What is Christian Philosophy and for what purpose does it serve?

Agra man

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Hello I am agra man I came across this site and saw that it had this section on Christian Philosophy. To be honest I have heard of it but never really got into what it is so I am niave in this area. And a friend of mine well we got intoan argument because he was saying some really odd things calling it philosophy things about mother earth using the mind to sync to the spirit even going so far as to explain how mother earth has some kind of life energy that using the mind with the spirit creates an aura of protection and just odd stuff he said there was a marriage with the angels and the church before creation and that divorce was in heaven with us and them

I love talking with him about the things of God we have a blast but the things he was saying here well he didn't take to well to me warning him about all this stuff even though there was absolutely no evidence of what he said what so ever he just saw it as truth and saw me as being petty and attacking him.

I tried first before even confronting him to understand what he meant about it being philosophy he said it is basically adding to an already established thing. Ok for studying and research looking at things from a different perspective maybe I can be on board with that but to say it as fact though well I wasn't having that.

But I wondered if perhaps the argument could have gone different if I had understood what Christian Philosophy is so what is it exactly what the reason to study it and what purpose does it serve?
 

Quentin

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The term "Christian Philosophy" is an oxymoron. Philosophy has no place in worship to God. In fact the Christian Scriptures call philosophy "empty deception:"

"Look out that no one takes you captive by means of the philosophy and empty deception according to human tradition, according to the elementary things of the world and not according to Christ."-Colossians 2:8.

Philosophy is human knowledge. And it ultimately leads to nowhere. The knowledge of the Christ, when applied leads to everlasting life. The knowledge found in the Bible is not of human origin, rather it was inspired of God. God's word condemns philosophy as foolish and worthless.
 
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sandman

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You are not wrong

Philosophy is man’s intellectual ideas and wisdom… any philosophical ideas of the Word of God or God is the devils rabbit hole to which there is no end ….and no truth……..it’s just man becoming the essence of the god he devises.

We have seen the effects of philosophy through the pages of history and unfortunately some of that has crept into religious beliefs which can still be seen today.

You show me a philosopher who can create something out of nothing ….or even make a frog and I will give them an ear. But until then …..keep your philosophical babbling’s away from the true God and His Word.
 
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Mark Quayle

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Hello I am agra man I came across this site and saw that it had this section on Christian Philosophy. To be honest I have heard of it but never really got into what it is so I am niave in this area. And a friend of mine well we got intoan argument because he was saying some really odd things calling it philosophy things about mother earth using the mind to sync to the spirit even going so far as to explain how mother earth has some kind of life energy that using the mind with the spirit creates an aura of protection and just odd stuff he said there was a marriage with the angels and the church before creation and that divorce was in heaven with us and them

I love talking with him about the things of God we have a blast but the things he was saying here well he didn't take to well to me warning him about all this stuff even though there was absolutely no evidence of what he said what so ever he just saw it as truth and saw me as being petty and attacking him.

I tried first before even confronting him to understand what he meant about it being philosophy he said it is basically adding to an already established thing. Ok for studying and research looking at things from a different perspective maybe I can be on board with that but to say it as fact though well I wasn't having that.

But I wondered if perhaps the argument could have gone different if I had understood what Christian Philosophy is so what is it exactly what the reason to study it and what purpose does it serve?
The term "Christian Philosophy" is an oxymoron. Philosophy has no place in worship to God. In fact the Christian Scriptures call philosophy "empty deception:"

"Look out that no one takes you captive by means of the philosophy and empty deception according to human tradition, according to the elementary things of the world and not according to Christ."-Colossians 2:8.

Philosophy is human knowledge. And it ultimately leads to nowhere. The knowledge of the Christ, when applied leads to everlasting life. The knowledge found in the Bible is not of human origin, rather it was inspired of God. God's word condemns philosophy as foolish and worthless.
You are not wrong

Philosophy is man’s intellectual ideas and wisdom… any philosophical ideas of the Word of God or God is the devils rabbit hole to which there is no end ….and no truth……..it’s just man becoming the essence of the god he devises.

We have seen the effects of philosophy through the pages of history and unfortunately some of that has crept into religious beliefs which can still be seen today.

You show me a philosopher who can create something out of nothing ….or even make a frog and I will give them an ear. But until then …..keep your philosophical babbling’s away from the true God and His Word.
We are all philosophers, like it or not. In another thread someone said a similar thing, that she has no theology (as if it was something to be despised). But we all, even atheists and children, have theology.

