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What is the “one baptism” mentioned in Ephesians 4:5? (Note: I am not asking because I don't know).

Discussion in 'Controversial Christian Theology' started by Bible Highlighter, Jan 31, 2021.

What is the one baptism mentioned in Ephesians 4:5?

  1. Spirit baptism

    46.4%
  2. Water baptism

    35.7%
  3. Baptism by fire

    3.6%
  4. Other (Please explain).

    14.3%
  1. Bible Highlighter

    Bible Highlighter Law of the Lord is perfect, converting the soul. Supporter

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    What is the “one baptism” mentioned in Ephesians 4:5?

    I believe the “one baptism” mentioned in Ephesians 4:5 is Spirit baptism (Which automatically takes place generally when a person receives Jesus Christ as their personal Lord and Savior). I believe Spirit baptism is the New Covenant form of baptism that has replaced water baptism in God's new program. Now, that said, before you throw down a hammer of verses to refute me, please realize that I believe Peter was mistaken about baptism in Acts chapter 2. In addition, in Acts 10-11: I believe that when Peter recalled the Lord's words on Spirit baptism (from Acts of the Apostles 1:5) he did not fully understand yet that water baptism was no more yet and he was just learning for the first time about Spirit baptism. By the time Peter wrote his letters, I believe that is when he knew that Spirit baptism was the one and only true baptism and that water baptism no longer applied. The same is true for Philip. Philip did not know the true baptism of the New Covenant yet when he encountered the Ethiopian enuch. For we have to remember, that it took time for the Jewish apostles to come out from under the Law of Moses. For the book of Acts is not an account of the apostles getting everything correct or right, but it was an account of their lives in growing and learning in the ways of God. For the disciples did not fully understand Christ's death and resurrection before the cross. So the apostles had to grow in their learning. I believe this to be the case with baptism, as well.
     
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  2. Bible Highlighter

    Bible Highlighter Law of the Lord is perfect, converting the soul. Supporter

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    Spirit Baptism is the one and only baptism in effect today.

    Scriptural Support:

    1. Ephesians 4:5 says that there is “one baptism.”

    2. 1 Corinthians 12:13 says, “For by one Spirit are we all baptized into one body, whether we be Jews or Gentiles, whether we be bond or free; and have been all made to drink into one Spirit.”

    3. The prophecy and fulfilment of the new baptism: Jesus stated: “For John truly baptized with water; but ye shall be baptized with the Holy Ghost not many days hence.” (Acts of the Apostles 1:5). Note: This baptism of the Holy Ghost took place at Pentecost for the Jewish believers (See: Acts of the Apostles 2), and it happened for the Gentiles with Cornelius and his family in Acts 10 (Also see: Acts 11 about Peter’s recollection of this event; For Peter recalls the words of Jesus in Acts of the Apostles 1:5 when Cornelius and his family experienced the baptism of the Spirit after the gospel was preached to them) (Note: In Acts 10-11: Peter was just first learning of the baptism of the Spirit and he did not know yet that water baptism had ended at this point in his life).

    4. 1 Corinthians 1:17 says, “For Christ sent me not to baptize, but to preach the gospel: not with wisdom of words, lest the cross of Christ should be made of none effect.” If water baptism is what places us into Christ, then why is Paul teaching against it here? This must mean that the true baptism is Spirit baptism and that the baptism that Paul was not sent by Christ to put forth was water baptism. For the apostles were commissioned to baptize in Matthew 28:19, and yet, Paul was an apostle.

    5. Acts of the Apostles 18:24-26 says, And a certain Jew named Apollos, born at Alexandria, an eloquent man, and mighty in the scriptures, came to Ephesus. This man was instructed in the way of the Lord; and being fervent in the spirit, he spake and taught diligently the things of the Lord, knowing only the baptism of John. And he began to speak boldly in the synagogue: whom when Aquila and Priscilla had heard, they took him unto them, and expounded unto him the way of God more perfectly.” In short, Aquila and Priscilla (who were taught by Paul) expounded the Word of God more perfectly unto Apollos because he only knew of John’s baptism of water. Apollos needed to learn of Spirit baptism (Which is the true New Covenant way of being baptized).

    6. Acts of the Apostles 19:1-7 says, “And it came to pass, that, while Apollos was at Corinth, Paul having passed through the upper came to Ephesus: and finding certain disciples, He said unto them, Have ye received the Holy Ghost since ye believed? And they said unto him, We have not so much as heard whether there be any Holy Ghost. And he said unto them, Unto what then were ye baptized? And they said, Unto John's baptism. Then said Paul, John verily baptized with the baptism of repentance, saying unto the people, that they should believe on him which should come after him, that is, on Christ Jesus. When they heard this, they were baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus. And when Paul had laid his hands upon them, the Holy Ghost came on them; and they spake with tongues, and prophesied. And all the men were about twelve.” In other words, the believers at Ephesus only knew of John’s baptism of water, and they were not aware of the Holy Ghost. So Paul baptized them into the Holy Ghost by laying his hands on them. So they received the baptism of the Spirit.

