Were the Pharisees all bad?

A very common misleading of the interpretation of B'rit Hadashah (NT) is the thought that all students and teachers of Torah were misguided and cold-hearted. However, a simple overlook listing of the word "Pharisee" in the B'rit Hadashah proves otherwise.

Acts 15:5
Then some of the believers who belonged to the party of the Pharisees stood up and said, "The Gentiles must be circumcised and required to obey the law of Moses."
Notice that in this verse, we see that it is capable to be a believer and a Pharisee at the same time. In this unfortunate situation, these particular believers were "Judaizers".

Acts 23
Then Sha'ul, knowing that some of them were Sadducees and the others Pharisees, called out in the Sanhedrin, "My brothers, I am a Pharisee, the son of a Pharisee. I stand on trial because of my hope in the resurrection of the dead."
Here we have Sha'ul self proclaiming to be a Pharisee himself, not just a son of a Pharisee.

Mark 12:28-34
One of the teachers of the Torah came and heard them debating. Noticing that Yeshua had given them a good answer, he asked him, "Of all the commandments, which is the most important?"
"The most important one," answered Yeshua, "is this: 'Hear, O Israel, the Lord our G-d, the Lord is one. Love the Lord your G-d with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind and with all your strength.' The second is this: 'Love your neighbor as yourself.' There is no commandment greater than these."
"Well said, Rabbi," the man replied. "You are right in saying that G-d is one and there is no other but him. To love him with all your heart, with all your understanding and with all your strength, and to love your neighbor as yourself is more important than all burnt offerings and sacrifices."
When Yeshua saw that he had answered wisely, he said to him, "You are not far from the kingdom of G-d." And from then on no one dared ask him any more questions.
Here an objective Rabbi, most likely a Pharisee himself, knew and agreed with Yeshua reguarding the greatest of the commandments.

Matthew 21:1-3
Then Yeshua said to the crowds and to his disciples: "The teachers of the law and the Pharisees sit in Moshes' seat. So you must obey them and do everything they tell you. But do not do what they do, for they do not practice what they preach.
Why in the world would Yeshua tell the people and his disciples to obey the Pharisees if the Torah had been abolished?

More coming for my fellow Gentiles :eek:
 

simchat_torah

Got Torah?
Feb 23, 2003
7,345
433
46
San Francisco, CA
Visit site
✟9,917.00
Faith
Judaism
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Libertarian
Y'shua more often than not agreed theologically with the pharisees. In fact, he really only combatted them on two issues:

1) The lifting of tradition higher than Torah (this can be seen in Mark 7)

2) and in hypocrisy

Shalom,
Yafet.
 
Upvote 0

Aethelsige

Regular Member
Mar 29, 2003
83
2
florida
Visit site
✟218.00
Faith
Messianic
Which Pharisees? I have read where there were 7 different kinds of Pharisees. There were 2 kind of Saducees as well. So in the sense that they were human and had an Adamic disposition is correct. :confused:
The teachings of the Saducees was worse. The Pharisees were correct alot of the time. Yeshua said to do what they said not what they did.
 
Upvote 0
Jun 25, 2003
1,146
45
Tacoma, WA
Visit site
✟9,288.00
Faith
Marital Status
Single
Matthew 9
9
And as Jesus passed forth from thence, he saw a man, named Matthew, sitting at the receipt of custom: and he saith unto him, Follow me. And he arose, and followed him.
10 And it came to pass, as Jesus sat at meat in the house, behold, many publicans and sinners came and sat down with him and his disciples.
11 And when the Pharisees saw it, they said unto his disciples, Why eateth your Master with publicans and sinners?
12 But when Jesus heard that, he said unto them, They that be whole need not a physician, but they that are sick.
13 But go ye and learn what that meaneth, I will have mercy, and not sacrifice: for I am not come to call the righteous, but sinners to repentance.
1342 dikaios dik'-ah-yos from 1349; equitable (in character or act); by implication, innocent, holy (absolutely or relatively):--just, meet, right(-eous).
Mark 2
14
And as he passed by, he saw Levi the son of Alphaeus sitting at the receipt of custom, and said unto him, Follow me. And he arose and followed him.
15 And it came to pass, that, as Jesus sat at meat in his house, many publicans and sinners sat also together with Jesus and his disciples: for there were many, and they followed him.
16 And when the scribes and Pharisees saw him eat with publicans and sinners, they said unto his disciples, How is it that he eateth and drinketh with publicans and sinners?
17 When Jesus heard it, he saith unto them, They that are whole have no need of the physician, but they that are sick: I came not to call the righteous, but sinners to repentance.
Luke 5
27
And after these things he went forth, and saw a publican, named Levi, sitting at the receipt of custom: and he said unto him, Follow me.
28 And he left all, rose up, and followed him.
29 And Levi made him a great feast in his own house: and there was a great company of publicans and of others that sat down with them.
30 But their scribes and Pharisees murmured against his disciples, saying, Why do ye eat and drink with publicans and sinners?
31 And Jesus answering said unto them, They that are whole need not a physician; but they that are sick.
32 I came not to call the righteous, but sinners to repentance.
Shalom to all,
I am quoting the above for I see Yeshua call those who are sinners to repentance and not those who are obeying the commands of YHWH. Not that all the Pharisees and Scribes were righteous before YHWH, yet if you read my signature which Robsav did quote already you see that Yeshua did tell us to do what they say and not what they do. Which in my humble opinion not ONE Church has its roots in the Roman started one(which I mean even those who broke off of) has done what the Pharisees said to do, on the contrary they persecuted them. Yet we see that many eyes are opening in these end-times and many are seeing the Jewish roots that weren't supposed to be thrown out.
Revelation 14
12 Here is the patience of the saints: here are they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus. (KJV)

