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? Unsure Question ?

Discussion in 'Controversial Christian Theology' started by AubreyM, Apr 19, 2021.

  1. AubreyM

    AubreyM Active Member

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    Hello you, not sure if this is the right place to put this either by the way.

    So heard from two people, that have explained to me the way they say see God, and how they see people.

    God is the Father of all people -> So everyone is a Son or Daughter already.

    Is there a biblical perspective that says that God is the Father of all people?

    Is not the biblical perspective from what is said, which instills that God is the Creator of all people, and we are all creation of God -> That have a choice to become a child, son or daughter of God?

    (My viewpoint is that of we are all creations of God -> through Christ Jesus we become Children of God.)

    Thoughts, Questions, Insights?

    Please leave a comment, thank you have a great day.
     
  2. Andrewn

    Andrewn Well-Known Member CF Ambassadors Supporter

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    Act 17:28 For ‘In him we live and move and have our being,’ as even some of your poets have said, ‘For we too are his offspring.’ 29 Since therefore we are the offspring of God, we ought not to think that the divinity is like an image fashioned from gold, silver, or stone by human art and imagination.

    All human beings are created in the image of God and are His offspring but there are a lot of prodigal sons.
     
    Last edited: Apr 19, 2021
  3. AubreyM

    AubreyM Active Member

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    Hello Andrewn

    Is it because they believe in the Messiah they are known as the offspring because of belief in God?

    Personally do believe we are all created by God, though because of what the Bible infers, the only way to become a child of God is by and through the Lord Jesus Christ, John 1:12.

    Thank you for offering up that scripture too Andrewn.
     
  4. AubreyM

    AubreyM Active Member

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    Okay, thank you anyway @Andrewn

    Just don’t understand how or where the notion of God being everyone’s Father whom resides in heaven if there are many people who reject God completely, or desire or have no care for the Son of God as well.

    The notion just seems highly unbiblical- even thought the one that was shared from Acts - in context maybe they are believers and that is why they refer to being children or offspring of God.

    just trying to get to where the idea comes from maybe the human aspect of a mother birthing a son, God being the creator over creation makes all creation sons and daughters, can respect the tradition, though do believe John 1:12 is more so valid, because of just the desire of truth, to know what is true and what is not.
     
  5. com7fy8

    com7fy8 Well-Known Member Supporter

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    I would say this is basically it.
    To me, it is clear that God's word says not every human is His child.

    In the context of Paul's statement quoted by Andrew > Paul says we are all His "offspring" because in Him we live and have our being, if I remember correctly. So, I see how being His "offspring" has to do with only the fact that God keeps humans alive. But ones need to become alive in Jesus, in order to live as children of God.

    I think Paul does mean all people are His "offspring", but "offspring" does not mean people who have become adopted through Jesus to become His children.

    "No one comes to the Father except through Me." (in John 14:6)
     
    Last edited: Apr 20, 2021
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  6. 2BeholdHisGlory

    2BeholdHisGlory Still on vacation!

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    We all have fathers according to the flesh and we are to be subject to the Father our spirits

    Heb 12:9 Furthermore we have had fathers of our flesh which corrected us, and we gave them reverence: shall we not much rather be in subjection unto the Father of spirits, and live?

    The Spirit itself beareth witness with our spirit, that we are the children of God

    Ephes 1:5 Having predestinated us unto the adoption of children by Jesus Christ to himself, according to the good pleasure of his will,

    The children of God by the Spirit of adoption

    Rom 8:15... ye have received the Spirit of adoption, whereby we cry, Abba, Father.
     
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  7. 2BeholdHisGlory

    2BeholdHisGlory Still on vacation!

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    Here is one that makes distinction between two

    Romans 9:8 That is, They which are the children of the flesh, these are not the children of God: but the children of the promise are counted for the seed.

    Which is the promise Spirit

    Romans 8:16 The Spirit itself beareth witness with our spirit, that we are the children of God

    And the Spirit of God puts the difference here

    Romans 8:9 But ye are not in the flesh, but in the Spirit, if so be that the Spirit of God dwell in you. Now if any man have not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of his.
     
  8. Der Alte

    Der Alte This is me about 1 yr. old. Supporter

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    I think there is one verse which addresses this more than any other.
    John 3:16-18
    16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.
    17 For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world; but that the world through him might be saved.
    18 He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.
    God so loved the world, the whole world not just a chosen few, that he gave his only begotten Son, or one and only son, that whosoever believes in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.
     