    7. Mark 16:16 says: “He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned.” If one believes Ephesians 2:8-9, and they also believe that water baptism is for salvation: Well, this is a problem if they are claiming that believers are initially and foundationally saved by God’s grace and not of works according to Ephesians 2:8-9, Romans 4:3-5, and Titus 3:5. For if baptism is a work we must do to be saved by God’s grace or as a part of the gospel, then it nullifies the first aspect in the salvation process in being saved by God’s grace through faith in Jesus Christ without the deeds of the Law. Thus, when Jesus refers to baptism here to be saved he is referring to the baptism of the Holy Spirit (Which takes place every time a person accepts Jesus Christ as their personal Lord and Savior). The Holy Spirit is a part of our salvation (See: Romans 8:9, Romans 8:11, and Romans 8:13; Ephesians 1:13-14).

    8. The Holy Spirit is compared to water; Water baptism (an OT ritual) is a picture that points ahead to the true baptism (i.e. Spirit baptism). Jesus told the woman at the well, “Whosoever drinketh of this water shall thirst again: But whosoever drinketh of the water that I shall give him shall never thirst; but the water that I shall give him shall be in him a well of water springing up into everlasting life.” (John 4:13-14). So what is this living water that Jesus talks about that is like a well of water springing up into everlasting life? John 7 gives us the answer. “He that believeth on me, as the scripture hath said, out of his belly shall flow rivers of living water. (But this spake he of the Spirit, which they that believe on him should receive: for the Holy Ghost was not yet given ; because that Jesus was not yet glorified.)“ (John 7:38-39). In other words, the Holy Spirit is the living waters that can live in a person that Jesus was talking about with the woman at the well.

    9. Hebrews 9:10 says, “Which stood only in meats and drinks, and divers washings, and carnal ordinances, imposed on them until the time of reformation.” The word “washings” is the Greek word “baptismos” (βαπτισμός) (Check out here for the Strong’s definition). In other words, Hebrews 9:10 is saying that diverse baptisms (washings) were imposed on believers until the time of reformation. Meaning, water baptism will give way or pass away until the time of reformation (Which means that Spirit baptism is now the one and only true baptism for today).

    10. 1 Corinthians 6:11 says, “And such were some of you: but ye are washed, but ye are sanctified, but ye are justified in the name of the Lord Jesus, and by the Spirit of our God.” This shows that when we accept Jesus as our Savior, our hearts our WASHED (like with water) and sanctified by the Spirit of God (i.e. the Holy Spirit). We are born again, and we have a new heart with new desires. We have become baptized by the Spirit. ................................................................................................................
    11. Ezekiel 36:25-27 says,
      [25] Then will I sprinkle clean water upon you, and ye shall be clean: from all your filthiness, and from all your idols, will I cleanse you. [26] A new heart also will I give you, and a new spirit will I put within you: and I will take away the stony heart out of your flesh, and I will give you an heart of flesh. [27] And I will put my spirit within you, and cause you to walk in my statutes, and ye shall keep my judgments, and do them.” This clean water that is sprinkled upon them so that they would be clean is referring to the immersion (baptism) of the Holy Spirit when and when we receive a new heart with new desires (become born again). This water is not water baptism but Spirit baptism that transforms a person’s life.

    12. Ephesians 1:13 says,
      “In whom ye also trusted, after that ye heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation: in whom also after that ye believed, ye were sealed with that holy Spirit of promise,” This lets us know that by hearing the gospel, we are sealed with the Holy Spirit of promise. This is being immersed into the Spirit for the first time sort of like with Cornelius and his household (Note: This does not mean we will speak in tongues, but we will have a change of the heart and a peace like never. before).....................................................................................................................................................
    13. Certain baptist groups believe that the word “baptize” in 1 Corinthians 12:13 refers to water baptism and not Spirit baptism. This suggests that they are building the church. However, in Matthew 16:18, we learn that Jesus Christ said, "I WILL build my church." The future tense of the verb suggests that the construction of the church had not yet started when Christ said these words. Our Lord did not say, "I have built my church." He also did not say, "I am building my church." No, the construction of the church had not yet started and thus the church was yet future. At the time Jesus spoke the words of Matthew 16:18 the church had not yet begun. This suggests that Spirit baptism (done by Christ) is the new form of baptism for the New Covenant.his ...............................................................................................................................
    14. Jesus did not water baptize anyone. Some Christian groups teach that water baptism is for salvation. Yet, if this is the case, then they would be saying that Jesus did not save anyone because He did not water baptize. However, we know that Jesus does baptize, but it is Spirit baptism and not water baptism. For John the Baptist said, “I indeed baptize you with water unto repentance: but he that cometh after me is mightier than I, whose shoes I am not worthy to bear: he shall baptize you with the Holy Ghost, and with fire:” (Matthew 3:11).
     
