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We are riddled with government conspiracies.

Discussion in 'Conspiracy Theories' started by OldWiseGuy, Dec 19, 2021.

  1. OldWiseGuy

    OldWiseGuy Wake me when it's soup. Supporter

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    Government officials often state publically, even campaigning on, promises to solve pressing social and economic problems. Too often the truth is that they have no intention of following through on these promises, if indeed they are even able to do so when elected.

    In my city mayors and county officials promise to "clean up our (once beautiful) lakes". It is an annual media event usually held in the spring when citizens begin to think about summer activities on the lakes.

    This while knowing that the DNR and several science departments at our university have no intention of allowing the lake to slip from their control into the hands of the people at large. The DNR, which has control of all navigable waterways in the state, manages the lakes for the benefit of big-game fishing, which requires a weedy lake, especially near the shorelines where prey species can multiply and find refuge in the thick weed beds. By midsummer shoreline fishing is virtually impossible in all the county lakes.

    Also clean, clear waters are of little interest to biologists, who favor hyper-eutrophic waters for their study purposes. They would be delighted if the lakes turned into swamps; more 'biological communities' to study. Meanwhile nearly all the beaches will need to be closed often because of toxic algae blooms that infect most of the lakes.

    Now that there, that's a conspiracy.
     
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  2. Nithavela

    Nithavela Press Z for disrespect

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    That's not a conspiracy.
     
  3. Rene Loup

    Rene Loup Left the pack, joined the flock.

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    When it comes to conspiracy theories in general, I think it shows we're more interested in scapegoats than solutions; especially because of the fear and anger surrounding COVID-19, and all of the events leading up to it.
     
  4. OldWiseGuy

    OldWiseGuy Wake me when it's soup. Supporter

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    Just because they don't see the harm in their secret plans doesn't mean it's not a conspiracy. Their plans are secret because with few exceptions no one knows what they are doing. A conspiracy because they are the ones giving assurances to local leaders that they are doing all they can to clean up the lakes while their actions (and non-actions) assure that the lakes won't be cleaned up.
     
  5. Rene Loup

    Rene Loup Left the pack, joined the flock.

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    If it's a complete secret, then where are you getting your evidence from? Where are they getting their evidence from? How did they obtain the evidence to provide to you?
     
  6. OldWiseGuy

    OldWiseGuy Wake me when it's soup. Supporter

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    Their plans are buried in reams of reports or obscure journals that they know few will read. It's a way of covering their butts just in case someone makes a stink.

    Take this test. Try to find out the principles of health by reading articles by doctors, health guru's, scientists, and the many others who publish such information. The truth is in there...a pint of truth carefully hidden in a lake of mostly useless information. Good luck trying to find it, or recognizing it if you do.
     
  7. SkyWriting

    SkyWriting The Librarian Supporter

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    The "People at large" rarely fish out floating crap from the lakes.
    Nor do they monitor chemical dumping.
    Algae is the most natural of any lake wildlife.
    They feed on human waste in the water.
     
  8. Nithavela

    Nithavela Press Z for disrespect

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    No, I mean it's not a conspiracy because it's done very much in the open.
     
  9. Rene Loup

    Rene Loup Left the pack, joined the flock.

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    Then how do you know of its existence? Do you have proof of their existence, or is this speculative?
     
  10. OldWiseGuy

    OldWiseGuy Wake me when it's soup. Supporter

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    The 'people at large' largely want clean lakes. Providing this is in the hands of those who have authority over public waters. The public has no such authority.
     
  11. OldWiseGuy

    OldWiseGuy Wake me when it's soup. Supporter

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    It's obvious. Not all conspiracies are hidden from view.

    There are several non-government groups that propose to help clean up the lakes here (some supported by local businesses), yet the lakes get worse each year. A spokesperson for one such group confided to me that there were "roadblocks" that hampered their efforts at cleaning up one particular lake. That roadblock is the control of and agenda for that lake by the DNR and the local university science departments.
     
    Last edited: Dec 19, 2021
  12. angelsaroundme

    angelsaroundme Well-Known Member

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    They sometimes say that a charity can't be too successful or the problem will go away and they won't be able to get more money. Problems for governments aren't always burdens. Often they are a kind of social currency. Letting the problem get worse may even be in their best interest.
     
