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We CAN BE PERFECT now in this life.

Discussion in 'Discipleship: Following Jesus' started by childoftheword, Sep 30, 2020.

  1. childoftheword

    childoftheword New Member

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    Jesus has showed me that a lot of people are intimidated by the word "perfect". But the truth is He commanded us to be perfect (Matthew 5:48; Deuteronomy 18:3) and if He commanded it, then we can do so, it is just that we cannot do so on our own.

    People say "no one is perfect" yet the Bible says Noah (Genesis 6:9), Abraham (Genesis 17:1-2), Job (Job 1:1; Job 1:8, Job 2:3), even David (1 Kings 15:5), also Zechariah and Elizabeth the parents of John the Baptist (Luke 1:5-6), were all called perfect, blameless in the Law or obeyed God's laws all their lives. Paul said he and other in his time were perfect (1 Corinthians 2:6; Philippians 3:15). All of them had sinned at some point, especially David, but it is clear they all repented and came to a place in living in obedience to what was expected of them in their generations. Our Generation has the highest standard because of Jesus and the Holy Spirit. We can live up to the complete perfection God is looking for because of Jesus through the Holy Spirit changes us and teaches us.

    Perfection is simply living up to the measure of light Jesus has given us, doing what we know is right and not doing what we know we should not. Jesus told me that when we are born again, we are start as babies all over again. You do not expect a 3 year old live up to what you expect of an 21 year old. So when we start off, if all we know is one thing, if we do that 1 thing (1/1), we are perfect. Jesus will then reveal more to us as we “grow in Grace”. So now if we have 3 things, if we live up to those 3 things (3/3) we are perfect; if we are trained and still do 1/3, knowing the truth, we are not perfect. However as long as we are working at it learning from Jesus, we will get to the 3/3 now. Really it is not that much different than school in this world, it's about what you believe and how dedicated or faithful are you to the Grace that is teaching us. A seedling that has sprouted that is at the place it should be when it starts growing, is the exact same perfection as a blossomed flower at its season to blossom. But if the blossom is still acting like a seedling when it knows it is suppose to blossom, it is not perfect. Many Christians know sins they should not be doing and are still doing them and making excuses, rather than learning and overcoming and blossoming in their seasons.

    It is possible to be perfect as we have been commanded, it is just that Jesus through the Holy Spirit must teach us how after we have been delivered, born again. He teaches us the lifestyle and attitude of the way of perfection so we may run this race right and obtain the perfected body (i.e. the resurrection body).

    Here is my testimony on this matter I just explained above:


    This is right now answers on how to start overcoming sin if you are born again and still struggling with sin:



    May the Father and Jesus Christ both bless you and pour out Grace upon you.
     
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  2. BNR32FAN

    BNR32FAN He’s a Way of life Supporter

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    If these men had not sinned they wouldn’t have died. They were counted as being righteous by God. It doesn’t mean they never sinned. Take for example Colossians 1:21-22.

    “And although you were formerly alienated and hostile in mind, engaged in evil deeds, yet He has now reconciled you in His fleshly body through death, in order to present you before Him holy and blameless and beyond reproach-”
    ‭‭Colossians‬ ‭1:21-22‬ ‭NASB‬‬

    These people are counted as being righteous and perfect even tho they were previously sinners. Paul openly admits his sinful nature in Romans 7.

    “For we know that the Law is spiritual, but I am of flesh, sold into bondage to sin. For what I am doing, I do not understand; for I am not practicing what I would like to do, but I am doing the very thing I hate. But if I do the very thing I do not want to do, I agree with the Law, confessing that the Law is good. So now, no longer am I the one doing it, but sin which dwells in me. For I know that nothing good dwells in me, that is, in my flesh; for the willing is present in me, but the doing of the good is not. For the good that I want, I do not do, but I practice the very evil that I do not want. But if I am doing the very thing I do not want, I am no longer the one doing it, but sin which dwells in me. I find then the principle that evil is present in me, the one who wants to do good. For I joyfully concur with the law of God in the inner man, but I see a different law in the members of my body, waging war against the law of my mind and making me a prisoner of the law of sin which is in my members. Wretched man that I am! Who will set me free from the body of this death? Thanks be to God through Jesus Christ our Lord! So then, on the one hand I myself with my mind am serving the law of God, but on the other, with my flesh the law of sin.”
    ‭‭Romans‬ ‭7:14-25‬ ‭NASB‬‬
     
  3. childoftheword

    childoftheword New Member

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    But, I did say they all sinned:

     
  4. BNR32FAN

    BNR32FAN He’s a Way of life Supporter

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    I’m sorry I don’t know how I didn’t see that. Blessing to you friend.
     
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  5. childoftheword

    childoftheword New Member

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    Blessing to you :)
     
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  6. Junia

    Junia Well-Known Member

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    And the wonderful thing is we have been given the righteousness of Jesus and the holy spirit to help us
     
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  7. GDL

    GDL Well-Known Member

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    - Hebrews 5:13-14 explains one concept of our perfection by contrasting it with our infancy in Christ. Perfection here can thus also mean "maturity," which ends up meaning to have our faculties well exercised in judging both good & bad - which is to be learned/skilled in the Word of Righteousness.

    The beginning of Hebrews 6 speaks of our growth from learning the basics (milk) to advance in learning the above (meat), which is commanded of us in Heb6:1. By 6:4 and beyond is a warning to grow to Perfection as we are commanded to do.

    - In Philippians 3:7-16 Paul explains that there is another level of Perfection (3:12) to strive for after reaching maturity (3:15). It is in this context that Paul then speaks of others he calls "enemies of the cross of Christ" (3:18).

