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Featured What exactly happens after we die?

Discussion in 'General Theology' started by Bee_Brian, Apr 11, 2017.

  1. Bee_Brian

    Bee_Brian Member

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    Anyway, bumping this thread. I want to hear more answers about whether we go to our eternal destination after death, or sleep until resurrection.
     
  2. Armoured

    Armoured So is America great again yet? Supporter

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    Hair and nails continue to grow, but marketing phonecalls eventually taper off.
     
  3. Big Drew

    Big Drew Believer Supporter

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    Something happens...don't know what. To be absent from this world is to be present with the Lord...but I don't understand the logistics, because we don't get our resurrected bodies until after Christ returns. I'm speaking only of believers.

    Unbelievers are eternally separated from God on the day of Judgement...depart, I never knew you...but I don't think they'll be roasting like pigs over coals forever, with Satan turning the rotisserie...that's Danteism...I believe it's as said...the second death...first they died physically, then completely...
     
  4. Big Drew

    Big Drew Believer Supporter

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    After my MIL passed away my wife kept getting calls from credit card companies about unpaid bills...most wrote things off once they found out she had passed, but one was very insistent...told my wife, "If we don't receive payment this will affect her credit." My wife's response, "My mother is dead! Do you really think she cares about her credit score at this point?"
     
  5. vinsight4u

    vinsight4u Contributor

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    /nvm
     
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  6. vinsight4u

    vinsight4u Contributor

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    /nvm
     
    Last edited: May 19, 2017
  7. vinsight4u

    vinsight4u Contributor

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    /nvm
     
    Last edited: May 19, 2017
  8. vinsight4u

    vinsight4u Contributor

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    /nvm
     
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  9. Curtis.Hilliker

    Curtis.Hilliker Now what.......

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    Great topic;

    I once had a loaded rifle with the barrel in my mouth (dark days), and when I was ready to pull the trigger I stopped. Then something grabbed a hold of me, I had some weird experience of something holding onto to me and flying away (I could hear wings flapping) but I was still sitting on the bed.

    Anyway, I think it was God saying if you do that you're going to be brought before me.

    The next day I found out my landlords cousin down the street had shot himself.

    True story.
     
  10. ChristianFromKazakhstan

    ChristianFromKazakhstan Well-Known Member

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    Short answer: nobody knows.

    Longer answer: in Christianity, you trust that because you have Jesus, you'll be all right after death.
     
  11. SeventyOne

    SeventyOne Well-Known Member

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    No one is sleeping after they die. That's a euphemism.

    The spirit of Samuel was contacted by the witch.

    Moses and Elijah was at the transfiguration.

    Paul said he desired to depart because to be absent from the body would result being in the Lord. Which would make no sense if he were just to sleep.

    The spirits of the Tribulation martyrs in Revelation reside before the Throne of God.
     
  12. Ken Rank

    Ken Rank Well-Known Member Supporter

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    People will be able to make a case for both sides Brian, and you might find yourself with a decision as to which you believe. I would like to submit to you, and others reading, that this is a non-issue that need not even be decided on.

    First of all, you have no say beyond living a righteous life before the Lord you serve. He calls the shots and it is whatever He wants it to be. But most importantly, both sides have the same ending. I know that sounds odd so let me explain....

    If you die and go to heaven immediately, the first thing you will see (I am assuming) is the Lord. And if you die and slept until the resurrection, you'll open your eyes and see the Lord. Either way, when you close your eyes in this life, the first thing you'll see in the next is Him. That's why I say this is a non-issue that unfortunately divides too many people. :)
     
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  13. Ken Rank

    Ken Rank Well-Known Member Supporter

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    I have no bias here, I honestly don't care which ending we have because both end with us closing our eyes to this life and seeing our Lord in the next. That said... these verses can mean that when they died they went to their people. But it could also be a little more idiomatic and mean being buried together. I have heard for 51 years people talking about their death saying "I just want to be with _____." The meaning was, "buried together." That is why people buy family plots.... and they have had family plots (or caves or tombs) since we have buried people. Look at Jacob's death in the example you cite... he wants to be "gathered unto my people" and then it says, "bury me with my fathers in the cave." So "the gathering of his people" is tied directly to "bury me with my fathers."

