very confused

[chordstruck]

and I might add frusturated. I never thought this would occur but as a newly married 27 year old male(actually married 2 years now) I have hit a block wall religiously-well at least being married. I grew up Catholic my entire life. Raised in an incredible home of loving parents. Went to mass every Sunday but then fell out of religion somewhat when I was in my early and mid 20's. I got married to a fabulous woman that I love dearly. She grew up bouncing around from Baptist to non-demoninational churches. Perhaps not as church going as I was growing up-dont know if that makes a difference. I am a very deep person who takes the Lord seriously but have certain convictions I hold very strong to. I am not a Bible literalist. I believe God is an all loving God who created us and we are his children. The whole world actually. My strong conviction that a man like Ghandi(sp?) is in heaven at the moment I wouldnt question for a moment. He spent probably more time helping mankind in a week than I have my entire life. A liberal? Not really. I am socially conservative and though I have disagreed with Bush on several issues, I voted for him. Okay, I am a little off the subject. My wife doesnt "mind" the Catholic church but doesnt understand a lot of the rituals, etc. Not a problem by me. Here is my point-we are trying to find a church that we can both go to and perhaps raise children at. Unfortunaltely, a many of the "non-denominal" churches I have tried to attend make me feel as though I, as a visitor, have shown up to become "born again" or start my life with Christ. I love the Lord and am not there as a first-time Christian believer. In addition, most of those churches(and perhaps a lot of you reading this) feel as though salvation is obtained by faith alone, not your works as a human being. Has anyone been in my situation? It seems my closest possiblities are Lutheran, Methodist and some Presbyterian churches. Anyone who can help me? Anyone belong to one of those churches who would think of it as a perfect fit? Sorry this is so long. God Bless

 

[chordstruck]

oh I didn't state follow up on the faith alone comment-I believe one must also present themselves and try to live like Jesus did as best they can. Jesus life was about works. Thanks again

 

[Rafael]

Maybe try and find a place that does some charitable work, and not just a place to be comfortable. Actually, being stirred up to use our gifts from God and being encouraged for good works is a large part of what churches are for. Imagine the impact on communities and our lives when we learn to give, which is God's love, Agape, giving without expectation of return. Perhaps finding a place where this kind of activity is happening will spark your spirit, becoming a doer of God's word instead of just a hearer. It made a big difference in my spiritual walk when I found and participated in Church work towards the poor and needy. Be sure and pray that God leads you to a Church. Ask Him to open doors or bring the right people into your life to help you find His will for you and your family. Be sure and read His Word and pray as much as you can. It always helps to cover yourself with Him and know you have at least asked for His help. You'd be surprised at how many would leave out the simple part of asking God. I hope you find a place to grow in grace with your family.

Hebrews 10:24 And let us consider one another to provoke unto love and to good works:
25 Not forsaking the assembling of ourselves together, as the manner of some is; but exhorting one another: and so much the more, as ye see the day approaching.

Ephesians 2:10 For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God afore prepared that we should walk in them.

I JOHN 3:16-19 This is how we know what love is: Jesus Christ laid down his life for us. And we ought to lay down our lives for our brothers. If anyone has material possessions and sees his brother in need but has no pity on him, how can. the love of God be in him? Dear children, let us not love with words or tongue but with ACTIONS and TRUTH. This then is how we KNOW that we belong to the truth and how we set our hearts at rest in his presence whenever our hearts condemn us.

 

[Jinn_Ku]

Perhaps I can help.

I was also raised Catholic, while my wife of 3 years was raised Pentecostal. We came to a point where my Catholic views didn't mix with her Pentecostal views. On a side note, I think Catholics have a very hard time living with non-Catholics because it is very different than other denominations. Anyway, our dissagreements led me to study the Bible more in depth so I could look at her views as well as mine and see which ones were in the Bible, which weren't, and why. This actually led to my leaving the Catholic church and her leaving hers. We are now very happy because we basically forced ourselves to completely engulf ourselves in the Word of God. We are not bound by the rules of any denominations, but set free by Christ. We are open to love Him as only we can. I, like you, am a more serious person in regards to prayer and worship also, while she is far more outgoing. My worship would be very out of place in a Pentecostal church, and hers would be frowned apon in a Catholic church.

My question to you is why is it so important for you to find a denomination or church? A church is helpful, but by no means nessessary. Abraham, Noah, Moses, Joseph, they all came to know God without any other person telling them what to think or believe. Jesus never said we had to go to the temple once a week, but to love others, and to seek God. Seek Him and you will find Him.

There have been some books and preachers that have helped me quite a bit. If it's something you might be interested in, let me know.

I don't think I said what I wanted to say very well, but I was in the same boat, so if you have any questions or anything, I'll help you as best I can.


Have a nice day.