    Last edited: Feb 3, 2021
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  3. Bible Highlighter

    Bible Highlighter Law of the Lord is perfect, converting the soul. Supporter

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    Explaining Common Objections to Spirit Baptism being the one and only Baptism:

    1. Objection: Jesus told us to water baptize as a part of the great commission in Matthew 28:19. Response: First, nothing is said whether it was water or Spirit baptism by Jesus Christ in Matthew 28:19. However, if we were to look at parallel verses we would discover that Jesus is indeed referring to Spirit baptism and not water baptism. Mark 16:16 refers to how he that believes and is baptized shall be saved, and then in Mark 16:17 it refers to how certain signs will follow those who believe, and they shall speak with new tongues. Also, Acts 1:5 (which is another parallel verse), we discover that Jesus said, “For John truly baptized with water; but ye shall be baptized with the Holy Ghost not many days hence.” So Jesus had Spirit baptism in view of the future and not water baptism.

    2. Objection: Hebrews 6:2 mentions how there is more than one baptism in that there is a doctrine of baptism as a part of the beginning principles of the doctrines of Christ (See: Hebrews 6:1). 1 John 5:8 says, “And there are three that bear witness in earth, the spirit, and the water, and the blood: and these three agree in one.” These three things that bear witness in the Earth refer to each of the three different baptisms mentioned in the Bible. Response: First, if there were multiple forms of baptism (with water baptism being included among them), then why did Paul appear to speak against water baptism in 1 Corinthians 1:17? He said he came not to baptize but to preach the gospel. If water baptism is a necessary act for all Christians, then Paul would not have spoken against it. Second, baptism is not exactly like God. While the parallel appears to fit, Ephesians 4:5 cannot be read as being literally one baptism but in reality it would technically be three. One has to be able to refer to one kind of baptism in Ephesians 4:5. One has to truly stick out. Yes, the word, “Lord” can refer to the Holy Spirit, but generally that word refers to Jesus. Yes, Jesus can be our everlasting Father, but generally the word “Father” refers to “God the Father.” Thus, the one baptism has to refer to one specific kind of baptism and not three. Three, Hebrews 9:10 says,“Which stood only in meats and drinks, and divers washings, and carnal ordinances, imposed on them until the time of reformation.” The word “washings” is the Greek word “baptismos” (βαπτισμός) (Check out here for the Strong’s definition). In other words, Hebrews 9:10 is saying that diverse baptisms (washings) were imposed on believers until the time of reformation. Meaning, water baptism will give way or pass away until the time of reformation (Which means that Spirit baptism is now the one and only true baptism for today). So Hebrews 6:2 must be referring to explaining this very particular topic (in that at one time, water baptism under the Old Covenant was a necessary part of the faith, and it pointed ahead to the working of the Holy Spirit that would come when a person is baptized into the Spirit after the cross).