14:12 This is when perseverance is needed on the part of God's people, those who observe his commands and exercise Yeshua's faithfulness. (Complete Jewish Bible)
May the peace that transcends all understanding be with you,
Tag
 
Upvote 0

Rafael

Only time enough for love
Jul 25, 2002
2,570
319
73
Midwest
Visit site
✟6,445.00
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
Gamaliel is recorded in history as helping and standing up for disciples. Only God sees the heart, and even those that don't have their doctrine down to perfection will stand before their God and give account only for the faith they have been given and what they did with it.

I'n so sure that there will be many surprises in heaven, and grace and mercy that we will wonder about and give praise for - enough for eternity.
 
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums

SonWorshipper

Old Timer
Jan 15, 2002
2,840
31
✟10,769.00
Faith
Messianic
Is not Yosef of Ramamtayim ( Joseph of Arimathaea) thought to be a Pharisee? We know he was part of the Sanhedrin, and it was said he was awaiting the kingdom of G-d hense the ressurection which if I remember correctly the Sadducees did not believe in.
In Luke it says he was a good and just or righteous ( tzaddik) man.
 
Upvote 0

sojeru

just a Jew
Mar 22, 2003
870
21
41
USA
Visit site
✟1,145.00
Faith
Judaism
well to be of the sanhedrin, you couldnt be a lay man/common
now doubt a person had to be learned- and to await the kingdom- didnt necessarily mean the ressurection (unless you have further insight in this- please share) however, the tzaddikim did not believe in the such since they have seen so many similarities between what the prushim hold and zoroasterianism- so they made their own sanction of course not beliving in angels, spirits, demons, or the world to come, however they held to torah, and some were good men aswell.

But good insight, i didnt think about that- so thanks
Yosef mey'Ramamtayim is no doubt prushi

shalom u'bracha
 
Upvote 0

Sabian

Active Member
Jul 11, 2003
281
5
57
key's
Visit site
✟466.00
http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/pages/...&subContrassID=14&sbSubContrassID=0&listSrc=Y

Puech decoded part of the inscription, which
Zias says is about 1.2 meters long and 10
centimeters high. "This is the tomb of
Zacharia, martyr, a very pious priest, father
of John," it said. According to the New
Testament, Zacharia the priest was the father
of John the Baptist. Judging by the design and
style of the letters, and the spacing between
them, Puech determined that the inscription was
written in the 4th century C.E., in other
words, about 300 years after the structure was
built, which testifies to the fact that the
place was a Christian holy site at the time. In
addition he discovered, in the upper lefthand
corner, the Greek word "psycho," meaning soul,
referring to the tomb. He also identified the
name Simeon, but it is not known in what
connection the name was written.

The reason why the inscription became eroded
over the years, to the point where even Avigad
didn't notice it, is related to the erroneous
identification of the site with the tomb of
Absalom, son of David. Avigad wrote, "It was a
popular custom for a passerby to take a stone
in his hand and throw it at the monument of the
prodigal son, and sometimes they would add
curses and spit." Zias says that not only Jews,
but Christians and Muslims as well, used to
come to the place and throw stones at the tomb.
As proof, he displays a woodcut by a European
artist from 1677: "Here one sees people in
European dress throwing stones at the tomb of
Absalom, who took his father's mistresses to
the rooftops of Jerusalem in order to enjoy
their company, and also decided that he was the
king of Israel. In a photo from 1890, the site
is seen surrounded by rocks thrown by pilgrims,
and this is one of the reasons why the
inscription became blurred and couldn't be
seen."
I put this here Because I can not post a new thread,
Plus it is speaking of John the baptise's. which was part of the Priesthood
YHWH say's he walk in all the commandments and statutes.
 
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums