What Ideas do you have that might be considered "heretical" by some in your beliefs...?

[MyGivenNameIsKeith]

Why are the people who criticize doctrine, the last to pray for those who are suffering? It seems like people are trying to depopulate the church just by promoting so called sound doctrine. That's my heresy, feel free to examine.

It goes both ways I think. We are to correct and promote the true gospel, urge people towards repentance and observe whether they do so, even cast out, not be around people who clearly lead a sinful unrepentant life who are attempting to lead others astray. Though you will have different administrations of course, and the same spirit for the true believing church, whatever the denomination I would suppose. The purpose in doing so ensures that the church is holy (be holy as he is holy). While at the same time, there are people who lean on their own understanding* and propagate lies, speak what they ought not, and divert many people all while criticizing doctrines. Lifting themselves up to be as those who walk around in robes, drawing attention to themselves, etc. Not really heretical to think that way. I believe you are just simply stating what is obviously sadly done in this day and age, as we are drawing near to judgment. Not a bad observation.

 

[1stcenturylady]

Why are the people who criticize doctrine, the last to pray for those who are suffering? It seems like people are trying to depopulate the church just by promoting so called sound doctrine. That's my heresy, feel free to examine.

sound doctrine vs. praying for the suffering

You can do both, or neither. This is apples and oranges. Not sure what you are talking about.

 

[Gregory Thompson]

sound doctrine vs. praying for the suffering

You can do both, or neither. This is apples and oranges. Not sure what you are talking about.

You sure can.

 

[rturner76]

Of course the sacrifice of the cross, atonement and promise of new birth is sufficient to save whosoever will. God can forgive any and every sin which would make you innocent, not necessarily righteous. God's divine nature requires righteousness, holiness and in short perfection, as Jesus said, 'be perfect even as your father in heaven is perfect'. There has to be a time of decision and willful sin is something God does not forgive because the basis of forgiveness is being born again in the image of the Son of God. You must be born again of incorruptible seed, receive the divine nature and the Holy Spirit and bear fruit to the glory of God. This God freely give by grace through faith to whosoever will but Jesus makes it clear, many are called, few are chosen. God's grace is sufficient all, but some refuse. But to many who receive him he gives power to become the children of God.

Grace and peace,
Mark

That's what puzzles my heart. "Many are called, fw are chosen." That would indicate that our loving father sends to hell for eternal torment the majority of the beings he creates. It just doesn't compute. Eternal torment for a choice in a temporary condition (our short lives) seems unethical to my admittedly limited human sense of justice. Does God meet out cruel and unusual punishment if you do not love him?

 

[rturner76]

As I said before based on scripture, Christ died for the sins of the whole world. But we have a responsibility too, to accept what He paid for, or reject it. Look at it this way. Vaccines have been made of a number of different disease/(or sins) for everybody, but if you reject the vaccination, you will get the disease. Was it the doctors fault you refused the vaccination? Or yours? A loving doctor made the vaccine and doesn't want anyone to perish from the disease of sin, but we are not robots. We have free will to not even believe in the disease, and go about our merry way, until it is too late. Why people want to blame the doctor is irrational.

But there is another false doctrines in the same family of false doctrines as U.S., but just the opposite. For this one, in the above analogy, the doctor made vaccines for only a few, and refused to give it to anyone not on his list. And the ones that ARE on his list, he pins them in a choke hold and gives them the vaccination whether they sought it or not. They say there is no such thing as free will.

It is hard for people entrenched in these false doctrines to see any other way. But at least you are asking the right questions, so there is hope for you.

And like I say, it'snot that I refuse to acknowledge what scripture says. I don't go around telling everyone they are going to heaven no matter what they do. My question is based on Does God have the desire to save all mankind? and Does God have the ability to save all mankind? If the answer is yes to both of these, then let God's will be done.

