Virginia teen was detained and prosecuted for saying 'OINK OINK' to cop

[SummerMadness]

In all these "better training" arguments, I've noticed there has been no explanation of what training will be done in particular. That's because the statement for "better training" is not a genuine argument, it is simply a cover for someone pointing out the amount energy devoted to whether a child was rude while simultaneously ignoring police brutality.

And I still have not heard an explanation of how training addresses police corruption.

 

[W2L]

In all these "better training" arguments, I've noticed there has been no explanation of what training will be done in particular. That's because the statement for "better training" is not a genuine argument, it is simply a cover for someone pointing out the amount energy devoted to whether a child was rude while simultaneously ignoring police brutality.

And I still have not heard an explanation of how training addresses police corruption.

whether a child was rude while simultaneously ignoring police brutality.

Is that what the article said? Training is key imo.

 

[SummerMadness]

Is that what the article said? Training is key imo.

You still have said nothing, which suggests there is no substance to your post. Carry on and peace out.

 

[Ana the Ist]

No, statistics measure and assess danger would work over time given populations, and sampling would want to model what is going on in those populations, they aren't deciphered anecdotally like this.

If we took all incidences of cooking, and all incidences of soldiers in fire fights, then we looked at both the rate and severity of injuries incurred we could assess how dangerous relatively those two actions are.

The problem lies in the fundamental assumption that "the most dangerous job is that which incurs the most injury".

Injuries can happen because of all sorts of things....complacency, negligence, or just a general disregard for safety or health standards.

All of these things can take a relatively safe job and increase the likelihood of injury.

 

[Sorgen]

"But what preceded it is a matter of debate. James remembers sitting on the sidewalk, smoking a cigarette, and saying "oink oink" to a police officer, but the police had a different version of events. They claimed James provoked violence, refused to give his name, and resisted arrest.

A black teenager sitting on a sidewalk smoking a cigarette says he didn't do anything?

That's all I need! Why is there any debate?

 

[variant]

The problem lies in the fundamental assumption that "the most dangerous job is that which incurs the most injury".

Injuries can happen because of all sorts of things....complacency, negligence, or just a general disregard for safety or health standards.

All of these things can take a relatively safe job and increase the likelihood of injury.

And do we know the incidences of complacency, negligence or just general disregard for health and safety by the average police officer vs the average job you would like to compare so we can actually compare these things?

 

[variant]

In all these "better training" arguments, I've noticed there has been no explanation of what training will be done in particular. That's because the statement for "better training" is not a genuine argument, it is simply a cover for someone pointing out the amount energy devoted to whether a child was rude while simultaneously ignoring police brutality.

And I still have not heard an explanation of how training addresses police corruption.

In my experience you can't really train people not to be jerks if their parents didn't accomplish it.

Having a culture that doesn't seek to cover up for police misdeeds and spin every story to their advantage would probably be better than any "training" at mitigating situations like the one in the OP.

 

[Sorgen]

In all these "better training" arguments, I've noticed there has been no explanation of what training will be done in particular. That's because the statement for "better training" is not a genuine argument, it is simply a cover for someone pointing out the amount energy devoted to whether a child was rude while simultaneously ignoring police brutality.

And I still have not heard an explanation of how training addresses police corruption.

It appears there was no brutality.

The problem isn't with the police.

There are many videos of police interactions with Americans of African origin. There are lots of black people that do what the cop asks, like we all do, and go home, like we all do.

Then there are angry teenage boys without fathers who take out their anger on the police. I can't imagine why teenagers without fathers have issues with random authority figures.]

 

[Ana the Ist]

And do we know the incidences of complacency, negligence or just general disregard for health and safety by the average police officer vs the average job you would like to compare so we can actually compare these things?

Again....even if an officer is complacent or negligent....nobody has to assault them.

The decision to assault a cop is someone else's responsibility.

 

[SummerMadness]

It appears there was no brutality.

The problem isn't with the police.

There are many videos of police interactions with Americans of African origin. There are lots of black people that do what the cop asks, like we all do, and go home, like we all do.

Then there are angry teenage boys without fathers who take out their anger on the police. I can't imagine why teenagers without fathers have issues with random authority figures.]