    I am NOT saying your conclusion is wrong, I am simply saying that this part of your conclusion shouldn't be used to make your case. :)
     
  14. vinsight4u

    vinsight4u Contributor

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    /nvm
     
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  15. vinsight4u

    vinsight4u Contributor

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    /nvm
     
    Last edited: May 19, 2017
  16. Ken Rank

    Ken Rank Well-Known Member Supporter

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    You won't convince me... I can make both cases equally strong and though I side to one view, I am not 100% sold on either. And... because in either case we see the Lord once we close our eyes to this life... then I don't care. People divide over this, denominations started... and it is not important in the scope of our effect on the increasingly dark world around us as witnesses. That said.. for the sake of debate... the "gathered to his people" line is idiomatic and here is some context to consider... but remember, I am sharing this only to consider not cause a fight. :)

    First we see Joseph, making an oath with Jacob to bury him where Isaac and Rebekah and his own wife Leah lay by the side of Abraham and Sarah. These were his people....

    Gen 47:29 When the time drew near that Israel must die, he called his son Joseph and said to him, "Now if I have found favor in your sight, please put your hand under my thigh, and deal kindly and truly with me. Please do not bury me in Egypt, (30) but let me lie with my fathers; you shall carry me out of Egypt and bury me in their burial place." And he said, "I will do as you have said." (31) Then he said, "Swear to me." And he swore to him. So Israel bowed himself on the head of the bed.

    So now when we come to the death itself, he repeats the desire to be gathered to the people that Joseph already took an oath to bury him with.

    Gen 49:29 Then he charged them and said to them: "I am to be gathered to my people; bury me with my fathers in the cave that is in the field of Ephron the Hittite, (30) in the cave that is in the field of Machpelah, which is before Mamre in the land of Canaan, which Abraham bought with the field of Ephron the Hittite as a possession for a burial place. (31) There they buried Abraham and Sarah his wife, there they buried Isaac and Rebekah his wife, and there I buried Leah.

    His desire in this case is to be buried with his people, gathered to his people. Look brother (I assume, sister? :) ) we have this western idea that we die and go to heaven. But on this I side with the Jehovah's Witnesses... the meek will inherit the earth not heaven. Heaven is the abode of God... messiah will reign on earth and we will reign with him. Then the earth is renewed and we will live in a perfect state like Adam before the fall... the idea that we live in heaven for eternity is just a modern western concept. "Gathered to my people" and "go to your fathers" is just a Hebraic idiom we don't use in our culture today, which is why we don't recognize it as such.

    Blessings.
    Ken
     
  17. Ken Rank

    Ken Rank Well-Known Member Supporter

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    I will throw something else in.... the idea of a soul in Hebrew is seen in the Adam creation. God took dirt, formed it into a man, breathed into it... and then he BECAME a living soul. So you have a body and the breath of life and the two become a living soul. That is how it is rendered in the Hebrew... and so if you kill the body or remove the breath of life, you no longer have a living soul.
     
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  18. Tony Trout

    Tony Trout New Member Supporter

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    Incorrect. We do not lay dormant. I have never had a near-death experience or anything such as that but I believe that when we pass from this life, we immediately either wake up in Heaven or we will wake up in Hell. The Bible says that a man named Lazarus (not the one Jesus raised from the dead) "lifted up his eyes in Hell" (I'm paraphrasing because I can't remember the exact scripture) so - that tells me partly that when we die our souls will either be with Jesus or we'll wind up in Hell if we're not right with God.

    And, by the way, I wouldn't trust the NIV. If you've never noticed, the NIV and the writers/translators of that particular version of the Bible, have removed any and all references to the Blood of Jesus and the power of His blood. So, please do be careful.
     
  19. A Freeman

    A Freeman New Member

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    Actually the doctrine of Karma is very Scriptural.

    Galatians 6:7 Be not deceived; God is not mocked: for whatsoever a man soweth, THAT shall he also reap.

    And with regard to the formula for receiving God's Blessings for doing good or punishments for doing evil (breaking His Law), we can turn to His Law to find out exactly how it works.

