Vaccine - Take, wait, never + political position + right - middle - left

[LightLoveHope]

On a forum which has a lot of conspiracy followers, who also express anti government sentiments, the rights of individuals to behave as they like etc.
60% would never take the vaccine, 20% would wait, 20% would take it

The central position of the group was cynicism and seeing outsiders as evil and to be not trusted. Anything that seemed to suggest this was unwise an approach was rejected as lies and any conspiracy theory no matter how ludicrous was obviously true.

The motivation was to avoid making the choice and leaving the status quo as it is.
So I wondered if this is more about politics and world outlook, than anything objective.

It has shocked me something so unbelievably scientific and open, with all the information about mRNA and use of cold viruses etc are accessible, along with study results, such a level of doubt exists, especially among a community who claim to follow truth and love.

In my church, there is as far as I know a 100% acceptance of the vaccine, and many being 60+ are looking for some reassurance, and often are literally only alive today because of the medical support they have received over their lives, to a degree of 50% of the congregation or more are still here and would not be without medicine.

So what is actually going on? Is it actually a distortion due to the internet and who comes to forums or some other ethical, world view issue?

 

[GreekOrthodox]

Got my second Moderna shot yesterday, just tired and a sore arm today. I havent been transformed into Deadpool, but my wife is hoping for Jason Momoa!

The main reason for hesitating was not wanting to be the first round of guinea pigs, and I work at a hospital. Clinicians wanted to see what the main side effects were going to be before getting it.

 

[OldWiseGuy]

It's no wonder with the daily barrage of medications being hawked, along with which are a laundry list of possible side effects up to and including death.

Doctor: Why did this patient die. I treated him with the latest medications?
Coroner: The drug worked fine. He died of multiple side effects from it.

 

[GreekOrthodox]

It's no wonder with the daily barrage of medications being hawked, along with which are a laundry list of possible side effects up to and including death.

Doctor: Why did this patient die. I treated him with the latest medications?
Coroner: The drug worked fine. He died of multiple side effects from it.

I remember sitting down for a meeting with the chief pharmacist a few years ago and there was a full-size grocery bag filled with bottles on his desk. This was for a single patient.

 

[LightLoveHope]

It's no wonder with the daily barrage of medications being hawked, along with which are a laundry list of possible side effects up to and including death.

Doctor: Why did this patient die. I treated him with the latest medications?
Coroner: The drug worked fine. He died of multiple side effects from it.

If people understood mRNA is the safest approach one could imagine to the production of a protein, which cannot be taken over or miss-used. In a computing analogy it is like putting in the code to print to a screen "Hello, I am here"

It is unbelievably simple and direct and can do nothing else.
The other fact is it mimics just the spike protein turning up in the body, which is the same as getting infected, but with no infection or risk. So the method carries the same immune challenge of an agent entering the body, but no other downside.

There are of course other immune compromises that occur when the immune system becomes sensitive to a protein, but as everyone will get Covid eventually, we are going to have to live with this.

Following the above logic, where is the downside, at all.
Personally I rejoice that this advance in genetics has happened and shown it can save lives, across the whole world. This is a revolutionary tipping point in history, where genetics will directly affect the whole world. For some this is the end of the world, because they fear exploitation, but for others, this is a promise of a bright future.

God bless you

 

[OldWiseGuy]

I remember sitting down for a meeting with the chief pharmacist a few years ago and there was a full-size grocery bag filled with bottles on his desk. This was for a single patient.

My sister was so treated. She found a new doctor who was appalled by the two dozen or so medications she was taking. He took her off of most of them immediately.

 

[keith99]

I'm going to wait.

Until 4:50 today. The earliest appointment I could get.

