What is the Big Secret About the Emmaus Walk? Need Advice!

TheyCallMeDave

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Well this time we will have to wait till you are back to continue and I honestly do hope your experience is truly from God.

The reason I don't interpret the quote as giving yourself completely to what God has in store for you while on the Emmaus Walk is simply because that is not what it says. It says to give yourself completely to the Emmaus Walk. Period. It is only a logical interpretation if you don't question the motives behind it. I do question the motives behind it and just because it is "mainstream" Christian event does not mean I trust it. Some cults originated in mainstream churches.

If you read all the by-laws and principles and rules and covenants and agreements laid out by Emmaus, you will see that it is a very carefully structured program. Do you really think that they would leave something like that quote which says something very definite if it wasn't what they meant?

Emmaus do not want you questioning anything that goes on as they say it is not for theological debate and you are expected to be involved in all of the 72 hours as, again according to the "What is Emmaus?" booklet, you are "indispensable" to the program and your table group.

My "axe" that I am grinding is simply the hurt and division that Emmaus has caused in churches which you can see on the various forums. Added to that is the fact that Emmaus is promoted aggressively in churches and some of those commenting on forums have felt pressured to go even when they have refused.
The booklet backs this up as the Emmaus Community want the program pushed in churches.

When I first heard of this program, I wanted to know what it was about but could find little information anywhere. That is when I ran into the secrecy and that is what drove me to investigate further. Simply put, I will not get involved in any weekend that requires such secrecy. And that's when I started reading the Upper Room's own material and with every page read, it got worse!

So I await your return and maybe we will still be at odds. I will have some challenging questions for you. But a great emotional experience won't help any because there are many with bad emotional experiences at Emmaus as well. And that is why I concentrate on the "why" instead of the experience.

Very sadly, i had to leave the Emmaus get together after a few hours last night due to something i ate earlier at dinnertime on the way up to Emmaus which caused me diahrea , sweats, and a headache. Fortunately, I lived only 45 min. away. But they are going to give me a raincheck to go on the next scheduled Emmaus Walk in a few months time.

However, based on what i did experience for the first few hours, I did not see anything that caused concern or be anti-biblical or dishonoring to God in the least.

To your point of 'giving yourself to the Emmaus Walk' ; they did verbalize this last night to the entire group along with the statement of getting all you can out of the spiritual experience God has for you . The very purpose of Emmaus is to bring you closer to God in relationship with the added benefit of drawing closer to the Bretherun in attendence , so again... i fail to see the validity of your assertions.

As far as secrecy is concerned ; dont Christians who are are evangelizing another to be saved apply some level of secrecy by reserving to tell the Person that the Christian Walk is going to be made up of carrying Ones cross thru daily spiritual battles , that there will be times of disappointments and personal struggles, and possible abandonment of vital family relationships instituted by Another ? Dont Christians exhibit secrecy in this regard ? Is it correct to term this sort of secrecy being disengenuous or having cultic overtones to it ?

Questions for You :
a. Can you give specific examples of how churches have been harmed by Emmaus including actual links to people claiming such ...who have, themselves, been on the Emmaus Walk ?

b. Have you personally been on the Emmaus Walk ? Did you have a distinctive bad experience during this walk with another(s) ? Was there any form of betrayal involved in your bad experience(s) ?

c. If you have been on an Emmaus Walk, how would you change certain things about the Walk to be more biblically acceptable in your view ?

TY. Dave
 
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Phil G

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Very sadly, i had to leave the Emmaus get together after a few hours last night due to something i ate earlier at dinnertime on the way up to Emmaus which caused me diahrea , sweats, and a headache. Fortunately, I lived only 45 min. away. But they are going to give me a raincheck to go on the next scheduled Emmaus Walk in a few months time.

However, based on what i did experience for the first few hours, I did not see anything that caused concern or be anti-biblical or dishonoring to God in the least.

To your point of 'giving yourself to the Emmaus Walk' ; they did verbalize this last night to the entire group along with the statement of getting all you can out of the spiritual experience God has for you . The very purpose of Emmaus is to bring you closer to God in relationship with the added benefit of drawing closer to the Bretherun in attendence , so again... i fail to see the validity of your assertions.

