Wesley's Parish Fellowship ASA Thread (7)

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kelco

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Out of how many?

Preaching II class starts tomorrow. hhmm....

5-6 suggested pages. It won't be hard, Augustine is my favorite church father. I got another 2 pages before bedtime.

I've yet to take a preaching class. I will probably be doing one this year or the next. You will do fine with your class...:)
 
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Maid Marie

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This philosophy class drives me nuts - in one moment lifts my self-esteem and the next wrecks it. The instructor doesn't help either - he's overly fussy and over silly things, critical and not really into giving praise. It really helps me to know that my pastor got a C+ in his masters level philosophy class. He and I struggle for the same reasons - we just are not into studying how some godless thinkers think. We'd rather study Christian thinkers. So I've given myself permission that I don't have to obsess over getting an A. Surviving and passing is a goal now...

Preaching class conducted over skype was good, though I am still confused. Apparently, the in thing regarding sermon preparation is different from how I have ever heard it. 3 point sermons are out,so is expository preaching, and some other kind of preaching. The in thing is narrative preaching - tell a story as I preach and at the same time make it simple and profound. I'm lost. But at least I have a decent instructor this time around.
 
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Lee52

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This philosophy class drives me nuts - in one moment lifts my self-esteem and the next wrecks it. The instructor doesn't help either - he's overly fussy and over silly things, critical and not really into giving praise. It really helps me to know that my pastor got a C+ in his masters level philosophy class. He and I struggle for the same reasons - we just are not into studying how some godless thinkers think. We'd rather study Christian thinkers. So I've given myself permission that I don't have to obsess over getting an A. Surviving and passing is a goal now...

Preaching class conducted over skype was good, though I am still confused. Apparently, the in thing regarding sermon preparation is different from how I have ever heard it. 3 point sermons are out,so is expository preaching, and some other kind of preaching. The in thing is narrative preaching - tell a story as I preach and at the same time make it simple and profound. I'm lost. But at least I have a decent instructor this time around.

Keep your friends close, and your enemies closer. "Sun-tzu" I have issues with Christian universities and seminaries teaching man's philosophies also. But then, we must know the tactics used by the enemy of man's soul. Once we have the tools available to show fools their foolishness, we remove all excuses except human pride and uppity attitude from those that reject the One true Savior. Be blessed,Lee52
 
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Maid Marie

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Keep your friends close, and your enemies closer. "Sun-tzu" I have issues with Christian universities and seminaries teaching man's philosophies also. But then, we must know the tactics used by the enemy of man's soul. Once we have the tools available to show fools their foolishness, we remove all excuses except human pride and uppity attitude from those that reject the One true Savior. Be blessed,Lee52

That's their rationale for having us study this stuff, but it doesn't makt it easy for me. Plus, the instructor is adding to my stress. In my missional church class we had to do the same thing but from a current culture point of view. That class was tolerable because the current culture isn't really intellectual so no mental gymnastics were rquired. While in this class, even the christian philosophers are too "out there" for me.
 
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GraceSeeker

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That's their rationale for having us study this stuff, but it doesn't makt it easy for me. Plus, the instructor is adding to my stress. In my missional church class we had to do the same thing but from a current culture point of view. That class was tolerable because the current culture isn't really intellectual so no mental gymnastics were rquired. While in this class, even the christian philosophers are too "out there" for me.

If you never intend to engage the world, then you can forget all of that stuff. But I know you didn't feel called into ministry to just feed the sheep. Besides, as our old friend GadFly would have correctly pointed out, much of the church is also under the influence of these other forms of philosophy. So, difficult as it may be, I believe your school is doing you a favor in introducing you to them.

With respect to preaching, various styles come and go. What works/doesn't work has to do with the audience toward whom our sermons are directed. Done well each style still has its place. So, if you already know how to deliver an exopository sermon that's great. Then learning how to construct and deliver a narrative style will give you another arrow in your quiver. In life you're going to need as many different arrows as you can get.
 
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Maid Marie

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With respect to preaching, various styles come and go. What works/doesn't work has to do with the audience toward whom our sermons are directed. Done well each style still has its place. So, if you already know how to deliver an exopository sermon that's great. Then learning how to construct and deliver a narrative style will give you another arrow in your quiver. In life you're going to need as many different arrows as you can get.

