US police have killed 602 in 2017

[Motherofkittens]

Broad brushing to get a point across about a problem, is never a good ideal and in fact, can be prejudiced and even racist in and of itself.

Each situation that one claims to be wrong, should be handled individually and evidence discovered to show wrong actions, racism, etc...

We live in a society, were it is acceptable to cry racism first and ask questions later and that is just an unacceptable, as racism itself.

I vehemently disagree that crying racism (I assume you mean wrongly. Which does happen but I don't see it as a huge problem. It doesn't cause that much pain) is as bad as institutional racism/prejudice.

I can only conclude you are ignorant on the subject. I don't mean that to insult you, most people that don't experience prejudice are ignorant about it (and even some who do experience it .) And of course they are, why would they know unless they went out of their way to know. It doesn't affect them. I was. I studied it . There are many scientific studies done on systematic prejudice. I urge you to do basic research on this. Please.

 

[bhsmte]

I vehemently disagree that crying racism (I assume you mean wrongly. Which does happen but I don't see it as a huge problem. It doesn't cause that much pain) is as bad as institutional racism/prejudice.

I can only conclude you are ignorant on the subject. I don't mean that to insult you, most people that don't experience prejudice are ignorant about it (and even some who do experience it .) I was. I studied it . There are many scientific studies done on systematic prejudice. I urge you to do basic research on this. Please.

I disagree. Accusing someone of racism, with no evidence to do so, can cause a person extreme harm and ruin reputations.

 

[tulc]

U.S. police have killed 635 people in 2017
(635) July 8, 2017 NC M
http://www.wbtv.com/story/35838427/on-duty-cmpd-officer-hits-kills-man-in-uptown-charlotte

(634) July 8, 2017 FL M
http://jacksonville.com/news/metro/public-safety/2017-07-08/putnam-officers-shoot-kill-man-reportedly-armed-knife

(633) July 8, 2017 WA M
http://www.theolympian.com/news/local/crime/article160278184.html
tulc(the police have killed 35 people so far in July)

 

[Steve Petersen]

I'm not sure I understand the question, are you asking me what number of people it would be acceptable for the police to kill? On average they kill about 3 people a day, this month it's grown to about 4 a day. Are you asking do I think 3 a day is ok but 4 may be a little excessive? Could you expand your question by telling me how many you think they should have killed and then I could have some idea of what you're trying to find out?
tulc(is just wondering)

You seem to be suggesting there is some injustice at work here. Do you know the details of all those killings?

 

[tulc]

You seem to be suggesting there is some injustice at work here.

I'm not "suggesting" anything, I'm posting some facts and now I'm trying to understand a question you asked.

Do you know the details of all those killings?

I know what the articles I post about each death says. Now could you explain your question?
tulc(is still curious)

 

[Steve Petersen]

I'm not "suggesting" anything, I'm posting some facts and now I'm trying to understand a question you asked.

I know what the articles I post about each death says. Now could you explain your question?
tulc(is still curious)

What was your motive for posting? Are these numbers unexpectedly high? if so, what would you expect them to be and based on what criteria?

 

[tulc]

What was your motive for posting?

so people would have information.

Are these numbers unexpectedly high?

Like I said over the years it's worked out to the police killing (on average) about 3 people a day in the U.S.. This month (as of yesterday) it's about 4 a day.

if so, what would you expect them to be and based on what criteria?

I don't expect anything. I simply post the amounts and a link to the stories about the deaths.
tulc(hopes that helps)

 

[tulc]

U.S. police have killed 641 people in 2017
(641) July 10, 2017 OH M/B Kareem Ali Nadir Jones, 30
http://www.dispatch.com/news/20170710/man-dies-after-officer-involved-shooting

(640) July 10, 2017 MN M
http://kstp.com/news/suspect-dead-child-safe-north-branch-carjacking/4538090/

(639) July 10, 2017 MD M
http://www.carrollcountytimes.com/news/mountairy/ph-cc-mount-airy-shooting-071017-20170710-story.html

(638) July 9, 2017 OH M Ryan Allen Probst, 28
http://www.ohio.com/news/local/update-uniontown-police-officer-shot-repeatedly-while-responding-to-call-suspect-killed-1.779355

(637) July 9, 2017 IL
http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/local/breaking/ct-police-involved-shooting-0710-20170709-story.html

(636) July 9, 2017 WA M
http://komonews.com/news/local/breaking-active-shooter-situation-in-bainbridge-island
tulc(the police have killed 41 people so far in July)

 

[tulc]

U.S. police have killed 647 people in 2017
(647) July 11, 2017 KS M
http://www.kshb.com/news/crime/officer-involved-shooting-reported-in-leavenworth

(646) July 11, 2017 MO M
http://www.kfvs12.com/story/35862459/1-dead-in-officer-involved-shooting-in-butler-co-mo