  13. OldWiseGuy

    OldWiseGuy Wake me when it's soup. Supporter

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    True. One of our lakes is famous as a 'study subject' attracting scientists from all over the world, and provides our university science departments with huge study grants from all over the place as well. It's the 'golden petri dish' for them.
     
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  14. inquiring mind

    inquiring mind associate with those you can learn from Supporter

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    Trump did most of what he promised, even though opposed continually at every turn, but still arguably more than any other politician... and we see where that got him in the swamp. So, you're right, most will play the swamp game.
     
  15. Rene Loup

    Rene Loup Left the pack, joined the flock.

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    I'm simply going by the word of a stranger on the internet. Where's the evidence?
     
  16. OldWiseGuy

    OldWiseGuy Wake me when it's soup. Supporter

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    Doesn't my story have a familiar ring?
     
  17. Rene Loup

    Rene Loup Left the pack, joined the flock.

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    This is why I don't take online claims at face value. Anyone truly caring about truth should at least make the effort to provide evidence instead of using mental gymnastics to justify one's position.

    Always test the spirits (1 John 4:1-6). Even Levitical Law required physical evidence to expose criminal activities (Deut. 19:15-21, 22:12-21, Num. 5:11-31). Numbers 5:11-31 is comparable to a modern day DNA/lie detector test. If even the ancient Israelites understood the important of physical evidence, then what is our excuse?
     
  18. JacksBratt

    JacksBratt Searching for Truth Supporter

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    I understand your concern. However, I grew up on a lake. It has changed over the years due to a few things.

    One, an invasive weed species that ran rampant in the 70's and 80's. The government tried to run "weed cutters" to clean it up and allow for boating and other water sports, including fishing. In the end, cutting did work only because the clipping of the weeds made the more bushy and choked them out.

    Then there was the invasive Zebra mussels. These little critters clogged pipes and caused sharp surfaces on the bottom and many cut feet resulted. The mussels cleared the water in our usually murky lake and the Walleye left for deeper waters where they could get away from the sun. The weeds and mussels are still there and the lake is not the same as it was when I was a child.

    Eventually different fowl and other organisms learned that the mussels were good to eat and the overpopulation died down.

    Then there was the great Carp cull. Oh ya, it was presented as a "virus" that started killing all the Carp ( an invasive species as well). But rumors were quite accepted that the ministry of natural resources had done this on purpose in order to get rid of the majority of this fish species and allow the Catfish to come back.

    If they had of announced that they were doing this there would have been a huge outcry.

    In the end, weeds will grow where the depth of the water and bottom type allow. Invasive species are going to come. Control of these are expensive and marginally effective.

    Now we have the Cormorants. IMO, disgusting water birds that eat copious amounts of small fish and defecate toxic waste into the water system. They roost in trees killing them. They are allowing a "shoot on site" hunting law in order to slow this down.

    Muskie and Pike do not cohabitate well. Our lakes have no Pike... but they are coming. It's inevitable in a system which I can boat from our dock all the way to Florida if I took the time to do so. Fish will eventually migrate throughout.

    Managing waterways is a huge chore. Our small system of local lakes are reservoir lakes. Their levels are lowered in the winter to allow for spring run off. But they must maintain significant levels for Ice fishing until that season ends. Then lower the lakes for the spring melt. Then, levels must be maintained at chart datum levels to allow safe navigation.

    Too much snow melt or rain means that the navigation system must shut down travel due to high current rates. Some people get stranded between locks and lakes while they get the system in balance.

    I think it would be very difficult to manage a lake system to cater to one interest group.

    It's probably not a conspiracy. It's probably the best they can do with a very large ecosystem with numerous influencing factors.

    You want "no weeds" for boating and skiing. You want some weeds for fishing and specie diversification. You don't want the lake clogged with weeds as it benefits nobody.. not even the fish.

    Just my two cents.
     
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  19. OldWiseGuy

    OldWiseGuy Wake me when it's soup. Supporter

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    Thanks for your input.

    Our lakes are easily managed for the benefit of all. Those in authority just won't do it, while saying that they will.
     
  20. JacksBratt

    JacksBratt Searching for Truth Supporter

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    It's too bad that there is so much deceit and corruption in the world.. and... it seems to be that it concentrates with those in power... or.. we notice it more because it has such an impact on us while we can do very little.
     
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