    Deuteronomy 27:26, 28:1-68
    27:26 Cursed [be] he that confirmeth not [all] the words of this Law to do them. And all the people shall say, Amen.
    28:1 And it shall come to pass, if thou shalt hearken diligently unto the voice of the "I AM" thy God, to observe [and] to do all His Commandments which I command thee this day, that the "I AM" thy God will set thee on high above all nations of the earth:
    28:2 And ALL THESE BLESSINGS shall come on thee, and overtake thee, if thou shalt hearken unto the voice of the "I AM" thy God.
    28:3 Blessed [shalt] thou [be] in the city, and blessed [shalt] thou [be] in the field.
    28:4 Blessed [shall be] the fruit of thy body, and the fruit of thy ground, and the fruit of thy cattle, the increase of thy kine, and the flocks of thy sheep.
    28:5 Blessed [shall be] thy basket and thy store.
    28:6 Blessed [shalt] thou [be] when thou comest in, and blessed [shalt] thou [be] when thou goest out.
    28:7 The "I AM" shall cause thine enemies that rise up against thee to be smitten before thy face: they shall come out against thee one way, and flee before thee seven ways.
    28:8 The "I AM" shall command the blessing upon thee in thy storehouses, and in all that thou settest thine hand unto; and He shall bless thee in the land which the "I AM" thy God giveth thee.
    28:9 The "I AM" shall establish thee an holy people unto Himself, as He hath sworn unto thee, if thou shalt keep the Commandments of the "I AM" thy God, and walk in His Ways.
    28:10 And all people of the earth shall see that thou art called by the name of the "I AM"; and they shall be afraid of thee.
    28:11 And the "I AM" shall make thee plenteous in goods, in the fruit of thy body, and in the fruit of thy cattle, and in the fruit of thy ground, in the land which the "I AM" sware unto thy fathers to give thee.
    28:12 The "I AM" shall open unto thee His good treasure, the heaven to give the rain unto thy land in his season, and to bless all the work of thine hand: and thou shalt lend unto many nations, and thou shalt not borrow.
    28:13 And the "I AM" shall make thee the head, and not the tail; and thou shalt be above only, and thou shalt not be beneath; if that thou hearken unto the Commandments of the "I AM" thy God, which I command thee this day, to observe and to DO [them]:
    28:14 And thou shalt not go aside from any of the Words which I command thee this day, [to] the right hand, or [to] the left, to go after other gods to serve them.
    28:15 But it shall come to pass, if thou wilt not hearken unto the voice of the "I AM" thy God, to observe to do all His Commandments and His Statutes which I command thee this day; that ALL THESE CURSES [of the Law] shall come upon thee, and overtake thee:
    28:16 Cursed [shalt] thou [be] in the city, and cursed [shalt] thou [be] in the field.
    28:17 Cursed [shall be] thy basket and thy store.
    Eno. 96:14), and the fruit of thy land, the increase of thy kine, and the flocks of thy sheep.
    28:19 Cursed [shalt] thou [be] when thou comest in, and cursed [shalt] thou [be] when thou goest out.
    28:20 The "I AM" shall send upon thee cursing, vexation, and rebuke, in all that thou settest thine hand unto for to do, until thou be destroyed, and until thou perish quickly; because of the wickedness of thy doings, whereby thou hast forsaken Me.
    28:21 The "I AM" shall make the pestilence cleave unto thee, until He have consumed thee from off the land, where thou goest to possess it.
    28:22 The "I AM" shall smite thee with a consumption, and with a fever, and with an inflammation, and with an extreme burning, and with the sword, and with blasting, and with mildew; and they shall pursue thee until thou perish.
    28:23 And thy heaven that [is] over thy head shall be brass, and the earth that is under thee [shall be] [like] iron.
    28:24 The "I AM" shall make the rain of thy land powder and dust: from heaven shall it come down upon thee, until thou be destroyed.
    28:25 The "I AM" shall cause thee to be smitten before thine enemies: thou shalt go out one way against them, and flee seven ways before them: and shalt be removed into all the kingdoms of the earth.
    28:26 And thy carcase shall be meat unto all fowls of the air, and unto the beasts of the earth, and no man shall scare [them] away.
    28:27 The "I AM" will smite thee with the botch of Egypt, and with the hemorrhoids, and with the scab, and with the itch, whereof thou canst not be healed.
    28:28 The "I AM" shall smite thee with madness, and blindness, and with heart-attack:
    28:29 And thou shalt grope at noonday, as the blind gropeth in darkness, and thou shalt not prosper in thy ways: and thou shalt be only oppressed and spoiled evermore, and no man shall save [thee].
    28:30 Thou shalt marry a wife, and another man shall lie with her: thou shalt build an house, and thou shalt not dwell therein: thou shalt plant a vineyard, and shalt not gather the grapes thereof.
    28:31 Thine ox [shall be] slain before thine eyes, and thou shalt not eat thereof: thine ass [shall be] violently taken away from before thy face, and shall not be restored to thee: thy sheep [shall be] given unto thine enemies, and thou shalt have none to rescue [them].
    28:32 Thy sons and thy daughters [shall be] given unto another people, and thine eyes shall look, and fail [with longing] for them all the day long: and [there shall be] no might in thine hand.
    28:33 The fruit of thy land, and all thy labours, shall a nation which thou knowest not eat up; and thou shalt be only oppressed and crushed always:
    28:34 So that thou shalt be mad for the sight of thine eyes which thou shalt see.
    28:35 The "I AM" shall smite thee in the knees, and in the legs, with a sore botch that cannot be healed, from the sole of thy foot unto the top of thy head.
    28:36 The "I AM" shall bring thee, and thy king which thou shalt set over thee, unto a nation which neither thou nor thy fathers have known; and there shalt thou serve other gods, wood and stone.