    3. Objection: 1 Peter 3:21 clearly is referring to water baptism because it compares Noah being saved on the Ark through water (See: 1 Peter 3:20). Response: 1 Peter 3:20-21 says,“to those who were disobedient long ago when God waited patiently in the days of Noah while the ark was being built. In it only a few people, eight in all, were saved through water (NIV). The like figure whereunto even baptism doth also now save us (not the putting away of the filth of the flesh, but the answer of a good conscience toward God,) by the resurrection of Jesus Christ:” (KJV). At first glance, this definitely sounds like water baptism because of the parallel made with Noah being saved on the Ark through the water. But we have to understand that the Ark is symbolic of Jesus Christ, and we are not saved by a literal wooden Ark ourselves. So if the Ark is symbolic of Jesus Christ, then the water must also be symbolic, too. I believe the water is symbolic of the Holy Spirit; For John 7:38-39 refers to the Holy Spirit as being like that of water. We are saved by the Holy Spirit (Romans 8:11, Romans 8:13, John 4:14). Verse 18 says: For Christ also suffered once for sins, the just for the unjust, that He might bring us to God, being put to death in the flesh but made alive by the Spirit (1 Peter 3:18) (NKJV). We are made alive by the Holy Spirit when we first came to Jesus Christ and trusted in Him as our Savior. Noah and his family did not get wet. The water was a form of judgment upon the rest of the world. Noah and his family were saved from that sinful world and it’s horrible sinful influences. The same is true when we receive the Holy Spirit. When we enter the Ark (Jesus) we are forgiven of our past sins or past old life of sins (Just as Noah was no longer plagued by a sinful world anymore). For when Noah stepped off the Ark onto dry land (after the flood waters abated), he had a whole new beginning for his life and his family. His mind was cleared from that old sinful world. For it could no longer reach him. It was wiped away clean by the water. Just as our conscience or mind is cleared by the Holy Spirit when we are forgiven of our sins by Jesus Christ. In addition, Peter says to receive the gift of the Holy Spirit in Acts chapter 2. Yet, Peter speaks of a gift again in 1 Peter 4:10 (Which I believe is in reference to the Holy Spirit) which is the saving water in 1 Peter 3:21. I believe 1 Peter 3:21 is saying this by way of comparison to 1 Peter 3:20. Now, some may wonder how do I interpret the words “even baptism doth also now save us (not the putting away of the filth of the flesh…)” in 1 Peter 3:21. Well, I believe one possible interpretation is that this is in reference to Peter saying that we are saved by any literal physical washings like in water baptisms (whereby the dirt is cleansed from the body). For example: In the Old Testament, there were ritual washings in water in order to be clean if one eats an animal that died itself or if it was torn by beasts. For Leviticus 17:15-16 says, “And every soul that eateth that which died of itself, or that which was torn with beasts, whether it be one of your own country, or a stranger, he shall both wash his clothes, and bathe himself in water, and be unclean until the even: then shall he be clean. But if he wash them not, nor bathe his flesh; then he shall bear his iniquity.” Seeing Peter was Jewish, and he knew the Law of Moses, ritual washings in water like these were done so as to be ritually clean. Peter was trying to tell us that this was not the kind of baptism that would literally remove any kind of dirt physically from us by any physical act of washing in water, but this was a washing of one’s conscience by the power of the resurrection of Jesus Christ.

    4. Objection: Paul refers to the baptism of the Christians in Rome within Romans 6:3-4. This is clearly in reference to water baptism because it refers to a more spiritual meaning like being baptized into Christ’s death. For Spirit baptism was not something that was always administered and it could just happen spontaneously like with Cornelius and his family. Paul also says many of you who were baptized suggesting that there may be some who may not have been water baptized. Response: We have to understand that back in the early church, being water baptized was just something everyone did when they first came to have faith in Jesus Christ. Even the Ethiopian eunuch knew of water baptism being associated with the faith without Philip suggesting it to him. So when a person was baptized, the more important aspect is that they were placing faith in Jesus Christ as their personal Savior. This was a person receiving the good news of Jesus Christ by faith and it went hand in hand with a person also being baptized. Their baptism was merely a part of their faith in Jesus Christ as the Savior. It was not the water baptism alone itself that was saving them or connecting them to Christ. Baptism was something that they did as a part of coming to Christ. This coming to Christ by faith is what pointed to the real baptism (i.e. Spirit baptism which is what connects them to Christ’s death and their salvation). We know that the Spirit came upon Cornelius and his family before they were water baptized. So they were joined to Christ in his death through the Holy Spirit before they were water baptized. So if Paul ever wrote to Cornelius, he would not have said the same thing he did with the believers in Rome. We have to remember that Paul only water baptized two people and one household (1 Corinthians 1:14-16). But if water baptism truly is the source of baptizing men into Christ, you would think Paul would be water baptizing more people. This shows why Paul placed little importance on baptism in 1 Corinthians 1:17. In short, in Romans 6:3-4: Paul was merely telling those who have already professed a faith in Christ and who received the Spirit baptism while they just so happened to also be water baptized (as a part of their initial faith in Christ). It does not mean Paul is suggesting that water baptism is the only means by which to obtain in connecting to the Holy Spirit and being baptized into Christ’s death. For we know by Cornelius and his family that such was not the case for them. At one point, the baptism of the Holy Ghost was a simultaneous experience with water baptism (Acts of the Apostles 2:38), of which we see the same thing happen with our Lord's baptism (See: Matthew 3:16-17); Yet, on the other hand, we see Spirit baptism to be an exclusive experience alone which came upon the apostles at Pentecost (Acts of the Apostles 2:1-12) and those in Cornelius' house (Acts of the Apostles 10:44), and later with the believers at Ephesus (Acts of the Apostles 19:1-7).
     
