed the guilt upon the people by stating, "they knew not the time of their visitation" and "ye would not." As a result of not responding to God's call to turn from their abominations, their temple was to be desolated. This prophecy was fulfilled in 70 A.D. when the Roman armies of Titus burned the temple to the ground. This second desolation of the temple perfectly paralleled its first destruction. On both occasions the abominations were done by the apostate people of God and the desolation was an act of judgment performed by a army which brought its own abomination coupled with unimaginable desolation.

    SOP tells us, "The long-suffering of God toward Jerusalem only confirmed the Jews in their stubborn impenitence. In their hatred and cruelty toward the disciples of Jesus they rejected the last offer of mercy. Then God withdrew His protection from them and removed His restraining power from Satan and his angels, and the nation was left to the control of the leader she had chosen." GC Page 28.
     
  11. reddogs

    reddogs Contributor Supporter

    +184
    SDA
    Married
    US-Others
    The Romans as was their usual practice for siege warfare dug a trench around the city to keep anyone from escaping. Now how bad was it, well historian Josephus tells how Roman soldiers "went in numbers into the lanes of the city, with their swords drawn, they slew those whom they overtook, without mercy, and set fire to the houses wither the Jews were fled, and burnt every soul in them, and laid waste a great many of the rest; and when they were come to the houses to plunder them, they found in them entire families of dead men, and the upper rooms full of dead corpses, that is of such as died by the famine; they then stood in horror at this sight, and went out without touching anything. But although they had this commiseration for such as were destroyed in that manner, yet had they not the same for those that were still alive, but they ran every one through whom they met with, and obstructed the very lanes with their dead bodies, and made the whole city run down with blood, to such a degree indeed that the fire of many houses was quenched with these men's blood." (The Wars Of The Jews, 6:8:5).

    But the Christians didn't die, why because they knew it was coming and headed Christs word. Listen to how exact Jesus laid out what was to happen. The Roman general Vespasian besieged Jerusalem during the Jewish rebellion, but emperor Nero committed suicide and plunged Rome into a year of civil war and he had to leave. But now what Josephus tells us, "And now Vespasian had fortified all the places round about Jerusalem, and erected citadels at Jericho and Adida, and placed garrisons in them both And now the war having gone through all the mountainous country, and all the plain country also, those that were at Jerusalem were deprived of the liberty of going out of the city; Now as Vespasian was returned to Caesarea, and was getting ready, with all his army to march directly to Jerusalem, he was informed that Nero was dead Wherefore Vespasian put off at first his expedition against Jerusalem, and stood waiting whither the empire would be transferred after the death of Nero the Roman empire being then in a fluctuating condition, and did not go on with the expedition against the Jews" (The Wars Of The Jews, 4:9:1, 2).
    When the legions of Rome finally got to Jerusalem they camped at the Mount of Olives (The Wars Of The Jews, 5:2:3). Immediately after their arrival a trench was cast about Jerusalem. A nine mile long wall was constructed in three days that totally enclosed the city (The Wars Of The Jews, 5:12:2).

    This gave clear warning to the Christians and they fled in time before Titus came back. Now Josephus had acted as a mediator for the Romans and, when negotiations failed, witnessed the siege and aftermath. He wrote:

    Now as soon as the army had no more people to slay or to plunder, because there remained none to be the objects of their fury (for they would not have spared any, had there remained any other work to be done), [Titus] Caesar gave orders that they should now demolish the entire city and Temple, but should leave as many of the towers standing as they were of the greatest eminence; that is, Phasaelus, and Hippicus, and Mariamne; and so much of the wall enclosed the city on the west side. This wall was spared, in order to afford a camp for such as were to lie in garrison [in the Upper City], as were the towers [the three forts] also spared, in order to demonstrate to posterity what kind of city it was, and how well fortified, which the Roman valor had subdued; but for all the rest of the wall [surrounding Jerusalem], it was so thoroughly laid even with the ground by those that dug it up to the foundation, that there was left nothing to make those that came thither believe it [Jerusalem] had ever been inhabited. This was the end which Jerusalem came to by the madness of those that were for innovations; a city otherwise of great magnificence, and of mighty fame among all mankind.[10]
    And truly, the very view itself was a melancholy thing; for those places which were adorned with trees and pleasant gardens, were now become desolate country every way, and its trees were all cut down. Nor could any foreigner that had formerly seen Judaea and the most beautiful suburbs of the city, and now saw it as a desert, but lament and mourn sadly at so great a change. For the war had laid all signs of beauty quite waste. Nor had anyone who had known the place before, had come on a sudden to it now, would he have known it again. But though he [a foreigner] were at the city itself, yet would he have inquired for it.

    Josephus claims that over a million people were killed during the siege, and that 97,000 were captured and enslaved. Aome scholars find that hard to believe but certainly a great many died.

    Jesus said, "Do you not see all these things? Assuredly, I say to you, not one stone shall be left here upon another, that shall not be thrown down." (Matt. 24:2).
    Titus, the Roman general, did not want to destroy the temple. In a speech to the Jewish defenders of the city he said, "I appeal to my own army, and the Jews that are now with me, and even to you yourselves, that I do not force you to defile this sanctuary; and if you will but change the place whereon you will fight, no Roman shall either come near your sanctuary, or offer any affront to it; nay, I will endeavor to preserve you your holy house, whether you will or not." (The Wars Of The Jews, 6:2:4).

