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What can Orthodox Christians do during the peaceful riots plaguing our cities?

Discussion in 'The Ancient Way - Eastern Orthodox' started by Justin-H.S., Aug 26, 2020.

  1. Hermit76

    Hermit76 You can call me Paisios Supporter

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    My car broke down tonight in a rural area. We call the police because we are in a bad place. He shows up and the first thing I tell him is that I have a concealed carry permit and I have a gun in the car. I ask him if I can take it out and put it in my son's car. My wife also had 2 guns.
    Because I was honest, played by the rules, and didn't pose a threat there wasn't a problem. I have taught in urban schools. The problem isn't police. The problem isn't race. The problem is a growing disrespect for everyone. Yes there are too many killings by police. Yes some of them are unjustified. However the issue of respect and personal responsibility must be part of the discussion.
    I have sympathy for the issue. I don't think the point is invalid. But the movement needs to stop causing destruction and chaos and accept responsibility for the actions of criminals. This boy had warrants and was the subject of a domestic disturbance call. Any other time there would be outrage because he is a serial abuser. He gets plugged for fighting and resisting and suddenly he's a hero. Surely to goodness out of 1,000 people they can find a martyr that's not a career criminal.
     
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  2. rusmeister

    rusmeister A Russified American Orthodox Chestertonian

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    That’s the essential problem. They have chosen to cast and see these people as innocent victims, and facts that contradict that narrative are simply ignored. Driving a narrative of an essentially unjust and racist America is priority.
    Again, I live in Russia, and have actually been unjustly arrested for literally no cause, strip-searched, jailed and robbed by corrupt cops. Most of you don’t know anything of real injustice at the hands of the police. It makes me mad to see people claiming injustice in far more egregious circumstances.
     
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  3. Justin-H.S.

    Justin-H.S. Retrograde

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    There’s a series on Amazon Prime called “A Man Rampant” which is a series of interviews by Pastor Doug Wilson (a reformed pastor who often visits colleges to give talks for the conservative students who request it). There was one talk in which the person he interviewed and himself were talking about how the culture is (and even Christian culture) is now feminized in that Empathy is the preferred MO and not Sympathy. They go on to explain the difference between Empathy and Sympathy, and how Sympathy is the preferred emotional response. Your use of ‘Sympathy’ reminded me of that.

    If I had to describe the difference between the two: Empathy would be to find a drowning person and you jump in to help, but you end up possibly drowning with them. Sympathy would be to find a drowning person and you throw out a rope to pull them ashore. Essentially, the Incarnation is an example of sympathy by God.

     
    Last edited: Aug 30, 2020
  4. gzt

    gzt The age of the Earth is 4.54 ± 0.07 billion years

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    Doug Wilson is a protestant who defends slavery, he has no place on an Orthodox board
     
  5. Platina

    Platina Active Member

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    Nothing says only Orthodox sources or authors or speakers can be referred to.
     
  6. Justin-H.S.

    Justin-H.S. Retrograde

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    Isn’t the Orthodox position that “Truth is everywhere present and fills all things?”

    That’s how I look at worldly knowledge. If it comports with Truth, I will listen because God is not limited to speaking only through Orthodox people. Demanding that God speaks only through the Orthodox tries to put a limit on God, I’d think, as well as reducing Christianity to be just another tribe in a world full of tribes. Perhaps God will speak His Truth through the heterodox in order to humble the Orthodox?
     
  7. gzt

    gzt The age of the Earth is 4.54 ± 0.07 billion years

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    There's a reason I qualified with the slavery apologia as well
     
  8. gzt

    gzt The age of the Earth is 4.54 ± 0.07 billion years

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    I don't want to into an entire case here about him but posting far right non Orthodox figures like him isn't really topical
     
  9. Platina

    Platina Active Member

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    Well, this forum has had to endure pro-LGBT posts, race baiting posts, pro-rioting posts, and all kinds of non-Orthodox stuff. I imagine no one will get too upset about a Protestant talking about empathy vs. sympathy.
     
  10. Justin-H.S.

    Justin-H.S. Retrograde

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    Do you mean TAW or CF? I have to admit I don’t see much pro-gressive posts on TAW, but CF itself (and especially the secular areas) is very pro-gressive. If there were an Orthodox person speaking on the subject of Empathy and Sympathy, I’d post that, but I don’t know of any.
     
  11. Platina

    Platina Active Member

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    I mean TAW. Thankfully it's not a super common thing, but such posts and comments appear from time to time.
     
  12. Platina

    Platina Active Member

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    Unsurprisingly, it seems saying he defends slavery is misinformed at best.

    In this video: , when asked about slavery, he says:

    Slavery ended, and good riddance, in the western world everywhere else peaceably. Here we killed 600,000 in order to do it, and established a pattern of racial animosities that lasted well over a century. And that came from disobeying how the Bible said to do it. So the problem is not wanting to labor for the elimination of slavery. Prior to the war, 5/7 of all the anti-slavery societies that existed were in the south. Southerners knew they had a problem. This is not a long-term tenable situation—clearly, obviously not. The question is whether you kill buttloads of people to solve it. I don’t think we ought to have done that. I think we departed from the Pauline way of addressing social problems and opted for the revolutionary way. So when I reject the revolutionary way, many people think I am arguing for ongoing slavery as a positive good, like food, air, and sunshine. No. I object to the debt slavery that is so common in our society now—what the banks are doing to people and mortgaging our futures—a real tangible debt slavery. I object to that debt slavery but I don’t believe that we ought to storm the banks and execute the managers. Not revolution, but we have to do something…. This was a screaming social, religious, ethical problem, which cannot be solved by armies. That’s the point. But to say that armies can’t solve it is not to deny that there’s a problem. No, there was very clearly a problem, particularly the racial basis for slavery. I’ve pointed out that in the New Testament there were slaves and masters in the same congregations, and that would chafe the abolitionists when I point that out, but if I wanted to chafe a racist southerner, I would point out that all the slaves in the New Testament were white. They’re white slaves. Could a white man be a slave in the south? No. Why not? Doesn’t the New Testament allow for slavery? There was a racial component in there that’s alien to the Greco-Roman situation.

    .... So whether you agree with his position or not, it's certainly not one of defending slavery.
     
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  13. Justin-H.S.

    Justin-H.S. Retrograde

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    The etymology of “slave” is interesting, too. Apparently, it comes from the word “Slav” which is a people still in existence somewhere in the world, but I can’t quite put my finger on it...
     
  14. Hermit76

    Hermit76 You can call me Paisios Supporter

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    Without a SLAVE cylinder your clutch won't work.
     
  15. Justin-H.S.

    Justin-H.S. Retrograde

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    Abolish the FED. Bring back the gold standard. JP Morgan is stacking gold for a reason. It’s mathematically inevitable that the house of cards will fall. Hedge your wealth now before it’s too late. Start looking for silver spoons in antique shops. Buy now while spot price is relatively low.
     
  16. Hermit76

    Hermit76 You can call me Paisios Supporter

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    Our just buy some property in the middle of nowhere, a bunch of hand tools, and heirloom seeds.
     
  17. Justin-H.S.

    Justin-H.S. Retrograde

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    Guns, ammo, and medical as well.
     
  18. gzt

    gzt The age of the Earth is 4.54 ± 0.07 billion years

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    Wilson's public position is that he SAYS he thinks slavery sucks, but also argues the antebellum South was great, actually, and slavery shouldn't have ended the way it did. However, he basically tells the public this but tells his congregation privately that slavery was good, actually - about what you'd expect from somebody who calls their position paleo-Confederate. Further, he's got some real problems and is vehemently anti-Orthodox. cf Scandal in Moscow | The American Conservative and if you really want more details Pastor Doug Wilson, A Serial Pedophile, and the Real Victims I don't know if we really want to get into this on this board because we're drifting further off topic. I don't care what goes on in the rest of CF because they are a law unto themselves - I don't pray with heretics.
     
  19. InnerPhyre

    InnerPhyre Well-Known Member

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    I think the answer is to be Christians. Show radical levels of love toward your enemies.
     
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  20. Platina

    Platina Active Member

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    No doubt, but the question is what does that look like in this situation?
     
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