    Last edited: Feb 1, 2021
  4. disciple Clint

    disciple Clint Well-Known Member

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    Do you believe that the church and all the theologians have missed this somehow for the last 2000 years?
     
  5. tturt

    tturt Senior Veteran Supporter

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    "One Lord, one faith, one baptism," One Lord is referring to the Godhead shown in Scripture such as "The grace of the Lord Jesus Christ, and the love of God, and the communion of the Holy Ghost, be with you all. Amen." II Cor 13:14 The one baptism is referring to them all.

    There's "...the doctrine of baptisms,..." (Heb 6:2). There's 3 baptisms. We initiate each one and they're available to whosoever will..
    1 - By The Holy Spirit into Jesus which reconciles us to God is the baptism for salvation. Baptized by the Holy Spirit into the body of Christ by believing in His death, burial, and resurrection.(Rev 1:5; Matt 26:28; Mark 1:4-9, 16:16; Luk 3:3; 1 Cor 12:13; Acts 2:38; Gal 3:27, II Cor 5;18).)
    Water and Spirit baptism follows salvation - not in a set order though
    2 - By another believer (water baptism) Jesus said "... fitting for us to fulfill all righteousness," All 3 persons of the Godhead endorsed water baptism. (Matt 3:13-16; 3:6,11; 28:18-20; Acts 8:39, 10:47, 22:16; John 3:5).
    3 - By Jesus who sends the promise of the Father baptists us "by," "with" and "in" the Holy Spirit (The Spirit baptism) includes when the Holy Spirit comes upon us, He endures us with power for service to Him and to keep His Word. (Acts 1:5, 8:14-17, 10:44-48, 11:16; Matt 3:11; Mark 1:8, Luke 3:16; I Cor 12:13, Luk 24:49, Eph 5:18, Acts 4:31; I John 3:24; Eze 36:25-28; John 14:25-27).

    "And there are three that bear witness in earth, the Spirit, and the water, and the blood: and these three agree in one." I John 5:7-8
     
    Last edited: Jan 31, 2021
  6. ViaCrucis

    ViaCrucis Evangelical Catholic of the Augsburg Confession

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    It's Christian Baptism, which is always with water. The Bible never mentions "water baptism", because that is redundant, Baptism always involves water. And this Baptism isn't referring to Jewish ritual ablations (tevilah), or to St. John the Baptist's baptism which was a ritual ablation done for repentance in anticipation of the coming of the Messiah. It is specifically that Baptism which Christ Himself gave and instituted, where He says, "Make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, Son, and the Holy Spirit".

    There are times where Scripture speaks of analogical "baptisms", for example the pouring out of the Holy Spirit on Pentecost is the fulfillment of where St. John the Baptist says that He who would come after him will "baptize with the Holy Spirit and with fire" (though others think the "and with fire" refers not to Pentecost, but rather to a "baptism of fire" i.e. persecution or perhaps judgment). In the same way Jesus uses baptism analogically when He speaks of His Passion as a "baptism", asking His disciples if they can be baptized with the same baptism He will, or drink from the same cup as Him, speaking of His sufferings. St. Paul, in a similar way, speaks of the Israelites having received a "baptism" "into Moses" through the red sea.

    So the language of baptism in figurative and poetic ways, such as the above, do exist. But when Scripture speaks of baptism, it really and quite simply means what it says. When it says baptism, it means baptism. It means the Sacrament of Baptism, the "washing of water with the word" (Ephesians 5:26) as St. Paul says. This is the baptism Christ gave to the Church in the Great Commission, the baptism St. Peter mentions in Acts 2:38, the baptism Paul talks about in Romans 6:3-4, Galatians 3:27, Colossians 2:12-13. It's what Jesus is talking about in John 3:5, echoed again by St. Paul in Titus 3:5.

    This has always been the belief of the Christian Church since the beginning. It's what the Apostles taught and believed, and what Christians have always confessed--because it's what the Bible quite plainly and objectively says and means. There's simply no confusion on this subject when one looks at what has been written from the New Testament onward throughout Christian history. At least until modern times in the past several hundred years where a minority of Christians have gone off and formed radically new doctrines and ideas which are completely foreign to Scripture and to the historic confession of faith.

    -CryptoLutheran
     
  7. disciple Clint

    disciple Clint Well-Known Member

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    Acts 8:36 As they traveled along the road, they came to some water and the eunuch said, "Look, here is water. What can stand in the way of my being baptized?"
     
