What does 1 Timothy 2:15 mean?

[Sophia7]

This is a text that I have never understood. Does anyone have any ideas about what Paul meant when he said that women will be saved through childbearing? This is not intended to be a discussion on submission; we already have a thread on that, but I will quote a couple of previous verses just for context:

1 Timothy 2:11 A woman should learn in quietness and full submission. 12 I do not permit a woman to teach or to have authority over a man; she must be silent. 13 For Adam was formed first, then Eve. 14 And Adam was not the one deceived; it was the woman who was deceived and became a sinner. 15 But women will be saved through childbearing--if they continue in faith, love and holiness with propriety.

 

[HoneyDew]

I have issues with this verse myself so I will wait to see what others say. For if Adam was not deceived, then neither was Eve, because they were One.

 

[Sophia7]

Here is a link sent to me by Cliff2: http://www.bible.org/page.asp?page_id=2497

It's a survey of the main interpretations of 1 Tim. 2:15. Some of them might be plausible while others are very strange. Something to think about, anyway. Thanks, Cliff.

 

[woobadooba]

I was just thinking about this one the other day. I don't even have a clue. It just doesn't make any sense at all.

 

[HoneyDew]

I was just thinking about this one the other day. I don't even have a clue. It just doesn't make any sense at all.

... could it be cultural?
I know that is a much-bandied word when we attempt to deconstruct the epistles but I cannot come up with an inspired answer. (Meaning that the author was inspired.)

 

[woobadooba]

... could it be cultural?
I know that is a much-bandied word when we attempt to deconstruct the epistles but I cannot come up with an inspired answer. (Meaning that the author was inspired.)

It doesn't sound like it could be cultural because it is too general, and childbearing is something that people of all cultures experience.

I just think it is very strange, and I am having a hard time seeing how it even fits in with the gospel.

 

[HoneyDew]

It doesn't sound like it could be cultural because it is too general, and childbearing is something that people of all cultures experience.

I just think it is very strange, and I am having a hard time seeing how it even fits in with the gospel.

Yes, but how many cultures say that the woman will be saved in childbearing since she was the one who sinned, and not her darling hubby?

 

[woobadooba]

Yes, but how many cultures say that the woman will be saved in childbearing since she was the one who sinned, and not her darling hubby?

None that I am aware of.

 

[nahMish]

Could it possibly mean that Eve is redeemed because through her womb the saviour (her saviour) came to the world? and bringing God's kingdom into the world????
not sure..

 

[woobadooba]

Could it possibly mean that Eve is redeemed because through her womb the saviour (her saviour) came to the world? and bringing God's kingdom into the world????
not sure..

No, because it wasn't through her womb that the savior was born.

But I read something about this verse just recently that I think to be interesting.

Women back then were not treated with high regard by men. In fact, for the most part they were belittled, and thus led to believe that they weren't important. Even in terms of salvation they were frowned upon by certain men who did not even see them as being worth saving.

And so it was believed that women just weren't important.

And Paul, in saying this about child bearing, was disclosing that a woman would come to know her worth in bearing and raising up children. For, this is one of the most wonderful responsibilities!

And so in child bearing, a woman came to see that she was important, and that there was a place for her in this world.

And this idea is actually fitting for ther concept of salvation. For, what does the concept of salvation disclose to the sinner? That he is worth something, that he is important. Thus, the woman would come to know that she isn't a dog, but a queen with a very important purpose in life! Hence, she would be "saved through bearing children".

Anyway, that's the idea that I got from one scholar. I think it does make some sense out of the verse. What do you think?

 

[Cliff2]

15 But women will be saved through childbearing--if they continue in faith, love and holiness with propriety.

We all know that there is sometimes a double meaning to what is said in the Bible.

Could this "woman" in this verse be the Church?

When you think about this in the context of the woman being the Church it may start to make some sense.

 

[HoneyDew]

We all know that there is sometimes a double meaning to what is said in the Bible.

Could this "woman" in this verse be the Church?

When you think about this in the context of the woman being the Church it may start to make some sense.

****Yes, but alert****

Yes, Cliff, sounds plausible, doesn't it? ... until we go back to previous verses (remember our historical stance of reading in context?) and verses 11 on to 15 don't seem in anyway to give allusion to the "Church." It just seems cut and dried to me, and I cannot see a double meaning. Paul was not an ace in brevity -- for sure he would have expounded on that, if that was what he meant.
But, I am listening ...

 

[moicherie]

No, because it wasn't through her womb that the savior was born.

But I read something about this verse just recently that I think to be interesting.

Women back then were not treated with high regard by men. In fact, for the most part they were belittled, and thus led to believe that they weren't important. Even in terms of salvation they were frowned upon by certain men who did not even see them as being worth saving.

And so it was believed that women just weren't important.

And Paul, in saying this about child bearing, was disclosing that a woman would come to know her worth in bearing and raising up children. For, this is one of the most wonderful responsibilities!

And so in child bearing, a woman came to see that she was important, and that there was a place for her in this world.

And this idea is actually fitting for ther concept of salvation. For, what does the concept of salvation disclose to the sinner? That he is worth something, that he is important. Thus, the woman would come to know that she isn't a dog, but a queen with a very important purpose in life! Hence, she would be "saved through bearing children".

Anyway, that's the idea that I got from one scholar. I think it does make some sense out of the verse. What do you think?

Interesting and it makes sense for a culture where a woman was considered nothing. Remember how radical it was for Jesus to talk to the Samaritan woman? In our society where we just can't understand such a almost mysgonist concept - i.e women being nothing it would make sense to other cultures where this is still the case (unfortunately).

 

[woobadooba]

We all know that there is sometimes a double meaning to what is said in the Bible.

Could this "woman" in this verse be the Church?

When you think about this in the context of the woman being the Church it may start to make some sense.

It's not likely. When you look at the context of the entire passage it makes a reference to Eve who represents womankind, but no where is there a reference made to the church. In fact, no where in the entire Bible is Eve associated with the church in that the church is likened to her. So this is one hint that it isn't referring to the church.

Another hint is that it goes on to speak of "women" in general. Thus it is in the plural. And if it were referring to the church, it would not be in the plural, but it would be "woman", rather than "women", since the church is always referred to in the Bible in the singular, because it is that entity which is made up by the totality of those who believe in Jesus.