 

[mark kennedy]

That's what puzzles my heart. "Many are called, fw are chosen." That would indicate that our loving father sends to hell for eternal torment the majority of the beings he creates. It just doesn't compute. Eternal torment for a choice in a temporary condition (our short lives) seems unethical to my admittedly limited human sense of justice. Does God meet out cruel and unusual punishment if you do not love him?

For he who finds me finds life And obtains favor from the LORD. "But he who sins against me injures himself; All those who hate me love death." (Prov. 8:35-36)
​

We should know what God requires for us to be saved, we must be the righteousness of God in Christ. There is a choice, an act of the will, choose life or choose death.

I call heaven and earth to witness against you today, that I have set before you life and death, the blessing and the curse. So choose life in order that you may live, you and your descendants. (Deut. 30:19)
​

There is only one solution, if you would have eternal life you must be born again. Once you understand that you must choose between life and death. It's either the righteousness of God in Christ or the flames of perdition. You can't be with God forever without it, God cannot because of his own nature accept anything less. God will do whatever is required and has, but his nature does not change and regretfully many are those who choose the path that leads to destruction. But to as many as will receive him he offers salvation through the person and work of the Son of God.

Grace and peace,
Mark

 

[1stcenturylady]

And like I say, it'snot that I refuse to acknowledge what scripture says. I don't go around telling everyone they are going to heaven no matter what they do. My question is based on Does God have the desire to save all mankind? and Does God have the ability to save all mankind? If the answer is yes to both of these, then let God's will be done.

God made us for a purpose, an eternal one - fellowship with Him. Earth is our testing ground.

Does God have the desire to save all mankind? Yes, He gave us His Own Son to die a horrendous death, just for us, to pay the price required to save us from our sin. It is enough to save all mankind. Some actually teach there was only enough to save the "elect," a predetermined amount of people. NO! It would have saved the whole world!

Does God have the ability to save all mankind? No. When we were created, we were made in God's image and likeness. God is sovereign, but what is lost on many in the church is that God made man sovereign over his own life to choose light or darkness. God is just. He didn't make puppets or robots or something less than His likeness. He makes every attempt to draw us to Himself to accept His great sacrifice. You have got your mind set on God must be unjust to burn off the chaff of humanity who rejected Him. But WE are to blame for our own choices.

 

[1stcenturylady]

So there are definitely creatures that God has created or will create with the full knowledge that they will go to hell and suffer for eternally? For them there is no reprieve ever for their mistake? Did God want these beings to suffer forever more when he created them?

Hell is not predestined for anyone. So, NO, for as long as you live you can choose God.

 

[Doug Melven]

To any who believe in Universal salvation I have questions.
If your doctrine is true, why live a godly life? Why preach the Gospel? Why suffer persecution?
If your doctrine is true, I feel sorry for all those who gave up there lives for Jesus and the Gospel.
I think the Apostle Paul would be really happy to see that everybody gets to go to heaven. I think he would be unhappy at the same time thinking about all the suffering he went through for nothing. Also see 2 Cor 5:11

Now for my most controversial belief.
Holiness is not the goal, it is a byproduct of an intimate relationship with Christ. Jesus didn't die just to forgive my sin. He died so we could have a relationship with God, and sin was in the way. Isa 59:2
When I sin, my relationship/ fellowship with God is not affected in any way, shape or form. God forgave me long before I drew breath or committed a single sin. He cast my sins away as far as the East is from the West. Ps 103:10-12 He said He would not impute my sin against me. 2 Cor 5:21 He said He would not remember my sins and lawless deeds. Heb 8:11-13
Now from man's point of view, various things may happen. Anywhere from loss of salvation to loss of fellowship and requiring discipline. None of that is true from God's point of view. When I sin, I may feel guilty and
feel like a hypocrite going to God for mercy to get me out of the hole I am in that I created by my
sin. This is my failing, God doesn't have a change in His attitude towards me. And His point of view
is the only one that really matters.
Holy Spirit conviction of sin. John 16:8-9 He does not convict of breaking 10
commandments. He convicts the world of unbelief. This is the only sin Jesus did not die for, so it is
the only sin that will send a person to hell. Convicting an unbeliever of breaking the 10 commandments
would not do that person any good. If they stopped committing that sin, even if they stopped breaking
the 10 commandments for the rest of there life, they would still go to hell. Convicting a believer of
breaking the 10 commandments, He said He would not remember our sins. So how could He remind us of
that sin. Think about having a person that is always with you, 24/7/365, and every time you sin, this
person says, "I am not doing this to condemn you, but I am reminding you of your sin because I love
you." How long before you would want to get away from this person?
Remember some definitions of sin.
Whatsoever is not of faith is sin. Rom 14:23
To him that knows to do good and does it not, to him it is sin. James 4:17
Then Jesus said in Matt 22:37-39
Love the Lord your God with all your heart, soul, mind and strength. And your neighbor as yourself.
Who can do that all of the time?