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  8. Bible Highlighter

    Bible Highlighter Law of the Lord is perfect, converting the soul. Supporter

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    Hebrews 9:10 says, “Which stood only in meats and drinks, and divers washings, and carnal ordinances, imposed on them until the time of reformation.” The word “washings” is the Greek word “baptismos” (βαπτισμός) (Check out here for the Strong’s definition). In other words, Hebrews 9:10 is saying that diverse baptisms (washings) were imposed on believers until the time of reformation. Meaning, water baptism will give way or pass away until the time of reformation (Which means that Spirit baptism is now the one and only true baptism for today).

    In other words, the reformation with Paul's teaching baptism was not taught yet to the these other Jewish apostles. So they were water baptizing still and not knowing God's new program yet involving Spirit baptism as being the replacement for water baptism. For Paul says he came not to baptize but to preach the gospel (1 Corinthians 1:17). Obviously Paul was referring to water baptism and not Spirit baptism. Paul refers to “one baptism” in Ephesians 4:5. It cannot be both water baptism and Spirit baptism. It has to be one or the other.

    Side Note:

    Anyways, I am working on a common objections post (to place at the beginning of this thread). So hopefully I will be able to cover the big ones that people may bring up. So far I have offered in post #2 my Scriptural support for Spirit baptism being the one and only true baptism for today.
     
    Last edited: Jan 31, 2021
  9. Minister Monardo

    Minister Monardo Well-Known Member Supporter

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    Ephesians 4:
    1
    I, therefore, the prisoner of the Lord, beseech you to walk worthy of the calling with which you
    were called,
    2 with all lowliness and gentleness, with longsuffering, bearing with one another in love,
    3 endeavoring to keep the unity of the Spirit in the bond of peace.
    4 There is one body and one Spirit, just as you were called in one hope of your calling;
    5 one Lord, one faith, one baptism;
    6 one God and Father of all, who is above all, and through all, and in you all.

    Of course. It is obvious from the context that the 'one baptism' Paul speaks of pertains to the
    'one body and one Spirit' in verse 4, which is Christ. He is addressing the church, or body of
    Christ at Ephesus, and corporately, they are of that one baptism, Spirit and body.
    This has nothing to do with an individual's conversion, but pertains to being an active part of
    that one body, by One Spirit, which is the baptism that establishes the 'bond of peace',
    the seal of the Spirit, etc...
    Seems you are being a bit premature in re-writing the New Testament in order to correct
    "the misunderstandings of the apostles".

    The Lord spent 40 days with the apostles post resurrection. They were ordered to wait for Him
    in Galilee at the mountain that He assigned to them. Their comprehension was fine.


    Water baptism is necessary for every individual convert. It is a baptism into the death of Christ,
    to be raised in newness of Life.
    The baptism of the Spirit is that new life in Christ, as an active part of that body.
    There is only one baptism that can unite us, "the Spirit of Unity In the Bond of Peace".


    Romans 6:
    3
    Or do you not know that as many of us as were baptized into Christ Jesus were baptized
    into His death?
    4 Therefore we were buried with Him through baptism into death, that just as Christ
    was raised from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life.
     
  10. disciple Clint

    disciple Clint Well-Known Member

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    Hebrews 9:10 is addressing custom and practice prior to Jesus. Paul as usual is addressing the Jewish laws.
     
  11. klutedavid

    klutedavid Well-Known Member

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    Yes.
     
  12. Bible Highlighter

    Bible Highlighter Law of the Lord is perfect, converting the soul. Supporter

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    Check out my post #3.
     
  13. Bible Highlighter

    Bible Highlighter Law of the Lord is perfect, converting the soul. Supporter

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  14. ViaCrucis

    ViaCrucis Evangelical Catholic of the Augsburg Confession

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    Exactly, the eunuch sees water and says "what can stand in the way of my being baptized"? He doesn't say "what can stand in the way of my being baptized in water" or "what can stand in the way of my being water baptized", but just "baptized". He sees water, and desires to receive Christian Baptism, and so he receives Christian Baptism.

    -CryptoLutheran
     
  15. Minister Monardo

    Minister Monardo Well-Known Member Supporter

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    It is the one baptism that is spoken of in Ephesians 4, because only Spirit baptism can bring many
    members together in one body.[my post in #9] which is not answered by your "common objections".
    Water baptism remains a part of the individual's conversion into Christ's death, before they are
    baptized into the Spirit of Life in Christ, the spiritual seed of Abraham's promise.

    Acts 10:
    Then Peter answered,
    47 Can anyone forbid water, that these should not be baptized who have received the Holy Spirit
    just as we have?
    48 And he commanded them to be baptized in the name of the Lord.

    A clear distinction is made in the scriptures between water baptism and Holy Spirit baptism. That is
    because both are a part of the testimony. You are making some elaborate case based on Paul using
    the term "one baptism" which is Truth because regardless Of Jew or Gentile, etc...all drink from
    the same cup, all receive of the One Spirit, that is Christ.


