What does it mean to be "Righteous"?

[ScottF]

Following and obeying the word of God.

 

[holo]

Righteousness is a gift.
Victory is a gift.

 

[DevotiontoBible]

I guess you mistake me for someone else then.

Actually, you can't change yourself. You need to be born again. You can't simply decide to become another person, God must kill the old man and give birth to a new one.

But you can adjust your behaviour. If you believe you're a sinner, you'll sin like sinners do. Just like the elephant who thinks the chain is too strong, doesn't escape even though he's actually free to go.

Your behaviour didn't save you, and so naturally it won't "unsave" you.

The context of my posts here in this thread show I am speaking of a regenerated person who's responsibility is to exercise strict self-control to change himself. God does not kill the old man we do through self control. Paul tells us many times that we are do that job. I have given several verses that show this and you have given none to show we don't. You are also wrong that our behavior can't cause us to lose our salvation because; Hebrews 10:26-27 (NLT)
Dear friends, if we deliberately continue sinning after we have received a full knowledge of the truth, there is no other sacrifice that will cover these sins. [27] There will be nothing to look forward to but the terrible expectation of God's judgment and the raging fire that will consume his enemies.

 

[JimfromOhio]

We are "declared Righteous".

Romans 3 Righteousness Through Faith
21But now a righteousness from God, apart from law, has been made known, to which the Law and the Prophets testify. 22This righteousness from God comes through faith in Jesus Christ to all who believe. There is no difference, 23for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God, 24and are justified freely by his grace through the redemption that came by Christ Jesus. 25God presented him as a sacrifice of atonement, through faith in his blood. He did this to demonstrate his justice, because in his forbearance he had left the sins committed beforehand unpunished— 26he did it to demonstrate his justice at the present time, so as to be just and the one who justifies those who have faith in Jesus.

27Where, then, is boasting? It is excluded. On what principle? On that of observing the law? No, but on that of faith. 28For we maintain that a man is justified by faith apart from observing the law. 29Is God the God of Jews only? Is he not the God of Gentiles too? Yes, of Gentiles too, 30since there is only one God, who will justify the circumcised by faith and the uncircumcised through that same faith. 31Do we, then, nullify the law by this faith? Not at all! Rather, we uphold the law.

Hebrews 9:15
For this reason Christ is the mediator of a new covenant, that those who are called may receive the promised eternal inheritance—now that He has died as a ransom to set them free from the sins committed under the first covenant.

 

[holo]

The context of my posts here in this thread show I am speaking of a regenerated person who's responsibility is to exercise strict self-control to change himself. God does not kill the old man we do through self control. Paul tells us many times that we are do that job. I have given several verses that show this and you have given none to show we don't.

Paul writes that we are crucified with Christ, "baptized into his death." And "how much more" we are to LIVE by him, now that the old man is dead etc. We can't change ourselves, we were sinners by nature and had to die and be born again. A new spirit, a new you. Your flesh, where sin lives, won't go to heaven. We can, however, let our minds be renewed. For example, I was used to stealing and lying and using drugs, and even though my spirit was new and free, it took some time to get my mind adjusted to the new life.

The old you is dead already, we are dead to the law and we're free to reckon ourselves dead to sin.

You are also wrong that our behavior can't cause us to lose our salvation because; Hebrews 10:26-27 (NLT)

I could surely give you a heap of quotes that speak of salvation by grace through faith etc etc, and it wouldn't make us agree any more

Salvation is about identity, not works. You're saved, you're bound for heaven because of who you ARE. You are a child of God, your spirit is born of him and can not sin. Works didn't save you, so why do you think they can "unsave" you? Are your works mightier than Jesus'?

Dear friends, if we deliberately continue sinning after we have received a full knowledge of the truth, there is no other sacrifice that will cover these sins. [27] There will be nothing to look forward to but the terrible expectation of God's judgment and the raging fire that will consume his enemies.

Either you've never sinned deliberately after being saved (which I'm sure you have), or this verse isn't about you and me, at the time and place we are at. I've sinned deliberately and repeatedly after being saved, especially when I thought I was a "saved sinner" as opposed to a righteous man, which I am. I'm still saved though. Therefore, these verses must be about someone or something else.

