What about Revelation 11:1-2 SANCTUARY, COURT AND HOLY CITY

[LittleLambofJesus]

The "time of the judgment of the dead", and "wrath", and "reward", and destruction in Revelation 11:18 reveal the Book of Revelation is not in chronological order.
The 7th trumpet is the end, instead of the middle, of the tribulation period.

.

Also, the full consummation of the age and end of all things happens at the pouring out of the 7th bowl of wrath upon 70ad Jerusalem [Revelation 16:17].

Matthew 24, Mark 13 and Luke's Temple/Jerusalem Discourses harmonized- Poll Thread

Matthew 24:3
Yet of Him sitting on the Mount of the Olives, the Disciples came toward to Him according to own saying "be telling to us!
when shall these be being?
and what the sign of Thy parousia<3952> and full-consummation<4930> of the Age?
Luke 21
7 They inquire yet of Him saying “Teacher! when then shall these be being? And what the sign whenever may be being about<3195> these to becoming<1096>?

Visual Timeline of the Roman-Jewish War ARTchive
THE ROMAN-JEWISH WAR

Luke 21:9
“Yet whenever ye should be hearing battles and tumults<181>, no may be being frightened<4422>, for is binding these to be becoming,
but not immediately the End<5056>

1Co 15:24
Then the End<5056>, when He delivers the kingdom to God the Father, when He puts an end to all rule and all authority and power.

1 Peter 4:7
Of all-things yet, the End<5056> is nigh<1448>.
Be sane then, and be sober into the prayers,

Revelation 16:17
and the seventh Messenger pours out His bowl/vial into the air<109>
and came out great Voice from the Sanctuary of the heaven from the Throne saying "it has become!"<1096> [Revelation 21:6]

The Destruction of Jerusalem - George Peter Holford, 1805AD
Proof that Matthew 24 was fully fulfilled in 70 AD!
Also see: Rapture refuted

The vial of divine wrath, which had been so long pouring out upon this devoted city was now emptying, and JERUSALEM, once "a praise in all the earth," and the subject of a thousand prophecies, deprived of' the staff of life, wrapt in flames, and bleeding on every side sunk into utter ruin and desolation.

This memorable siege terminated on the eighth day of the ninth month, A. D. 70 : its duration was nearly five months, the Romans having invested the city on the fourteenth day of the fourth month, preceeding.

Before their final demolition, however, Titus took, a survey of the city and its fortifications ; and, while contemplating their impregnable strength, could not help ascribing his success to the peculiar interposition of the ALMIGHTY HIMSELF. "Had not God himself (exclaimed he) aided out operations, and driven the Jews from their fortresses, it would have been absolutely impossible to have taken them ;
for what could men, and the force of engines, have done against such towers as these ?
==============================

 

[iamlamad]

The "time of the judgment of the dead", and "wrath", and "reward", and destruction in Revelation 11:18 reveal the Book of Revelation is not in chronological order.
The 7th trumpet is the end, instead of the middle, of the tribulation period.

.

It is no one's fault except your own that you don't understand John's chronology.

 

[LittleLambofJesus]

d p...............

 

[BABerean2]

It is no one's fault except your own that you don't understand John's chronology.

Great Errors in Dispensational Eschatology: Pastor John Otis

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[BABerean2]

Also, the full consummation of the age and end of all things happens at the pouring out of the 7th bowl of wrath upon 70ad Jerusalem [Revelation 16:17].

All man-made doctrines are revealed not by the scripture quoted by its proponents, but rather by the scripture they must ignore to make it work.
Your 70 AD doctrine is an excellent example of this principle.

Did the greatest earthquake in history happen during 70 AD?

Did all of the islands move, and did all of the mountains disappear during 70 AD?

Did all the cities of the nations fall during 70 AD?

Ignore the scripture found below, and maybe you can make your viewpoint of 70 AD work.


Rev 16:1 And I heard a great voice out of the temple saying to the seven angels, Go your ways, and pour out the vials of the wrath of God upon the earth.
Rev 16:2 And the first went, and poured out his vial upon the earth; and there fell a noisome and grievous sore upon the men which had the mark of the beast, and upon them which worshipped his image.
Rev 16:3 And the second angel poured out his vial upon the sea; and it became as the blood of a dead man: and every living soul died in the sea.
Rev 16:4 And the third angel poured out his vial upon the rivers and fountains of waters; and they became blood.
Rev 16:5 And I heard the angel of the waters say, Thou art righteous, O Lord, which art, and wast, and shalt be, because thou hast judged thus.
Rev 16:6 For they have shed the blood of saints and prophets, and thou hast given them blood to drink; for they are worthy.
Rev 16:7 And I heard another out of the altar say, Even so, Lord God Almighty, true and righteous are thy judgments.
Rev 16:8 And the fourth angel poured out his vial upon the sun; and power was given unto him to scorch men with fire.
Rev 16:9 And men were scorched with great heat, and blasphemed the name of God, which hath power over these plagues: and they repented not to give him glory.
Rev 16:10 And the fifth angel poured out his vial upon the seat of the beast; and his kingdom was full of darkness; and they gnawed their tongues for pain,
Rev 16:11 And blasphemed the God of heaven because of their pains and their sores, and repented not of their deeds.
Rev 16:12 And the sixth angel poured out his vial upon the great river Euphrates; and the water thereof was dried up, that the way of the kings of the east might be prepared.
Rev 16:13 And I saw three unclean spirits like frogs come out of the mouth of the dragon, and out of the mouth of the beast, and out of the mouth of the false prophet.
Rev 16:14 For they are the spirits of devils, working miracles, which go forth unto the kings of the earth and of the whole world, to gather them to the battle of that great day of God Almighty.
Rev 16:15 Behold, I come as a thief. Blessed is he that watcheth, and keepeth his garments, lest he walk naked, and they see his shame.
Rev 16:16 And he gathered them together into a place called in the Hebrew tongue Armageddon.
Rev 16:17 And the seventh angel poured out his vial into the air; and there came a great voice out of the temple of heaven, from the throne, saying, It is done.
Rev 16:18 And there were voices, and thunders, and lightnings; and there was a great earthquake, such as was not since men were upon the earth, so mighty an earthquake, and so great.
Rev 16:19 And the great city was divided into three parts, and the cities of the nations fell: and great Babylon came in remembrance before God, to give unto her the cup of the wine of the fierceness of his wrath.
Rev 16:20 And every island fled away, and the mountains were not found.
Rev 16:21 And there fell upon men a great hail out of heaven, every stone about the weight of a talent: and men blasphemed God because of the plague of the hail; for the plague thereof was exceeding great.

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[LittleLambofJesus]

All man-made doctrines are revealed not by the scripture quoted by its proponents, but rather by the scripture they must ignore to make it work.
Your 70 AD doctrine is an excellent example of this principle.
Did the greatest earthquake in history happen during 70 AD?
Did all of the islands move, and did all of the mountains disappear during 70 AD?
Did all the cities of the nations fall during 70 AD?
Ignore the scripture found below, and maybe you can make your viewpoint of 70 AD work.
.

1st century 70AD Jerusalem is in Revelation 18.
=====================
What great City is being symbolized in Revelation?

Is Jerusalem 70 ad the great City in Revelation?

1. 
   
   • *
     Yes
     6 vote(s)
     24.0%
   • No
     13 vote(s)
     52.0%
   • Maybe
     1 vote(s)
     4.0%
   • Never thought about it that way
     0 vote(s)
     0.0%
   • I don't know, but am willing to learn
     0 vote(s)
     0.0%
   • Why does it matter?
     0 vote(s)
     0.0%
   • Other [please explain]
     4 vote(s)
     16.0%
   • It is Rome
     1 vote(s)
     4.0%

 

[LittleLambofJesus]

Revelation 11:2
and the Court/Fold<833> without of the Sanctuary, be casting-out!<ἔκβαλε/ekbale1544> outside/without<1854> and no it thou should be measuring, that it was given to the Gentiles/Nations.
And the holy City they shall be trampling<3961>forty two months.
===============================
The COURT. Definitions and along with 12 verses in Revelation......

Used mainly in conjunction with the 1st century OC Priesthood........

Strong's Concordance with Hebrew and Greek Lexicon

STRONGS NT 833: αὐλή
αὐλή, -ῆς, ἡ, (ἄω to blow; hence) properly, a place open to the air (διαπνεόμενος τόπος αὐλὴ λέγεται, Athen. 5, 15, p. 189 b.);
1. among the Greeks in Homer's time an uncovered space around the house, enclosed by a wall, in which the stables stood (Homer, Odyssey 9, 185; Iliad 4, 433); hence, among the Orientals that roofless enclosure in the open country in which flocks were herded at night, a sheepfold: John 10:1, 16.
2. the uncovered court-yard of the house, Hebrew חָצֵר, the Sept. αὐλή, Vulg. atrium. In the O. T. particularly of the courts of the tabernacle and of the temple at Jerusalem; so in the N. T. once: Revelation 11:2 (τὴν αὐλὴν τήν ἔξωθεν [Rec.st ἔσωθεν] τοῦ ναοῦ). The dwellings of the higher classes usually had two αὐλαί, one exterior, between the door and the street, called also προαύλιον (which see); the other interior, surrounded by the buildings of the dwelling itself. The latter is mentioned Matthew 26:69 (where ἔξω is opposed to the room in which the judges were sitting); Mark 14:66; Luke 22:55. Cf. Winers RWB under the word Häuser; [B. D. American edition under the word Court; BB. DD. under the word House].
3. the house itself, a palace: Matthew 26:3, 58; Mark 14:54; Mark 15:16; Luke 11:21; John 18:15, and so very often in Greek writings from Homer, Odyssey 4, 74 down [cf. Eustathius 1483, 39 τῷ τῆς αὐλῆς ὀνόματι τὰ δώματα δηλοῖ, Suidas col. 652 c. αὐλή· ἡ τοῦ βασιλέως οἰκία. Yet this sense is denied to the N. T. by Meyer neuter plural; see Meyer on Matthew, the passage cited].

G833 αὐλή (aulē) occurs 12 times in 12 verses
============================

Continuing..........
The Court and Tabernacle in the Wilderness, surrounded by the 12 Tribes of Israel divided into 4 camps around it...........

Compared to the Court of Herod's Temple in the 1st century.........

Revelation 11:2
and the Court/Fold<833> without of the Sanctuary, be casting-out! outside and no it thou should be measuring, that it was given to the Gentiles/Nations.
And the holy City they shall be trampling<3961>forty two months.

 

[mkgal1]

All man-made doctrines are revealed not by the scripture quoted by its proponents, but rather by the scripture they must ignore to make it work.
Your 70 AD doctrine is an excellent example of this principle.

Did the greatest earthquake in history happen during 70 AD?

Did all of the islands move, and did all of the mountains disappear during 70 AD?

Did all the cities of the nations fall during 70 AD?

Ignore the scripture found below, and maybe you can make your viewpoint of 70 AD work.

No Scripture has to be *ignored* - it merely has to be recognized that Revelation is an example of figurative and symbolic language that we see in the Hebrew style of writing.

The prophecy of the destruction of Jerusalem in 70 A.D. is not "man-made". Jesus Himself advanced it in most of His teaching - but especially in His Olivet Discourse. Even your - seemingly preferred - study Bible, the Geneva Study Bible recognizes this. The authors of the GSB notes even recognize the writings of Josephus:

24:20 But pray ye that your flight be not in the winter, neither on the h sabbath day:

(h) It was not lawful to take a journey on the sabbath day; Josephus, book 13. ~ Matthew 24 Commentary - Geneva Study Bible​

 

[mkgal1]

Think about the phrase used in Revelation quite a bit (one that we already know how to interpret it - and don't take it literally) - the lamb that was slain. Did Jesus, at some point in time, supernaturally turn into a literal lamb and offered Himself as a burning sacrifice? Do we wait for Jesus - as a lamb - to open the sixth seal (somehow - maybe with his teeth)?

Revelation 6:12 ~ I watched as the Lamb broke the sixth seal, and there was a great earthquake. The sun became as dark as black cloth, and the moon became as red as blood.​

Quoting from linked article:
Mark A. Copeland, a Preterist, says of this passage that it “[r]epresents civil war, in which people would kill one another, such as God used in His judgment against Egypt (Isa 19:1-4).” This certainly fits the language used here. As a historical fact, in the fall/winter of 67 AD a brutal civil war broke out in Jerusalem and Judea between the revolutionaries and those who wanted to maintain peace with Rome. Jerusalem was eventually divided into three factions led by [1] Eleazar, who was over the Zealots [2] John of Gischala, who was over the Galileans, and [3] Simon, who was over the Idumeans. It remained this way until the city was destroyed. The conditions were awful. In one night 8500 people were killed, and their bodies were cast outside of Jerusalem without being buried. The outer temple was “overflowing with blood” and the inner court even had pools of blood in it. Homes and gravesites were looted (For more information, see Footnote #1).

Steve Gregg, in his book “Revelation: Four Views (A Parallel Commentary),” quotes from J. Stuart Russell, who says (p. 106),

The Jewish war, under Vespasian, commenced at the furthest distance from Jerusalem in Galilee, and gradually drew nearer and nearer to the doomed city. The Romans were not the only agents in the work of slaughter that depopulated the land; hostile factions among the Jews themselves turned their arms against one another, so that it might be said that “every man’s hand was against his brother.”

Gregg also quotes Josephus (from Wars, 2:18:2): “Every city was divided into two armies encamped one against another…so the daytime was spent in shedding of blood, and the night in fear.” Gregg himself adds (p. 108) that these verses in Revelation 6:3-4 substantiate the words of Jesus when He wept over Jerusalem:

The Jews had rejected the Prince of Peace, who had said, while weeping over Jerusalem, “If you had known…the things that make for your peace! But now they are hidden from your eyes” (Luke 19:42). The next words Jesus spoke predicted the Roman armies invading the land and leveling the city of Jerusalem (Luke 19:43-44). What could speak more directly to the fulfillment of this threat than for Revelation to speak, as here, of one sent to take peace (v. 4) from the land? Zechariah also had predicted this as a consequence of the Jews’ rejection of Christ (Zech. 11:10-14). ~ https://adammaarschalk.com/2009/09/04/revelation-chapter-6-part-1/

Zechariah 11:10-14 ~
10 Next I took my staff called Favor and cut it in two, annulling the covenant I had made with all the peoples.
11 It was annulled on that day, and so the afflicted of the flock who were watching me knew that it was the word of the Lord.
12 Then I said to them, "If it seems right to you, give me my wages; but if not, keep [them]." So they weighed my wages, 30 pieces of silver.
13 "Throw it to the potter," the Lord said to me-this magnificent price I was valued by them. So I took the 30 pieces of silver and threw it into the house of the Lord, to the potter.
14 Then I cut in two my second staff, Union, annulling the brotherhood between Judah and Israel.​

 

[BABerean2]

The prophecy of the destruction of Jerusalem in 70 A.D. is not "man-made". Jesus Himself advanced it in most of His teaching - but especially in His Olivet Discourse.

I agree 100% that most of the Olivet Discourse if about 70 AD, but not Luke 21:25-28.


Those who try to make the whole Book of Revelation about 70 AD have gone off the road of Bible prophecy, and into the ditch.

.

 

[mkgal1]

I agree 100% that most of the Olivet Discourse if about 70 AD, but not Luke 21:25-28.

Jesus was speaking to His followers in the 1st century in Luke 21. The context of His teaching is the impending condemnation of religious leaders of the Temple (see Luke 20:45-47) :

Jesus' opening statement:

Warning Against the Teachers of the Law
45 While all the people were listening, Jesus said to his disciples,
46 “Beware of the teachers of the law. They like to walk around in flowing robes and love to be greeted with respect in the marketplaces and have the most important seats in the synagogues and the places of honor at banquets.
47 They devour widows’ houses and for a show make lengthy prayers. These men will be punished most severely.”​

And His closing statement of summary:

Luke 21:32 ~ Truly I say to you, this generation will not pass away until all things take place. ​

Those who try to make the whole Book of Revelation about 70 AD have gone off the road of Bible prophecy, and into the ditch.