As far as secrecy is concerned ; dont Christians who are are evangelizing another to be saved apply some level of secrecy by reserving to tell the Person that the Christian Walk is going to be made up of carrying Ones cross thru daily spiritual battles , that there will be times of disappointments and personal struggles, and possible abandonment of vital family relationships instituted by Another ? Dont Christians exhibit secrecy in this regard ? Is it correct to term this sort of secrecy being disengenuous or having cultic overtones to it ?

Questions for You :
a. Can you give specific examples of how churches have been harmed by Emmaus including actual links to people claiming such ...who have, themselves, been on the Emmaus Walk ?

b. Have you personally been on the Emmaus Walk ? Did you have a distinctive bad experience during this walk with another(s) ? Was there any form of betrayal involved in your bad experience(s) ?

c. If you have been on an Emmaus Walk, how would you change certain things about the Walk to be more biblically acceptable in your view ?

TY. Dave

Hi Dave, I'm sorry to hear you were sick and hope you get better soon.

I didn't expect you would see anything wrong after the first few hours so that doesn't surprise me. The problem with the statement giving yourelf completely to Emmaus is very obvious. Despite what they told you, they don't want you to question anything that goes on, just accept it as part of the experience. And it is primarily an emotional rather than teaching based experience.

I have not been on a walk but that does not discount me having my opinion or doing research into it just as I haven't been to a Mormon meeting but can decide it is wrong from the literature.

I do however personally know people who have had a terrible time at Emmaus and who have felt pressure to go when they didn't want to. I am not going to go into details because that is up to them but suffice to say there is common ground with my own points.

I haven't posted enough on this website to provide you with links to forums where people talked about their experiences (good and bad) but try searching for rr-bb.com, topix monticello forum and orthodoxchristianity.net to start with.

Your point about the secrecy doesn't really make sense to me. Before I gave my life to the Lord, I was hearing about the cost as well as the salvation. The Bible is an open book and there is nothing hidden from one and not another. The secrecy has led to problems both for me and my wife where, despite being Bible believing Christians, it has been difficult to break through the "Emmaus barrier".

If pilgrims came back from their walk and told us what they learned, and witnessed to their blessing from God, then that would be normal. But having a fantastic experience and then keeping it quiet because you don't want to spoil it for someone else makes no sense at all when it comes to God's Kingdom.

One potentially dangerous aspect of Emmaus is the fact that pilgrims join a community outside of the local church. The expectation is for pilgrims to be spiritually accountable to the Emmaus Community by meeting in regular groups. Some of these groups are even called accountability groups. To me this is saying Emmaus doesn't want pilgrims to just leave the weekend and go into their churches and live what they learned. They want to keep them in Emmaus while working in the churches. Why?


I am not out to stop people going to Emmaus, but I am out to stop the secrecy and the pressure applied by the Emmaus Community for people to go. One poster on the topix forum said that Emmaus is about Emmaus evangelism and not Jesus evangelism. That is a point I agree with. Some pilgrims seem eager to promote the Emmaus experience instead of pointing to Jesus. That is a common complaint where Emmaus is run. I'm not alone in this so I know I'm not just grinding my axe.

One again, I hope you are felling better and wish you blessing in Christ.
 
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TheyCallMeDave

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Hi Dave, I'm sorry to hear you were sick and hope you get better soon.

I didn't expect you would see anything wrong after the first few hours so that doesn't surprise me. The problem with the statement giving yourelf completely to Emmaus is very obvious. Despite what they told you, they don't want you to question anything that goes on, just accept it as part of the experience. And it is primarily an emotional rather than teaching based experience.

I have not been on a walk but that does not discount me having my opinion or doing research into it just as I haven't been to a Mormon meeting but can decide it is wrong from the literature.

I do however personally know people who have had a terrible time at Emmaus and who have felt pressure to go when they didn't want to. I am not going to go into details because that is up to them but suffice to say there is common ground with my own points.

I haven't posted enough on this website to provide you with links to forums where people talked about their experiences (good and bad) but try searching for rr-bb.com, topix monticello forum and orthodoxchristianity.net to start with.

