What day is the sabath what day does the bible say?

[klutedavid]

I'm not confused I'm a seventh day Adventist!

I would prefer that you confess the name of Jesus Christ and call yourself a Christian.

You were called to follow Jesus and not some church division. Paul warned the Corinthians against this desire to develop factions.

1 Corinthians 1:10-14
Now I exhort you, brethren, by the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that you all agree and that there be no divisions among you, but that you be made complete in the same mind and in the same judgment. For I have been informed concerning you, my brethren, by Chloe’s people, that there are quarrels among you. Now I mean this, that each one of you is saying, “I am of Paul,” and “I of Apollos,” and “I of Cephas,” and “I of Christ.”

'I of SDA', 'I of Protestant', 'I of JW', I of Morman, I of Catholic, I of Baptist, I of Lutheran. On and on it goes, interpretation after interpretation, where it stops we do know and only when Jesus returns.

 

[klutedavid]

And it is to be done in Spirit and in Truth, which can be different from the letter, but/and is superior to the letter, etc...

Thanks,

God Bless!

Any time my friend in Christ.

 

[Soyeong]

In the time of Jesus that was most certainly true and Jesus was sent only to the Jews.

Jesus began his ministry with the Gospel message to repent from our sins for the Kingdom of God was at hand (Matthew 4:17-23) and the Mosaic Law was how his audience knew what sin is, so repenting from our disobedience to it is an integral part of the Gospel of Christ, which he also commission his disciples to teach to the nations.

Above all, the whole purpose for the nation of Israel was to usher in the Christ. Not so much teaching a repentance from sin to other nations.

Israel was in the whole a rebellious nation and this opposition to God was magnified in that they would ultimately crucify their own messiah.

The whole purpose of Israel is to act as a light to the nations, which is certainly done though ushering in Christ, but is by no means limited to that. In John 5:46, Jesus said that Moses wrote about him, in Luke 24:27, Jesus began with Moses and the Prophets interpreting to them all of the things in Scripture concerning himself, in Hebrews 10:7, the volume of the scroll is written about Jesus, in Romans 10:4, Jesus is the goal of the Law for righteousness for everyone who has faith, and in Romans 3:21-22, the Law and the Prophets testify that the righteousness of God comes through faith in Christ for everyone who believes, so teaching the Law to the nations is acting as a light to the nations through testifying about who Christ is.

How good or bad of a job the Israelites have done of performing this role does not change the fact that it is their God-given role.

Walking in the footsteps of Jesus is obeying the law of Christ. The apostle Paul pushed love to the extreme and that is what He taught the Gentiles. Love for others and God was in itself the ultimate expression of the Christian life.

Love is poured into our hearts by Jesus and that love for others is written in our hearts. Not a legalism as such, obey the Sabbath and your loving others by obeying that Sabbath. Not coveting the neighbor's oxen is not loving others.

1 Timothy 1:5
But the goal of our instruction is love from a pure heart and a good conscience and a sincere faith.

Jesus set a sinless example of how to walk in obedience to the Mosaic Law, so that is what it looks like to walk in his footsteps. God is not in disagreement with Himself about which laws we should follow, so the Law of Christ is the same as the Law of the Spirit and the Law of the Father, which was given to Moses. The sum of everything that Jesus taught by word and by example was to obey the Mosaic Law, so it wouldn't make any sense to think that the Law of Christ was something other than what he taught. In Matthew 22:36-40, Jesus summarized the Mosaic Law as being about how to love God and our neighbor, so obedience to God's Law is what it looks like to love Him and our neighbor. The Mosaic Law is certainly how the Israelites knew how to obey those two commandments, and it shouldn't mean something different to us.

Correction on this point.

The whole reason for the law was to reveal sin for what it was, and how sin demanded that the messiah fill that gap between us and God.

That blood sacrifice removed the fatal penalty of sin.