 

[RaptureTicketHolder]

our dissagreements led me to study the Bible more in depth so I could look at her views as well as mine and see which ones were in the Bible, which weren't, and why. This actually led to my leaving the Catholic church and her leaving hers. We are now very happy because we basically forced ourselves to completely engulf ourselves in the Word of God.

What a blessing this should be to all of us. No, not in stepping away from church, but in stepping into the word of GOD! I commend your committment to the Lord and to your marriage. I will trust that you were about to feel the most comfortable in this decision while leaving it all up to the Lord and His word!

Along your lines of thinking "church could be "outside de box" Jinn, I ask you Chord and our fine readers, is church something of building or a relationship?

If its a building then physically going to a place with a name would become important. I am reminded of the jewish leaders of Jesus' time.

It its a relationship, then going to the Lord at whatever place and whatever time suits you all (you, your wife, and the Lord) is important. Job is a fine example of a very close relationship with the Lord.

I have found that going to my bible studies are just as large and important as sitting in some church. I have really strengthened my relationship with the Lord in my Bible Study Fellowship (BSF) meetings and studies that no church could ever match. You may wish to consider this worldwide group as an alternative. What a wonderful bunch they are!

I really do not believe you need to go through motions or patterns, or specified times or locations as "church" dictates to have a relationship w/the Lord. I am reminded of Christs words, where two are gathered..... Be part of Christ's church body in following him, but have your relationship blossem in the Lord, through the Lord and where He leads you.

Rely not on yourself, me, other posters or some church and its building - send your concern up to Him in prayer. He will show you the way. Ask earnestly in prayer like Elijah did. Seek the Lord like David did. In doing so, HE will respond and what blessing of a relationship will follow!

I dont know, is this an amen or an oh me?

 

[Carico]

What a wonderful testimony, Jinn-Ku. That is how it should be with couples. Truly search the word of God and form a personal relationhsip with Christ. Christ is our church. God bless you!

 

[chordstruck]

thank you...I appreciated all those responses...

 

[Svt4Him]

Salvation is by faith alone, but it produces works. The Bible is clear that we are saved unto good works, not by them.

As for your salvation, there's nothing wrong with examining it, but if you feel that the churches are judging you then one of two things could be going on.

1. They are- find a different church.
2. They're not, and you're feeling convicted. Then run and hide or face the conviction.

I know some churches do do that, so I hope you find a church you both like. All churches have different feels to them, but I've never felt the need to defend my faith in any church I've visited. My wife and I have been searching for two months, after leaving my home church of eight years.

 

[nate bomb]

Get into the word man! Christ is speaking everyday thru the word. Faith and olny faith is the way to heaven John 3;16, .God didnt send his olny son so whoever did the good works that he did , shall not perish but have ever lasting life. No god sent him so that any that believed in himwould have everlasting life.

God gave us his word (the bible)if you follow it you will not olny be saved but you will find true joy, and purpose here on earth.............Nate

 

[openeyes]

May I add.... If attending a church is important to you and being part of a fellowship would help you to grow and learn, then don't be fearful of approaching the pastor, minister, preacher, or whatever his/her title is, and questioning his message.

Don't be afraid to ask:
"How did you get your message, the message I recieved from this piece of scripture is this...."
There may be something either of you didn't consider and everyone comes out more knowlegeable.
The apostles questioned Jesus and his doctorines, and the were the first to believe he was the son of God. Upon further clearification they were enlightened.

 

[JeffreyLloyd]

I'll be the odd one out I guess.

If you wife doesn't mind the Catholic Church, then maybe you should stay with the Catholic Church.

If she has questions about rituals maybe you could explain some to her.

A good book to check out is: "The Lamb's Supper: The Mass as Heaven on Earth" by Scott Hahn which tells you a lot about it.

I'm praying for you man, please don't be so quick to leave the Catholic Church.

If I can help answer any questions please feel free to ask.

 

[Benedicta00]

cordstruck,

Jeff is not the only odd one. You weren’t born Catholic by accident and you owe it to yourself and to God to kow what you reject before you reject it.

You really should learn Catholicism from Catholics before you renounce the Church's teachings.

Did you know that Jesus Christ is truly present in the Eucharist? That you receive his body and blood at mass and there is no other Church, accept the Orthodox who are also Catholic, where you will receive him in this way?

For me there is no issue because it does matter when you are looking at Jesus substantially present to us in the Catholic Church.

You will not have that in Protestantism. You will have great motivation and wonderful upbeat congregations that love the Lord, but you will not have Christ come to you and bind him, self to you in the Eucharist filling your soul with all His graces and blessings.

This is not to say that you can not be blessed in the Protestant Church, because you can but why settle for anything less then Christ's real presence itself?