    However, after the city was taken, he "gave order that they should now demolish the entire city and temple but for all the rest of the wall, it was so thoroughly laid even with the ground by those that dug it up to the foundation, that there was left nothing to make those that came thither believe it had ever been inhabited." (The Wars Of The Jews, 7:1:1). The prophecy of Micah of the desolation applies, "Therefore because of you Zion shall be plowed like a field, Jerusalem shall become heaps of ruins, and the mountain of the temple like the bare hills of the forest" (Micah 3:12).
     
  12. steve hartman

    steve hartman New Member

    26
    +4
    United States
    SDA
    Married
    I wonder if it also points to when the papacy will gain full control of Jerusalem he already owns 60 percent of it.
     
  13. Dave-W

    Dave-W Welcoming grandchild #7, Arturus Waggoner! Supporter

    +14,201
    United States
    Messianic
    Married
    US-Others
    He will never have it. We (Messianic Jews) will have it.
     
  14. steve hartman

    steve hartman New Member

    26
    +4
    United States
    SDA
    Married
    according to revelation he will have full control of the world for one hour.
     
  15. Dave-W

    Dave-W Welcoming grandchild #7, Arturus Waggoner! Supporter

    +14,201
    United States
    Messianic
    Married
    US-Others
    That makes the assumption that the Pope is the antichrist.
    That has yet to be proven.

    My bet (if I were a betting man) would be on some islamic leader, especially if he were a convert from pentecostal or charismatic christianity.
     
  16. stuart lawrence

    stuart lawrence Well-Known Member

    +1,577
    Christian
    Single
    I remember at one time some people believed president Jimmy carter was the antichrist
     
  17. steve hartman

    steve hartman New Member

    26
    +4
    United States
    SDA
    Married
    It's not a assumption tell me how these characteristics fit anyone else then you have a point

    CHARACTERISTICS OF ANTICHRIST:

    1

    Exterminates 3 nations

    Antichrist destroys 3 nations after Rome falls



    2

    Rome will concede to it

    Antichrist receives it's seat and authority from Rome



    3

    Political & religious in one

    Antichrist is both political & religious power



    4

    Will reside on 7 hills

    Antichrist will have his church & state sit on 7 hills



    5

    Rules for 1260 years

    Antichrist is to rule the world for 1260 years



    6

    Will receive mortal wound

    Antichrist is wounded after 1260 year reign



    7

    Mortal wound will heal

    Antichrist receives "deadly wound" which later heals



    8

    Was.. is not... yet is

    Antichrist is the beast "that was, is not, yet is"



    9

    Will blaspheme

    Antichrist is to be a blasphemous power



    10

    Will expect worship

    Antichrist will be able to charm the world to worship him.



    11

    Dark Sentences

    Antichrist will understand the "dark sentences" of hell



    12

    Says Jesus had not flesh

    Antichrist declares Jesus has not come in the flesh


    13

    Craftiness and deceit

    Antichrist is to use craftiness and deceit in a major way


    14

    Preaches another Jesus

    Antichrist is to preach 'another Jesus' unto all


    15

    666

    Antichrist controls a man who's name will add to 666


    16

    Will hate the Bible

    Antichrist hates Bible and anyone that uses it


    17

    Will kill Christians

    Antichrist has a church that makes war with the saints


    18

    All wonder after him

    Antichrist is a world power which the world "wonders after"


    19

    Will embrace Babylon

    Antichrist is a "Christian" church mixed with Babylon


    20

    Will join with all kings

    Antichrist must join with the "kings of the Earth"


    21

    Will mock Jesus

    Antichrist will mock Christ so as to confuse the unlearned.


    22

    Antichrist hates women

    Antichrist's men will be homosexual


    23

    Forces Remnant to hide

    Antichrist forces Christians into hiding for 1260 years!


    24

    Will be a mother church

    Antichrist is a "mother" church that spawns many errors!


    25

    Try's changing times & law

    Antichrist seeks to tamper with and change times & laws


    26

    Will use Sorcery - Pharmacy

    Antichrist will use drugs on the masses to control them
     
  18. Dave-W

    Dave-W Welcoming grandchild #7, Arturus Waggoner! Supporter

    +14,201
    United States
    Messianic
    Married
    US-Others
    Yeah - so was Leonid Brezhnev, Golda Myier, Anwar Saddat, Saddam Hussein, George Bush, Bill Clinton, U Thant, Barak Obama, and the list goes on and on.

    As John tells us in his first letter, many (small a) antichrists have come (and now have gone) but the spirit behind all of them remains. We see in a glass darkly (1 Cor 13) and probably will not see clearly enough to recognize what is going on until it is already in play.
     
  19. steve hartman

    steve hartman New Member

    26
    +4
    United States
    SDA
    Married
    They are all forms of anti-christ as is anyone else with wealth,power,influence especially political people but the anti-christ spoken of in daniel and revelation is the papacy system.
     
  20. Dave-W

    Dave-W Welcoming grandchild #7, Arturus Waggoner! Supporter

    +14,201
    United States
    Messianic
    Married
    US-Others
    Impressive list. (but standard fare)

    You left one out: Denies that Christ came in the flesh:

    1 John 2:22
    Who is a liar but he who denies that Jesus is the Christ? He is antichrist who denies the Father and the Son.

    1 John 4:3
    and every spirit that does not confess that Jesus Christ has come in the flesh is not of God. And this is the spirit of the Antichrist, which you have heard was coming, and is now already in the world.
     
Loading...