(645) July 11, 2017 NV M
https://lasvegassun.com/news/2017/jul/11/metro-police-shoot-wound-man-in-north-valley/

(644) July 11, 2017 NC F Tina Renee Medlin, 50
http://www.newsobserver.com/news/local/counties/johnston-county/article160803469.html

July 11, 2017 PA M Joseph Hufnagel, 47
http://www.post-gazette.com/local/north/2017/07/11/Pennsyvlania-State-police-Butler-County-Driver-killed-hits-trooper-head-on-collision/stories/201707110111

(643) July 11, 2017 WI M
http://www.wisn.com/article/deputies-respond-to-reports-of-armed-naked-man-at-johnson-creek-outlet-mall/10290690
tulc(the police have killed 47 people so far in July)

 

[tulc]

U.S. police have killed 650 people in 2017
(650) July 12, 2017 SC M
http://wbtw.com/2017/07/12/sled-investigat-deadly-officer-involved-shooting-in-dillon-county/

(649) July 12, 2017 OK M
http://newsok.com/article/5556016

(648) July 11, 2017 AZ M
http://www.ktnv.com/news/crime/man-shot-killed-by-mohave-county-sheriffs-detectives
tulc(the police have killed 50 people so far in July)

 

[Motherofkittens]

I disagree. Accusing someone of racism, with no evidence to do so, can cause a persIon extreme harm and ruin reputations.

I didn't say it doesn't cause harm, of course it does. But this isn't a major problem. It is like billions of people going in the ER about to die and there are a few hundred people with a broken finger and people acting like it is all equally bad. It is not. Please just research systematic and institutional prejudice. There are many peer reviewed studies saying it exists.

That's why i don't know why so many so called skeptics have a hard time believing prejudice is a problem. Their privilege and/or ignorance are making them anti science. This is real. Research it. Please.

 

[tulc]

U.S. police have killed 654 people in 2017
(654) July 13, 2017 FL M Stephen Steele, 56
http://www.wtsp.com/news/crime/pasco-deputies-say-they-shot-man-coming-at-them/456564152

(653) July 13, 2017 AZ M Chancey Chamblee, 55
http://www.kgun9.com/news/local-news/deputy-involved-shooting-on-s-alice-vail-lane

(652) July 13, 2017 CA M
http://www.keyt.com/news/man-killed-in-grover-beach-officer-involved-shooting/586636266

(651) July 12, 2017 AL M Ladarius Dontrell Jackson, 25
http://wiat.com/2017/07/13/alea-investigating-mans-death-after-reported-police-tasing-incident/
tulc(the police have killed 54 people so far in July)

 

[tulc]

U.S. police have killed 657 people in 2017
(657) July 15, 2017 TX M , 22 https://www.dallasnews.com/news/crime/2017/07/15/suspect-killed-officer-involved-shooting-west-arlington

(656) July 14, 2017 SC M
http://www.greenvilleonline.com/story/news/crime/2017/07/14/coroner-called-shooting-white-horse-road/480823001/

(655) July 13, 2017 AZ M Pedro Rubio, 42 http://www.azfamily.com/story/35879923/suspect-wounded-in-deputy-involved-shooting-in-goodyear
tulc(the police have killed 57 people so far in July)

 

[Ana the Ist]

U.S. police have killed 607 people in 2017
(607) July 3, 2017 WA M
http://www.kxly.com/news/local-news/spokane-police-involved-in-south-hill-shooting/573014127

(606) July 2, 2017 VA M
http://wtkr.com/2017/07/03/norfolk-police-officer-shot-suspect-killed-in-ocean-view-shooting/

(605) July 1, 2017 CO M
http://denver.cbslocal.com/2017/07/02/colorado-state-university-officer-shooting/

(604) July 1, 2017 IL M/B Quintec Locke, 37 http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/local/breaking/ct-police-shooting-lawndale-chicago-20170702-story.html

(603) July 1, 2017 AZ M
http://www.12news.com/news/local/valley/suspect-dead-officers-ok-after-glendale-officer-involved-shooting/453632288
tulc(the police have killed 7 people so far in July)

#600 and 603 look eerily similar....as do 605 and 602...

What's the actual count at?

 

[tulc]

the count stands at 657 right now

this is 600:

(600) June 30, 2017 TN M Richard Sparks, 37 R
http://wkrn.com/2017/06/30/tbi-investigates-after-man-died-during-arrest-by-cookeville-police/

this is 603

(603) July 1, 2017 AZ M Patrick Sanchez, 23 Suspect dead, officers OK after Glendale officer-involved shooting

this is 605

(605) July 1, 2017 CO M Jeremy Holmes, 19 http://denver.cbslocal.com/2017/07/02/colorado-state-university-officer-shooting/

this is 602

(602) July 1, 2017 WA M , 57 http://skyvalleychronicle.com/BREAKING-NEWS/Man-Who-Claims-He-Ingested-Too-Much-Meth-Goes-Berserk-In-McLeary-WA-br-i-Ends-up-dying-i-2895792

the count can change when new info is discovered. I try and make sure the count in my sig is as accurate as possible.
tulc(is finishing his coffee)

 

[tulc]

U.S. police have killed 660 people in 2017
(660) July 15, 2017 MN F
Woman shot and killed by officer during assault call in south Minneapolis – Twin Cities "The officers’ body cameras were not turned on during the shooting..."