Read John 6. "He who eats my flesh and drinks my blood will have life because of me and I will raise him on the last day, he who does not eat my flesh and drink my blood has no life in him"

 

[Svt4Him]

cordstruck,

Jeff is not the oily odd one. You weren’t born Catholic by accident and you owe it to yourself and to God to kow what you reject before you reject it.

You really should learn Catholicism from Catholics before you renounce the Church's teachings.

Did you know that Jesus Christ is truly present in the Eucharist? That you receive his body and blood at mass and there is no other Church, accept the Orthodox who are also Catholic, where you will receive him in this way?

For me there is no issue because it does matter when you are looking at Jesus substantially present to us in the Catholic Church.

You will not have that in Protestantism. You will have great motivation and wonderful upbeat congregations that love the Lord, but you will not have Christ come to you and bind him, self to you in the Eucharist filling your soul with all His graces and blessings.

This is not to say that you can not be blessed in the Protestant Church, because you can but why settle for anything less then Christ's real presence itself?

Read John 6. "He who eats my flesh and drinks my blood will have life because of me and I will raise him on the last day, he who does not eat my flesh and drink my blood has no life in him"

As an exCatholic, I can honestly say this is a load. You have just as much of Christ as you want. To say that because Catholics believe some doctrine different then Jesus is more with them is false. And John 6 is an idiom. If something costs you an arm and a leg, and you pay it, does your money become your arm and leg? When Jesus was at 'the last supper' and said the cup was His blood, did all His blood exit His body and go into the cup, or did He, as a man, have an endless supply of blood? But I won't debate that here. Go to a church that preaches the Bible, you understand what they're preaching, it brings you closer to God, and helps you go through life's struggles. If that's a Catholic church, and it feels like home, go there. If it's a charismatic church, go there. Go where you fit in the body.

 

[Benedicta00]

As an exCatholic, I can honestly say this is a load.

This is not a debate forum but since my beliefs and my response to the OP is attacked and refered to as a "load", I must ask, you know this as fact ? I am a practicing Catholic who was raised in the Assembly of God denomination who thinks that it is the truth. So what do you base this assessment on that it is not true?

You have just as much of Christ as you want. To say that because Catholics believe some doctrine different then Jesus is more with them is false.

No one says we have Him more, just that He is substantially present in the Eucharist. Do you understand what that means? There are many Protestants that have Him more than there are many Catholics by way of their commitment to Him. One must be worthy of Him to receive Him in the Eucharist.

And John 6 is an idiom. If something costs you an arm and a leg, and you pay it, does your money become your arm and leg? When Jesus was at 'the last supper' and said the cup was His blood, did all His blood exit His body and go into the cup, or did He, as a man, have an endless supply of blood?

And Jesus said, "Does this shock you?" And many went back to their former way of life because they couldn't not believe much like we see today, people leaving because they can not believe.

But I won't debate that here.

Then why did you feel the need to attack my advice? This is the section where questions are asks and information sought, Catholics have a right to give advice especially to a fellow Catholic.

Go to a church that preaches the Bible, you understand what they're preaching, it brings you closer to God, and helps you go through life's struggles. If that's a Catholic church, and it feels like home, go there. If it's a charismatic church, go there. Go where you fit in the body.

The Catholic Church has three different scripture readings a day at mass, and not just on Sundays. One will hear the bible preached to them in the Catholic Church but one should seek to go where the truth is and not the subjective version of it.

 

[thereselittleflower]

chordstruck

Are you prepared to take a journey in faith?

I was origianlly raised Eastern Orthodox, had a very profound conversion experience in my early teens after playing with the occult, and as my friends were prostestants, I was given a protestant interpretation to my conversion expeirence . . my catachesis as an Eastern Orthodox had not been the best. . .

But, after 30 years as a protestant, and a strong one who loves the lord and has experienced His power and love in my life in incredible ways, I came across some historical information that shook what I had accepted to be true, that the Reformation was a needed good, that the Reformers were men of God, etc . .what I found from the historical record shook me, but left my faith in Christ stronger .. I realized that I needed to find what Church had truth, and had the most truth . .

To do so, because at that time I was not willing to accept or believe that the Catholic or Eastern Orthodox Churches had preserved the truth, I realized the only way to know which denomination was the right one would be to find out, as much as possible, what the Early Church taught, believed and practiced . . I thought this may not be easy . . but what I found was, not only was finding information about the Early Church easy as well as finding translated writings of the Early Church Fathers, but I found the basic teachings of the Catholic and Orthodox churches!!

I found the Sacraments: The Real Presence, Baptisimal Regeneration, Confesion/Reconcilliation, etc . . The Perpetual Virginity of Mary, Mother Of God, Communion of Saints, the Mass . .

I was surprised and shocked . .but not yet ready to accept that what the Catholic Church is today is what it was then . .