  9. bling

    bling Regular Member Supporter

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    Andrew showed how we are born children of God, this could happen if we throw out the idea of being sinners as the result of Adam's sin. I think we become sinners when we sin, so until then we are children of God. Like the prodigal son who was discribed by Christ as being "dead" while in the foriegn land we are dead to the father while leading a sinful life and a dead child was a child of God but a dead child is not a child of God. We have to humbly turn to God willing to accept God's chrity (like the prodigal son did) and the Father can make us a new child of his.
     
  10. Der Alte

    Der Alte This is me about 1 yr. old. Supporter

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    Matthew 6:9
    9 After this manner therefore pray ye: Our Father which art in heaven, Hallowed be thy name. Luke 11:2
     
  11. AubreyM

    AubreyM Active Member

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    Thank you all for your insights, as well as scripture.
     
  12. Tolworth John

    Tolworth John Well-Known Member Supporter

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    God is creator of all yes, but Father?

    Why in John 1do we have the right to become Children of God, if he is already our Father.
    Why are we adopted into his family. Natural children are not adopted.
    Finally it is by how we live that we show who our Father is.
    As Jesus said, you are of your father the devil, to those who rejected him.
     
  13. Andrewn

    Andrewn Well-Known Member CF Ambassadors Supporter

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    What does being "sons of God" means?

    1) Christ is the one and only unique Son of God and according to the Nicene Creed:

    "And [we believe] in one Lord Jesus Christ, the only-begotten Son of God, begotten of the Father before all ages; Light of Light, true God of true God, begotten, not created, of one essence with the Father through Whom all things were made."

    So, Christ is the only true Son of God who is of the same essence. But the word "sons" is elsewhere applied figuratively with 2 additional implications:

    2) God is the Father of spirits meaning that He formed spirits of people and angels as in Heb 12:19, quoted above and also in the following verses:

    Zec 12:1 An Oracle. The word of the Lord concerning Israel: Thus says the Lord, who stretched out the heavens and founded the earth and formed the human spirit within:

    Job 38:6 On what were its [the earth] foundations set, or who laid its cornerstone— 7 when the morning stars sang together, and all the sons of God shouted for joy?

    3) The expression "sons of God" is also used to mean that He adopts us who believe in His name. We can see this expressed throughout the NT:

    Joh 1:12 But to those who did accept him [Christ] he gave power to become children of God, to those who believe in his name,

    Heb 2:11 He who consecrates and those who are being consecrated all have one origin. Therefore, he is not ashamed to call them “brothers,”

    The same concept is also expressed in Rom 8:15-16; Rom 9:8; Eph 1:5 and many other passages.

    Conclusion:

    Only Jesus Christ is the only begotten Son of God. But human beings are born children of God in the sense that He "formed" our spirits. A lot of people choose to be prodigal sons who travel to a distant country, taking the blessings of God and "wasting them with reckless living."

    Other people stay in the household, they listen to Jesus' voice and follow him. Like Peter, they say, “Lord, to whom shall we go? You have the words of eternal life! We have trusted and have come to know that you are the Holy One of God.”
     
    Last edited: Apr 20, 2021
  14. com7fy8

    com7fy8 Well-Known Member Supporter

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    John 8:44

    And our Apostle Paul says "we all once" "were by nature children of wrath, just as the others." (in Ephesians 2:3)

    Paul says "we" were "children of wrath". He is writing this to Gentiles. So, here where Paul says "we", he includes himself with Gentiles, and Paul was a Jew!! Paul once was a Pharisee who looked down on Gentiles as being filthy and totally unacceptable to God; yet, now Paul is saying he was no different than Gentile sinners, while Paul was not a Christian. He is saying he and they together were "children of wrath" . . . not children of God.

    And he says "we" were Satan's children . . . "by nature".

    "not by choice" (not a quote from the Bible)

    Our nature has to do with whose children we are, I see from this.
     
  15. Andrewn

    Andrewn Well-Known Member CF Ambassadors Supporter

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    I've shown from the Bible that all people are children of God (posts #2 & #13).

    But the Lord Jesus said Jews are children of the devil and the Apostle Paul said that Gentiles are children of wrath.

