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Featured We are the Church, so why is it a problem churches temporarily closed?

Discussion in 'Christian Philosophy & Ethics' started by WrappedUpinHisLove3, May 18, 2020.

  1. WrappedUpinHisLove3

    WrappedUpinHisLove3 Well-Known Member

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    Hi, I live in the UK and I do miss my physical church. online gatherings are helpful but they are not the same. also not everyone has internet access. but...

    Here is where i stuggle a bit. I hear many Christians saying how awful it is that churches are closed, and saying that ministers are in sin for complying with the regulations and staying closed. Some are saying that thsoe churches are never going to open again? Lockdown is temporary, and is being gradually lifted here in the Uk. Most churches won't close. some might do due to lack of income and am not saying i am not sad about it. but, the Church is the bride of Christ. The Remnant. so this virus is not going to destroy her.

    i am guessing that we will maybe end up meeting in house churches and holding meetings that way? i don't see how that is actually a bad thing, although I guess many community based and social justice activities set up by church may have to fold which would be very sad. i support those kind of preojects wholeheartedly. i am labelled as vulnerable and marginalised (disabled, sick and on welfare etc) an dhave benefitted from the churches support in this way.

    but, although i support social justice and welfare, in temrs of being the church and preaching the gospel, healing the sick, driving out demons, encouraging and prayign for each other, giving to each other who are in need, well having house churches or undrground churches did not stop the early church , did it? In countries like China, the underground church is flourishing. life is much harder for them than it is in the West, yet they have not been extinguished. they are flourishing.

    we can still BE the church. we ARE His body. We are waiting for Him to take us to our wedding feast. when i say Church, i do not refer to an institution. i am talking about ALL born again believers. yes, it will be hard. yes there will be limitations. but i dont get the "doom and gloom" of some believers who are saying pastors are sinning for not opening church.

    for a start, are we meant to be judging our brothers and sisters in Christ for a personal conviction? maybe God has shown them to close for a season until there are sufficient hospital beds to deal with the crisis. or maybe, some He has told to open? are we not supposed to be UNITED as a body of believers, rather than condemning and judging one another which can cause splits in the body? what kind of witness is it to the world if they see us backbiting at each other in this way?
     
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  2. Not David

    Not David Der Ewige Katechumene

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    Regardless if we think the temporary closing is necessary or not, the Sunday Worship is supposed to be physical.
     
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  3. ralliann

    ralliann christian

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    It is the coming together that the Lord's edification is isn't it?

    1Co 14:26 How is it then, brethren? when ye come together, every one of you hath a psalm, hath a doctrine, hath a tongue, hath a revelation, hath an interpretation. Let all things be done unto edifying.


    Mt 18:20 For where two or three are gathered together in my name, there am I in the midst of them.
    And keeping the Feast....a holy convocation?

    I think also to partake of the Lord's supper

    1Co 11:33 Wherefore, my brethren, when ye come together to eat, tarry one for another.

    Yeah we can go underground just like the early Church did. Because we are called like they were to do so. Do you not think this a big deal?
     
    Last edited: May 18, 2020
  4. messianist

    messianist Well-Known Member Supporter

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    Why Sunday?
     
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  5. ViaCrucis

    ViaCrucis Evangelical Catholic of the Augsburg Confession

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    That churches are temporarily closed is an unfortunate, but necessary thing in order to protect our congregations and ministers, many of whom are very vulnerable. Most of the congregants at my church are 60+, thus making them among the most vulnerable to COVID-19.

    Now, the reason why this is unfortunate is because church is something that happens together, when we gather together to hear God's Word and receive His Sacraments. There are vital dimensions to Christian life and worship which are lost when we do not meet together.

    But Christ teaches us that how we treat our fellow man is more important than our own sense of religious obligation, saying that if one is on the way to the Temple to make an offering, but has left a matter unresolved with his brother, he should go and make amends with his brother and then go make his sacrifice.

    My desire for the Lord's Supper, while on its own a good thing, if warped and twisted to become selfish and leads me against my brother or sister or neighbor then it is no longer good but sinful and wicked. And there is serious warning against taking the Supper in an unworthy manner. The Lord's Table is a place of peace and mercy. Christ Himself is there giving Himself freely in and under the bread and the wine. Let us come before the Lord with humility, gladness, and thanksgiving, together in the unity of the faith.

    -CryptoLutheran
     
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  6. ViaCrucis

    ViaCrucis Evangelical Catholic of the Augsburg Confession

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    While Christians have historically met on every day of the week, or most days of the week; the first day of the week, the Lord's Day, has always been the day of special significance: The day Christ rose from the dead, the 8th Day of Creation for Christ's resurrection is new creation, the renewal of all things, the Eternal Day for which there is no more night. As such, since the time of the New Testament, that has been the most important day of the week on which Christians have gathered for worship.

    The evidence for this is abundant throughout Christian history, beginning with the New Testament itself.