This is helpful.

My pastor's comment was that you can use the rubric of a certain sermon construction but ultimately you have to find your own voice. My voice is to be primarily explore the world of the bible and make it understood by others. I got marked down for this in my preaching I class official sermon. To preach in another way would put me to sleep.

I can use other methods as the need arises but have no shame if I stick to my own way. And that would probably show in my sermon - if I am doing a method that is not currently in use but is 'my voice' that would probably be better delivered then one that is in vogue, assumed to be the better method, but isn't my voice.
 
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Maid Marie

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If you never intend to engage the world, then you can forget all of that stuff. But I know you didn't feel called into ministry to just feed the sheep. Besides, as our old friend GadFly would have correctly pointed out, much of the church is also under the influence of these other forms of philosophy. So, difficult as it may be, I believe your school is doing you a favor in introducing you to them.

Gadfly's been on my mind this week - in one of our readings it touched upon phenomenology. I remember he was a big fan of it. I didn't understand it when he talked about it and didn't understand it when I read it in the reading this week. :confused:

But, after 28 years of confusion, I have finally conquered the area of French athiestic existentialism!!!!!!!! Wooo hooo!! :clap: When I read Camus' The Stranger in high school French class, I didn't get the point. I didn't get it later in college either. But I did finally last night when I was researching Sartre. It is still Godless as ever but now at least I understand why he's asking the questions.

I know that there is a good reason why this class is required. My issues is that the instructor kind of rubs me the wrong way and also because this part of my brain is rusty. The whine you hear in my posts is the horrible creaking of rusty cogs, nuts and bolts being used for the first time in eons.
 
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Lee52

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Gadfly's been on my mind this week - in one of our readings it touched upon phenomenology. I remember he was a big fan of it. I didn't understand it when he talked about it and didn't understand it when I read it in the reading this week. :confused:

But, after 28 years of confusion, I have finally conquered the area of French athiestic existentialism!!!!!!!! Wooo hooo!! :clap: When I read Camus' The Stranger in high school French class, I didn't get the point. I didn't get it later in college either. But I did finally last night when I was researching Sartre. It is still Godless as ever but now at least I understand why he's asking the questions.

I know that there is a good reason why this class is required. My issues is that the instructor kind of rubs me the wrong way and also because this part of my brain is rusty. The whine you hear in my posts is the horrible creaking of rusty cogs, nuts and bolts being used for the first time in eons.

Maid Marie,
Thanks for the wonderful smile, chuckle and laugh this morning! Now where did I put that towel I use to wipe coffee off my keyboard and screen??????

You are called to be a shepherd of GOD's flock. GOD gives you ownership of that flock, which remains fully His. One of His wonderful mysteries.

Some sheep in that flock are not going to yield the best wool when sheared. Their wool is going to rub you the wrong way, be an irritant to you. You must learn to love their wool just as much, in a different way, as you love the pure white, soft, warm wool of many of the other sheep in the flock. You must learn to employ that rough wool where it will do the most good for the Body. Their wool is not the greatest quality, but they are still sheep. You must also learn to discern the wolves hiding under the fleeces of sheep they have killed, as they masquerade as sheep of the flock, from the sheep of the flock. They will sound similar to the sheep of the flock, they will look like sheep of the flock, but there will be differences in their language and tone as they bay like sheep, though not really like sheep. The other sheep will see only the fleeces covering them until they are too close and have sprung on their unsuspecting prey.

Only the shepherd of the flock can tell the difference. That ability is being taught to you right now. Embrace it.

Be blessed,
Lee52
 
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Maid Marie

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Maid Marie,
Thanks for the wonderful smile, chuckle and laugh this morning! Now where did I put that towel I use to wipe coffee off my keyboard and screen??????

... Embrace it.

Glad I could bring a chuckle to your day. I've had the coffee explosion before :)

The reason why you hear the whining of rusty bolts and nuts is this -

I don't know how things are in your church, but traditionally the CotN can be anti-intellectual at times even though we have many universities. The church I grew up in was heavily predjuced. I was always the kid in class who asked "too many" questions. The teachers never knew what to do with me. Finally one of them told me that all these questions means I am doubting, the book of James says doubting is sin so stop asking questions. And then I'd hear from people that our intellects prevent people from getting saved. Poor reasoning but it had an effect on me. I squashed that part of myself for the longest time. This class is undoing all that but it is hard to undo the damage done over so long a time.