Personally - I can't see ALL of Revelation to be about 70 A.D. (I doubt *anyone* does!). The book of Revelation is the revelation of Christ.

Revelation 1:1 ~ This is the revelation of Jesus Christ, which God gave him to show his servants the events that must soon take place. He sent an angel to present this revelation to his servant John....​

 

[mkgal1]

All man-made doctrines are revealed not by the scripture quoted by its proponents, but rather by the scripture they must ignore to make it work.

"Man-made doctrines"? Like the man-formed doctrine of a rapture?

 

[BABerean2]

"Man-made doctrines"? Like the man-formed doctrine of a rapture?

Bible scholar Adam Clarke ( born 1762- died 1832)

1 Thessalonians 4:16

The Lord himself - That is: Jesus Christ shall descend from heaven; shall descend in like manner as he was seen by his disciples to ascend, i.e. in his human form, but now infinitely more glorious; for thousands of thousands shall minister unto him, and ten thousand times ten thousand shall stand before him; for the Son of man shall come on the throne of his glory: but who may abide the day of his coming, or stand when he appeareth?
With a shout - Or order, εν κελευσματι· and probably in these words: Arise, ye dead, and come to judgment; which order shall be repeated by the archangel, who shall accompany it with the sound of the trump of God, whose great and terrible blasts, like those on mount Sinai, sounding louder and louder, shall shake both the heavens and the earth!
Observe the order of this terribly glorious day:
1. Jesus, in all the dignity and splendor of his eternal majesty, shall descend from heaven to the mid region, what the apostle calls the air, somewhere within the earth’s atmosphere.
2. Then the κελευσμα, shout or order, shall be given for the dead to arise.
3. Next the archangel, as the herald of Christ, shall repeat the order, Arise, ye dead, and come to judgment!
4. When all the dead in Christ are raised, then the trumpet shall sound, as the signal for them all to flock together to the throne of Christ. It was by the sound of the trumpet that the solemn assemblies, under the law, were convoked; and to such convocations there appears to be here an allusion.
5. When the dead in Christ are raised, their vile bodies being made like unto his glorious body, then,
6. Those who are alive shall be changed, and made immortal.
7. These shall be caught up together with them to meet the Lord in the air.
8. We may suppose that the judgment will now be set, and the books opened, and the dead judged out of the things written in those books.
9. The eternal states of quick and dead being thus determined, then all who shall be found to have made a covenant with him by sacrifice, and to have washed their robes, and made them white in the blood of the Lamb, shall be taken to his eternal glory, and be for ever with the Lord. What an inexpressibly terrific glory will then be exhibited! I forbear to call in here the descriptions which men of a poetic turn have made of this terrible scene, because I cannot trust to their correctness; and it is a subject which we should speak of and contemplate as nearly as possible in the words of Scripture.

.

 

[LittleLambofJesus]

mkgal1 said: ↑
The prophecy of the destruction of Jerusalem in 70 A.D. is not "man-made". Jesus Himself advanced it in most of His teaching - but especially in His Olivet Discourse.

Also Daniel and Revelation.............

What about Daniel 9

 

[LittleLambofJesus]

BABerean2 said: ↑
The "time of the judgment of the dead", and "wrath", and "reward", and destruction in Revelation 11:18 reveal the Book of Revelation is not in chronological order.
The 7th trumpet is the end, instead of the middle, of the tribulation period.

Hello BAB. I have a thread on that verse for those interested. It didn't garner much attention..........
Revelation 11:18 "2nd Woe passed, .......time of wrath ........
Mar 13, 2019

It is no one's fault except your own that you don't understand John's chronology.

And you do?
Heck, you may be the only person in the world that does....................

 

[mkgal1]

"Man-made doctrines"? Like the man-formed doctrine of a rapture?