    -CryptoLutheran
     
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  7. WrappedUpinHisLove3

    WrappedUpinHisLove3 Well-Known Member

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    It is a big deal but this closure is temporary for most churches. most of them will open again. pastors are not sinning by closing their churches. some pastors did open their churches and died from the virus. was that God's will?
     
  8. WrappedUpinHisLove3

    WrappedUpinHisLove3 Well-Known Member

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    THIS. surely we can close temporarily so vulnerable people do not die?
     
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  9. WrappedUpinHisLove3

    WrappedUpinHisLove3 Well-Known Member

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    why sunday?

    Jesus is our Sabbath rest. we worship every day in a sense, as believers, don't we? as Jesus has fulfilled the Shabbat, does the day matter?
     
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  10. WrappedUpinHisLove3

    WrappedUpinHisLove3 Well-Known Member

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    it is, but someone with a condition lke diabetes or asthma could die from the virus. so how are they sinning by staying away for a few months? i styaed away from church due to my health. i miss it but it seemed sensible becaue God wants us to care for our bodies.
     
  11. ralliann

    ralliann christian

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    I did not say it is sinning or not. I was just answering the op. As for closing the Churches it ought not be done. It should be voluntary where nobody is forcing anyone concerning it, nor judging anyone concerning it either way.
     
  12. messianist

    messianist Well-Known Member Supporter

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    The disciples met daily not once a week.
     
  13. ralliann

    ralliann christian

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    I might stay away myself. It should be a choice we make as believers, not the government.
     
  14. WrappedUpinHisLove3

    WrappedUpinHisLove3 Well-Known Member

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    aah- i see. yes, am with you on that one. i do believe it should be decision up to individual churches whether they stay open or not.

    i guess i just dont understand why so many christians are seeing this as the end of the road rather than trusting God that this season we are in will pass?
     
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  15. ralliann

    ralliann christian

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    It's a violation of our constitutional rights as Christians. That is why it is important.
     
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  16. WrappedUpinHisLove3

    WrappedUpinHisLove3 Well-Known Member

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    some of them are acting like the UK and America are going to be judged by God for the churches closing! but we are not subject to wrath, if we are born again believers. that is why i say the true church (us who are Elect) will continue
     
  17. WrappedUpinHisLove3

    WrappedUpinHisLove3 Well-Known Member

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    ah- so it is political rather than theological? ok, yeah, I understand now. thank you. there are so many confuisnopinions on this everywhere!
     
  18. ralliann

    ralliann christian

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    Well some are making a choice and being arrested. It's a shame that everyone is not upset over this.
     
  19. ralliann

    ralliann christian

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    No it is not political. It can go underground and be done illegally.
     
  20. ViaCrucis

    ViaCrucis Evangelical Catholic of the Augsburg Confession

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    And yet the first day of the week was a day of special significance.

    "But every Lord's day gather yourselves together, and break bread, and give thanksgiving after having confessed your transgressions, that your sacrifice may be pure. But let no one that is at variance with his fellow come together with you, until they be reconciled, that your sacrifice may not be profaned. For this is that which was spoken by the Lord: In every place and time offer to me a pure sacrifice; for I am a great King, says the Lord, and my name is wonderful among the nations." - Didache ch. 14, c. 60-100 AD

    "You perceive how He speaks: Your present Sabbaths are not acceptable to Me, but that is which I have made, [namely this,] when, giving rest to all things, I shall make a beginning of the eighth day, that is, a beginning of another world. Wherefore, also, we keep the eighth day with joyfulness, the day also on which Jesus rose again from the dead. And when He had manifested Himself, He ascended into the heavens." - Epistle of Barnabas 15:8-9, c. 80-130 AD

    "If, therefore, those who were brought up in the ancient order of things have come to the possession of a new hope, no longer observing the Sabbath, but living in the observance of the Lord's Day, on which also our life has sprung up again by Him and by His death — whom some deny, by which mystery we have obtained faith, and therefore endure, that we may be found the disciples of Jesus Christ, our only Master — how shall we be able to live apart from Him, whose disciples the prophets themselves in the Spirit did wait for Him as their Teacher? And therefore He whom they rightly waited for, having come, raised them from the dead." - St. Ignatius, Epistle to the Magnesians, ch. 9, c. 107 AD

    "I, John, your brother and partner in the tribulation and the kingdom and the patient endurance that are in Jesus, was on the island called Patmos on account of the word of God and the testimony of Jesus. I was in the Spirit on the Lord's day, and I heard behind me a loud voice like a trumpet" - Revelation 1:9-10, c. 90-100 AD

    -CryptoLutheran
     
  21. WrappedUpinHisLove3

    WrappedUpinHisLove3 Well-Known Member

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    i am upset and i think most of us are. but that doesnt mean God is going to judge us. buti do agree it is wrong that government closed them. i hope this season ends soon. at least we can pray. that is one thing we can do.
     
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