Whether we realize it or not, or whether we can communicate it or not, we are philosophers. At perhaps its simplest meaning, Philosophy means only love of knowledge, which implies study. But, regardless, there is formal philosophy that is of a theological nature, that is VERY good and useful.

When the Bible speaks of 'philosophy' in a deprecatory manner, it is not talking about formal philosophy, but about 'thinking' and 'worldview' and such. It is not speaking of logical pursuit of fact and such, unless it is contrasting that which is merely human self-assertion and self-determinism with the wisdom of God.

There is bad philosophy, but there is good philosophy, too, which does not contradict nor work against God.


Below are some synonyms for philosophy.
attitude
doctrine
idea
ideology
logic
outlook
reasoning
system
tenet
theory
thinking
thought
truth
view
viewpoint
wisdom
aesthetics
axiom
beliefs
conception
convictions
metaphysics
ontology
rationalism
reason
values
 
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Agra man

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Thank you everyone for your helpful responses I accidently left my pc on when I fell asleep so I apologize I wasn't ignoring you.

So as I understand it so far Philosophy is basically the study for knowledge but clearly there is a difference between the knowledge of man and of God.

As far as theology if we are actually honest even those who claim to not have one we all have a bias towards a certain belief even if we are willing to learn and admit we may be wrong that bias is there initially

But you know that to me is the problem. Theology and how seperated and divided the body is how the truth and word of God has been disorted as if Jesus didn't warn us ahead of time this was going to happen and everyone is just ok with as if it is the norm.

I keep thinking about how Jesus who was and knew the turth shut down the pharisee's like a boss they had no way of countering him even though they knew the scriptures better than anyone else at that time

If we in all of our studying in all of our seeking all of our research reaching a conclusion that we believe is truth yet it can be easily countered with the simple act of cherry picking scripture then it seems to me we don't have the full truth and understanding otherwise we could shut others down with the truth.

So personally I am all to aware of how effective studying theology or doctrine is. I want the truth the the real thing who cares if I am right or worng in my thinking and understanding of scripture or the truth he says it plain and simple lean not on your own understanding

But what do you see? Any heated debate you get into you see how everyone uses their knowledge of scripture their intellect to debate using scripture as if it isn't the word of God using doctrine that has been instilled in them and don't you dare oppose it god forbid they could actually be wrong in their understanding.

We call the bible the word of God, that is insulting. If he spoke to you and gave you a word how would you treat it? Would you treat it with care and caution as if it is not something to play around with or would go around spouting it and treating it like it is yours to do as you please with.

We call the word of God like it is just a term or a definition of the bible but with words alone he created all of existance his word is power it is holy sacred and there is a price to pay for mistreating it. If people really considered the bible to be the word of God they would know they are playing with fire treating any other way than the very words of God himself

I don't know why people cannot see this and even if they do well what are you going to do about it? Will continue to go with the system or will you seek after the truth the real truth.

Sure we can say we are seeking it in our studies our debates ect. and this is good and is good for growth but to actually do so for the sake of the truth itself well it requires you go before him knowing nothing if you want the truth you go to him directly first you surrender utterly and completely what he says goes no interpretation no adding or making it seem like it saying this or that no you shut up and you listen if you try adding or interpretating he asks you is that what I said? try to speak about your reasoning for it or try to say anything other than yes or no he just stops you before you can finnish and says is that what I said?


I am nowhere near great at this but am learning a lot from him I had to admit that if my doctrines and my beleifs and my truths are lacking then maybe there comes a point where we sit back stop studying until he says we are ready to and seek after him first the truth the way and the life.

But to find the truth he isn't messing around he demands comploete devotion in this you have to want the truth more than anything else you have to be willing to go into the unknown with him to trust him in a way that brings you out of your comfort zone your going to have to learn to act of faith and trust because the things he tells you to do when your walking with him like this well it is going to go against the normal flow it won't be seen as good for some those who are trapped in their theological minds forget that God is not just an idea or a subject to study and discuss he is a real person with real emotions attributes traits he is a personal God.


I mean it seems simple to me if we are not finding the actual truth of a matter in studying and debating the bible we have the actual source to go to Jesus himself
 
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public hermit

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Christians have engaged in philosophy from the earliest centuries of the faith. Everyone on this site that affirms the Trinity and the divine/human person of Christ has Greek philosophy to thank for helping the early church navigate the issues surrounding orthodox doctrine. Without the philosophical concepts and framework available at that time, orthodox doctrine would not be what we now take for granted.

There are so many talented Christian philosophers out there, right now, doing great work.

