Vision, tagline, SoF, and revised promotion rule (last post has link to Wiki)

[mnphysicist]

Members and staff,

Lee has set out his vision for CF. The new site motto will be: "Where Two or Three are Gathered." The vision for CF will be heavily focused on inreach, uplifting and encouraging Christians in faith, with slight emphasis on outreach.

Some of the keywords Lee used to describe his vision for CF:

- friendly
- Christian love
- kindness
- peace
- encouragement
- hope
- support
- PRAYER


In addition, the following will replace the Nicene Creed as Christian Forums' Statement of Faith. This was drawn up as a collaborative effort between senior staff, with the intent of having a clear, concise, and easy to understand statement of faith:

CF statement of faith: This is the basis of which our non-promotion rule is based upon, and is the baseline for forum-specific guidelines. An individual forum can use the Nicene Creed without asterisks, a confession of faith, or other statements, provided such is an expansion of the CF statement of faith. However, forum-specific guidelines must not conflict with the CF Statement of Faith.

CF supports the following as a statement of faith

We worship one God, the God of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob (Isaiah 44:6-8; Exodus 3:15). God is three divine persons, the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit, who share one essence--the Trinity (John 6:27; John 1:1, 14; Romans 8:9; Hebrews 1:2-3).

Our Lord, God and Savior, Jesus Christ, the incarnate second person of the Holy Trinity, fully God and fully man (John 1:1, 14), was conceived in time by the power of the Holy Spirit and the Virgin Mary (Luke 1: 35) and existed before all time begotten of God the Father (John 1: 2; John 1: 18). He was crucified for our sins, died, was buried, resurrected on the third day (1 Corinthians 15: 3-4) and is seated at the right hand of the Father (Mark 16: 19). Jesus is the Christ, the Messiah (John 1:49; Matthew 16:16). His coming was foretold by the prophets of the Old Testament (Acts 3:18-23). He shall come again with glory to judge the living and the dead (Acts 10: 42) and His Kingdom will have no end (2 Peter 1: 11).

With the new statement of faith, the promotion rule will be changed to the following:

You will not promote any faith, belief, or religion other than Christianity. For the purpose of these rules, Christianity is defined by Christian Forums' Statement of Faith.

 

[Angeldove97]

Woot! Thanks for posting this Ron!

 

[Million Pieces]

MOST excellent!! Thanks so much Ron, and the Seniors, for making this so clear.

 

[scraparcs]

In practice, how will this affect the role of non-Christians on CF? Are there any specifics regarding how this will affect such groups? Thanks!

 

[pete56]

In practice, how will this affect the role of non-Christians on CF? Are there any specifics regarding how this will affect such groups? Thanks!

Good question, I would be very interested in the answer to this, particularly as regards non professing Christians as Mods.

 

[Nomenclature]

The statement of faith is beautifully written. I cannot see any reason for any Christian denomination or individual to have a problem with it.

 

[Lisa0315]

The statement of faith is beautifully written. I cannot see any reason for any Christian denomination or individual to have a problem with it.

I agree with the statement. However, there will be plenty who do not.

Lisa

 

[Million Pieces]

Oh yeah, that's inevitable. Someone will always find something to argue about. But that's what we are. Unapologetic.

We can not afford to candy-coat or water down or back down from our statement. Ever. Is it worth defending? Then let's do it.

 

[MN John]

Congratulations. Good job. I could wish for more, but I understand the need for it to be concise and simple. Again ... good job!

 

[Iosias]

Why was there need for a change?

 

[Timothy]

We have a creed which only really mentions Jesus... can someone explain to me just why it misses out the Fatherhood and Creatorship of God the Father, the Creatorship of God the Son and anything to do with the working of the Holy Spirit? I understand it needs to be agreeable to all, but I'm seriously concerned that it is not balancedly trinitarian.

Tim

 

[Polycarp1]

The statement of faith is beautifully written. I cannot see any reason for any Christian denomination or individual to have a problem with it.

I do (see such reasons, that is). It is a statement of faith with every element of which I agree -- and which I can see nothing in with which any mainstream Christian (range Orthodox to Baptist conventions and everything between) could not agree.

But it is not a creed adopted by the Bishops of the entire Church in conclave and taught by them. It is not the creed established by any denomination. There are those who proclaim "no creed but Christ" and "where the Bible speaks, we speak; where it is silent, we are silent" to whom a creed is anathema.

I think it's a brilliant effort to reduce the essentials of Christianity to a set of statements all can agree with. But I do see the same issues as have arisen in the past -- and more, because it doesn't have the historical cachet and unquestionable authority of the Nicene Creed.

