we have no proofs about the existence of god

Almost there

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Bit like that face in Mars and canals on moon. People see what they want to see.
No, nothing like that.

One startling difference: The more we know, the more complexities expose themselves.

If Darwin had had a clue just how complex even a single cell is, well, nobody today would have ever heard of him, because he'd have never come up with that ludicrous theory about the origin of species.
 
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Greg Merrill

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And just few posts ago everything was perfect....how have the mighty fallen.
Obviously you have some blind spots and keep coming to the wrong conclusions. Are you hear for the sake of arguing or learning or just trying to back up your own present position? Wishing you the best regardless.
 
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Greg Merrill

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It is man's innate nature to figure out the unknown.

God is the ultimate unknown.

But everyone knows HE IS, when He reveals Himself to them.
John 17:3 Some "think" they know God, when they really don't. John 5:39-40.
 
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Greg Merrill

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No, nothing like that.

One startling difference: The more we know, the more complexities expose themselves.

If Darwin had had a clue just how complex even a single cell is, well, nobody today would have ever heard of him, because he'd have never come up with that ludicrous theory about the origin of species.
Love your reply. Stick with it.
 
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maybe spiritual proofs but not material proofs that unbelievers want

What is proof, if we do not start with the God of Scripture as the necessary precondition for intelligibility? Because if we do not start with God, all that is left is pure subjectivism, relativism with no objective truth, no universal truths, which is beyond absurd, while acknowledging some areas of epistemology, especially aesthetics involve relativism.
 
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Favourofone

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JIMINZ

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What is proof, if we do not start with the God of Scripture as the necessary precondition for intelligibility? Because if we do not start with God, all that is left is pure subjectivism, relativism with no objective truth, no universal truths, which is beyond absurd, while acknowledging some areas of epistemology, especially aesthetics involve relativism.
.
How True, How True, well said! :clap::amen::bow::oldthumbsup:........:scratch: huh?
 
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JIMINZ

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How about the origin of the absolute moral good as described by CS Lewis in Mere Christianity?
.
Now here 's a good read.

"THE KINGDOM OF GOD IS WITHIN YOU" CHRISTIANITY NOT AS A MYSTIC RELIGION BUT AS A NEW THEORY OF LIFE By - - - Leo Tolstoy
 
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How about the origin of the absolute moral good as described by CS Lewis in Mere Christianity?

While not a fan of Lewis' theology, I do appreciate his philosophical insights, especially his formulations for the moral argument, and his "Lord, Liar, Lunatic" argument, both are pressing and stressing in meaningful ways. His Screwtape Letters is an interesting piece, masterful work in playing advocate, getting into the mind of our enemy, and his traps and tricks and veil of deception.
 
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want-love

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funny how many of you try to prove the existence of god referring the bible, but what proofs the bible was written by the holy spirit?, what proof you have that holy spirit exists?

if an atheist comes to this forum and ask for proofs we got nothing, the atheist must make an exercise of humility and just decide to believe.

what proof we have that a man-god named jesus was born 2018 years ago? we haven't, but we christian decided to just believe

so we never can be arrogant respect to our belief
 
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ToBeLoved

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funny how many of you try to prove the existence of god referring the bible, but what proofs the bible was written by the holy spirit?, what proof you have that holy spirit exists?

if an atheist comes to this forum and ask for proofs we got nothing, the atheist must make an exercise of humility and just decide to believe.

what proof we have that a man-god named jesus was born 2018 years ago? we haven't, but we christian decided to just believe

so we never can be arrogant respect to our belief
The same is true on the other side. They cannot prove God DOES NOT exist.
 
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Vicomte13

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maybe spiritual proofs but not material proofs that unbelievers want
No. We have material proofs also, which the well-educated can discern are proof. But unbelievers don’t accept those proofs either. Of course, neither do many Christians, especiapplt around here, because those physical proofs also prove or disprove certain contested Christian doctrines, so while they prove God, they also prove God’s view of certain things that I runs contrary to the will of many Christians, so all the unbeliever needs to do is point to the objections of Some very vocal Christians and thereby avoid having to address the material proofs.
 
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Jesus told the story about the rich man who went to hell and asked Abraham to send someone back to tell his brothers not to come to this place. Abraham told him that if they won't believe the Law and the Prophets, it won't make any difference if someone was raised from the dead to warn them because they wouldn't believe him either.

The Pharisees of Jesus' time witnessed His miracles yet they did not believe in Him and conspired to kill Him because He threatened their status and their approach to their religion.

So if people won't believe the Bible, then all the empirical proof in the world won't convince them of the truth of the Gospel because the devil has blinded their minds so that they cannot see or understand what the Gospel is all about.

This is such an insight, I remember the eye opening importance of remembering those passages of Scripture and the value of them while contending for the faith with non-believers. Romans Chapter 1:18-32 also helped shed light, from it we see that non-believers do believe, but suppress that knowledge, and in the process deceive themselves to the point of believing the lie concerning the existence of God. Which is why all the empirical proof in the world would not convince them. And if we take a further look in Scripture, concerning non-believers we read..

The non-believer is dead in sins and trespasses (Eph 2:1), and does not want interaction with the true God of Scripture.

1 Cor 2:14 - But the natural man does not receive the things of the Spirit of God, for they are foolishness to him; nor can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.

Jn 14:16-18 - And I will pray the Father, and He will give you another Helper, that He may abide with you forever, even the Spirit of truth, whom the world cannot receive because it neither sees Him nor knows Him

Jn 3:18-21 - He who believes in Him is not condemned; but he who does not believe is condemned already, because he has not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God. And this is the condemnation, that the light has come into the world, and men loved darkness rather than light, because their deeds were evil. For everyone practicing evil hates the light and does not come to the light, lest his deeds should be exposed.


Romans 8:5-8 For those who live according to the flesh set their minds on the things of the flesh, but those who live according to the Spirit, the things of the Spirit. 6 For to be carnally minded is death, but to be spiritually minded is life and peace. 7 Because the carnal mind is enmity against God; for it is not subject to the law of God, nor indeed can be. 8 So then, those who are in the flesh cannot please God.

Not only do they not want the truth (Jesus), but cannot the receive things of the Spirit of God, nor please God.

However, because we do not have certain knowledge of who is elect or not among us, we are like farmers sowing seed, while God gives the growth or not.
 
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DennisTate

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maybe spiritual proofs but not material proofs that unbelievers want

Do a search for near death experiences......triggers.... Extreme Gravity........ and you may be surprised.
 
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chirpyluna

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One definition of faith is: "strong belief in God or in the doctrines of a religion, based on spiritual apprehension rather than proof."

So then why do we argue over who has proof, who does not, and who, if anyone, has the burden of proof? I'm not trying to get smart, I'm truly asking "why?"

I accepted God's invitation to me because my heart told me it was right; not because of any kind of "proof" shown to me by another person.

I'm new to faith, not just this forum, so maybe I'm naïve. I would tell someone asking for proof that he/she should ask his/her heart for the proof. Is that too "out there?" lol
 
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