    Galatians 3:
    27
    For as many of you as were baptized into Christ have put on Christ.
    28
    There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither slave nor free, there is neither male nor female;
    for you are all one in Christ Jesus.
    29 And if you are Christ’s, then you are Abraham’s seed, and heirs according to the promise.

    Nowhere in scripture do you find the words
    "one and only baptism". You seem to have coined that term.


    Acts 1:
    4
    And being assembled together with them, He commanded them not to depart from Jerusalem,
    but to wait for the Promise of the Father, “which,” He said, “you have heard from Me;
    5 for John truly baptized with water, but you shall be baptized with the Holy Spirit not many days
    from now.

    They clearly knew, after being instructed by the resurrected Lord, the difference between water
    baptism and Holy Spirit baptism. There is no scriptural support that one replaced the other in the preaching of the Gospel and the great commission.


    Luke 24:
    44
    Then He said to them, These are the words which I spoke to you while I was still with you,
    that all things must be fulfilled which were written in the Law of Moses and the Prophets and the Psalms concerning Me.
    45 And He opened their understanding, that they might comprehend the Scriptures.

    All this instruction was given prior to the ascension, weeks after the resurrection.
    Misconceptions about the death and resurrection that existed before the crucifixion are irrelevant.

    Matthew 28:
    16
    Then the eleven disciples went away into Galilee, to the mountain which Jesus had
    appointed for them.
    17 When they saw Him, they worshiped Him; but some doubted.
    18 And Jesus came and spoke to them, saying, All authority has been given to Me in heaven and on earth.
    19 Go therefore and make disciples of all the nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father
    and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit,

    20 teaching them to observe all things that I have commanded you; and lo, I am
    with you always, even to the end of the age. Amen.


    They understood the teaching and obeyed the instructions.

    Not at all an appropriate response to my post #9.
     
  16. Bible Highlighter

    Bible Highlighter Law of the Lord is perfect, converting the soul. Supporter

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    The Jewish apostles were not aware of the new Spirit baptism teaching replacing the old one yet. It took time for the apostles to come out from under the Old Law. Remember, in Acts of the Apostles 22:17-26 that Paul was pressured to go through an Old Testament ritual rite that involved an animal sacrifice by his fellow Jewish apostles. So they were still figuring things out. I mean, even Christ's own disciples did not know about His death and resurrection in what they meant until AFTER the cross. Paul rebuked Peter for trying to get the Gentiles to live as the Jews. The book of Acts is not an account of men always perfectly getting everything right or correct. So we have to compare Scripture with Scripture to see what is really going on.
     
  17. Bible Highlighter

    Bible Highlighter Law of the Lord is perfect, converting the soul. Supporter

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    1 Corinthians 12:13 says, “For by one Spirit are we all baptized into one body, whether we be Jews or Gentiles, whether we be bond or free; and have been all made to drink into one Spirit.”

    Christ is the head of the body of Christ (Colossians 1:18). So if we are baptized into Christ's death in water baptism as you say, then we are one with Christ. This means we are united to Him, and if so, then we are one with the body of Christ and so trying to be united to the body of Christ by one Spirit in Spirit baptism is redundant.

    I mean, I get it. You want that nice picture to be Christ being buried with us in water baptism, and that we are raised in Spirit baptism (while we are performing water baptism). Okay, I do believe that Romans 6:3-4 is referring to a simultaneous event of water baptism and Holy Spirit baptism, but this was under the time when period when the Roman believers did not know that water baptism had ended. Paul was pointing to the greater reality in their baptism (i.e. Spirit Baptism when they were being water baptized).

    Anyways, the Holy Spirit is symbolized by water in John 7:38-39. If we are to read the flood waters that washed away this sinful world before Noah in 1 Peter 3:20-21 as being in reference to Spirit baptism, then one can see that Noah was being protected in the Ark of Christ, while the Spirit cleansed Noah's mind of that old sinful world (i.e. in our case it would be putting away the old man by our receiving a new heart and receiving the Spirit). For Noah began a new beginning when he stepped off that ark on to dry land (When the flood waters abated). Just as we put on the new man or have a new beginning when we encountered Jesus Christ and His Holy Spirit. In Romans 6:3-4 is referring to their act of faith at that time. It did not necessarily mean that water baptism was necessary. For Paul also says that he came not to baptize (water baptize) but to preach the gospel (1 Corinthians 1:17). For again, why would Paul not want others to be joined in Christ's death if water baptism alone is what truly places a person into Christ's death?


    This was Peter and not Paul. Peter still had yet to learn about how Spirit baptism would replace water baptism. Peter was just still learning about Holy Spirit baptism with Pentecost and this event involving Cornelius. Peter did not fully grasp the full truth yet.


    We are baptized into Christ by Holy Spirit baptism. Water baptism just gets you wet and it was merely symbolic of the real baptism (i.e. Spirit baptism). For if this was not the case, then Paul would be saying in 1 Corinthians 1:17, I come not to help you to put on Christ, but to preach the gospel. Surely Paul was not saying that.



    John the baptist said he baptized with water and that Jesus would baptize with the Holy Spirit (Which shows the difference between their ministies). This is why Jesus never water baptized but he had his disciples baptize. For Jesus would be the one who water baptizes. If we are to follow Jesus, then there is no indication that he ever water baptized others himself, and thus we should not water baptize if we are to follow his example.


    It's not irrelevant because it shows you that they were human and had false misunderstanding about the things of God. We see Peter being confused when he was trying to make the Gentiles live as the Jews do. We would see them still all still struggling with the Old Law (including partaking in animal sacrifice) which took place in Acts of the Apostles 21:17-26.

    Jesus was referring to Spirit baptism that was to take place soon at Pentecost, and with Cornelius and his house. Peter did not need to water baptize Cornelius and his house. They already were baptized into the Spirit (Which is the greater reality of water baptism). Water baptism is just the outward show pointing to the greater and true baptism (i.e. Spirit baptism). For if water baptism was the one baptism in Ephesians 4:5, then Spirit baptism would be excluded because we see two distinctions between them clearly in Scripture. We see men becoming water baptized and yet they had not been Spirit baptized (See: Acts of the Apostles 19:1-7). We see men being Spirit baptized and yet they were not water baptized yet. This shows the clear distinction between baptisms. So there can be only one real baptism. This has always been Spirit baptism. Water baptism is just a picture or symbol or shadow that points to working of Christ and the Holy Spirit. Hebrews 9:10 talks about how baptismos (washings) util the time of reformation took place. This is clearly in reference to water baptism. The time of reformation would be when everyone understood what Paul was talking about in regards to being Spirit baptized. For if water baptism placed the Ephesian believers into having the Holy Spirit baptism, then why did Paul have to administer it to them in Acts of the Apostles 19:1-7?
     
    Last edited: Feb 1, 2021
  18. Butterball1

    Butterball1 Well-Known Member

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    F.F. Bruce: “baptism in the New Testament is always baptism in water unless the context shows it to be something else; that is to say, the word is always to be understood literally unless the context indicates a figurative meaning” (Questions Answered, p. 106).

    There is nothing in Ephesians 4:5 that proves baptism in this verse is anything other than a literal immersion in water. To place a figurative meaning on baptism in this verse is due to nothing more than a personal theological bias against the necessity of water baptism.
     
  19. Bible Highlighter

    Bible Highlighter Law of the Lord is perfect, converting the soul. Supporter

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    Yet, the Ephesians believers only knew of John's water baptism and this did not appear to help them. Paul laid his hands on them and they were baptized into the Holy Spirit (See: Acts of the Apostles 19:1-7).
     
  20. Butterball1

    Butterball1 Well-Known Member

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    Acts of the Apostles 8:29 "Then the Spirit said unto Philip, Go near, and join thyself to this chariot."

    Why would the Spirit send Phillip to teach and water baptize the eunuch if water baptism is not the one baptism of Eph 4:5...not the baptism of Christ's great comission? Why didn't the Spirit just "spirit baptize" the eunuch Himself. No need to send for Phillip........unless the Spirit had it wrong too and needs those on this forum to correct Him. If Phillip was wrong he in what he taught the eunuch why didn't the Spirit intecede and stop him?

    Peter commanded (command = requirement, a necessity) water baptism to the Gentiles Acts of the Apostles 10:47-48.

    To accuse the Apostles to be wrong on this issue is undermining their inspiration and making the BIble irrelevant. If they were wrong on this issue then that opens the door they could be wrong on other issues therefore the Bible cannot be 'true' (John 17:17) if it contains error therefore cannot be trusted. Once the genies is out of the bottle, there is nothing to stop anyone from accusing the Aposltes of being wrong. What if I personally do not like what the Apostles spoke about on a a particular issue? I can simply declare the Aposltes were wrong, I am right...don't listen to the inspired BIble writers but listen to me, a unknown internet poster with a theological agenda. I have seen many attempts to get around the necesity of water baptism but I think this is the first time I have seen inspired Bible writers being accused of being wrong in order to get around that necessity of water baptism.
     
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