Your point about the secrecy doesn't really make sense to me. Before I gave my life to the Lord, I was hearing about the cost as well as the salvation. The Bible is an open book and there is nothing hidden from one and not another. The secrecy has led to problems both for me and my wife where, despite being Bible believing Christians, it has been difficult to break through the "Emmaus barrier".

If pilgrims came back from their walk and told us what they learned, and witnessed to their blessing from God, then that would be normal. But having a fantastic experience and then keeping it quiet because you don't want to spoil it for someone else makes no sense at all when it comes to God's Kingdom.

One potentially dangerous aspect of Emmaus is the fact that pilgrims join a community outside of the local church. The expectation is for pilgrims to be spiritually accountable to the Emmaus Community by meeting in regular groups. Some of these groups are even called accountability groups. To me this is saying Emmaus doesn't want pilgrims to just leave the weekend and go into their churches and live what they learned. They want to keep them in Emmaus while working in the churches. Why?


I am not out to stop people going to Emmaus, but I am out to stop the secrecy and the pressure applied by the Emmaus Community for people to go. One poster on the topix forum said that Emmaus is about Emmaus evangelism and not Jesus evangelism. That is a point I agree with. Some pilgrims seem eager to promote the Emmaus experience instead of pointing to Jesus. That is a common complaint where Emmaus is run. I'm not alone in this so I know I'm not just grinding my axe.

One again, I hope you are felling better and wish you blessing in Christ.

Ill check out the web forums you listed. Thanks. Then ill make my decision whether im going to go on it again in May.
 
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TheyCallMeDave

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Ugh- spiritual abuse turns my stomach. Giving people panic attacks, causing them to fear, and swearing them to secrecy isn't from God.

Each one of those needs to be highly scrutinized to see if in fact there is credibility toward blaming the alleged Source . 'Spiritual abuse' can often be misconstrued as such . Im not saying these assertions are true or false of Emmaus...for, school is still out on that at least for myself.
 
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Phil G

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Each one of those needs to be highly scrutinized to see if in fact there is credibility toward blaming the alleged Source . 'Spiritual abuse' can often be misconstrued as such . Im not saying these assertions are true or false of Emmaus...for, school is still out on that at least for myself.

I absolutely agree with you on that one Dave. All I would want is for people to stop and think about any teaching etc that they hear and test it. Do not trust the messenger or the experience, check out the message and what is involved for yourself.
 
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JohnGM10

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I delivered to my Sponsor this afternoon my form to attend an April WTE . The question was asked why?
The answer is balance .
My Wife and the sponsor and his wife have moved away from me
they are 4thdayers
to get balance with my wife I have to walk this walk.
It Is that simple and that complex.
Peace of Christ be with you
 
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seashale76

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I delivered to my Sponsor this afternoon my form to attend an April WTE . The question was asked why?
The answer is balance .
My Wife and the sponsor and his wife have moved away from me
they are 4thdayers
to get balance with my wife I have to walk this walk.
It Is that simple and that complex.
Peace of Christ be with you

And that makes absolutely no sense. What you're talking about has nothing to do with God and everything to do with following man-made obstacles.
 
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JohnGM10

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Ahh Man-Made Obstacles ,,, One of the ways some people would discribe The Upper Room Walk To Emmaus. Please go back and read my first post. Build some understanding about WTE and my relationship to the program. Often the struggles within relegious groups Make Absolutely No Sense
And
MAy the Peae of Christ be with you
JohnGM10
 
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JuJube

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I've been on a walk (its been about 10 yrs) and I would compare it to a womans conference but a sleep over with GREAT food!!!! You have alot of testimonies (that can be very personal) and etc.s. The reason truely for the 'no sharing' is only because of the surprise factor. To me it was like a weekend revival/surprise birthday party cause I really felt revived. I know I had gone on the one the Lord had led me to because one of my biggest battles happened to be one that was covered there by a speaker. Its encouraging and was a great blessing. Will it get you out of your comfort zone...yes. Do you follow a routine....yes. If you havent ever been on one, believe me you dont want the finer details told to you especially Candlelight. I dont follow up with a 4thday group cause I live out in the country but I do get involved with some of the activities. There has never been any pressure. I am not a very social person so that caused me some discomfort...but like I said, thats a good thing.;)
Btw, if you are so afraid of being deceived so easily, then I would refrain from working, going to school, going to the store out in the world, talking with your unsaved neighbors for fear of being led astray. Scary world we live in.
 