The main purpose of giving someone instructions is to teaching them about something and no one gives instructions for the main purpose of showing someone how bad they are at following those instructions. The Law was given to teach us about who God is, so the mark is God's ways or character traits, and by teaching how to hit the mark through expressing God's character traits the Law also indirectly teaches us about what it means to miss the mark, and sin is missing the mark.

Negative, we are a brand new creation in Christ, fully reconciled to the Father through the blood of Jesus Christ.

Romans 5:10
For if while we were enemies we were reconciled to God through the death of His Son.

2 Corinthians 5:18
Now all these things are from God, who reconciled us to Himself through Christ and gave us the ministry of reconciliation.

2 Corinthians 5:20
Therefore, we are ambassadors for Christ, as though God were making an appeal through us; we beg you on behalf of Christ, be reconciled to God.

Colossians 1:22
Yet He has now reconciled you in His fleshly body through death, in order to present you before Him holy and blameless and beyond reproach.

There is nothing about saying this:

"and we are followers of the same God with the same ways and the same instructions for how to walk in His ways."

that is in disagreement with any of the verses that you posted. For example, the way to act in accordance with God's righteousness is based on God's righteousness, not on any particular covenant, and God's righteousness is eternal, so any instructions that God has ever given for how to do what is righteous are eternally valid. We are under the same God with the same eternal righteousness and therefore the same eternals instructions for how to act in accordance with His eternal righteousness. For example, it will always be in accordance with God's righteousness to help the poor no matter how many covenants God makes, so that command is valid for all followers of God, and even those who are not followers of God, such as when God will judge the world for their sin in Revelation.

 

[klutedavid]

Yes, we should concern ourselves with what is internal. So why are Catholics condemned by some Protestant on the external of Catholicism such as graven images, praying the Rosary, praying to Mary, etc? I, as a Catholic, would never condemn someone for not participating in these externals. The Catholic Church has never taught that it is a sin to do these externals. They are mere aides to bring us closer to Christ. If you choose not to use these aide then that is OK. You have not sinned if you do not choose to do them. But many Protestants accuse us of sinning for doing these externals. It matters not whether our relationship with Christ is personal, written on our hearts.

Would you agree that others should not judge us Catholics for the externals of Catholicism?

Probably because a statue is an external entity.

Christ is within and is not external.

 

[packermann]

That is because they apply what is called an interpretation to the scripture. A method of reading the scripture and placing emphasis on specific verses or ideas mentioned in the scripture. So any verse may not be read at it's face value as it may mean something else within an interpretation.

You are not far from the kingdom.

That is why sola scriptura does not work. All of us interpret the Bible. And although the Bible is infallible, our interpretation of the Bible is not. The Bible is only as infallible as the one who is interpreting it. I just cannot believe that God would leave us with this dilemma. My God would not only leave us with an infallible Bible but an infallible Interpreter to that Bible.

So what is that infallible Interpreter? Some say the Holy Spirit. I agree. But the problem is that each individual person thinks that the Holy Spirit is leading him to his interpretation. So it cannot be that the Holy Spirit leading each individual, but the church collectively. But which church? The Baptist church? The Methodist church? The problem is that they cannot agree. And none of these Protestant churches would say that they are infallible. Even more so, none of the Protestant churches go back any further than 500 years ago. So how could Christians have survived the first 15 centuries without the truth?

The only Church that could even come close to going all the way back to Christ and the apostles is the Catholic Church (with special mention given to the Orthodox churches, and it is amazing how in many areas that the Catholic Church and Orthodoxy are in agreement - such as the Eucharist, veneration of Mary, the sacraments, the importance of tradition, etc.). I believe that only here can the Holy Spirit have guided the Christians for 20 centuries with the right interpretation of the Bible.

 

[packermann]

I give up. Why do you think they do?