As I started struggling with this, I happened to turn on the tv show American Pickers. It is about two men who go to junk yards and garages looking for junk that they can refurbish and sell. I turned it on to see one of them hold up some metal thingy and say enthusiastically "this is a WONDERFUL piece of history! I can take this rusty old _________, that looks like garbage, fix it up and it will be BEAUTIFUL!" I felt like God was saying that to me - he can take this beautiful part that has become rusty, and in some folks' eyes is ugly, clean it up and make it beautiful.

Thus, when you hear me whine, that is really me doing my best to give this to God and let him open the door to letting my brain being used. The hinges are super rusty and very noisy as God opens up the door. But if I wasn't embracing it and giving it to God, there'd be no whining at all.

My other sad thought is that after my class is over, I don't know how this part of me will continue to be fulfilled. I realized this week that, in spite of my whining, that this is the happiest I've been since I graduated from Olivet 2 decades ago or so...
 
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GraceSeeker

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Thus, when you hear me whine, that is really me doing my best to give this to God and let him open the door to letting my brain being used. The hinges are super rusty and very noisy as God opens up the door. But if I wasn't embracing it and giving it to God, there'd be no whining at all.

My other sad thought is that after my class is over, I don't know how this part of me will continue to be fulfilled. I realized this week that, in spite of my whining, that this is the happiest I've been since I graduated from Olivet 2 decades ago or so...


I've got a feeling that if this is the happiest you have been since graduating from college, that God will make sure you have abundant access to what you need to keep you fulfilled, perhaps even pressed down and overflowing.
 
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Maid Marie

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I've got a feeling that if this is the happiest you have been since graduating from college, that God will make sure you have abundant access to what you need to keep you fulfilled, perhaps even pressed down and overflowing.

That's my prayer. It also has helped me in the class to have a guy in there who is a member of Mensa. I feel like if he can answer these questions, then I can too. I am not a member of Mensa but my father was eligible for it at one time. In other words, it has helped me not to be the smartest one in a group anymore. And the peace and joy that I feel [even though I am whining a lot] makes me feel like God is telling me something. Now, to pray and wait for discernment.
 
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Maid Marie

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I'm annoyed and stressed out. I just spent significant time doing an assignment for my philosophy class, handed it in 6 minutes late, saw how a brainiac classmate did his and started to wonder if I did it all wrong. :dead:

Here is the sentence I had to defend in a 1,000 word essay - "resolved, that humans have the right to explore and exploit the natural environment for their own use and benefit without restriction." We could not use relgious answers in the essay.

I really saw the bolded part as the key. But then I saw one of my brainiac classmate's answers and saw that he had concentrated on the word "right" which totally changes things. And a brainac scientist at church suggested the same thing. Thus, it becomes less about benefitting society and more about defending selfish humans who think they are God. I can do the 'benefitting society" but I honestly can't write a defense for selfish humans who think they are God, at least not 1,000 words worth. So between handing it in late and wondering if I focused correctly, I am annoyed and stressed. Sigh. But, I think what I did do, was good. I showed how we exploited [as in developed for our benefit] our natural resourses for energy from whale oil to nuclear to fracking. Society has benefited. Learned alot about natural gas in PA and in the county I grew up in. But, if I did the assignment wrong, I'll be bummed.

And I had a migraine before this even started...
 
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I'm annoyed and stressed out. I just spent significant time doing an assignment for my philosophy class, handed it in 6 minutes late, saw how a brainiac classmate did his and started to wonder if I did it all wrong. :dead:

Here is the sentence I had to defend in a 1,000 word essay - "resolved, that humans have the right to explore and exploit the natural environment for their own use and benefit without restriction." We could not use relgious answers in the essay.