I don't want to throw cold water on what was obviously a remarkable piece of work. I just want to raise a note of caution that there might be issues resulting from it, and why.

 

[JasonV]

CF statement of faith = lowest common denominator?

 

[karen freeinchristman]

I think it's fine. My goodness, we are using this as a tool for the site - it isn't supposed be the 'fullness of the faith'. Even the Nicene creed doesn't cover everything to do with the faith (for example it says nothing of what Jesus did during his earthly ministry - it is as if he was born and then died, with nothing in between).

 

[TomUK]

I think it's fine. My goodness, we are using this as a tool for the site - it isn't supposed be the 'fullness of the faith'. Even the Nicene creed doesn't cover everything to do with the faith (for example it says nothing of what Jesus did during his earthly ministry - it is as if he was born and then died, with nothing in between).

I don't think there's anyone who would argue that the nicene is supposed to be the fullness of the faith - historically or in the modern Church that was never its purpose. However what it does do is identify a few key aspects of doctrine, it covers the bases as it were.

This statement of faith however is significantly lacking. I don't have a huge problem what's been written already - there are quite a few bits where it'd be easy to picky, but as you say ultimately it's for a website, not a national Church. However as Polycarp pointed out, it's the things which are missing that are the biggest form of concern. As it stands at the moment i'd almost go as far as say it points towards some backwards, bizzaro form of Arianism.

As a statement of faith for anything it is woefully lacking.

 

[SpiritualAntiseptic]

"existed before all time begotten of God the Father"

Please use another word besides existed, it is problematic. The word is not used anywhere in the John Chapter 1, which it is claimed to be cited from.

Existence is a word given to things that are created. Christ is begotten of the Father, who does not 'exist', but makes things exist.

 

[drstevej]

"existed before all time begotten of God the Father"

Please use another word besides existed, it is problematic. The word is not used anywhere in the John Chapter 1, which it is claimed to be cited from.

Existence is a word given to things that are created. Christ is begotten of the Father, who does not 'exist', but makes things exist.

I did not see a request for suggested edits. This is not a WIKI.

 

[mnphysicist]

We chose the Nicene Creed when we wrote the promotion rule due to past CF history, but the problems associated with it were significant.

Many felt uncomfortable with the use of asterisks.
Many felt uncomfortable that we didnt have enough asterisks.
Many felt that the promotion document was unclear.
We kept having to rewrite rules to prevent overzealous staff from warning and infracting members over what many considered cross denominational issues.... and it kept getting worse and worse as time went on.

Many of the arguments surrounding the Nicene Creed seemed to be coming from a difference in points of view, ie the sola scriptura pov, vs the pov that the Nicene Creed is being compromised such that its no longer aligned with what the church fathers intended. Those are closely held beliefs, with hundreds of years of difference of opinion behind them. Short of shafting one group to the exception of another, there is no way to resolve it within an ecumenical group. Thus, we needed a solution, and it needed to be simple.

It should be noted, fsg's can use the full Nicene Creed without asterisks if they should want, or any other church document, provided it doesn't conflict with the OP.

 

[MariaRegina]

Which version is considered to be the "full" Nicene Creed without the asterisks?

a. The Roman Catholic Version with the later filioque addition. (Note that the Eastern Catholic Churches have recently removed the filioque "and the Son." Remember that this unscriptural addition to the Nicene Creed occurred in Spain and that this was a unilateral move. )

b. The more ancient version which did not have the filioque addition and which was approved by the Third Ecumenical Council and is currently used by the Orthodox Church.



Another question?

Can only those forums who use the Nicene Creed as their statement of faith teach the belief in angels?
Someone left out the fact that God created everything visible and invisible and that would include the angels.

Why was this statement from the Nicene Creed left out of the CF statement of faith?

I believe in one God, the Father Almighty, Maker of heaven and earth, and of all things visible and invisible.

 

[CaDan]

Which version is considered to be the "full" Nicene Creed without the asterisks?

a. The Roman Catholic Version with the later filioque addition. (Note that the Eastern Catholic Churches have recently removed the filioque "and the Son." Remember that this unscriptural addition to the Nicene Creed occurred in Spain and that this was a unilateral move. )

b. The more ancient version which did not have the filioque addition and which was approved by the Third Ecumenical Council and is currently used by the Orthodox Church.

For the purposes of FSGs, either one. Just like the Seventh Day Adventists can use the 28 Fundamental Beliefs, the Anglicans can use the 39 Articles of Religion, and the Lutherans can use the Augsburg Confession.