 

[1stcenturylady]

To any who believe in Universal salvation I have questions.
If your doctrine is true, why live a godly life? Why preach the Gospel? Why suffer persecution?
If your doctrine is true, I feel sorry for all those who gave up there lives for Jesus and the Gospel.
I think the Apostle Paul would be really happy to see that everybody gets to go to heaven. I think he would be unhappy at the same time thinking about all the suffering he went through for nothing. Also see 2 Cor 5:11

Now for my most controversial belief.
Holiness is not the goal, it is a byproduct of an intimate relationship with Christ. Jesus didn't die just to forgive my sin. He died so we could have a relationship with God, and sin was in the way. Isa 59:2
When I sin, my relationship/ fellowship with God is not affected in any way, shape or form. God forgave me long before I drew breath or committed a single sin. He cast my sins away as far as the East is from the West. Ps 103:10-12 He said He would not impute my sin against me. 2 Cor 5:21 He said He would not remember my sins and lawless deeds. Heb 8:11-13
Now from man's point of view, various things may happen. Anywhere from loss of salvation to loss of fellowship and requiring discipline. None of that is true from God's point of view. When I sin, I may feel guilty and
feel like a hypocrite going to God for mercy to get me out of the hole I am in that I created by my
sin. This is my failing, God doesn't have a change in His attitude towards me. And His point of view
is the only one that really matters.
Holy Spirit conviction of sin. John 16:8-9 He does not convict of breaking 10
commandments. He convicts the world of unbelief. This is the only sin Jesus did not die for, so it is
the only sin that will send a person to hell. Convicting an unbeliever of breaking the 10 commandments
would not do that person any good. If they stopped committing that sin, even if they stopped breaking
the 10 commandments for the rest of there life, they would still go to hell. Convicting a believer of
breaking the 10 commandments, He said He would not remember our sins. So how could He remind us of
that sin. Think about having a person that is always with you, 24/7/365, and every time you sin, this
person says, "I am not doing this to condemn you, but I am reminding you of your sin because I love
you." How long before you would want to get away from this person?
Remember some definitions of sin.
Whatsoever is not of faith is sin. Rom 14:23
To him that knows to do good and does it not, to him it is sin. James 4:17
Then Jesus said in Matt 22:37-39
Love the Lord your God with all your heart, soul, mind and strength. And your neighbor as yourself.
Who can do that all of the time?

I'm disturbed by your last question. It sounds like you don't know the answer???

 

[vinsight4u]

/nvm

 

[vinsight4u]

/nvm

 

[Doug Melven]

I'm disturbed by your last question. It sounds like you don't know the answer???