I have been a Protestant, and now I am a Catholic. All the externals of Catholicism are mere aids to bring me closer to Christ - the sacraments, devotion to Mary, the Rosary, images in the church, etc. Through these aids, I am closer to Christ than ever before, just as the Bible and other spiritual books bring me closer to Christ. I have a deep desire to pray to Him and to serve Him. I have a horror of sin and there is nothing more that I want than to please Him. I am madly in love with Him. He is my all in all.

 

[charsan]

So basically your saying the church gets to fill in the blanks as it sees fit and the rest of us should just accept what it says? Even though it may not be what God intended?

And who are you or I to say what God wants when He purposely put in the Bible that the Church is the pillar an foundation of truth. Christ left a Church not every individual to decide what to do for themselves. You may follow you, I will follow what Christ instituted and called the pillar and foundation of truth the Church.

 

[Semper-Fi]

That is why the Jewish religious days occur on the same day every year.

The weekly cycle, which runs concurrently
with but independently of the monthly
and annual cycles.
Hebrew calendar - Wikipedia

Months
The Hebrew calendar is a lunisolar calendar, meaning that months are based on lunar months, but years are based on solar years.[12]
x

Pentecost is the only convocation of Gods
that stays the same day of the week.[sunday] This day is figured by counting to [50].
-

But Other Holy Convocations fall on different
days of the week. Here is an example:

Apr. 19, 2019 Passover- a friday
Apr. 10, 2017 Passover- a monday.

Passover, and the 7 day of Unleavened bread was started, and declaired a Memorial, ordained forever, before one word of the old covenent was spoken.
-

"this do in remembrance of me"
this is the start of the 14th [passover]

Do what in remembrance of me?
They were taking the Passover.

Jesus changed the symbles of the
passover only, did not do away with it.

1Co 5:6 Your glorying is not good. Know ye not that a little leaven leaveneth the whole lump? Purge out therefore the old leaven, that ye may be a new lump, as ye are unleavened. For even Christ our passover is sacrificed for us:

1Co 5:8 Therefore let us keep [the feast], not with old leaven, neither with the leaven of malice and wickedness; but with the unleavened bread of sincerity and truth.

And he said that to a Gentile church,
to keep the feast of unleavened bread.
[the feast] of unleavened bread, was
[the night to be most remembered]

The New testament church keep it.

Acts 12:3 (KJV)
And because he saw it pleased the Jews, he proceeded further to take Peter also. (Then were the days of unleavened bread.)

Acts 20:6 (KJV)
And we sailed away from Philippi after (the days of unleavened bread), and came unto them to Troas in five days; where we abode seven days.

Even was keep after the apostles died.
Quartodecimanism
Quartodecimanism - Wikipedia

 

[packermann]

Probably because a statue is an external entity.

Christ is within and is not external.

But you are judging me on an external. If we are not to judge someone on whether a person worships God on a Saturday or a Sunday then why should you judge me if looking at a statue of Jesus suffering on the cross helps me to love Him more? Why the tolerance to the Seventh-Day Adventist but not to the Catholic?

I am not telling you that you must look at the statue. If you can grow in love with Christ without it, I praise God. But why should you judge me if this helps me?

And please do not quote verses in the Old Testament about graven images. The Old Testament also condemns not resting on Saturday - it even orders that the Sabbath breaker should be executed! So if the Sabbath is not a big deal to you then be consistent and say that whether or not a person views a statue is also no big deal - what matters is Christ within.

 

[Toro]

Protestants do not even agree on the important stuff, not just the details. They cannot even agree how one is saved! Are we saved by accepting Jesus as Savior and Lord (John MacArthur)? Or are we saved by asking Jesus to be our Savior alone (Charles Ryrie)? Can we lose our salvation (Free-Will Baptists, Assemblies of God, Methodists)? Or can we never lose our salvation (Reformed, most Baptists)? Is one born-again by praying a prayer (Baptists, Assemblies of God)? Or is one born-again by water baptism (Lutherans)?

Each one uses the Bible to support their position.

If one is led by the Holy Spirit... all else ARE merely details.