(659) July 15, 2017 CA M , 23 http://www.pe.com/2017/07/15/moreno-valley-deputies-shoot-man-at-apartment-complex-grandma-says/

(658) July 15, 2017 AZ M
Suspected arsonist who shot at Forest Service worker shot, killed near Globe
tulc(the police have killed 60 people so far in July)

 

[Ygrene Imref]

You know what is crazier? In chicago alone, citizens have killed 336 other citizens so far in 2017 and there were 102 shootings and 14 killed from guns just over the 4th of july holiday. That is one city of 2.5 million, when the cops in the entire US, are dealing with 300 million.

There is a completely different dynamic going on.

On one hand, it is civilian criminals shooting people. On the other hand, there are law-enforcement officers shooting people. One is supposed to UPHOLD the law, the other purposefully abuses the law. These days, the line is blurring.

But, even so there is a huge difference, and notice I didn't even try to make a joke of the above (no matter how easy) because it is a serious issue. It is not the same thing.

 

[bhsmte]

There is a completely different dynamic going on.

On one hand, it is civilian criminals shooting people. On the other hand, there are law-enforcement officers shooting people. One is supposed to UPHOLD the law, the other purposefully abuses the law. These days, the line is blurring.

But, even so there is a huge difference, and notice I didn't even try to make a joke of the above (no matter how easy) because it is a serious issue. It is not the same thing.

If one wants to get to the bottom of this and deal with reality, we need to take each situation, one at a time and not broad brush for ideology sake.

So, one would need to examine all of the civilian killings of other civilians, to determine which of those were justified (self defense, etc.) vs the police killings, to determine those situations one at a time, to determine whether deadly force was justified.

I have an inkling, that a very high percentage of police killings (when examined), are justified when the facts are examined and a much lower percentage of civilian to civilian killings are justified when the facts are reviewed.

 

[Ygrene Imref]

If one wants to get to the bottom of this and deal with reality, we need to take each situation, one at a time and not broad brush for ideology sake.

So, one would need to examine all of the civilian killings of other civilians, to determine which of those were justified (self defense, etc.) vs the police killings, to determine those situations one at a time, to determine whether deadly force was justified.

I have an inkling, that a very high percentage of police killings (when examined), are justified when the facts are examined and a much lower percentage of civilian to civilian killings are justified when the facts are reviewed.

I wouldn't trust inklings, but that does seem to be enough in court.

We have seen the publicized executions of several people - with a couple on Facebook Live. Cops are shooting people in the back, unloading scores of bullets to take down one unarmed person.

There is already a problem with the police in America such that trying to do the work we should have done 30 years ago only wastes time, and affords more lawlessness. Trying to go on an individual bases of judgment is ludicrous when people are being shot by cops faster than you can research the event.

It needs to begin with those who allege they enforce the law: if the law enforcers are so blatantly crooked, less people will respect the law. Eventually, only the poor schmucks who believed in the system in the first place will be the ones left following their ideals while the rest of the world around them adapts to a Mad Max world with bluer skies, and tastier food.

If we want to lie to ourselves about what this is - especially assuming people won't recognize what is going on for what it is - then continue to lie to self.

I am not going to lie to myself and say these cops are justified even most of the time, and that the vast majority of these shootings are completely innocent.

 

[bhsmte]

I wouldn't trust inklings, but that does seem to be enough in court.

We have seen the publicized executions of several people - with a couple on Facebook Live. Cops are shooting people in the back, unloading scores of bullets to take down one unarmed person.

There is already a problem with the police in America such that trying to do the work we should have done 30 years ago only wastes time, and affords more lawlessness. Trying to go on an individual bases of judgment is ludicrous when people are being shot by cops faster than you can research the event.

It needs to begin with those who allege they enforce the law: if the law enforcers are so blatantly crooked, less people will respect the law. Eventually, only the poor schmucks who believed in the system in the first place will be the ones left following their ideals while the rest of the world around them adapts to a Mad Max world with bluer skies, and tastier food.

If we want to lie to ourselves about what this is - especially assuming people won't recognize what is going on for what it is - then continue to lie to self.

I am not going to lie to myself and say these cops are justified even most of the time, and that the vast majority of these shootings are completely innocent.

If you have followed my posts on this thread, I have made it plain, that each shooting should be investigated individually and if the evidence shows that deadly force was not required, the officer should be prosecuted to the full force of the law.

It is this broad brushing to any degree, that makes zero sense, if you want to get at the facts.