 

[muichimotsu]

If my reaction is anything like the flu shot, I'll barely even notice, but who knows. Probably won't get any kind of access for my age range until early fall at best, but that might be a bit pessimistic

 

[stevevw]

On a forum which has a lot of conspiracy followers, who also express anti government sentiments, the rights of individuals to behave as they like etc.
60% would never take the vaccine, 20% would wait, 20% would take it

The central position of the group was cynicism and seeing outsiders as evil and to be not trusted. Anything that seemed to suggest this was unwise an approach was rejected as lies and any conspiracy theory no matter how ludicrous was obviously true.

The motivation was to avoid making the choice and leaving the status quo as it is.
So I wondered if this is more about politics and world outlook, than anything objective.

It has shocked me something so unbelievably scientific and open, with all the information about mRNA and use of cold viruses etc are accessible, along with study results, such a level of doubt exists, especially among a community who claim to follow truth and love.

In my church, there is as far as I know a 100% acceptance of the vaccine, and many being 60+ are looking for some reassurance, and often are literally only alive today because of the medical support they have received over their lives, to a degree of 50% of the congregation or more are still here and would not be without medicine.

So what is actually going on? Is it actually a distortion due to the internet and who comes to forums or some other ethical, world view issue?

Theres a few dynamics happening around the Covid-19 and vaccination. I think there can be the extreme anti and the extreme pro view about vaccination. There is also a more balanced view that can question things which is a healthy view in all things.

We know about the extreme views as you have pointed out and these will be motivated by far left and right ideaologies as well as being over anxious. But within the balanced centre view I would imagine people must be surprised to some extent that the vaccine has happened so quick when the science has not been able to find a vaccine for similar viruses. There has been stories of even doctors in the know having doubts about the scrutiny and testing process. So this could make people worried.

Then there is the fact that many people today just dont trust governments in anything. This is where the conspiracies come in where people think the Government wants to control everyone. But there maybe some truth to this. The way some governments have acted too quickly to shutting down society seems a bit extreme. Its easier to control a situation by controlling people than the hassle of putting all the checks and balances in place for contact tracing ect. As a result economies have suffered which may bring more problems than the virus.

In Australia we have been delayed in getting the vaccine because the government is choosing a source which has a longer testing process. So I think people are more trusting of this. I guess it comes down to weighing up the pros and cons. If there is no vaccine and people refuse to take it then its more of the same which we know means more deaths and health consequences. With the vaccine there is an unknown aspect but maybe the risk of potential side effects for some outweights not having the vaccine.

I still get this feeling that the government is up to something. Governments have a tendency to take advantage of situations and the Virus may open the door to more restrictions of society based on the growing concerns of secuirty against terrorism domestic and internatio, health controls against disease in a changing world, a simplfied paperless monetary system and to counter, and the control of immigration in a overpopulated world. Just saying.

 

[GreekOrthodox]

Well, 48 hours since I got the second shot.
Day of shot - Fine
24 hours - felt like I'd been hit by a truck, just exhausted
48 - Fine

 

[keith99]

Had a 4:50 appointment at Dodger Stadium. Left early to be sure I was on time, in large part because either 4:50 or 5:00 was teh last appointment time. Arived at about 4:20 and got in the line of cars. There were actually 3 lines. Sort of like Disneyland, all weaving back and forth. Just over an hour later it was needle in arm. That sounds like a long wait. But thinking of it that was from what corresponds to turning into t phearking lot to actual injection. Not all that bad except that crawling lines are a pain. But that was safe in my car.

When I got to the front they moved 10 cars into a line and then started vaccinating from both ends of that block. As I said there were 3 lines and each went to a different area. I got area B. There were at least 17 sets of places where the cars went in. I wasn't checking but I did notice B17. I ended up in B4. Each area they moved cars to had 2 lines. That was because they kept us there after the shot just to be sure no one had a bad reaction. So when my block of cars was finishing up they were moving cars into the area next to us and the same people started vaccinating them. Before that was done we were released.

Really done very well. The worst part actually was just before getting there. The Stadium Way exit from I5 is right in the middle of the interchange with the 2. That meant fighting my way across cars going from teh 2 to I5 and teh crossover is short. It was sort of amusing once I made the first lane change because the second was very easy, that lane was exit only and empty!