My apologies, I thought it was clear that it was a rhetorical question.
Nobody can keep those rules all the time except Christ.
No unbeliever can, no believer can. Nobody except Jesus Christ.
But I know where you are coming from, starting at the point of Christ living in you keeping the law.
We believers do not keep the law.
I once went to a church that told me by God's power aiding me I could keep the law. But that was still me doing my best to keep the law with Him helping me.
I finally gave up in frustration. Twenty or so years later I was in a jail cell reading a Bible, there was nothing else to read, when God told me it was time to get back up.
I told God I couldn't, because I knew I would just fail again. He opened my eyes to what Philippians 4:13 meant.
I can do all things through Christ who strengthens me.
Stop trying to do good things , let Christ do them through you.
Remember that wristband people used to wear, WWJD "What would Jesus do"?
I say don't you try to figure out what to do, just let Jesus do it.

 

[1stcenturylady]

My apologies, I thought it was clear that it was a rhetorical question.
Nobody can keep those rules all the time except Christ.
No unbeliever can, no believer can. Nobody except Jesus Christ.
But I know where you are coming from, starting at the point of Christ living in you keeping the law.
We believers do not keep the law.
I once went to a church that told me by God's power aiding me I could keep the law. But that was still me doing my best to keep the law with Him helping me.
I finally gave up in frustration. Twenty or so years later I was in a jail cell reading a Bible, there was nothing else to read, when God told me it was time to get back up.
I told God I couldn't, because I knew I would just fail again. He opened my eyes to what Philippians 4:13 meant.
I can do all things through Christ who strengthens me.
Stop trying to do good things , let Christ do them through you.
Remember that wristband people used to wear, WWJD "What would Jesus do"?
I say don't you try to figure out what to do, just let Jesus do it.

And that is what "walking in the Spirit" is all about, and why Paul said to make sure we don't quench the Spirit. He also said, "I die daily."

 

[ToBeLoved]

I was saying U.S. is something my heart believes and that I can't control. I don't actually preach that doctrine because I have tried and been proven wrong with Biblical text over and over by people quoting Jesus' own words. Believing that suffering in hell is not permanent is more along the lines of something I would say to reassure someone with a non Christian relative rather than Universal Salvation although I do always say "God saves whom he will," Hell was explained to me as "a place where God does not exist." So my logic tells me that would have to be annihilation because how can there be a place where God does not exist when he is Omnipresent (in all places or everywhere that exists)?

If God is love, then hell could be a place where evil still exists.

God cannot coabide with evil.

 

[ToBeLoved]

As I said before based on scripture, Christ died for the sins of the whole world. But we have a responsibility too, to accept what He paid for, or reject it. Look at it this way. Vaccines have been made of a number of different disease/(or sins) for everybody, but if you reject the vaccination, you will get the disease. Was it the doctors fault you refused the vaccination? Or yours? A loving doctor made the vaccine and doesn't want anyone to perish from the disease of sin, but we are not robots. We have free will to not even believe in the disease, and go about our merry way, until it is too late. Why people want to blame the doctor is irrational.

This is a pretty cool way of explaining it. Simple enough for most people to get about a doctor and vaccines.

Only the people that actually take the vaccine are protected against that illness.

 

[rturner76]

If God is love, then hell could be a place where evil still exists.

God cannot coabide with evil.

Then that brings up a question for me.....If God created all things, does that mean God also created evil?

 

[Doug Melven]

Then that brings up a question for me.....If God created all things, does that mean God also created evil?

Isaiah 45:7 I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the LORD do all these things.

 

[ToBeLoved]

And like I say, it'snot that I refuse to acknowledge what scripture says. I don't go around telling everyone they are going to heaven no matter what they do. My question is based on Does God have the desire to save all mankind? and Does God have the ability to save all mankind? If the answer is yes to both of these, then let God's will be done.

Why can’t God choose to want, through the creation (human beings) free will for them to choose to love Him and desire for them to Want to spend eternity with Him?

You think God should spend eternity in heaven in His Holiness with everyone who doesn’t want to be Holy?

God cannot abide with sin, so He would them force the same creation He gave free will to
A Holy life.

 

[ToBeLoved]

Then that brings up a question for me.....If God created all things, does that mean God also created evil?

No. God gave His creation the gift of
Free will and being free to choose. People choose sin and evil. Jesus did not