 

[MarkEvan]

I don't mourn my sin, because it's as far from me as the east is from the west. I'm just happy that it's gone

I've mourned, and I've been comforted, and I'm not going to mourn again just so that I can be comforted more... heh. I also don't think we're hurting God as much as ourselves and our fellow man. I can't harm God. I can't give him anything or take anything from him, and I'm afraid the idea of "hurting" God will add to people's guilty and unproductive feelings about themselves.

When we initially repent God then forgives us for all the sins that we have commited, He puts His Spirit in us so that we may walk in righteousness, that is obediance to Him, or to put it another way, it is "faith working through love."
A for the sins that we may commit after he has given us His Spirit, these require fresh repentance and a mourning over the sin that was commited, this is what Paul said to the church of corinth in his second epistle, he said that they had a "godly grief," he didn`t say it was bad for them to feel grieved about what they did, but rather that this was good and correct for them as christians.

Mark

 

[kw5kw]

When we initially repent God then forgives us for all the sins that we have commited, He puts His Spirit in us so that we may walk in righteousness, that is obediance to Him, or to put it another way, it is "faith working through love."

How true! But I must add that He has forgiven all sins, not just those before I accepted Him as my Saviour. Jesus died on the cross nearly 2000 years ago long before any of us was ever born, yet our sins have been forgiven--all of them; the sins in our past, the sins that we comit in the present time and for all those sins that will come.

As for the sins that we may commit after he has given us His Spirit, these require fresh repentance and a mourning over the sin that was commited, this is what Paul said to the church of corinth in his second epistle, he said that they had a "godly grief," he didn`t say it was bad for them to feel grieved about what they did, but rather that this was good and correct for them as christians.

Mark

Oh, for this, does not the author of Hebrews say: "
But this man [Jesus], after he had offered one sacrifice for sins for ever, sat down on the right hand of God;" (KJV; the emphasis would be mine.)

Notice that Jesus only offered His life once, not over and over for each sin that you did or will ever do, but once only for all sins for all mankind.

What you have to do, when you sin, is to thank the Father for His Grace, for His gift of His own Son as the perfect sacrafice for all of our human weakness; because we have already been forgiven.

We need to acknowledge that we did indeed sin, but not to ask for forgiveness, but to give thanks to the forgiveness that has already been given to us.

 

[holo]

When we initially repent God then forgives us for all the sins that we have commited, He puts His Spirit in us so that we may walk in righteousness, that is obediance to Him, or to put it another way, it is "faith working through love."
A for the sins that we may commit after he has given us His Spirit, these require fresh repentance and a mourning over the sin that was commited, this is what Paul said to the church of corinth in his second epistle, he said that they had a "godly grief," he didn`t say it was bad for them to feel grieved about what they did, but rather that this was good and correct for them as christians.

Mark

I agree that repentance and "godly grief" has a place in the walk of the believer - at the last supper Jesus talked about the need to wash our feet even though we were clean otherwise. I think that means that we are clean, we are righteous, we are his children, but our feet still touch the dusty ground. Perhaps washing each other's feet can be compared to confessing our shortcoming to each other, and forgiving them.

 

[MarkEvan]

How true! But I must add that He has forgiven all sins, not just those before I accepted Him as my Saviour. Jesus died on the cross nearly 2000 years ago long before any of us was ever born, yet our sins have been forgiven--all of them; the sins in our past, the sins that we comit in the present time and for all those sins that will come.

I won`t say that He has forgiven us all our sins in terms of those that we commit after we are born again, mainly I guess because Jesus Himself says that each of us is to pray "forgive us our tresspasses as we forgive those who tresspass against us," if our sins are already forgiven then why are we told to pray and ask for forgivness of our sins?
Also Jesus says that if we do not forgive our brother from our heart then neither will our heavenly Father forgive us, it would appear that this is a sin for which we can not earn repentance unless we forgive our brother from the heart.
Finally as jesus also says in revelation to the Ephiasians, "but I have this against you, you have lost your first love, repent therefore and do the deeds you did at first."


These scriptures it would appear to me say that we still need to pray for forgiveness when we sin.

Mark

 

[kw5kw]

I won`t say that He has forgiven us all our sins in terms of those that we commit after we are born again, mainly I guess because Jesus Himself says that each of us is to pray "forgive us our tresspasses as we forgive those who tresspass against us," if our sins are already forgiven then why are we told to pray and ask for forgivness of our sins?
Also Jesus says that if we do not forgive our brother from our heart then neither will our heavenly Father forgive us, it would appear that this is a sin for which we can not earn repentance unless we forgive our brother from the heart.
Finally as jesus also says in revelation to the Ephiasians, "but I have this against you, you have lost your first love, repent therefore and do the deeds you did at first."