And you offer up a commentary from a man. I'm not sure how that is supposed to dispute my claim?

Bible scholar Adam Clarke ( born 1762- died 1832)

 

[BABerean2]

And you offer up a commentary from a man. I'm not sure how that is supposed to dispute my claim?

His commentary of that passage has been the predominate viewpoint of Christians for hundreds of years. It includes the future visible return of Jesus Christ to this planet, along with the bodily resurrection, and judgment of the dead. It is also found in the Nicene Creed, which is used as a standard in the rules of this forum.

If you reject those things, feel free to share your viewpoint.


.

 

[LittleLambofJesus]

It is good to look up the Greek on every word, but what is more important is this: what was in the mind of the Author, the Holy Spirit, as He caused John to write?

What event is about to take place that will cause the city to be trodden by Gentiles for the next 42 months? Next, what time is it in John's narrative? How close is it to the midpoint of the week?

We know from Paul that the man of sin is going to enter the most holy place in a temple and declare to the world that he is God. Does it make sense that to accomplish this, he must first arrive in Jerusalem?

This is what is happening behind the scenes here: John was in heaven so did not see the man of sin arrive; but this is why the city will be trampled: the man of sin will arrive in Jerusalem, probably just 3 1/2 days before he will enter the temple. He will arrive with his gentile (probably Islamic) armies - who will then trample the city from that day on.

The two witnesses are sent at that time, because the Man of sin just arrived. We can tell that they show up in Jerusalem just 3 1/2 days before the man of sin will enter the temple. Therefore only 3 1/2 days of these testimony will be in the first half of the week - the rest in the second half.

So the man of sin arrives in Jerusalem, and probably seconds later, the Two Witnesses arrive. Three days later, the man of sin will enter the temple and declare he is God, causing the daily sacrifices to cease - exactly as Daniel predicted. The 7th trumpet will sound in heaven notifying heaven that the midpoint of the week has arrived and the days of GT will soon follow.

As further proof of this, in 12:6 we see those in Judea begin to flee because they have just seen the abomination Jesus spoke of.

Is it possible to have daily sacrifices without a temple? Certainly; but John was told to measure a real "brick and mortar" temple. A temple with people inside worshiping.

BABerean2 said: ↑
The "time of the judgment of the dead", and "wrath", and "reward", and destruction in Revelation 11:18 reveal the Book of Revelation is not in chronological order.
The 7th trumpet is the end, instead of the middle, of the tribulation period.

Also, the full consummation of the age and end of all things happens at the pouring out of the 7th bowl of wrath upon 70ad Jerusalem [Revelation 16:17].

Matthew 24, Mark 13 and Luke's Temple/Jerusalem Discourses harmonized- Poll Thread

Matthew 24:3
Yet of Him sitting on the Mount of the Olives, the Disciples came toward to Him according to own saying "be telling to us!
when shall these be being?
and what the sign of Thy parousia<3952> and full-consummation<4930> of the Age?
Luke 21
7 They inquire yet of Him saying “Teacher! when then shall these be being? And what the sign whenever may be being about<3195> these to becoming<1096>?

Visual Timeline of the Roman-Jewish War ARTchive
THE ROMAN-JEWISH WAR

Luke 21:9
“Yet whenever ye should be hearing battles and tumults<181>, no may be being frightened<4422>, for is binding these to be becoming,
but not immediately the End<5056>

1Co 15:24
Then the End<5056>, when He delivers the kingdom to God the Father, when He puts an end to all rule and all authority and power.

1 Peter 4:7
Of all-things yet, the End<5056> is nigh<1448>.
Be sane then, and be sober into the prayers,

Revelation 16:17
and the seventh Messenger pours out His bowl/vial into the air<109>
and came out great Voice from the Sanctuary of the heaven from the Throne saying "it has become!"<1096> [Revelation 21:6]

The Destruction of Jerusalem - George Peter Holford, 1805AD
Proof that Matthew 24 was fully fulfilled in 70 AD!
Also see: Rapture refuted

The vial of divine wrath, which had been so long pouring out upon this devoted city was now emptying, and JERUSALEM, once "a praise in all the earth," and the subject of a thousand prophecies, deprived of' the staff of life, wrapt in flames, and bleeding on every side sunk into utter ruin and desolation.