So I studied history, the Early Church Fathers, the bible (which I have studied for years . .but now I was seeing things there I had never seen before . . wow!)

I came to the place of finally realizing I was no longer Protestant, that no Protestant Church could give me the fullness of faith and truth I had discovered present in the Early Church . .

I then came to the point of recognizing that if I was going to believe fully, and be part of the church that had the fulllness of faith, I would either need to return to the Eastern Orthodox Church, or become Catholic . .

After dealing with the issue of the Papacy, I realized I only had one real choice to make . .to either accept all the truth and be true to it by coming into the Catholic Church, or reject some, even if a small part of the truth, to go back to Eastern Orthodoxy ..

I made my decision early last summer .. I am now on my way into the Catholic Church . . I have only grown closer to God as a result, and the further I delve into God's truth, the deeper and vaster everything is . . I am awe struck at the depth, heigth, breadeth and beauty of God's truth and His Church. .

That you are where you are is, I believe, a result of several things . . one, is that catachesis in the last half of the last century in the Catholic Church was not very good . .lots of stuff was promoted that was not correct, and many were told they had learned their faith well, when they had not been taught by their teachers well . . it sounds as though your family was awesome in many ways, so perhaps you received better instruction than many I know . .

But that you are now at this point of confusion, I believe, may be because the Holy Spirit is drawing you back to the fullness of faith .. you are looking for a church that will give you this fullness . not something superficial . . and so you are looking at older Protestant denominations . .which I also did breifly . .

But, as Jeffery and Shelb5 pointed out, there is one difference that cannot be pushed aside . . though you can participate in communion in Protestant Churches, you are only participating in a symbolic gesture, something that either symbolizes our communion with Christ, or at the most is a participation spritually in Him, but you do not, and cannot, receive Him body and blood, soul and divinity . .

What I found was in the Early Church, they believed Him when He said we are to eat His flesh and drink His blood or we cannot have His life in us . . They understood that they were eating His flesh and drinking His blood . . Only in the Catholic and Eastern Orthodox Churches can one receive Him in communion in this way . .Not only do Catholics and Eastern Orthodox receive Him spiritually, they receive Him physically . . they receive Him FULLY.


Are you willing to follow Jesus Fully? Are you willing to settle for something that is less that the Fullness of faith He desires to give you?

Dig deep into the Christian faith . . dig deep into the history of the Early Church . . pray and ask the Holy Spirit to lead you, you will find your confussion leaving you as you begin to understand the basis of your Catholic faith from you childhood and what God wants to give you . . He will not fail you!




Peace in Him!

 

[Svt4Him]

This is not a debate forum but since my beliefs and my response to the OP is attacked and refered to as a "load", I must ask, you know this as fact ? I am a practicing Catholic who was raised in the Assembly of God denomination who thinks that it is the truth. So what do you base this assessment on that it is not true?

Sorry, that was unfair of me to do that. What I believe is wrong with your post is the inference that Jesus is somehow closer to you because of your doctrinal belief. If God is in my heart, how can He be closer if I believe a cracker becomes His body. Whether it actually does or not is another issue.

 

[Benedicta00]

Sorry, that was unfair of me to do that. What I believe is wrong with your post is the inference that Jesus is somehow closer to you because of your doctrinal belief. If God is in my heart, how can He be closer if I believe a cracker becomes His body. Whether it actually does or not is another issue.

Because it is not a cracker, it is the body of Christ who said to celebrate the Eucharist in memory of Him.

The thing that is wrong here is thinking that the Catholic Church believes that we have more of Him because He indeed is not a cracker but the Lord Jesus. We don’t believe that. We believe God is not stopped by the reformation that he can go to any born again Christian who is worthy of Him but he comes to Catholics in the Eucharist in a special way, not a more abundant way.

My point is, that if you are a Catholic, why give up the Eucharist? What is the reason is doing that? What could be a better deal than receiving Him this way? Protestants do not have the Eucharist. They have the Lord’s supper, but not the Eucharist. Jesus is not truly presence in a substantial way in their communion services like He is in the Eucharist but this does not mean that Protestants do not have the spiritual dwelling of Christ.

 

[Svt4Him]

Because it is not a cracker, it is the body of Christ who said to celebrate the Eucharist in memory of Him.

Jesus is not truly presence in a substantial way in their communion services like He is in the Eucharist but this does not mean that Protestants do not have the spiritual dwelling of Christ.

And this we'll have to agree to disagree on.

 

[Benedicta00]

And this we'll have to agree to disagree on.

And my original point was as a Catholic and because this person is a Catholic he should first learn what he rejects before he rejects it, not after, do you disagree with this?

He should learn from unbiased sources. You don’t go to a foot doctor to get an opinion on your heart do you?

 

[altya]

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