    28:37 And thou shalt become an astonishment, a proverb, and a byword, among all nations where the "I AM" shall lead thee.
    28:38 Thou shalt carry much seed out into the field, and shalt gather [but] little in; for the locust shall consume it.
    28:39 Thou shalt plant vineyards, and dress [them], but shalt neither drink [of] the wine, nor gather [the grapes]; for the worms shall eat them.
    28:40 Thou shalt have olive trees throughout all thy coasts, but thou shalt not anoint [thyself] with the oil; for thine olive shall cast [his fruit].
    28:41 Thou shalt beget sons and daughters, but thou shalt not enjoy them; for they shall go into captivity.
    28:42 All thy trees and fruit of thy land shall the locust consume.
    28:43 The stranger that [is] within thy borders shall get up above thee very high; and thou shalt come down very low.
    28:44 He shall lend to thee, and thou shalt not lend to him: he shall be the head, and thou shalt be the tail.
    28:45 Moreover all these curses shall come upon thee, and shall pursue thee, and overtake thee, till thou be destroyed; because thou hearkenedst not unto the voice of the "I AM" thy God, to keep His Commandments and His Statutes which He commanded thee:
    28:46 And they shall be upon thee for a sign and for a wonder, and upon thy seed for ever.
    28:47 Because thou servedst not the "I AM" thy God with joyfulness, and with gladness of heart, for the abundance of all [things];
    28:48 Therefore shalt thou serve thine enemies which the "I AM" shall send against thee, in hunger, and in thirst, and in nakedness, and in need of all [things]: and He shall put a yoke of iron upon thy neck, until He have destroyed thee.
    28:49 The "I AM" shall bring a nation against thee from far, from the end of the earth, [as swift] as the eagle (emblem of Babylon and their descendants the Romans) flieth; a nation whose tongue (babble-onian) thou shalt not understand;
    28:50 A nation of fierce countenance, which shall not regard the person of the old, nor show favour to the young:
    28:51 And he shall eat the fruit of thy cattle, and the fruit of thy land, until thou be destroyed: which [also] shall not leave thee [either] corn, wine, or oil, [or] the increase of thy kine, or flocks of thy sheep, until he have destroyed thee.
    28:52 And he shall besiege thee in all thy gates, until thy high and fenced walls come down, wherein thou trustedst, throughout all thy land: and he shall besiege thee in all thy gates throughout all thy land, which the "I AM" thy God hath given thee.
    28:53 And thou shalt eat the fruit of thine own body, the flesh of thy sons and of thy daughters, which the "I AM" thy God hath given thee, in the siege, and in the strictness, wherewith thine enemies shall distress thee:
    28:54 [So that] the man [that is] tender among you, and very delicate, his eye shall be evil toward his brother, and toward the wife of his bosom, and toward the remnant of his children which he shall leave:
    28:55 So that he will not give to any of them of the flesh of his children whom he shall eat: because he hath nothing left him in the siege, and in the strictness, wherewith thine enemies shall distress thee in all thy gates.
    28:56 The tender and delicate woman among you, which would not adventure to set the sole of her foot upon the ground for delicateness and tenderness, her eye shall be evil toward the husband of her bosom, and toward her son, and toward her daughter,
    28:57 And toward her young one that cometh out from between her feet, and toward her children which she shall bear: for she shall eat them for want of all [things] secretly in the siege and strictness, wherewith thine enemy shall distress thee in thy gates.
    28:58 If thou wilt not observe to do all the words of this Law that are written in this Book, that thou mayest fear this glorious and fearful name, THE "I AM" THAT "I AM";
    28:59 Then the "I AM" will make thy plagues extraordinary, and the plagues of thy seed, [even] great plagues, and of long continuance, and sore sicknesses, and of long continuance.
    28:60 Moreover He will bring upon thee all the diseases of Egypt, which thou wast afraid of; and they shall cleave unto thee.
    28:61 Also every sickness, and every plague, which [is] not written in the Book of this Law, them will the "I AM" bring upon thee, until thou be destroyed.
    28:62 And ye shall be left few in number, whereas ye were as "the stars of heaven" for multitude; because thou wouldest not obey the voice of the "I AM" thy God.
    28:63 And it shall come to pass, [that] as the "I AM" rejoiced over you to do you good, and to multiply you; so the "I AM" will rejoice over you to destroy you, and to bring you to nought; and ye shall be plucked from off the land where thou goest to possess it.
    28:64 And the "I AM" shall scatter thee among all people, from the one end of the earth even unto the other; and there thou shalt serve other gods, which neither thou nor thy fathers have known, [even] wood and stone.
    28:65 And among these nations shalt thou find no ease, neither shall the sole of thy foot have rest: but the "I AM" shall give thee there a trembling heart, and failing of eyes, and sorrow of mind:
    28:66 And thy life shall hang in doubt before thee; and thou shalt fear day and night, and shalt have none assurance of thy life:
    28:67 In the morning thou shalt say, Would God it were evening! and at evening thou shalt say, Would God it were morning! for the fear of thine heart wherewith thou shalt fear, and for the sight of thine eyes which thou shalt see.
    28:68 And the "I AM" shall bring thee into slavery AGAIN with ships, by the way whereof I spoke unto thee, Thou shalt see it no more again (if ye keep The Covenant): and there ye shall be sold unto your enemies for bondmen and bondwomen, and no man shall buy [you].