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Phil G

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I've been on a walk (its been about 10 yrs) and I would compare it to a womans conference but a sleep over with GREAT food!!!! You have alot of testimonies (that can be very personal) and etc.s. The reason truely for the 'no sharing' is only because of the surprise factor. To me it was like a weekend revival/surprise birthday party cause I really felt revived. I know I had gone on the one the Lord had led me to because one of my biggest battles happened to be one that was covered there by a speaker. Its encouraging and was a great blessing. Will it get you out of your comfort zone...yes. Do you follow a routine....yes. If you havent ever been on one, believe me you dont want the finer details told to you especially Candlelight. I dont follow up with a 4thday group cause I live out in the country but I do get involved with some of the activities. There has never been any pressure. I am not a very social person so that caused me some discomfort...but like I said, thats a good thing.;)
Btw, if you are so afraid of being deceived so easily, then I would refrain from working, going to school, going to the store out in the world, talking with your unsaved neighbors for fear of being led astray. Scary world we live in.

Emmaus recognise that secrecy is a problem. In their own publication "What is Emmaus?" it says "Sometimes people who have attented Emmaus do not reveal aspects of the three-day event so as not to spoil the experiencefor others. But as this booklet illustrates, nothing that occurs in Emmaus is secret. This witholding of information creates an air of secrecy that hurts the program and sets participants apart in the church."

< Staff Edit >

Candlelight is a particularly manipulative experience. Seeing people you recognise unexpectedly in a candlelit room but not being allowed to interact with them in any way is really messing with your head. Apart from that, only Emmaus Community members are allowed to be there. If someone you love the most is not Emmaus Community, they will be banned from the event. That is exclusiveness and should not be allowed in the Church.
 
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JuJube

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Emmaus recognise that secrecy is a problem. In their own publication "What is Emmaus?" it says "Sometimes people who have attented Emmaus do not reveal aspects of the three-day event so as not to spoil the experiencefor others. But as this booklet illustrates, nothing that occurs in Emmaus is secret. This witholding of information creates an air of secrecy that hurts the program and sets participants apart in the church."

< Staff Edit >

Candlelight is a particularly manipulative experience. Seeing people you recognise unexpectedly in a candlelit room but not being allowed to interact with them in any way is really messing with your head. Apart from that, only Emmaus Community members are allowed to be there. If someone you love the most is not Emmaus Community, they will be banned from the event. That is exclusiveness and should not be allowed in the Church.

Well everyone is entitled to their own opinions. I can say that I am glad I went. My advice is that everyone needs to get their own ok from the Lord. God leads all of us to do what He wants us to do, so it is very important to be in tune to His voice and leading.
 
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Phil G

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Well everyone is entitled to their own opinions. I can say that I am glad I went. My advice is that everyone needs to get their own ok from the Lord. God leads all of us to do what He wants us to do, so it is very important to be in tune to His voice and leading.

Good advice. But you didn't engage at all with the points I raised. This is not just my opinion, as I said the part about the secrecy is a direct quote from Emmaus' own publication and what I said about Candlelight is actually what goes on.
 
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Phil G

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I found nothing weird or strange about Emmaus. Do they have a hidden cellar where they store the freeze dried brains of their innocent victims?[/quote]

Now you're just being silly. First you see it as odd and ironic that I would judge a program without experiencing it for myself (maybe I will try that cult after all - just to see what it's like!) and now you try to equate my thinking with absurdities.

What they do is subject "pilgrims" to 72 hours of intensive programming where you are not told the time or allowed to opt out of any part of the program. You are a captive audience with no contact with the outside world and given their own teaching and you just lap it up without question.

You are railroaded into "experiences" which are then assumed are from God. You are served by an exclusive community who shower you with "gifts" and "love" but don't allow non-members in their little circle.

If you didn't find it weird or strange, I suggest you investigate psycholigical and manipulative techniques and see how they match with Emmaus.
 
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JuJube

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Good advice. But you didn't engage at all with the points I raised. This is not just my opinion, as I said the part about the secrecy is a direct quote from Emmaus' own publication and what I said about Candlelight is actually what goes on.