15 hours later and minimal soreness.

LAFD does things rather well.

 

[Bradskii]

Everyone that I know will get it as soon as it's available. That some people will not doesn't really worry me in the slightest. It's like them driving without a seat belt or boating without a lifejacket. They'll bear the consequences.

 

[Paulos23]

Some people will have a harder time getting it then others.

Across The South, COVID-19 Vaccine Sites Missing From Black And Hispanic Neighborhoods

 

[loveofourlord]

I'm still scheduled for vague june/july to get the vaccine when those in my age group here in Canada can get it unless things change.

 

[MehGuy]

Yes.. even though I'm probably one of the last on the waiting list.

Hoping my parents get it.. although due to my father's chemo (he doesn't have cancer) he sadly won't be able to get it for at least several months.

 

[LightLoveHope]

This seriously puzzels me.

People are dying from Covid, scientists from around the world, in every country are confirming the disease and the power of the vaccine. People who have spent at least 10 years in their field declaring this is a scientific miracle, the speed and efficacy of such a development.

We all know about vaccines, we all have them as we grow up, without exception. Small pox has been eliminated because of how well they work. These are facts, indisputable facts, truth as deep and real as truth is. Yet believers will cry liar, deceiver, mass murderer at those who encourage others to take the vaccine and say lives, literally save lives.

But maybe I have got it wrong. Certainty is not a human condition, we love to doubt, go our own way, throw out the considered opinion and show them just how wrong they are. Look at Israel coming out of Egypt, saved by the Lord from certain death, literally saved from the hand of the strongest army of its time, by fire and the parting of the sea. Surely this fact would give them a better perspective, ground them in their need and the Lords provision?

But within two months, they are partying and worshiping a golden calf.
Is it any wonder there is a connection between those who desire to not obey or follow Gods way, claiming it is impossible but also they have faith, that the vaccine demonstrates this has nothing to do with faith, just sinful rebellion against anything that forces someone to do anything.

My response to the vaccine is AMEN, Halleluyah, Praise the Lord for the skill of scientists and their dedication to a cause.

I pray for the medical workers, care workers who are seeing people die and they can do nothing about it. PTSD is a serious problem for them, my daughter needed help through counselling after the first wave, and is finding the second wave very difficult. She loves her work, but to push yourself in the face of death and seeing suffering is tough. It shows the wonder of modern medicine and the miracle of bringing people back from the brink. My mother is 95, and has been there many times, and a good friend, likewise, who did not expect to be alive today.

It makes me think of the first nurses who saw people die without any real hope, yet tried to do their bit back in 1890, and saw a difference, enough to carry on in love and care. Jesus gives us this love and care, wherever we might be, Amen.

God bless you

 

[LightLoveHope]

Theres a few dynamics happening around the Covid-19 and vaccination. I think there can be the extreme anti and the extreme pro view about vaccination. There is also a more balanced view that can question things which is a healthy view in all things.

We know about the extreme views as you have pointed out and these will be motivated by far left and right ideaologies as well as being over anxious. But within the balanced centre view I would imagine people must be surprised to some extent that the vaccine has happened so quick when the science has not been able to find a vaccine for similar viruses. There has been stories of even doctors in the know having doubts about the scrutiny and testing process. So this could make people worried.

Then there is the fact that many people today just dont trust governments in anything. This is where the conspiracies come in where people think the Government wants to control everyone. But there maybe some truth to this. The way some governments have acted too quickly to shutting down society seems a bit extreme. Its easier to control a situation by controlling people than the hassle of putting all the checks and balances in place for contact tracing ect. As a result economies have suffered which may bring more problems than the virus.