I do not agree with most of the practice ls found in Catholicism, but one can share a theology with Catholicism and be led by the Spirit.

Just because a brother or sister in Christ do not agree with me on theology, practices or insert any other denominational requirement here.... we dont need to see eye to eye on ebery issue.

The ONLY thing that matters is where Jesus is in the heart.... all the right doctrines, practices or theology in the world are meaningless IF Jesus is not first in the heart and mind. IF Christ is NOT first, it amounts to nothing more than a pharisee.

If a brother or sister has Christ first in the heart... let Him guide them in Spirit and let me shut my mouth and not fight my brother or sister over issues of practices through flesh.... IF the Holy Spirit is IN them, leading them and I argue with that guidance... do I NOT find myself in opposition to God?

Was Peter not used by the devil and rebuked by Jesus in Matthew 16:21-23. All Peter thought he was doing is being supportive... instead he found out he was used by the devil.

IF Peter were unknowing being used as an attempt to be a stumbling block... how much more shall we be cautious to encourage rather than tear down?

Is that to say we be soft and excuse all things and allow one who calls themselves brother or sister... but is clearly in danger of being lost to remain on that path? No... but there is a HUGE difference between one thats excuses their living in sin... and one that chooses to show thanks to the Lord in a way that is different to your own.

IF one is to say sin is okay...... clearly they are in need of loving and serious correction.... but what business is it of mine to say the one that dedicates a day, a meal..... whatever.. to the Lord is wrong... just because I disaggree.... as long as they do it to, in love with and for the Lord.... that is between them and the Lord.

Let any member of any denomination do as they please..... as long as they FIRST seek the Lord always so they are not deceived and keep the Lord as FIRST in their heart.

Arguing doesnt change hearts nor minds... the Spirit does.

 

[Neogaia777]

But you are judging me on an external. If we are not to judge someone on whether a person worships God on a Saturday or a Sunday then why should you judge me if looking at a statue of Jesus suffering on the cross helps me to love Him more? Why the tolerance to the Seventh-Day Adventist but not to the Catholic?

I am not telling you that you must look at the statue. If you can grow in love with Christ without it, I praise God. But why should you judge me if this helps me?

And please do not quote verses in the Old Testament about graven images. The Old Testament also condemns not resting on Saturday - it even orders that the Sabbath breaker should be executed! So if the Sabbath is not a big deal to you then be consistent and say that whether or not a person views a statue is also no big deal - what matters is Christ within.

Would not having them make you feel further away from God, or that God was further away from you...?

Cause that's the only thing I would be a little bit apprehensive about or afraid of...?

Cause I think then I would deem it and idol in some aspects...?

God Bless!

 

[packermann]

Would not having them make you feel further away from God, or that God was further away from you...?

I would feel the same way if you did not have your Bible? Would you then feel further way from God? Or would you feel that God is further way from you?

Cause I think then I would deem it and idol in some aspects...?

Would you say that the Bible is an idol in some aspects? Is not the Bible an external?

 

[Neogaia777]

Would not having them make you feel further away from God, or that God was further away from you...?

Cause that's the only thing I would be a little bit apprehensive about or afraid of...?

Cause I think then I would deem it and idol in some aspects...?

God Bless!

But even in that case, I definitely don't think you'd be alone in having some "idols" in your life, even if that is the case, etc...

I just hope we are forgiven, and have God's great Love and Mercy covering us...

But, what is to happen, or what is supposed to happen if one does become aware that a thing might be an idol in their life or not...? Afterward, etc...?

Again, I don't know if it is or they are, and even if they were, I would not be the one who is to judge you for it, but if it's something that, if you had to do without it/them, would make you feel further away from God or that God was further away from you then...?

Well, I just think you'd need to just ask yourself that question anyway, and do what you think or feel is "accordingly" afterwards...

God Bless!

 

[Neogaia777]

I would feel the same way if you did not have your Bible? Would you then feel further way from God? Or would you feel that God is further way from you?