    One of the words Paul uses to speak of this same concept is the word "spiritual" as seen in Galatians 6:1-2. To become a "spiritual" / "mature/perfect" Christian is to come to the point where we can identify "any trespass" and help restore a fellow Christian who has become overtaken by sin. In this way we may fulfill the Law of Christ - which at the end of the analysis is to love one another as He loved us - and in this way also love our Lord & our Father by keeping God's commandments. By assisting one another with sin issues (part of love for one another), it is also our honor and responsibility as given to us by God to imitate what He has done for us to relieve us of sin.

    Perfection is commanded of us and is a vital part of our Salvation. The Biblical teaching about our Perfection includes warnings against not striving for this spiritual growth to perfection & beyond to another perfection - arriving at the resurrection (Phil3:11).

    There are several more verses to study re: Biblical Perfection. Our Perfection is a big deal, to say the least. It was also vital in Jesus' life (Heb5:6-9) and note how it is associated with His learning obedience by the things He suffered. Then note that Salvation is for those who obey Him.
     
    Last edited: Oct 7, 2020
  8. childoftheword

    childoftheword New Member

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    Amen!! And to add, we must always remember to do this (what you said) the way Jesus said to:

    Mat 7:3 Why do you see the speck that is in your brother's eye, but do not consider the beam that is in your own eye?
    Mat 7:4 Or how will you tell your brother, ‘Let me remove the speck from your eye;' and behold, the beam is in your own eye?
    Mat 7:5 You hypocrite! First remove the beam out of your own eye, and then you can see clearly to remove the speck out of your brother's eye.

    There are many Christians out there encouraging and trying to help other Christians out regarding the sins and bondage the other Christians are in, but the one helping has not dealt with their own sins first. Often times the help, "hypocrites" (as Jesus called them) give, is simply theory rather than their experience (i.e. their testimony) with Jesus, the New Covenant and overcoming. Truthful theory can help, but a living testimony on God's Covenant, instruction and teaching is far more powerful.
     
  9. WebersHome

    WebersHome Well-Known Member Supporter

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    The perfection spoken of in Matt 5:43-48 has to do with prejudice and favoritism; and that's it, nothing more.

    1John 1:8-10 . . If we say that we have no sin, we are deceiving ourselves, and the truth is not in us. If we say that we have not sinned, we make Him a liar, and His word is not in us.

    The pronouns "we" and "ourselves" and "us" include the author of the epistle. Well; if the apostle John wasn't sinless, then I honestly do not think it wise for Christians today to think themselves capable of doing any better.
    _
     
  10. GDL

    GDL Well-Known Member

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    Do you see someone here saying "perfection" for Christians is being sinless?

    Matt5:43-48 "prejudice and favoritism" is about "enemies" and "the evil" and "the unrighteous"? Will you elaborate what you see & mean?
     
  11. childoftheword

    childoftheword New Member

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    On the contrary, the Matthew 5:43-48 perfection is about LOVE.

    The Bible relates our perfection with LOVE:

    1Jn 2:5 But whoever keeps his word, God’s love has most certainly been perfected in him. This is how we know that we are in him:
    1Jn 2:6 he who says he remains in him ought himself also to walk just like he walked.

    1Jn 4:17 In this love has been made perfect among us, that we may have boldness in the day of judgment, because as he is, even so are we in this world.
    1Jn 4:18 There is no fear in love; but perfect love casts out fear, because fear has punishment. He who fears is not made perfect in love.

    Perfect LOVE comes with ceasing from sin completely, because the Bible defines LOVE as obeying God's commandments, God does not command us to sin, but to stop sinning:

    Joh 14:15 If you love me, keep my commandments.

    1Jn 5:2 By this we know that we love the children of God, when we love God and keep his commandments.
    1Jn 5:3 For this is loving God, that we keep his commandments. His commandments are not grievous.

    2Jn 1:6 This is love, that we should walk according to his commandments. This is the commandment, even as you heard from the beginning, that you should walk in it.

    SIN is breaking God's commandments:

    1Jn 3:4 Everyone who sins also commits lawlessness. Sin is lawlessness.

    Now with that being said, moving on to this:

    The Apostle John also said this:

    1Jn 3:5 You know that he was revealed to take away our sins, and in him is no sin.
    1Jn 3:6 Whoever remains in him does not sin. Whoever sins has not seen him and does not know him.
    1Jn 3:7 Little children, let no one lead you astray. He who does righteousness is righteous, even as he is righteous.
    1Jn 3:8 He who sins is of the devil, for the devil has been sinning from the beginning. To this end the Son of God was revealed: to destroy the works of the devil.
    1Jn 3:9 Whoever is born of God does not commit sin, because his seed remains in him; and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.

    John's point in Chapter 1 is if we come to God and have NOT been purged of our old sins as God has commanded and say "we have not sinned" (past tense), we make God a liar. Because He has ordained that we must be purged of our sins. But if we confess our sins He will cleanses us as promised. Jesus literally takes away our sins and we are expected to obey Him (abide in Him) and stop sinning (1 John 3:5-6) . By chapter 3 verse 9, John makes it clear children of God do not sin and they cannot sin because God's Word abides in them and they are born again of God (the old is gone). The reason for the fact that we come to a place where we stop sinning is because children of God are trained by God in how to live in Love (Titus 2:11-14), and they obey His teachings and new Way of life He teaches them.

    God's word abiding in us 1 John 1:10, equates to overcoming satan and sin 1 John 2:14, 1 John 3:9 (Luke 8:11). Those still sinning have not been purged and do not have God's Word in them.
     
    Last edited: Oct 8, 2020
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