These scriptures it would appear to me say that we still need to pray for forgiveness when we sin.

Mark

We need to acknowledge that we did indeed sin, but not to ask for forgiveness, but to give thanks to the forgiveness that has already been given to us.

 

[MarkEvan]

I agree that repentance and "godly grief" has a place in the walk of the believer - at the last supper Jesus talked about the need to wash our feet even though we were clean otherwise. I think that means that we are clean, we are righteous, we are his children, but our feet still touch the dusty ground. Perhaps washing each other's feet can be compared to confessing our shortcoming to each other, and forgiving them.

Hi Holo, oh and I also meant to say hi to kw5kw but I forgot, so hi kw5kw.

I agree with everything that you have said, of course my agreeing does not mean that it is right . I would perhaps go a little further though with the washing of feet, to say that the reason that we do it is to wash the filth of our contact with the world off us, and yes I believe that includes confessing our sins one to another.

Mark

 

[holo]

Yep. When I've done something wrong, I don't need to ask God to forgive me (though I tend to do so anyway, btw), but I (should) ask for forgiveness from the one I've wronged.

Oh, and when I sin, I may be my own victim, so sometimes I need to forgive myself as well

 

[kw5kw]

Yep. When I've done something wrong, I don't need to ask God to forgive me (though I tend to do so anyway, btw), but I (should) ask for forgiveness from the one I've wronged.

Oh, and when I sin, I may be my own victim, so sometimes I need to forgive myself as well

That's the wrong attitude.

You need to acknowled to God that you know that you have transgressed, and that you'll try to do better in the future.
And yes, you should ask for forgiveness from those whom you've wronged.
Russ

 

[MarkEvan]

We need to acknowledge that we did indeed sin, but not to ask for forgiveness, but to give thanks to the forgiveness that has already been given to us.

That's the wrong attitude.

You need to acknowled to God that you know that you have transgressed, and that you'll try to do better in the future.
And yes, you should ask for forgiveness from those whom you've wronged.
Russ

Forgive me from being a little dumb here but I don`t understand these two statements, there seems to me to be a contradiction, in that you are telling me that we don`t need to ask God for forgivness when we sin, but then apear to be telling Holo that we must ask for forgivness.


As I think I have missed something and that your original quote to me is your position let me ask something.....if we do not have to ask for forgivness because God has already forgiven us, then why does Jesus say that "unless we forgive our brother from the heart then neither will our heavenly Father forgive us," it would appear that on this occasion at least that God has not already forgiven us, otherwise why are we told that He will not forgive us?
Also take what 1 John 1 says that "if we confess our sins he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins?"

Mark

 

[Zeena]

It means not having a righteousness of your own!
But rather, recieving Jesus as your Righteousness!

 

[Zeena]

Yep. When I've done something wrong, I don't need to ask God to forgive me (though I tend to do so anyway, btw), but I (should) ask for forgiveness from the one I've wronged.

Oh, and when I sin, I may be my own victim, so sometimes I need to forgive myself as well

That right!

God has ALREADY forgiven you in Christ Jesus our Lord! WooT!

Only, confess your sin, be done with it, and turn and face your God!!!

Who gives LIFE more abundantly! WooT!

 

[holo]

That's the wrong attitude.

You need to acknowled to God that you know that you have transgressed, and that you'll try to do better in the future.

Actually, I don't think I even have to decide to try to be better. His grace is given, no matter how I feel or think about it. But of course, being forgiven does something to you, it inspires you. And, if you feel bad about what you did, it sort of follows that you'll try to avoid it in the future.

I just don't agree with the idea that God's grace somehow depends on our willing or doing anything good - it's the other way around

 

[holo]

Who gives LIFE more abundantly!

I'm thinking Pepsi or Mentos.

 

[Zeena]

The FRESH-MAKER! hahahaha!

 

[ChrisCountryGirl]

We have been declared righteous because our sin has been washed away by the blood of Jesus Christ (Rev. 1:5).

We are still sinners, but "forgiven sinners".