This memorable siege terminated on the eighth day of the ninth month, A. D. 70 : its duration was nearly five months, the Romans having invested the city on the fourteenth day of the fourth month, preceeding.

Before their final demolition, however, Titus took, a survey of the city and its fortifications ; and, while contemplating their impregnable strength, could not help ascribing his success to the peculiar interposition of the ALMIGHTY HIMSELF. "Had not God himself (exclaimed he) aided out operations, and driven the Jews from their fortresses, it would have been absolutely impossible to have taken them ;
for what could men, and the force of engines, have done against such towers as these ?
==============================

All man-made doctrines are revealed not by the scripture quoted by its proponents, but rather by the scripture they must ignore to make it work.
Your 70 AD doctrine is an excellent example of this principle.
.

mkgal1 said: ↑
"Man-made doctrines"? Like the man-formed doctrine of a rapture?

Bible scholar Adam Clarke ( born 1762- died 1832)
1 Thessalonians 4:16.

mkgal1 said: ↑
And you offer up a commentary from a man. I'm not sure how that is supposed to dispute my claim?

His commentary of that passage has been the predominate viewpoint of Christians for hundreds of years. It includes the future visible return of Jesus Christ to this planet, along with the bodily resurrection, and judgment of the dead. It is also found in the Nicene Creed, which is used as a standard in the rules of this forum.
If you reject those things, feel free to share your viewpoint.
.

BAB......... He is still JUST A MAN, as are ALL commentators!

There is nothing in the SOP that says a "visible bodily return of Christ".
Evidently CF gives a little leeway concerning "the type" of return, which I view as a good thing, as it opens up for interpretations concerning the "parousia" and keeps the Dispensationalist Futurists view more at bay.

• Partial Preterism: Partial preterism holds that most eschatological prophecies, such as the destruction of Jerusalem, the Antichrists, the Great Tribulation, and the advent of the Day of the Lord as a "judgment-coming" of Christ, were fulfilled either in AD 70 or during the persecution of Christians under the Emperor Nero. The Second coming and the resurrection of the dead, however, have not yet occurred in the partial preterist system.

Millennialism:

• Amillennialism: "no millennium", rejects the theory that Jesus Christ will have a thousand-year-long, physical reign on the earth. The amillennial viewpoint holds that the thousand years mentioned in Revelation 20 is a symbolic number, not a literal description; that the millennium has already begun and is identical with the current church age.

============================
Just search google "parousia 70 preterist"...........

A lot of Preterists view Christ's coming in judgement on 70AD Jerusalem as "a parousia"...

Partial Preterism at PreteristArchive.com, The Internet's Only Balanced Look at Preterism

70ad:
A coming (parousia) of Christ
A day of the Lord
A judgment
The end of the Jewish Age
(Source: R.C. Sproul, Last Days)

Still future:
The Coming (parousia) of Christ
The Day of the Lord
The Resurrection of the dead
The Rapture of the living
The (final) Judgment
The end of history
==============================
I myself like viewing both early century and modern preterist views and discern whether it is biblical or not [as do most Christians].

The Coming of Christ in A.D. 70-Like You’ve Never Heard it Before! - Revelation Revolution

The Parousia during the Jewish War and the Death of the Beast: The Bible is full of Types and Multiple Fulfillments. The “Second Coming” is No Exception. The Various Appearances of Christ during the Jewish War and at the Death of the Beast exemplify seemingly all the Various Ways in which God Appeared to People in the Old and New Testaments. The Coming of Christ in A.D. 70 is a Perfect Reflection of How God had Come on the Clouds in Judgment on a Wayward Nation in the Past...........................

 

[mkgal1]

NVM - off topic

 

[LittleLambofJesus]

Something perhaps interesting to note would be the following.