Here's a helpful article on the subject:
 
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Mark Quayle

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If we in all of our studying in all of our seeking all of our research reaching a conclusion that we believe is truth yet it can be easily countered with the simple act of cherry picking scripture then it seems to me we don't have the full truth and understanding otherwise we could shut others down with the truth.
Well, there is such a thing as kindness. There are many on this site that love to shut others down with what they think is the truth, but all that does is kill proper debate and learning. Too much of that and people quit listening.

Also, even things Christ said can be countered by cherry-picking Scripture. Cherry-picking Scripture is too easily a form of mis-quoting it.
We call the bible the word of God, that is insulting. If he spoke to you and gave you a word how would you treat it? Would you treat it with care and caution as if it is not something to play around with or would go around spouting it and treating it like it is yours to do as you please with.
I don't know why people cannot see this and even if they do well what are you going to do about it? Will continue to go with the system or will you seek after the truth the real truth.
Yet, we MUST use it. We are required to use it. Humility is important here; to understand one's inability as mere temporal human leads to humility —it is not only that we are biased towards one concept or ideology or creedal worldview, but that we are simply small, weak, ignorant, unable to comprehend the greatness of God.

The Bible speaks of honoring or, what I think of more as giving appropriate respect, to those who have committed themselves in spending time in studying truth, and teaching it. It is significant, to me, that it doesn't mention the main reason I give them respect —that they find themselves driven to teach, yet knowing that their teaching will necessarily fall short of facts. This, in the face of condemnation for those who teach falsehood (see Jude and 2 Peter). NONE of us has it quite right; yet, teach we must. The reason I say it is significant is that the lack of mention implies that to some degree it applies to ALL of us —not just the ones we recognize as teachers and preachers.
Sure we can say we are seeking it in our studies our debates ect. and this is good and is good for growth but to actually do so for the sake of the truth itself well it requires you go before him knowing nothing if you want the truth you go to him directly first you surrender utterly and completely what he says goes no interpretation no adding or making it seem like it saying this or that no you shut up and you listen if you try adding or interpretating he asks you is that what I said? try to speak about your reasoning for it or try to say anything other than yes or no he just stops you before you can finnish and says is that what I said?

I am nowhere near great at this but am learning a lot from him I had to admit that if my doctrines and my beleifs and my truths are lacking then maybe there comes a point where we sit back stop studying until he says we are ready to and seek after him first the truth the way and the life.

But to find the truth he isn't messing around he demands comploete devotion in this you have to want the truth more than anything else you have to be willing to go into the unknown with him to trust him in a way that brings you out of your comfort zone your going to have to learn to act of faith and trust because the things he tells you to do when your walking with him like this well it is going to go against the normal flow it won't be seen as good for some those who are trapped in their theological minds forget that God is not just an idea or a subject to study and discuss he is a real person with real emotions attributes traits he is a personal God.
Problem is, we can't do that anymore than we can avoid being human. We cannot separate ourselves from being silly, fallible, ignorant, biased, etc. It is what it is, and God uses that very weakness not just as contrast with what he is, but to even teach truth through the fallible, biased, weak minds of those to whom he will affect this way or that with his truth. You no doubt have seen several posters on this site who say they have committed their hearts and minds to know nothing but to listen to the Spirit tell them truth as they study the Word, and thus THEY have the truth. Balderdash! I believe that no more than I believe they are able to live sinlessly.

In the end, I think, we must simply do our best to bear in mind that we are indeed weak and biased. We all have our own worldview, and it is not the same as God's. A LOT of prayer, here, is appropriate.
I mean it seems simple to me if we are not finding the actual truth of a matter in studying and debating the bible we have the actual source to go to Jesus himself
True. And the fact is that the Spirit of God will "lead [us] into all truth". But that phrase can be taken several different ways, and I'm not sure he didn't mean it as somewhat of a riddle. But we need to be careful here. It is easy to deceive ourselves. John 16:13 may be making the point of emphasis that it is HE, who will lead us into all (categories of?) truth, rather than to be suggesting that one can eventually apprehend ALL truth, as some suppose.
 
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Akita Suggagaki

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We are all philosophers, like it or not. In another thread someone said a similar thing, that she has no theology (as if it was something to be despised). But we all, even atheists and children, have theology.
Absolutely. We all have a worldview, a metaphysical vision of what reality is and how it works. It may be unarticulated and undeveloped. But it is there. It is also related to our unconscious assumptions and moral aims. What is reality? What is good? How do we know? Fancy words, ontology, epistemology, axiology.
 
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Agra man

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Well, there is such a thing as kindness. There are many on this site that love to shut others down with what they think is the truth, but all that does is kill proper debate and learning. Too much of that and people quit listening.

Also, even things Christ said can be countered by cherry-picking Scripture. Cherry-picking Scripture is too easily a form of mis-quoting it.

Yet, we MUST use it. We are required to use it. Humility is important here; to understand one's inability as mere temporal human leads to humility —it is not only that we are biased towards one concept or ideology or creedal worldview, but that we are simply small, weak, ignorant, unable to comprehend the greatness of God.

The Bible speaks of honoring or, what I think of more as giving appropriate respect, to those who have committed themselves in spending time in studying truth, and teaching it. It is significant, to me, that it doesn't mention the main reason I give them respect —that they find themselves driven to teach, yet knowing that their teaching will necessarily fall short of facts. This, in the face of condemnation for those who teach falsehood (see Jude and 2 Peter). NONE of us has it quite right; yet, teach we must. The reason I say it is significant is that the lack of mention implies that to some degree it applies to ALL of us —not just the ones we recognize as teachers and preachers.

Problem is, we can't do that anymore than we can avoid being human. We cannot separate ourselves from being silly, fallible, ignorant, biased, etc. It is what it is, and God uses that very weakness not just as contrast with what he is, but to even teach truth through the fallible, biased, weak minds of those to whom he will affect this way or that with his truth. You no doubt have seen several posters on this site who say they have committed their hearts and minds to know nothing but to listen to the Spirit tell them truth as they study the Word, and thus THEY have the truth. Balderdash! I believe that no more than I believe they are able to live sinlessly.

In the end, I think, we must simply do our best to bear in mind that we are indeed weak and biased. We all have our own worldview, and it is not the same as God's. A LOT of prayer, here, is appropriate.

True. And the fact is that the Spirit of God will "lead [us] into all truth". But that phrase can be taken several different ways, and I'm not sure he didn't mean it as somewhat of a riddle. But we need to be careful here. It is easy to deceive ourselves. John 16:13 may be making the point of emphasis that it is HE, who will lead us into all (categories of?) truth, rather than to be suggesting that one can eventually apprehend ALL truth, as some suppose.
When I was talking about shutting people down I didn't mean in that way I am not one who appreciates people who shut others down in that regard. My point was that he knew the truth the whole truth not some of it not most of it all of it and thus there were no holes to poke in his argument they had nothing they could say because they knew he would just shut down everything they tried to say.

It isn't about the shutting down part it is about knowing the truth so well that they couldn't find any flaws. Sure one could use scripture to counter what Jesus said but trying to debate the God of the universe you won't last long.

And I in no way am saying we shouldn't study the word what I am saying is that we need to take a different approach. Now as far as your stance on obtaining all truth well is that what he said? He said that he would lead us to all truths nothing else he didn't give any limitations no conditions he said he woul and he said all and we have access to the source we have the holy spirit we have the word of God and we have each other how much more of an advantage do we need?
 
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Agra man

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Absolutely. We all have a worldview, a metaphysical vision of what reality is and how it works. It may be unarticulated and undeveloped. But it is there. It is also related to our unconscious assumptions and moral aims. What is reality? What is good? How do we know? Fancy words, ontology, epistemology, axiology.
You like to ask questions I like that. in particular what is reality that is a fun discussion.
 
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However, even John uses a philosophical term, logos, in his opening verse of the Gospel according to John. His opening chapter is the cornerstone of the Christian doctrine of Jesus being fully God and fully man without beginning. The early church had to use philosophy to help define what we understand about the nature of God, that being of three persons in one Godhood.
 
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Agra man

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However, even John uses a philosophical term, logos, in his opening verse of the Gospel according to John. His opening chapter is the cornerstone of the Christian doctrine of Jesus being fully God and fully man without beginning. The early church had to use philosophy to help define what we understand about the nature of God, that being of three persons in one Godhood.
Yes but the difference was whose philosophy that was being used mans or God's. Had they tried to use mans Philosophy it wouldn't work.
 
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Hazelelponi

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Hello I am agra man I came across this site and saw that it had this section on Christian Philosophy. To be honest I have heard of it but never really got into what it is so I am niave in this area. And a friend of mine well we got intoan argument because he was saying some really odd things calling it philosophy things about mother earth using the mind to sync to the spirit even going so far as to explain how mother earth has some kind of life energy that using the mind with the spirit creates an aura of protection and just odd stuff he said there was a marriage with the angels and the church before creation and that divorce was in heaven with us and them

I love talking with him about the things of God we have a blast but the things he was saying here well he didn't take to well to me warning him about all this stuff even though there was absolutely no evidence of what he said what so ever he just saw it as truth and saw me as being petty and attacking him.

