What are the differences and similarities between Wof and prosperity movements?

[Daniel Marsh]

What are the differences and similarities between Wof and prosperity movements?

Is there any other movements we should add to this discussion?

 

[com7fy8]

My opinion, as a guest here who has watched some number of TV prosperity and word of faith people >

If I may > each person is unique. And ones have morphed.

I think Joyce is one of the most interesting who has morphed.

She possibly has become much more Biblical. But even she seems . . . to me, of course > to still not give the word as well as the Bible does. If I am correct in this, this can be because any of us can be limited to how our true character has developed. We need to mature truly in order for us to give . . . and to live . . . a really mature Bible message.

 

[hhodgson]

My opinion, as a guest here who has watched some number of TV prosperity and word of faith people >

If I may > each person is unique. And ones have morphed.

I think Joyce is one of the most interesting who has morphed.

She possibly has become much more Biblical. But even she seems . . . to me, of course > to still not give the word as well as the Bible does. If I am correct in this, this can be because any of us can be limited to how our true character has developed. We need to mature truly in order for us to give . . . and to live . . . a really mature Bible message.

Good post com7fy8... I agree that she morphed into the movement (somewhat), then a few years ago she morphed away from some of the core teaching. She is a great faith teacher for sure... and continues to remain Word of Faith friendly.

Most, (if not all) the WOF teachers today are (more balanced) in the prosperity message... especially since the critics are really the ones that came up with the name phrase "prosperity gospel." There is only one gospel which is the gospel of Jesus Christ. I've heard some of the favorites in the movement say "there is no such thing as a prosperity gospel." Believe it or not...even Creflo Dollar is saying it and... it's about time! When I actually heard him say it... I quickly said "Thank you Lord." Now, we can be about our Father's business!

Have a great day...

 

[Richard T]

The movement that I watch is the one called New Apostolic Reformation or NAR. These are typically WOF people who have a different eschatology and governance system than most typical WOF churches. Part of this end time vision includes dominionism, such as their seven mountain mandate teachings. To an extent every charismatic/wof church I have been involved in has been influenced by this group. I am not passing judgment on them but I do think their differences are far greater than the prosperity gospel.

 

[com7fy8]

@Daniel Marsh > my impression is Joel Osteen is maybe a combination of both. He talks about using God's word and faith, plus he talks about how to prosper; but he does not only talk about material prosperity and using faith to get that.

@hhodgson >

If I may, here > I would like to share my personal take on him and his wife >

This might help to show, at least what I believe, how each minister is unique, really, not really to be put in some category >

I think Joel Osteen is a favorite "suspect" for ones criticizing word of faith and prosperity preaching. But there can be motives for criticizing him, whether he is legit or not.

He has a used basketball stadium which has been filled every time I saw him on TV before the COVID thing. He is said to have a place to live which cost millions.

So, I can be jealous, just to start off . . . since I can feel I myself should be heard around the world, since I can consider myself to be so expert in the Bible. Plus, others can secretly be jealous that he has money, and this can be their real reason for being critical. And there are pastors who might feel they are so right, that they should be the ones who have so many admirers.

In any case, I myself can indeed be self-righteously critical of ones who might indeed be wrong; so I can be the one who is more wrong because of how I am condemning instead of praying with hope for any and all people > love "hopes all things" (1 Corinthians 13:7).

My love companion selects certain ones on TBN, and I have watched some. She does not care for Joel, but I have watched him and his wife. I might not buy the emphasis of his attention, but he does have scriptures; and a lot of the time while he is ad libbing, I can think of the scriptures he could be referring to, though he does not actually mention or quote them; and I mean at times I could make a neckless of the verses which could be used with one of his sentences. So, yes I have been surprised. Yet, I am concerned about what gets the most attention. I suspect his messages tend to have the focus on how God will bless the individual listener, with not so much emphasis about getting blessed so I am all-loving and not mainly busy with how God will bless and heal and rescue me, myself, and I. But I think I remember that he does bring in caring about others. But now I understand that in Jesus it is not mainly or first so much about how each of us makes our own choices and gets oneself blessed by our faith; but we are a body and we depend on one another, as members of each other > we help each other; no one can do well on one's own > this is what I have learned, after . . . being much more about myself being so great and needed.

Even though I was not all-out accepting his messages, one day he off-handedly said he knows that having real friends is much greater wealth than what a lot of people consider to be prosperity. I was reacting, like, "how did someone like him know a thing like that?" Possibly, a person's material prosperity can be used by God as a foil to bring out how much more valuable it is for us to have genuine sharing with other Jesus people. And, of course, most of all is God Himself and sharing with Him and discovering how we become and love in submission with Him in His peace, and helping one another as family to grow in Jesus and how Jesus has us sharing with God and one another.

And I heard his wife, one time. Every word was scripture based, and she did not play attention to pet doctrine stuff. She was more no-nonsense, and plain and clear, than I have heard any preacher. But she seemed so right, that I now consider she could seem Bible-repetitious, and a number of us can't get ourselves to read the Bible; and so, if ones can't get themselves into the Bible, this could be why they can't get themselves into listening to her; so this could be why we would not want to listen to her > because there was nothing to criticize and look down on, for that matter. But I can't say if she always does this; it was one time, and I have my Bible and I have my own personal Jesus love people who are my examples.

 

[bèlla]

Daniel,

I don’t follow Word of Faith or prosperity teachings. But I read a lot and would never listen to a sermon until I had a sense of the person’s grounding in the word. Books are useful for sifting and seeing how they apply their thoughts to scripture.

Joyce and Joel have an ability to convey spiritual concepts in layman’s terms. Their messages are easy to follow for most.

Joel is a natural encourager. Many with that disposition have a positive attitude. There’s a motivational element to his message. This is where he goes awry with some. To receive the teaching as-is you’d need a lot of faith and maturity.

I’d liken him to a spiritual coach. But coaches and counselors are world’s apart. Those who seek coaches want to change. They’ve taken action and they’re seeking assistance with a stumbling block. They don’t require handholding.

Counseling is more involved and often requires confronting hard truths. It can be uncomfortable to undergo and there’s no guarantee they’ll stay the course. Joyce falls in this area. Her message is directed to women. She’s to the point and challenges their behavior frequently.

You can receive truth bombs from each. But some require a light touch and others a 2x4. Most are accustomed to hard hitting messages from the pulpit. We respond to some styles more than others.

I prefer straight talk that cuts to the chase and isn’t emotional. I don’t need a guilt trip or to hear I’ll be rich. I like Derek Prince. He’s the lone one I listen to.

Yours in His Service,

~Bella

 

[Daniel Marsh]

thanks all