When all else fails, pull out the absent black father myth. Although the data suggests otherwise, returning to racist tropes seems to be the repeated argument no matter how false it is.

 

[Ana the Ist]

And do we know the incidences of complacency, negligence or just general disregard for health and safety by the average police officer vs the average job you would like to compare so we can actually compare these things?

No....I was just counting assaults. I don't have data for how many cops slam their fingers in the cruiser doors or shoot their feet at the range.

 

[variant]

No....I was just counting assaults. I don't have data for how many cops slam their fingers in the cruiser doors or shoot their feet at the range.

Then you're just ignoring the possibility that mistakes lead to police getting assaulted.

 

[variant]

Again....even if an officer is complacent or negligent....nobody has to assault them.

The decision to assault a cop is someone else's responsibility.

I have no idea what police can do to protect themselves from assaults or how their complacency and negligence add to the danger of their work environment in this way.

You just seem to be making a bunch of assumptions for a narrative you are pushing.

 

[Ana the Ist]

I have no idea what police can do to protect themselves from assaults

I'm sure more/better training helps, but that won't eliminate the problem.

or how their complacency and negligence add to the danger of their work environment in this way.

They don't....again, the decision to assault a cop is someone else's choice. A complacent or negligent cop may or may not get assaulted completely irregardless of their their own behavior. A cop performing his job at 100% to the best of his ability incurs the same risk.

You just seem to be making a bunch of assumptions for a narrative you are pushing.

Nope. I've already given you links regarding things like drinking and drug use on contractor types of job. I can only imagine how many are linked to on the job accidents (maybe 50%...maybe not) so I'm not sure if you'd call that negligence or what.

It's the same point I've been making since the start....it's not comparable. You can't take a job where the main danger is from people attacking you and compare it to a job where you make an "oopsie" and someone gets hurt or killed.

 

[variant]

I'm sure more/better training helps, but that won't eliminate the problem.

They don't....again, the decision to assault a cop is someone else's choice. A complacent or negligent cop may or may not get assaulted completely irregardless of their their own behavior. A cop performing his job at 100% to the best of his ability incurs the same risk.

I simply doubt it. I am willing to bet that some cops get in a lot more fights than others, and further, ones that are better at dealing with it once it happens.

Nope. I've already given you links regarding things like drinking and drug use on contractor types of job. I can only imagine how many are linked to on the job accidents (maybe 50%...maybe not) so I'm not sure if you'd call that negligence or what.

It's the same point I've been making since the start....it's not comparable. You can't take a job where the main danger is from people attacking you and compare it to a job where you make an "oopsie" and someone gets hurt or killed.

I think you are mischaracterizing what it's like to work pretty much anywhere.

 

[SummerMadness]

I simply doubt it. I am willing to bet that some cops get in a lot more fights than others, and further, ones that are better at dealing with it once it happens.

I think you are mischaracterizing what it's like to work pretty much anywhere.

When it comes to covering for police misconduct, mischaracterization is the name of the game.

 

[Ana the Ist]

I simply doubt it. I am willing to bet that some cops get in a lot more fights than others, and further, ones that are better at dealing with it once it happens.

Those things aren't going to be necessarily indicative of an effective cop.

I think you are mischaracterizing what it's like to work pretty much anywhere.

How so?

 

[rjs330]

Yes, really. Cops rank 14th in most dangerous jobs. Construction work, roofing, and logging are all more dangerous.

25 Most Dangerous Jobs in America

When people say the cops risk their lives every day they are not just referring to slips and falls. They are referring to assault and attacks. Not too many heating and cooling specialists have to worry about getting shot or assaulted.

 

[Ana the Ist]

When people say the cops risk their lives every day they are not just referring to slips and falls. They are referring to assault and attacks. Not too many heating and cooling specialists have to worry about getting shot or assaulted.

Lol hey...I made the same point...

Apparently it's hard for some people to understand though. They think that we can somehow compare the difficulty of trying to stop someone from killing you ...to the difficulty of not falling off a roof or driving a truck. Simply looking at who gets injured more often, or who dies on the job, will somehow "measure" the danger.

 

[KCfromNC]

I agree, but i still think police need better training in handling proper use of force.

How much training do you need to not bring civil court cases against teenagers who joke about you? And we supposedly hold police to a much higher standard.