In Australia we have been delayed in getting the vaccine because the government is choosing a source which has a longer testing process. So I think people are more trusting of this. I guess it comes down to weighing up the pros and cons. If there is no vaccine and people refuse to take it then its more of the same which we know means more deaths and health consequences. With the vaccine there is an unknown aspect but maybe the risk of potential side effects for some outweights not having the vaccine.

I still get this feeling that the government is up to something. Governments have a tendency to take advantage of situations and the Virus may open the door to more restrictions of society based on the growing concerns of secuirty against terrorism domestic and internatio, health controls against disease in a changing world, a simplfied paperless monetary system and to counter, and the control of immigration in a overpopulated world. Just saying.

The nature of politics is to go with the least resistance and the quick solution.
What people think is plotting is often just opportunity that arises, to which it is easy to take advantage.

What for me has been the dividing line is saying people are corrupt, lying, intentionally stealing something when they are provably innocent. We are all born sinners, but until you have proof of sin, they are innocent.

I disliked Trumps language and approach, but he was innocent, until he claimed he won the election. Likewise I agree with sceptics of quick vaccine development, but when they say vaccinators are killing people, intentionally inserting chips etc. they are wrong and should be prosecuted for defamation of character.

In the impeachment trial republican lawyers are claiming the trial is about hatred of Trump, when it is about insurrection and slander of political opponents.

I would argue the republicans are continuing the emotional foundation of Trumps insurrection by continuing to fail to admit defaming people is a criminal act.
"You shall not give false testimony against your neighbour." Exo 20:16

Politics have got so bad, it is accepted lying about ones opponents is part of political campaigning, which means respect has gone out of the window along with facts. God declares the payment for sin is death. People get this wrong, thinking God judges sin with a death punishment, where God is declaring sin kills you, destroys everything you hold dear.

Once your enemy is not worthy of respect because of ones own lies and slander about them, you destroy your own standing, as one is guilty of the same false crimes flung at ones enemy, and so everything falls into chaos, from which there is no return.

So for me the vaccine slander is a symptom of a deeper sin of bearing false witness and its destructive affects on all aspects of society.

In discussions many fail to realise there own standing is only based on trust and a paper trail. Destroy valuing this, and you destroy the ability to discuss anything.

God bless you

 

[Larniavc]

On a forum which has a lot of conspiracy followers, who also express anti government sentiments, the rights of individuals to behave as they like etc.
60% would never take the vaccine, 20% would wait, 20% would take it

The central position of the group was cynicism and seeing outsiders as evil and to be not trusted. Anything that seemed to suggest this was unwise an approach was rejected as lies and any conspiracy theory no matter how ludicrous was obviously true.

The motivation was to avoid making the choice and leaving the status quo as it is.
So I wondered if this is more about politics and world outlook, than anything objective.

It has shocked me something so unbelievably scientific and open, with all the information about mRNA and use of cold viruses etc are accessible, along with study results, such a level of doubt exists, especially among a community who claim to follow truth and love.

In my church, there is as far as I know a 100% acceptance of the vaccine, and many being 60+ are looking for some reassurance, and often are literally only alive today because of the medical support they have received over their lives, to a degree of 50% of the congregation or more are still here and would not be without medicine.

So what is actually going on? Is it actually a distortion due to the internet and who comes to forums or some other ethical, world view issue?

My wife has had both hers and I will get my first on Friday.

 

[dogs4thewin]

At first I was not going to get it ( at least not yet) When more medical people that I know and trust started getting it I decided that I would. I cannot yet though as currently I do not fit in any groups GA is currently permitting. I plan to get it but I am in no real hurry not counting down the days or anything. Plus I have already had it, so I would rather people who have not had it get it before me anyway. Both of my grandparents got their first shot Feb 11

 

[Danthemailman]

I know a few people who got it and suffered some unpleasant side effects. I will get it only when it becomes mandatory. Get it or else I lose my job at the Post Office. Get it or else I can't fly on a plane. Get it or else I can't book a room at a hotel or resort etc.. I will be at the end of the line to get it.