I really saw the bolded part as the key. But then I saw one of my brainiac classmate's answers and saw that he had concentrated on the word "right" which totally changes things. And a brainac scientist at church suggested the same thing. Thus, it becomes less about benefitting society and more about defending selfish humans who think they are God. I can do the 'benefitting society" but I honestly can't write a defense for selfish humans who think they are God, at least not 1,000 words worth. So between handing it in late and wondering if I focused correctly, I am annoyed and stressed. Sigh. But, I think what I did do, was good. I showed how we exploited [as in developed for our benefit] our natural resourses for energy from whale oil to nuclear to fracking. Society has benefited. Learned alot about natural gas in PA and in the county I grew up in. But, if I did the assignment wrong, I'll be bummed.

And I had a migraine before this even started...

I can't see how on any level you've done the assignment wrong. I imagine that part of choosing a question like that is that there is more than one focus you can find in the question, so you have a question about whether it is ever ok to destroy the natural environment, whether we have a right as humans to master control over the world, whether we start with the fact that we can and do destroy the environment can continue do so without restriction or not?

It's one of the questions (as they can often be in subjects like philosophy) where there's no 'right' answer but it's about how you defend/argue what you see in the question.

Sounds to me like you did a good job of the question. It's like Bible verses, get 5 people together and they'll all be struck by a different part of the verse, giving 5 different understandings/interpretations. The plurality of views doesn't necessarily negate any of the views, but just goes to show that a sentence can be legitimately understood in different ways depending on the person.

:)

Hope your migraine's passed :hug:
 
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Maid Marie

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I can't see how on any level you've done the assignment wrong. I imagine that part of choosing a question like that is that there is more than one focus you can find in the question, so you have a question about whether it is ever ok to destroy the natural environment, whether we have a right as humans to master control over the world, whether we start with the fact that we can and do destroy the environment can continue do so without restriction or not?

It's one of the questions (as they can often be in subjects like philosophy) where there's no 'right' answer but it's about how you defend/argue what you see in the question.

Sounds to me like you did a good job of the question. It's like Bible verses, get 5 people together and they'll all be struck by a different part of the verse, giving 5 different understandings/interpretations. The plurality of views doesn't necessarily negate any of the views, but just goes to show that a sentence can be legitimately understood in different ways depending on the person.

:)

Hope your migraine's passed :hug:
Thanks for the encouraging words. They mirror what God seems to be telling me. After I posted my previous comment here, and even though it was in the middle of the night, I decided to play my flute for an hour to calm myself down. By the time I was done, I felt like God was telling me it will be alright. As you said, it is something for which there are different possible approaches. I'm not an analytical thinker so will be a little intimidated by the analytical thinker in the class as well as the scientific minded friends from whom I asked for imput.

As for the migraine, it went away for the most part after Zomig left my system. I suspect that as I have had major emotional healing the last 3 months that Zomig is too strong for me. I had a baby migraine yesterday morning so took 1.25 mg of Zomig and then felt my migraine increase. When migraines were at their worst, I took 10 mg of Zomig at one time and yet felt like the Zomig was as affective as candy.

I definitely know it is too expensive for me. I need to mention to my neuro that I need something different and something that gives out free samples [Zomig stopped doing that last fall]. At $25 per tablet, I needed those free samples.
 
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Maid Marie

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I can't see how on any level you've done the assignment wrong. I imagine that part of choosing a question like that is that there is more than one focus you can find in the question, so you have a question about whether it is ever ok to destroy the natural environment, whether we have a right as humans to master control over the world, whether we start with the fact that we can and do destroy the environment can continue do so without restriction or not?

It's one of the questions (as they can often be in subjects like philosophy) where there's no 'right' answer but it's about how you defend/argue what you see in the question.

Sounds to me like you did a good job of the question. It's like Bible verses, get 5 people together and they'll all be struck by a different part of the verse, giving 5 different understandings/interpretations. The plurality of views doesn't necessarily negate any of the views, but just goes to show that a sentence can be legitimately understood in different ways depending on the person.

:)

Hope your migraine's passed :hug:

well, it is back. Apparently, whatever it was that I was supposed to have done, he didn't think I did. And he couldn't seem to say this in a grace filled manner but a rather snarky one.
 
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Hope everyone has a great weekend! :wave: :)

Thanks, I'm in the University Gospel Choir, and we're off on our annual 'tour'. So am going to the other side of the country to the Lake District (one of the more spectacular of our national parks) to give several concerts (one of which will be in the remarkable named 'Sandylands Methodist Church). Should be good.

Hope you have a great weekend too :)
 
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