That's an excellent question, but can the Word of God be considered an "idol"...?

I've been in jail for and extended period of time, and I just know I really wanted to be able to bring just my little pocket Bible in with me, and they let me, and I was very glad for it, etc...

Later on I got pencil and paper, and was very glad for that or those as well...

I'd have to say I would have felt pretty lost in there without a Bible, which might mean that I felt I was further away from God or that God was further away from me maybe...?

Would you say that the Bible is an idol in some aspects? Is not the Bible an external?

Again that's a very good question, can the Bible itself be considered and "idol"...? I just know it's not a "graven image" though...?

But we consider other "things" "idols" that are not graven images as well, so when and where do we draw the line, and should we even...?

What about someone, like a Satan worshiper or something, was using pentagrams and other very real idols, statues of Satanic God's etc, killing things and shedding their blood on Satanic altars and such, etc...? Or then what about other places of the world with other religions who use statues and the like...?

Again, where do we draw the line...?

God Bless!

 

[klutedavid]

The weekly cycle, which runs concurrently
with but independently of the monthly
and annual cycles.
Hebrew calendar - Wikipedia

Months
The Hebrew calendar is a lunisolar calendar, meaning that months are based on lunar months, but years are based on solar years.[12]
x

Pentecost is the only convocation of Gods
that stays the same day of the week.[sunday] This day is figured by counting to [50].
-

But Other Holy Convocations fall on different
days of the week. Here is an example:

Apr. 19, 2019 Passover- a friday
Apr. 10, 2017 Passover- a monday.

Passover, and the 7 day of Unleavened bread was started, and declaired a Memorial, ordained forever, before one word of the old covenent was spoken.
-

"this do in remembrance of me"
this is the start of the 14th [passover]

Do what in remembrance of me?
They were taking the Passover.

Jesus changed the symbles of the
passover only, did not do away with it.

1Co 5:6 Your glorying is not good. Know ye not that a little leaven leaveneth the whole lump? Purge out therefore the old leaven, that ye may be a new lump, as ye are unleavened. For even Christ our passover is sacrificed for us:

1Co 5:8 Therefore let us keep [the feast], not with old leaven, neither with the leaven of malice and wickedness; but with the unleavened bread of sincerity and truth.

And he said that to a Gentile church,
to keep the feast of unleavened bread.
[the feast] of unleavened bread, was
[the night to be most remembered]

The New testament church keep it.

Acts 12:3 (KJV)
And because he saw it pleased the Jews, he proceeded further to take Peter also. (Then were the days of unleavened bread.)

Acts 20:6 (KJV)
And we sailed away from Philippi after (the days of unleavened bread), and came unto them to Troas in five days; where we abode seven days.

Even was keep after the apostles died.
Quartodecimanism
Quartodecimanism - Wikipedia

So what is a lunar month and what is a solar month?

 

[Semper-Fi]

Yeshua HaDerekh said: ↑
First, God does not need to rest, we do.

That's not what God says in scripture.

Gen 2:2 And on the seventh day God ended his work which he had made; and he rested on the seventh day from all his work which
he had made.

The Sabbath was made, not by work,
but by rest. What He ended on the seventh
day was the work of creation—that which
was created by work! On the seventh day He rested! He created the Sabbath by resting.

He was not fatigued, nor He was forced to stop and rest. "For God “fainteth not, neither is weary”! (Isaiah 40:28).

Yet, this was a real rest "and was refreshed.”
He made the Sabbath day by resting,whereas He had made all other things by working.

He “blessed the seventh day, and sanctified it” To “set apart, this day for holy use or purpose.”

God is holy , Moses took off his shoes on Holy ground because God was there that made the ground holy. God’s presence is in His Sabbath.