Ok, sorry if I didnt elaborate on that, but i thought I pretty much covered it in my 1st testimony about having gone on a walk. I dont see the "secrecy" as "secrecy". I look at it as someone putting on a surprise birthday party for someone. If someone was doing that for me, I sure would hate to drag the plansout of someone that was planning a great day for me, but out of my suspitions I ruined it... Listen , you are talking to someone that has brushed up along side of cultish activity, which I really dont feel like getting into here because that isnt the topic. PM me if you would like details....but Im sorry there is no comparison. You know there is a verse...whatsoever is not of faith is sin...if you dont have the faith for it..dont do it. Ive always said, when in doubt, DONT !!!
 
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Phil G

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Ok, sorry if I didnt elaborate on that, but i thought I pretty much covered it in my 1st testimony about having gone on a walk. I dont see the "secrecy" as "secrecy". I look at it as someone putting on a surprise birthday party for someone. If someone was doing that for me, I sure would hate to drag the plansout of someone that was planning a great day for me, but out of my suspitions I ruined it... Listen , you are talking to someone that has brushed up along side of cultish activity, which I really dont feel like getting into here because that isnt the topic. PM me if you would like details....but Im sorry there is no comparison. You know there is a verse...whatsoever is not of faith is sin...if you dont have the faith for it..dont do it. Ive always said, when in doubt, DONT !!!

As I said Emmaus clearly states that what you advocate about not spoiling the surprises is hurting the program and setting participants apart in the church (page 30 "What is Emmaus?"). This is their official position, so where are you getting the impression it is good to keep the secrets?

If it is from Emmaus, then they are being two-faced. If you are doing it on your own, you are doing more harm than good.

If you think Emmaus has nothing to do with cultish behaviour, then you have not taken the time to objectively examine the methods of Emmaus and compare them to cults. Isolating people for 72 hours and hitting them with an intensive program where they need to present for the whole lot is cult like behaviour. It's that simple.

Your point about faith does not mean you blindly follow any "Christian" event. I have faith to use the Scripture to test everything. Emmaus lacks in this. Talk #9 is titled "obstacles to grace" and indicates that sin is the obstacle to God's grace. Not so! Scripture indicates sin is the reason for God's grace eg Romans 5:20.

"When in doubt DON'T"? You seem to have no doubt, but have you tested?
 
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JohnGM10

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My Wife went to a WTE. 20+ Years friend took her . I was excluded from candle light because I had not gone to a WTE. Answer Who is the Most important person in a Married womans life , We are married 45 years.

Was a sponsor at a Junior High youth retreat Last weekend
I noticed that Agape was and is a major theme in the religious life of the church for these young leaders in the church. These High school kids that ran the program for the Junior high age kids know more about how to do a good meaningful program, including a candle light service Saturday night with the party after just like Emmaus, without all the secrecy stuff WTE thinks is necessary to make a good program.
The programs ran until 11:30 pm each night Lights out 12:30 am Breakfast at 8:00 am first program at 8:45 am. We had 5 break out meetings. It was a packed schedule, Oh we all had a schedule and had our watches so we would know what was going on, And there was no texting or use of cell phones during the activities. If you just needed to use your phone go outside. I was not surprised to find out that even Junior High age Youth can self regulate and not use their phones when not appropriate
Nice to see 150 Youth doing this program
Pease of Christ be with you
JohnGM
 
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go to sleepwalkinginthelight dot wordpress dot com and find her Walk to Emmaus.

I wish I had found the referenced blog BEFORE I wasted 3 days of my precious life on WTE. Several in my small group were church employees and had no choice but to stay and 'participate', which was clear. I left - only regret is that I did not leave the first morning. About half seemed to buy into the mindset of WTE - they assume the secretive responses to inquiries. The other half of us - well, we are trying to forget wasted time and misery of a brainwashing type approach to being in a group.

1) Sleep deprivation is used to kick emotions up to a feverish pitch.
2) Atmosphere of control - not one moment of free time.
3) No time for a shower - but they want you out of your comfort level.
4) My gut told me "don't go". I suggest if you are investating whether or not to go and your gut is talking to you ........ your gut never lies, which I have always known. But when someone else pays your way it changes your instinct to follow your gut.

Good luck everyone.
 
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