    The Bible does does not contradict itself, so how can both concepts be correct? It really is not difficult to understand if we look at what the word "nature" in the following verses:

    Gal 2:15 We are Jews by nature and not “Gentile sinners,”

    Rom 11:24 For if you were cut from what is by nature a wild olive tree, and grafted, contrary to nature, into a cultivated one, how much more will they who belong to it by nature be grafted back into their own olive tree.

    Eph 2:2 At that time, you walked in the way of this world, in conformity to the ruler of the domain of the air—the ruler of the spirit who is now operating in the sons of disobedience. 3 We too all lived among them in the cravings of our flesh, indulging the desires of the flesh and the mind. By nature we were children of wrath, just like the others.

    From this, one can see that before coming to faith in Christ, Jews have one nature and Gentiles have a different nature. The Apostle Paul uses the word ‘nature’ to describe the main character, disposition, or temperament of the unregenerate person.

    Conclusion:

    Unregenerate people are "children of God' in the sense that God formed their spirits, and He is the Father of spirits. But, at the same time, they are "children of the devil" in the extent that their temperament, character, and behavior may be similar to that of the devil.
     
  16. AubreyM

    AubreyM Active Member

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    Alright then.

    Opinions will always be subjective.

    So believe that in conclusion : On basis of the bible -> God created Humans.

    God is the creator of all human beings.

    Is He the Father of them? No -> Because it requires something back from them -> Faith.

    The bible says God created Adam from dirt, then breathed life into Adam. He then created, Eve from Adams rib.

    When it comes to anyone to being the Son of God it most certainly is and was and always forever will be -> Yeshua Christ The Anointed One of Nazareth who was the Son of God, and the Lord of Lords, and King of Kings -> Who worshiped in spirit and came and brought the truth of the Eternal God (His Father)-> From which we all can learn from looking in the bible.

    It's subjective, if people wanna believe that God is the Father of all people -> That means God is the Father of all the child -moles- -> Murderers -> Evil Human beings.

    He must be the Father of all them too, and nothing is going to happen to them, they are free to do those things right?

    Ah well, according to the bible -> Our attention is suppose to be turned towards God and walking in newness of life by the spirit of Yeshua Christ becoming a child of God through belief.


    Thank you all for the scripture, your views, and adding your insights.

    God bless and take care.
     
  17. Soyeong

    Soyeong Well-Known Member

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    We are all God's creations, but that is not the sense in which the Bible speaks about those who are children of God. A chip off of the old block is someone who has the same character or nature as their father, and this is the sense that Jesus is the Son of God in that the Son is the exact expression of God's nature (Hebrews 1:3), which he expressed through his actions by living in sinless obedience to the Mosaic Law. Furthermore, this is the sense in which we children of God when we partake in the divine nature through living in obedience to it, which is also why those who do not practice righteousness in obedience to it are not children of God (1 John 3:10).
     
  18. Daniel Marsh

    Daniel Marsh Well-Known Member

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    The well known Lord's Prayer starts with "Our Father who is in heaven..."

    Somewhere in the book of Acts it says all people are of "one blood"
     
  19. 4UallPraise

    4UallPraise disabled entertainment

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    What does God want for His people but to be free to worship Him. People all come from the human race so in that they are one family, from Adam and Eve, the mother of all living.

    But God's holiness seperates us from God and yet His sanctification brings us into fellowship once again as son or daughter. We know from Hebrews 2:11 that He the sanctifier and the sanctified are of one family. Just as Numbers 6:2 invited all who wished to be sanctified to come to Him.

    How so?

    By recieving His covering so all else has to pass over your household safely contained within.

    By trusting that what He has said will be completed.

    And by leaving what He has promised to complete in His hands.
     
  20. sawdust

    sawdust Well-Known Member

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    My understanding is this.

    God is creator of all souls which is why the the scripture says:

    Eze.18:4a Behold, all souls are mine;

    However, that does not make God our Father as we are born (since the fall) without a spirit (spiritually dead.) This is why we must be born anew (or from above).

    John 3:3 Jesus answered him, “Truly, truly, I say to you, unless one is born anew, he cannot see the kingdom of God.”

    It is the Spirit that gives birth to our spirit and it is through this process that we become children of God for we are receiving something of God Himself. Exactly how that is done, I don't know, but it is something intimate as the scriptures never speak of our spirits as being created but only ever given of God or birthed by God.

    John 3:6 That which is born of the flesh is flesh, and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.

    So, only the regenerate is technically a child of God.
     
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