He went into the synagogues as His custom was

 

[charsan]

Would you say that the Bible is an idol in some aspects

If I may. Yes the Bible is an idol to many evangelicals who take it as the highest authority and worship their Bible thinking everything must be in there

 

[Kaon]

It can't be, the lunar phases would not be in sync and also when you have the new moon (Rosh Chodesh) it would not overlap into the next new month, it would have to start a new pattern.
Shabbat Shalom Kaon

Chag Sameach

The lunar and stellar phases are perfectly in sync: each weekly Sabbath is roughly a lunar quarter, and without going into astronomical/physical details the alignment of the stars map out our temporal location as well. Most times the incredibly astronomical precision is marginalized into astrology (zodiac), but as a mathematician looking in - it goes way beyond astronomy and astrology. The system is coded; the fact that the phases and stars don't perfectly line up is supposed to let us know about the age in which we live, and the disorder already present and to come.


Why start a new pattern? Months are arbitrary except to locate holy convocations and holy days of the Most High God. It become easy to tell time because all you have to do is look up and you can determine the general time of "month", whether a Sabbath is coming up, or whether one has passed. A general awareness of self (meaning you can discern the physical, chemical, mathematical and astronomical changes associated with certain times of year) will allow you to determine whether one of seven holy days is near - assuming you don't know what month you are in.


The Most High God tells us to continue to count the Sabbaths - more than a months worth - to get to Pentecost. When talking about Tishri 1 (Trumpet), He tells us to recognize it as the 7th new moon (the number again). Your weekly Sabbath still holds, because as said He already disregarded the logic of our monthly system of comparing Sabbaths (restart every month) when He told the Hebrews to count seven Sabbaths to Pentecost. The overlap is just overlap - a selah. The Moon is used to highlight the high Sabbaths and feasts of the Most High God, but we have a perpetual Weekly Sabbath (literally meaning 7) that we follow based on the raw day of year - from new moon after spring Equinox to new moon after spring Equinox. Whatever day Passover falls on should be the Weekly Sabbath day for the year.


I want to be clear that despite my vehemence toward my point, I know the Most High God will correct whoever cares how to follow His Holy Days, and whomever makes the effort - including me. I think anyone trying to follow a Sabbath is doing well, since they are trying.

 

[GingerBeer]

Jesus kept the Sabbath holy, which confirms that it was on the correct day.

The religious teachers of Jesus day said he broke the sabbath. He healed a man and told the man he healed to rise up and carry his bed. So the religious teachers were sure he broke the sabbath and taught others to do so. Would you advise a person to carry their bed on the day that you count as the Sabbath?

 

[GingerBeer]

God commanded His followers to keep the 7th day Sabbath holy

That is true only of Israel. Yahweh commanded Israel to keep Sabbath. Jesus didn't command Christians to keep it. Nor did the apostles. Nor did Paul.

 

[Kaon]

The religious teachers of Jesus day said he broke the sabbath. He healed a man and told the man he healed to rise up and carry his bed. So the religious teachers were sure he broke the sabbath and taught others to do so. Would you advice a person to carry their bed on the day that you count as the Sabbath?

The religious teachers of Jesus's day had some nerve claiming the Word of God went against Himself - and "worked" on the Sabbath. The Redeemer never broke the Sabbath; the leaders were so incredibly ignorant of the Word of God and its function that they institutionalized the day with dogma - missing the fact (as the Redeemer said) the Sabbath was made for man - not the other way around.

We should understand you shouldn't starve to death because you cant pick an grain to eat on the Sabbath - how can you commune with the Most High God if you are focused on being faint? And, what "work" is it to the Word of God to heal a man so that they both can rest on the Sabbath - rather than letting the one wither, and the Word of God worry?

Adam 2 (The Redeemer/Word of God) is teaching us how to juxtaposition spirit and physical existence. On one hand, he is a Iron ruler of the Law, and on the other hand He understands Himself/The Law on such a profound level that He knows how to navigate it perfectly without drifting into institutional dogma, or into blind spiritual zealotry. He never went against Himself (the Word of God).