...... Rise, and measure the sanctuary of God, and the altar, and them that worship therein.
..................and the holy city shall they tread under foot forty and two months.

Daniel 9:26 And after threescore and two weeks shall Messiah be cut off, but not for himself: and the people of the prince that shall come shall destroy the city and the sanctuary; and the end thereof shall be with a flood, and unto the end of the war desolations are determined.

Both passages mention a sanctuary, a city, and a people destroying it. On the surface that might appear to fit with what occurred in 70 AD. But if the prince that shall come is meaning the beast in Revelation 13 though, a 70 AD interpretation of Daniel 9:26 and Revelation 11:1-2 are unlikely in that case.
IMO anyway, the destroying of the city and sanctuary is not meaning in a literal sense, as in it involving a literal city, etc.

Great post concerning Daniel, the City and Sanctuary.

I looked up the equivalent Hebrew word for "Sanctuary"

Strong's Concordance with Hebrew and Greek Lexicon
Condensed Brown-Driver-Briggs Hebrew Lexicon OR Thayer's Greek Lexicon (Search by Strong's word number [e.g. 2424 Greek])

Greek:

G3485: ναός

ναός, ναοῦ, ὁ (ναίω to dwell), the Sept. for הֵיכָל, used of the temple at Jerusalem, but only of the sacred edifice (or sanctuary) itself, consisting of the Holy place and the Holy of holies (in classical Greek used of the sanctuary or cell of a temple, where the image of the god was placed, called also δόμος, σηκός, which is to be distinguished from τό ἱερόν, the whole temple, the entire consecrated enclosure; this distinction is observed also in the Bible; see ἱερόν, p. 299{a}):

G3485 ναός (naos) occurs 46 times in 40 verses
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Hebrew:

H4720: miqdash

or miqqdash (Exod. 15:17) {mik-ked-awsh'}; from 6942;
a consecrated thing or place, especially, a palace, sanctuary (whether of Jehovah or of idols) or asylum:--chapel, hallowed part, holy place, sanctuary.
The KJV translates Strong's H4720 in the following manner: sanctuary (69x), holy place (3x), chapel (1x), hallowed part (1x).

H4720 מִקְדָּשׁ (miqdash) occurs 74 times in 71 verses

1st time used:

YLT)

Exo 15:17
Thou dost bring them in, And dost plant them In a mountain of Thine inheritance, A fixed place for Thy dwelling Thou hast made, O Jehovah; A sanctuary, O Lord, Thy hands have established;

That particular Hebrew word is used in 3 verses of Daniel:
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Dan 8:11
And unto the prince of the host it exerteth itself, and by it taken away hath been the continual sacrifice, and thrown down the base of his sanctuary.
Dan 9:17
and now, hearken, O our God, unto the prayer of Thy servant, and unto his supplication, and cause Thy face to shine on Thy sanctuary that is desolate, for the Lord's sake.

This appears to be referring to the 1st century Jewish Wars? [not Maccabees]

Dan 11:31
And strong ones out of him stand up, and have polluted the sanctuary, the stronghold, and have turned aside the continual sacrifice, and appointed the desolating abomination.
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According to Josephus, the Jewish Rebels had also taken over the Temple area where the Sanctuary was located......Will have to study more on this.........

Visual Timeline of the Roman-Jewish War ARTchive

Stage 2:
General Revolt in Jerusalem; Zealot Occupation of Masada: August-September 66
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The Destruction of Jerusalem - George Peter Holford, 1805AD
Proof that Matthew 24 was fully fulfilled in 70 AD!
Also see: Rapture refuted

While Jerusalem was a prey to these ferocious and devouring factions, every part of Judea was scourged and laid waste by bands of robbers and murderers, who plundered the towns; and, in case of resistance, slew the inhabitants, not sparing either women or children.................
The three factions, rendered frantic by drunkenness, rage, and desperation, trampling on heaps of slain, fought against each other with brutal savageness and madness. Even such as brou't sacrifices to the temple were murdered.
The dead bodies of priests and worshipers, both natives and foreigners were heaped together, and a lake of blood stagnated in the sacred courts

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To be continued............