    Deuteronomy 30:15-20
    30:15 See, I have set before thee this day life and good, and death and evil;
    30:16 In that I command thee this day to love the "I AM" thy God, to walk in His Ways, and to keep His Commandments and His Statutes and His Judgments, that thou mayest live and multiply: and the "I AM" thy God shall bless thee in the land where thou goest to possess it.
    30:17 But if thine heart turn away, so that thou wilt not hear, but shalt be drawn away, and worship other gods, and serve them;
    30:18 I denounce unto you this day, that ye shall surely perish, [and that] ye shall not prolong [your] days upon the land, where thou passest over Jordan to go to possess it.
    30:19 I call heaven and earth to record this day against you, [that] I have set before you life and death, blessing and cursing: therefore choose life, that both thou and thy seed may live:
    30:20 That thou mayest love the "I AM" thy God, [and] that thou mayest obey His voice, and that thou mayest cleave unto Him: for He [is] thy Life, and the length of thy days: that thou mayest dwell in the land which the "I AM" sware unto thy fathers, to Abraham, to Isaac, and to Jacob/Israel, to give them.
     
  20. danstribe

    danstribe Active Member

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    Well that certainly answered the question! In God's time those that have died in Christ are as though they are alive because of His promise to resurrect them at Christ's return! They are asleep and not "dead"
     
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