I tried first before even confronting him to understand what he meant about it being philosophy he said it is basically adding to an already established thing. Ok for studying and research looking at things from a different perspective maybe I can be on board with that but to say it as fact though well I wasn't having that.

But I wondered if perhaps the argument could have gone different if I had understood what Christian Philosophy is so what is it exactly what the reason to study it and what purpose does it serve?

Christian philosophy seems little if any different from the secular version.

I guess for that type of person it's fine on it's surface, but it completely ceases to be "Christian" when you start throwing new age nonsense into the mix - such as your friend has done.
 
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Agra man

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Christian philosophy seems little if any different from the secular version.

I guess for that type of person it's fine on it's surface, but it completely ceases to be "Christian" when you start throwing new age nonsense into the mix - such as your friend has done.
Yeah honestly He has been really wierd about it, he is dead set on this stuff being truth calling it hidden scripture explaining how since God created us from the earth that is why we have mother earth and our argument over marriage and the whole being married to angels thing well marriage to me is not a subject I take lightly

Marriage is the symbolic unity of Christ the bride groom and the church his bride it is meant to be a very special and beautiful thing and to stain it with trying to say we were married to angels and explaining about how marriage is a covanent so therefore when the angels rebelled they broke that covanent with God and us his term he used divorced.

This stuff just seemingly came from nowhere and I keep asking him about it where he learned it ect. he won't even aknowledge my question. And I can't avoid him I see him pretty much every day so I am trying to figure based on what he has said if he has gotten into some kind of teaching or occult type thing
 
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Yes but the difference was whose philosophy that was being used mans or God's. Had they tried to use mans Philosophy it wouldn't work.
John's use of Logos is has its origin with Heraclitus in 500s B.C. It was adopted by the Jewish philosopher, Philo, sometime contemporaneous to Jesus on earth in the first half of the first century. So a man-made philosophical construct was adopted by St. John to describe Christ.
 
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Agra man

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John's use of Logos is has its origin with Heraclitus in 500s B.C. It was adopted by the Jewish philosopher, Philo, sometime contemporaneous to Jesus on earth in the first half of the first century. So a man-made philosophical construct was adopted by St. John to describe Christ.
Well that isn't surprising he was both God and man so using a man made thing to describe the person of Jesus doesn't seem that unlikely. But the philosophy of God though I may be incorrect about this seems to me more of being his ways.

His ways are not our ways and his thoughts are not our thoughts so if this is the case philosophy of man cannot be used to understand the philosophy of God because his thoughts his ways his teachings they cannot be understand with the carnal
 
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Akita Suggagaki

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Well that isn't surprising he was both God and man so using a man made thing to describe the person of Jesus doesn't seem that unlikely. But the philosophy of God though I may be incorrect about this seems to me more of being his ways.

His ways are not our ways and his thoughts are not our thoughts so if this is the case philosophy of man cannot be used to understand the philosophy of God because his thoughts his ways his teachings they cannot be understand with the carnal
Not completely but wisdom is a gift from God that can take us part way.
 
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Agra man

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Not completely but wisdom is a gift from God that can take us part way.
Not completely but wisdom is a gift from God that can take us part way.
Well take what I said with a grain of salt considering I don't even understand the full concept of philosophy yet or rather if philosophy is even worth calling it and it was really more of my own thoughts being written down
 
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Hazelelponi

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Yeah honestly He has been really wierd about it, he is dead set on this stuff being truth calling it hidden scripture explaining how since God created us from the earth that is why we have mother earth and our argument over marriage and the whole being married to angels thing well marriage to me is not a subject I take lightly

Marriage is the symbolic unity of Christ the bride groom and the church his bride it is meant to be a very special and beautiful thing and to stain it with trying to say we were married to angels and explaining about how marriage is a covanent so therefore when the angels rebelled they broke that covanent with God and us his term he used divorced.

This stuff just seemingly came from nowhere and I keep asking him about it where he learned it ect. he won't even aknowledge my question. And I can't avoid him I see him pretty much every day so I am trying to figure based on what he has said if he has gotten into some kind of teaching or occult type thing

It sounds like you're friend has gotten into something that is potentially dangerous....

Honestly, I don't know what you should do, especially if you're friend has fallen under a cult leaders spell...

But there's some pretty big warning signs there. Red flags galore.
 
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Well take what I said with a grain of salt considering I don't even understand the full concept of philosophy yet or rather if philosophy is even worth calling it and it was really more of my own thoughts being written down
Your philosophy then? :D
 
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